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Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach

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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#21 » by Tom White » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:31 pm

I'll add another thought I had after this presser. KP didn't come right out and say it, but after gushing on about Brogdon's signing as being an "epic" day for the Pacers, and then talking about the lack of leadership on this team, I would not be surprised to see the team (at least) try to move on from Brogdon.

If he doesn't have the leadership qualities this team needs, I'd say he is very replaceable. Yes, he can shoot - when open - but is not quick nor a very good defender. I would say he is not nearly (not even close) the most creative passer on this team, and if he can't or won't lead, then he is close to being a one-trick pony.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#22 » by pacers33granger » Wed Jun 9, 2021 8:52 pm

Tom White wrote:I'll add another thought I had after this presser. KP didn't come right out and say it, but after gushing on about Brogdon's signing as being an "epic" day for the Pacers, and then talking about the lack of leadership on this team, I would not be surprised to see the team (at least) try to move on from Brogdon.

If he doesn't have the leadership qualities this team needs, I'd say he is very replaceable. Yes, he can shoot - when open - but is not quick nor a very good defender. I would say he is not nearly (not even close) the most creative passer on this team, and if he can't or won't lead, then he is close to being a one-trick pony.


It has become clear that Malcolm is an awesome guy and is a leader in his community (and abroad). He's not a leader in the lockerroom or on the court though and his personal endeavors seem to mask that issue at times. He came in as an older rookie, so he actually doesn't have as much experience in the league as it may seem, so that could be part of the problem.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#23 » by Tom White » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:02 pm

pacers33granger wrote:He came in as an older rookie, so he actually doesn't have as much experience in the league as it may seem, so that could be part of the problem.


He has now been in the league for five (I think) seasons. Yes, he was a second round pick, so maybe expectations should have been tempered a bit, but did become rookie of the year, so there is that. But he has been around long enough to show what he can and can't do. It looks to me like leadership is in the can't do column.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#24 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:12 pm

Tom White wrote:I'll add another thought I had after this presser. KP didn't come right out and say it, but after gushing on about Brogdon's signing as being an "epic" day for the Pacers, and then talking about the lack of leadership on this team, I would not be surprised to see the team (at least) try to move on from Brogdon.

If he doesn't have the leadership qualities this team needs, I'd say he is very replaceable. Yes, he can shoot - when open - but is not quick nor a very good defender. I would say he is not nearly (not even close) the most creative passer on this team, and if he can't or won't lead, then he is close to being a one-trick pony.



I took Pritchards response to the question about the quality of the locker room being essentially this type of answer. He talked about all the guys being great guys and individually great locker room guys, but that we lacked the cohesive leadership of and in the locker room. Sounded like saying that Brogdon might have tried to lead overall, since he’s a great individual leader, but it didn’t work. My interpretation is all, but seemed close to yours.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#25 » by HMFFL » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:36 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=21

Again, a guy that’s about 40-50% accurate on average.
A 63 year old coach is probably not the answer. I hope Indiana goes younger and finds a long-term solution.

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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#26 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:42 pm

HMFFL wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=21

Again, a guy that’s about 40-50% accurate on average.
A 63 year old coach is probably not the answer. I hope Indiana goes younger and finds a long-term solution.

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Yeah. The general assumption is always that a team will hire the opposite of what they just fired, though Pritchard pushed back on that a bit and talked about walking a fine line of balance.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#27 » by Tom White » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:42 pm

HMFFL wrote:A 63 year old coach is probably not the answer. I hope Indiana goes younger and finds a long-term solution.


I fail to see the problem. It isn't as though he is on his last legs or anything. There are reasons he has lasted in the league to his ripe old age. :lol: The team just fired their "younger" coach. How'd that work out?

You might get more credit by saying what it is you don't like about his coaching rather than just complain about his age.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#28 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 9:45 pm

Charcoal Filtered wrote:Disappointing season. Looked like a great hire at the time.

Would be interested in what Stotts would be able to do with this roster but his mediocre success with the Blazers does not excite me.



Hey, old friend. Hope life is treating you well.

Any specific thoughts on Stotts and his possible fit specifically in Indy? Is he a retread? Or is he just not the guy to get Portland over the edge.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#29 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:02 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=21

I think it’s supposed to say “refused to call OUT his best players”.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#30 » by Wizop » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:04 pm

I don't think the missing leadership needs to come from the best player or even a starter. A veteran on the bench who has been on winning teams can and has done it here.

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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#31 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:18 pm

Wizop wrote:I don't think the missing leadership needs to come from the best player or even a starter. A veteran on the bench who has been on winning teams can and has done it here.

Sent from my phone.


Sure. that’s specifically what Pritchard suggested. He said a veteran that sat on the bench, which he immediately interjected with a “but he’s ready to play when called upon”. He specifically cited Udonis Harlem. I’d say we should think of an Al Jefferson or Rasual Butler type.

High end would be a PJ Tucker type, and would probably require close to a full MLE for multiple years. Obviously, there are much cheaper options, too, for the bottom end of the roster.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#32 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:23 pm

This stood out from the J.Michael article.

They're likely to bring back LeVert, Sabonis, Brogdon and T.J. Warren, though blowing up the roster remains on the table, two league sources told IndyStar. There's a belief, however, that while Pritchard is open to the idea, owner Herb Simon won't give him the green light.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#33 » by Charcoal Filtered » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:33 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Charcoal Filtered wrote:Disappointing season. Looked like a great hire at the time.

Would be interested in what Stotts would be able to do with this roster but his mediocre success with the Blazers does not excite me.



Hey, old friend. Hope life is treating you well.

Any specific thoughts on Stotts and his possible fit specifically in Indy? Is he a retread? Or is he just not the guy to get Portland over the edge.


Holding players accountable was not a skill Stotts showed in Portland. He was tough on rookies and Nurkic. Did not pressure high priced veterans to play defense though. Nice guy but probably not a coach that is going to make a title contender out of this group.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#34 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:35 pm

Charcoal Filtered wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
Charcoal Filtered wrote:Disappointing season. Looked like a great hire at the time.

Would be interested in what Stotts would be able to do with this roster but his mediocre success with the Blazers does not excite me.



Hey, old friend. Hope life is treating you well.

Any specific thoughts on Stotts and his possible fit specifically in Indy? Is he a retread? Or is he just not the guy to get Portland over the edge.


Holding players accountable was not a skill Stotts showed in Portland. He was tough on rookies and Nurkic. Did not pressure high priced veterans to play defense though. Nice guy but probably not a coach that is going to make a title contender out of this group.


Yeah, that would not work well with the issues we just fired Bjorkgren for.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#35 » by Tom White » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:50 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:This stood out from the J.Michael article.

They're likely to bring back LeVert, Sabonis, Brogdon and T.J. Warren, though blowing up the roster remains on the table, two league sources told IndyStar. There's a belief, however, that while Pritchard is open to the idea, owner Herb Simon won't give him the green light.


That darned Herb is just a real party pooper. :lol:
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#36 » by boomershadow » Wed Jun 9, 2021 10:51 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
Charcoal Filtered wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:

Hey, old friend. Hope life is treating you well.

Any specific thoughts on Stotts and his possible fit specifically in Indy? Is he a retread? Or is he just not the guy to get Portland over the edge.


Holding players accountable was not a skill Stotts showed in Portland. He was tough on rookies and Nurkic. Did not pressure high priced veterans to play defense though. Nice guy but probably not a coach that is going to make a title contender out of this group.


Yeah, that would not work well with the issues we just fired Bjorkgren for.


Do we have any veterans that are high priced enough to fit that criteria?
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#37 » by pacers33granger » Thu Jun 10, 2021 12:19 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:This stood out from the J.Michael article.

They're likely to bring back LeVert, Sabonis, Brogdon and T.J. Warren, though blowing up the roster remains on the table, two league sources told IndyStar. There's a belief, however, that while Pritchard is open to the idea, owner Herb Simon won't give him the green light.
Could be a happy medium basically with a soft rebuild around Domas. Get some young talent and/or picks for Myles, Brogdon, and maybe LeVert and keep your cheap young all star big and try to build a roster to maximize him.

Not sure it's the best move, but something more than a retool and not quite a full rebuild where we'd likely end up with a couple of mid lotto picks.

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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#38 » by BooomBaby » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:55 pm

Nice guy but probably not a coach that is going to make a title contender out of this group.


:lol: Out of these scrubs, not even a superhuman sorcerer would make them a title contender.
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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#39 » by Wizop » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:09 am

pacers33granger wrote:Could be a happy medium basically with a soft rebuild around Domas. Get some young talent and/or picks for Myles, Brogdon, and maybe LeVert


I think trading 3 starters is exactly what gets a red light from Herb. I wouldn't call that soft.

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Re: Woj: Nate Bjorkgren out as Head Coach 

Post#40 » by Scoot McGroot » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:28 am

Wizop wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:Could be a happy medium basically with a soft rebuild around Domas. Get some young talent and/or picks for Myles, Brogdon, and maybe LeVert


I think trading 3 starters is exactly what gets a red light from Herb. I wouldn't call that soft.

Sent from my phone.


Honestly, depending on what you get back, you still might be competing for the play-in. :dontknow:

But, we probably should've really made the moves either going into this past season, or mid-season, if we were going to do a soft rebuild. Doing it during the pandemic and crowd free games would've made a ton of sense.

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