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How do You Assess Goga

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How do You Assess Goga 

Post#1 » by 8305 » Fri Jul 9, 2021 12:32 pm

Two years in what do you think?
He was sold as a guy who combined what we like about Myles and Domas.
Tough interior presence
Can shoot the three
Good passer
My observations,
He will never defend pick and roll as good as Myles, probably never be a Myles level rim protector either. I expect he won’t get pushed around by the physical centers of the league the way Myles does. He’s probably a better rim protector than Domas now. His three point shot looks good. I think he could be as good a three point shooter as Myles. Don’t see him being a guy you run offense through like Domas. I could see him being a pretty good rebounder probably not on Domas level.

I could see where the overall package could be a solid starting center.
How critical is it for the Pacers to develop this guy?
In his presser I believe Rick Carlisle said the best way to use Domas and Myles was to stagger them. I read that to mean Goga would not get rotation minutes. Do you agree?
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#2 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Fri Jul 9, 2021 7:58 pm

He was a good pick in the sense that he probably had the highest ceiling of people available at the time, so for that, I actually applaud the Pacers.

The problem was, and still is that he plays the same position as Myles and Domas. Seems like the Pacers took him as he was their BPA, but never actually set a plan on how to develop him. The log jam at his position has made it difficult for him to earn consistent minutes, which I feel makes it tougher for a player to develop. The best way for a player to get used to the speed of the game is by being on the court for extended stretches at a time, and he just hasn't really had that opportunity.

He has all the tools to be great....but I'm not entirely sold on his work ethic yet, and the feuding with coaches isn't a great look either. This next year is probably the year we'll find out if he's going to develop into anything for us, and based on comments by Rick, doesn't sound like there will be a consistent spot in the rotation for him.

Seems like we wasted a pick on a good player because we had no way to actually get him involved and develop him.

Centers always take longer to develop and as I said, he has the tools to really be a good player in this league...but I just don't see how he reaches that potential with the approach the Pacers have taken.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#3 » by Topofthekey » Fri Jul 9, 2021 8:19 pm

I think he a better shot blocker than Myles

Better in the sense that even though he probably won't block as many shots as Myles, he isn't as prone to giving up rebounding or defensive positioning as Myles. I feel it's impossible to count how many times opponents got easy second chance points because Myles wasn't in position to help block out the offensive rebounder due to him attempting a block. Either that, or the opponent's ball handler sees Myles coming and just simply makes an easy pass to the weak side for an easy bucket. Basically too much emphasis on the ball and opponent's ball handler (side note, TJ McConnell has almost the same problem well)

To be fair, Myles has improved a lot in this area this past season, this used to be one of his most glaring weaknesses. But it feels like with only barely two years of experience, Goga is already better at maintaining discipline in terms of positioning. So even though Goga won't block as many shots as Myles, he won't give up as many offensive rebounds leading to easy buckets either. That makes Goga the better shot blocker in my mind, especially if he can keep improving
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#4 » by Pacers Forever » Fri Jul 9, 2021 9:23 pm

I like Goga’s potential ! He’s played professionally over seas developing enough of a game to make the NBA. 2 years in now and in about a week he’ll be 22 years old. That’s huge in 2 ways. As a slow developer the Pacers will most likely be able to control him cheaply. Secondly he’s so young that if he does realize his potential he’ll have many more seasons to prosper. Remember he started out with tough luck his first two seasons. Had Nate 1 and 2 as coaches. He had multiple ankle issues plus a log jam at his position didn’t give him much time on the floor to improve plus this season COVID screwed up practice time. You have to wonder if he would have gotten as much time as he did late this season if injuries to Myles had not occurred. However I saw his game progress last year from his first year.

To be continued. Sorry dang Iphone causes problems posting.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#5 » by Pacers Forever » Fri Jul 9, 2021 11:20 pm

Continuing I think Goga’s strengths are that he tries to block shots and doesn’t take himself out of the play. He’s getting better at rebounding, and looking more confident with his under the basket moves. Was drawing some fouls.

I think he needs to work more on his 3 point shot selection and improve his 25% accuracy from there. His shot looks good but I think he rushes it sometimes. Goga needs to continue to grow his aggressiveness and confidence. He should strive to develop as a pass facilitator in the offense like Domas has done.

In conclusion I think as young and cheap as he is it let’s the Pacers buy time for further development and maybe Carlisle and coaching staff can teach him and make strides in his game. I’m willing to wait until we become less fortified in the front court and then he has to pull his share !

Can he become more than a 2nd stringer ? I hope so. I think that’s on him to really step up his game because currently he’s not a bad pick but not progressing will lead to a ticket out of town.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#6 » by Topofthekey » Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:25 am

One way to think about the way Myles blocks shots is this

Try to recall some of the all time great rim protectors of the league, like Mutombo or Olajuwon, or even Yao. They were always a threat to block the opponent 2 or 3 times in one single possession

They were able to do that because they don't take themselves out of defensive position when they go for their blocks, they are very measured in their shot blocking attempts. That's why they can quickly recover near the basket and keep blocking the opponent

And when was the last time Myles recorded multiple blocks in one possession?

I mean, I do clearly remember watching him do it maybe once or twice, but the point is it's quite rare, and it's rare because the way Myles attempts his blocks usually puts him in a less than ideal defensive position subsequently

The way Goga blocks shots though, is more similar to the all time greats, where he's a bit more patient and calculated in his attempts
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#7 » by Wizop » Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:46 am

As young as he is, I have no concerns. His floor is a long career as a backup. If he blossoms, so much the better. 1s and 5s take time.

Sent from my phone.
Please edit long quotes to only show what puts your new message into context.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#8 » by Moooose » Sun Jul 11, 2021 4:21 am

I like Goga and I think he can do more in more minutes. I saw how he developed into a non-draftable prospect into a close lottery pick in a short time, and I think he's developing albeit slower than expected. This is tied, of course, with how much playing time he's getting and with Myles and Domas around I don't think he will see heavy minutes. He may even split some minutes with Brissett, if we are to go small at times. I have lowered my expectations and so I think he's doing good as a backup. He is getting his confidence and that is very important.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#9 » by Pacercoltboiler » Wed Jul 14, 2021 4:44 pm

I am definitely pro Goga. He can block shots, rebound, and shoot. He is just buried in a deep position. Wouldn't he be the perfect pick and roll center. With his shot, he would be deadly after setting a screen. I see a classic pick and roll center who can block shots and rebound.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#10 » by Topofthekey » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:23 pm

It's interesting to note how team USA players have so far struggled with all the no calls in the Olympics - the officiating is just very different

It's been reported that players like Jayson Tatum and Bradley Beal have stared down Olympic officials, due to them not getting the calls that they would have normally gotten in the NBA - in their mind they were probably thinking "where's the whistle, are the refs blind?"

The thing to note here is the opposite is also probably true for international players playing in the NBA

I understand now why Goga seemingly always have that lost and perplexed look whenever he gets whistled for a foul - in his mind, he's probably thinking "how is that a foul, what did I do?"
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#11 » by Tom White » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:29 pm

Topofthekey wrote:It's interesting to note how team USA players have so far struggled with all the no calls in the Olympics - the officiating is just very different

It's been reported that players like Jayson Tatum and Bradley Beal have stared down Olympic officials, due to them not getting the calls that they would have normally gotten in the NBA - in their mind they were probably thinking "where's the whistle, are the refs blind?"

The thing to note here is the opposite is also probably true for international players playing in the NBA

I understand now why Goga seemingly always have that lost and perplexed look whenever he gets whistled for a foul - in his mind, he's probably thinking "how is that a foul, what did I do?"


Olympic officials don't feel the need to coddle the stars. Some of these guys are accustomed to getting a call if a defender gets within three feet of them, or being able to flop their way into a call. Not today, guys.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#12 » by Pacers Forever » Wed Jul 28, 2021 1:30 am

This is what’s wrong imho with the NBA game. The refs or whomever wants the league using reputation fouls is wrong. It’s been going on since Jordan and probably before with the refs giving preference to stars and this just irritates me that there’s not a level playing field in respect to officiating.
So there’s already an uneven playing field due to talent which is how it should be based on athletic abilities and team composition. They really don’t need to give stars an extra advantage. I can’t stand the whining and talking to the refs by any players after a foul call these days. I wish the NBA could clean this up. Players play and refs calls can only be questioned by the coaching staff.
I’m also sick of the flagrant 1 and 2 BS reviews. I understand that the game is so fast paced but the flagrant issues need to be handled by the review center only and buzz the ref to say hold up we’re reviewing for a flagrant. Refs would only call flagrant upon review center decision unless it’s an outright situation so obvious then ok.
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Re: How do You Assess Goga 

Post#13 » by Pacers Forever » Thu Jul 29, 2021 12:31 am

Read on Twitter
?s=21

Good hopefully reduces the players disputing way too many calls !

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