Image

Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks

Moderators: pacers33granger, Grang33r, pacerfan, Jake0890, boomershadow

User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#1 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 5:52 pm

Read on Twitter
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#2 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:00 pm

Specifically doesn’t want to consider a “process like tank”. But the headline is pretty much it. One center goes…which one depends on the return, it sounds like. Levert specifically (but not like he “has to go”. Mostly because Brogdon is trade restricted and Warren is injured, and reportedly has told Pritchard he’d prefer to stay in Indy long-term.

Also, the desire to clear minutes for Duarte and Jackson are specifically mentioned in the post. I know there’s been some frustration with Jackson not getting minutes, but that’s probably mostly just been that he’s still a 19 year old rookie and it’s just ridiculously early in his career. Sounds like he’ll be getting some run by the end of the year, which sounds about right.
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 14,488
And1: 6,275
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#3 » by pacers33granger » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:09 pm

Seems likely we get something alright for one of the centers and junk for LeVert. Maybe we also get a 2nd fir Goga or just continue to let him rot on the bench.

I'm hopeful the team will choose a direction but skeptical we get much at this point.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 14,488
And1: 6,275
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#4 » by pacers33granger » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:21 pm

And this really seems like Rick told management and ownership that the roster just won't cut it.

I'm skeptical of Pritchard shifting the blame for failing to rebuild to Simon. We all know Simon never wanted to but it's pretty unfair to take the credit for Vic and Domas when it's good but claim his hands were tied now that it's ultimately failed.

Maybe Pritchard did try to push and adding Rick along with the terrible play made it sink in. Just still not a good look potentially.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app
Tom White
Rookie
Posts: 1,131
And1: 542
Joined: Aug 27, 2001
Location: Indiana

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#5 » by Tom White » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:23 pm

pacers33granger wrote:Seems likely we get something alright for one of the centers and junk for LeVert. Maybe we also get a 2nd fir Goga or just continue to let him rot on the bench.

I'm hopeful the team will choose a direction but skeptical we get much at this point.


I can picture KP scanning various team rosters to find chronically injured players to trade for.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#6 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 6:45 pm

pacers33granger wrote:Seems likely we get something alright for one of the centers and junk for LeVert. Maybe we also get a 2nd fir Goga or just continue to let him rot on the bench.

I'm hopeful the team will choose a direction but skeptical we get much at this point.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app


If we’re trading one of the centers, no need to move Goga for a 2nd. He’ll get a chance at 15+ minutes a night, every night, right away if one is moved.
User avatar
Wizop
RealGM
Posts: 12,640
And1: 2,342
Joined: Jun 15, 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:
   

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#7 » by Wizop » Tue Dec 7, 2021 8:55 pm

pacers33granger wrote:I'm skeptical of Pritchard shifting the blame for failing to rebuild to Simon.


the Kravitz article in theAthletic says Simon didn't want to rebuild in 2017 but is on board for doing it now. personally, I'd rather trade LeVert and keep both Turner and Sabonis but let the rumors start.
Please edit long quotes to only show what puts your new message into context.
pacers33granger
Forum Mod - Pacers
Forum Mod - Pacers
Posts: 14,488
And1: 6,275
Joined: Sep 26, 2006
 

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#8 » by pacers33granger » Tue Dec 7, 2021 9:24 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:Seems likely we get something alright for one of the centers and junk for LeVert. Maybe we also get a 2nd fir Goga or just continue to let him rot on the bench.

I'm hopeful the team will choose a direction but skeptical we get much at this point.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app


If we’re trading one of the centers, no need to move Goga for a 2nd. He’ll get a chance at 15+ minutes a night, every night, right away if one is moved.
Will he? He hasn't gotten much of a chance are is and Jackson is clearly next in line for minutes. If we keep playing 2 bigs together following a trade of one, yeah there will be minutes. But I assume there would be almost exclusively 1 big lineups moving forward, making Goga the 3rd string emergency center.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#9 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 9:28 pm

pacers33granger wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:
pacers33granger wrote:Seems likely we get something alright for one of the centers and junk for LeVert. Maybe we also get a 2nd fir Goga or just continue to let him rot on the bench.

I'm hopeful the team will choose a direction but skeptical we get much at this point.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app


If we’re trading one of the centers, no need to move Goga for a 2nd. He’ll get a chance at 15+ minutes a night, every night, right away if one is moved.
Will he? He hasn't gotten much of a chance are is and Jackson is clearly next in line for minutes. If we keep playing 2 bigs together following a trade of one, yeah there will be minutes. But I assume there would be almost exclusively 1 big lineups moving forward, making Goga the 3rd string emergency center.

Sent from my SM-A716U using RealGM mobile app


Will he? Who knows? Could he? Absolutely. Even if Jackson is "next in line". Jackson can, and has, played the 4 for us. If Turner is leaving, hypothetically, and Goga snatches 15 minutes at the 5, there's still 14 minutes a night now vacated at the 4 for Jackson from Turner's minutes. Seems like both guys could snatch a lot more consistent playing time going forward from that type of move. I certainly don't think that Jackson would get all 29 minutes immediately.
agkagk
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,545
And1: 930
Joined: Sep 03, 2011

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#10 » by agkagk » Tue Dec 7, 2021 9:34 pm

From the outside looking in (raptors fan) I’m not buying it.

Pacers are one of the better programs in the league. You guys continually produce players without tanking.

Frankly, your team is loaded with talent, just the wrong mix.
User avatar
Wizop
RealGM
Posts: 12,640
And1: 2,342
Joined: Jun 15, 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:
   

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#11 » by Wizop » Tue Dec 7, 2021 9:47 pm

agkagk wrote:From the outside looking in (raptors fan) I’m not buying it.


LeVert for Dragic or is Toronto ready to blow your end up?
Please edit long quotes to only show what puts your new message into context.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#12 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 9:52 pm

agkagk wrote:From the outside looking in (raptors fan) I’m not buying it.

Pacers are one of the better programs in the league. You guys continually produce players without tanking.

Frankly, your team is loaded with talent, just the wrong mix.


A lotta talent, but poor fitting right now. Mostly the Levert part. The roster was tailor made to excel with a healthy, prime Oladipo as the 2 guard, as he and Brogdon complemented each other perfectly (in theory). Turning an all-defense 2 guard who could handle PG's into Levert was just a massive downgrade in terms of making the roster more clunky than anything.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#13 » by Scoot McGroot » Tue Dec 7, 2021 10:01 pm

Man, a healthy Ed Sumner would've done SO MUCH for this roster, and would've had SO many opportunities to explode this year. What a shame that injury was.
8305
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,772
And1: 356
Joined: Jun 11, 2009
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#14 » by 8305 » Wed Dec 8, 2021 12:58 am

Moving a center and Levert will create plenty of minutes/opportunity for Jackson, Duarte, Goga And Brissett. Sounds like the center that gets moved will be the one who brings the best return. If we are taking that route I’d guess Brogdan will be available ASAP. Can he be traded after season’s end but before the draft?
agkagk
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,545
And1: 930
Joined: Sep 03, 2011

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#15 » by agkagk » Wed Dec 8, 2021 1:10 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:
agkagk wrote:From the outside looking in (raptors fan) I’m not buying it.

Pacers are one of the better programs in the league. You guys continually produce players without tanking.

Frankly, your team is loaded with talent, just the wrong mix.


A lotta talent, but poor fitting right now. Mostly the Levert part. The roster was tailor made to excel with a healthy, prime Oladipo as the 2 guard, as he and Brogdon complemented each other perfectly (in theory). Turning an all-defense 2 guard who could handle PG's into Levert was just a massive downgrade in terms of making the roster more clunky than anything.



Selling high on sabonis and getting a couple of pieces that better compliment Malcolm, Duarte, turner etc is the better play.

Worse case scenario, You guys do just fine drafting in the teens.
User avatar
Scoot McGroot
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 35,161
And1: 7,209
Joined: Feb 16, 2005
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#16 » by Scoot McGroot » Wed Dec 8, 2021 1:25 am

8305 wrote:Moving a center and Levert will create plenty of minutes/opportunity for Jackson, Duarte, Goga And Brissett. Sounds like the center that gets moved will be the one who brings the best return. If we are taking that route I’d guess Brogdan will be available ASAP. Can he be traded after season’s end but before the draft?



Theoretically, yes. However, it’d essentially be a draft time deal, or one agreed to around draft day that would be executed after the league year rolls over on July 1.
User avatar
Wizop
RealGM
Posts: 12,640
And1: 2,342
Joined: Jun 15, 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Contact:
   

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#17 » by Wizop » Wed Dec 8, 2021 1:45 am

Apparently Carlisle met with LeVert, Brogdon, Turner, and Sabonis after practice. Sounds like the message was we want to win with you but you aren't untouchable.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using RealGM mobile app
Please edit long quotes to only show what puts your new message into context.
dkb965
Junior
Posts: 320
And1: 211
Joined: Sep 30, 2021
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#18 » by dkb965 » Wed Dec 8, 2021 2:14 am

How about Sabonis/Holiday for Anunoby/Boucher?

VanVleet/Banton/Flynn
Trent JR/Mykhailiuk/Holiday/Johnson
Barnes/Watanable/Champagine
Siakam/Achiuwa/Bonga
Sabonis/Birch

Brogdon/McConnel/Wanamaker
LeVert/Duarte/Lamb
Anunoby/Craig/Brissett
Warren/Boucher/Jackson/Martin
Turner/Bitdaze
Pacers Forever
Senior
Posts: 669
And1: 143
Joined: Nov 21, 2020
     

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#19 » by Pacers Forever » Wed Dec 8, 2021 2:24 am

dkb965 wrote:How about Sabonis/Holiday for Anunoby/Boucher?

VanVleet/Banton/Flynn
Trent JR/Mykhailiuk/Holiday/Johnson
Barnes/Watanable/Champagine
Siakam/Achiuwa/Bonga
Sabonis/Birch

Brogdon/McConnel/Wanamaker
LeVert/Duarte/Lamb
Anunoby/Craig/Brissett
Warren/Boucher/Jackson/Martin
Turner/Bitdaze


Love Anunoby’s game but definitely not a fan of Boucher. Would rather have draft picks and take a flyer on Banton. Also really like Barnes’s abilities but I’m sure he’s untouchable.
Topofthekey
Analyst
Posts: 3,466
And1: 1,326
Joined: Nov 18, 2017

Re: Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks 

Post#20 » by Topofthekey » Wed Dec 8, 2021 3:22 am

They need to forget about Warren and LeVert ever getting healthy, and assemble a proper starting 5

Treat Warren and LeVert as super backups if and when they are available. Don't mess with the continuity and chemistry of the team by constantly shuffling the starting lineup around. The team can never find an identity like that. Just treat Warren and LeVert as superweapons off the bench, whenever they are available

Slide Brogdon and Duarte to the 2 and 3, and get a proper floor general to start at 1. Try to pry Rubio from the Cavaliers

Myles, Domas, Duarte, Brogdon, Rubio

Play that lineup for the rest of the season and let them gel and develope an identity. They can shuffle Warren and LeVert in and out of the bench rotation, but leave the starting 5 intact

Trade Brogdon for a better 3 in the off-season if needed and slide Duarte back to the 2

Return to Indiana Pacers