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bondom34 wrote:

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Wow! $30 million a year for Allen how much will Myles Turner be costing?

basketballwacko2 wrote:

bondom34 wrote:

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Wow! $30 million a year for Allen how much will Myles Turner be costing?

Technically with the renegotiation & extension.... Myles got just over 25M a year. It's just that 35 mill of that was paid in the first year. With him being a UFA & having a high demand skill-set... Yeah.. I can see him getting 30M a year plus in AAV. I'm just hoping that he wants to stay in Indy,...is willing to take number that is fair, but on the low end of fair,... and a number that the team is willing to give & still has room to build around.

With our current cap numbers,... that isn't going to be easy. But, I don't yet believe that is impossible.

Myles can’t legally extend, because not enough time will have elapsed from his renegotiation.

I would imagine that Myles sees Allen, Porzingis, Hartenstein, Claxton, and others getting $25-30ish million and probably will be asking for a similar number? And with 25/26’s cap likely coming in around $156m, $30m isn’t too much to ask.

The question remains whether we can afford both Turner and Nembhard.

Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain. This year should really solidify Nembhard and Mathurin’s roles moving forward. If Mathurin pops and needs to get paid decently then someone will need to go. Not a bad problem to have.

GreatBuchinsky wrote:Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain.

I'm pretty sure starters' money will be over 25 in 2025-26.

I actually think everybody parts ways after this contract. Obviously I could be wrong, but I really think so.

GreatBuchinsky wrote:Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain. This year should really solidify Nembhard and Mathurin’s roles moving forward. If Mathurin pops and needs to get paid decently then someone will need to go. Not a bad problem to have.

Remember that $30m next year on a projected $154m salary cap is still only 19.5% of the salary cap. That’s still just starter money and nowhere near all star money. His rookie contract extension gave him 16-17% of the salary cap. His renegotiation gave him about 20-21% of the salary cap. $30m would largely keep him at the same relative salary he’s had the last 6 years. In fact, it would still technically be a “pay cut”.

The numbers will sound so much larger nowadays, but per nba salary cap inflation, $30m per year is almost a pay cut for Myles…. Which is WILD!

I recommend thinking percentages rather than dollars so you don't have to factor in the new cap. instead of saying 20-25m say 18-20%. that avoids sticker shock.

That’s fair. Haliburton and Siakam will be making slightly under 30% of the cap each. 20% of cap for Turner would start at $29m. I guess my concerns are more around who gets sacrificed to retain Turner at that number? TJ,Toppin and IJax I’d be fine with. Biggest outstanding question to me is what happens if Mathurin pops and needs a 20% of cap extension?

GreatBuchinsky wrote:That’s fair. Haliburton and Siakam will be making slightly under 30% of the cap each. 20% of cap for Turner would start at $29m. I guess my concerns are more around who gets sacrificed to retain Turner at that number? TJ,Toppin and IJax I’d be fine with. Biggest outstanding question to me is what happens if Mathurin pops and needs a 20% of cap extension?

Depends on what happens with Myles, McConnell, and Jackson? Also, at that point, I’m sure Obi would be long gone, and Nesmith wouid be entering the final year of his deal. Maybe Siakam is dealt? Maybe some of the smaller, but sizable deals are combined in some sort of deal for a long term, affordable contract? Mostly, that’s in two seasons, and an awful lot can change by then that you don’t push out a Myles Turner or someone early just for fear of what to do if Mathurin breaks out?

GreatBuchinsky wrote:Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain. This year should really solidify Nembhard and Mathurin’s roles moving forward. If Mathurin pops and needs to get paid decently then someone will need to go. Not a bad problem to have.

Do you think Allen is worth more than Turner?

boomershadow wrote:I actually think everybody parts ways after this contract. Obviously I could be wrong, but I really think so.

If that's the case then I think he'd be traded at the deadline. The the question is, "Will Jackson or Wiseman be able to handle the starting job."

basketballwacko2 wrote:

GreatBuchinsky wrote:Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain. This year should really solidify Nembhard and Mathurin’s roles moving forward. If Mathurin pops and needs to get paid decently then someone will need to go. Not a bad problem to have.

Do you think Allen is worth more than Turner?

Allen is overall a better player. He’s been an All-Star and is a better rebounder and defender. I don’t love the Allen deal either as he and Mobley aren’t a great fit with neither being able to shoot.

I'm comfortable paying Myles even if it means trading some combination of Nembhard, Nesmith, and Toppin to a team with enough cap space to only send one SF on a rookie contract back. But I think Nembhard's extension means he can't be traded for months. Scoot probably has the date. In other messages, Scoot has said he expects Toppin to be traded. That wouldn't be my first or second choice.

GreatBuchinsky wrote:

basketballwacko2 wrote:

GreatBuchinsky wrote:Personally I’d go $20-25m/yr tops for Turner. He’s a quality starter but not worth paying him All-Star level money to retain. This year should really solidify Nembhard and Mathurin’s roles moving forward. If Mathurin pops and needs to get paid decently then someone will need to go. Not a bad problem to have.

Do you think Allen is worth more than Turner?

Allen is overall a better player. He’s been an All-Star and is a better rebounder and defender. I don’t love the Allen deal either as he and Mobley aren’t a great fit with neither being able to shoot.

Allen is not a better player, his is a non factor if he's more than 8 feet from the basket, Turner shot 35.8% from 3 pt range during the season and 45% in the playoffs. Turner blocked 1.9 shots per game, Allen blocked 1.1 shots per game. Allen is a better rebounder but it's mostly offensive rebounds and there's a reason Turner doesn't get as many because he is more on the outside of offense shooting 3s and on defense a shot blocker at times is out of position to rebound because he's blocking and changing shots.

Allen is not garbage by any means but he's not a better or more impactful player than Turner.

Wizop wrote:I'm comfortable paying Myles even if it means trading some combination of Nembhard, Nesmith, and Toppin to a team with enough cap space to only send one SF on a rookie contract back. But I think Nembhard's extension means he can't be traded for months. Scoot probably has the date. In other messages, Scoot has said he expects Toppin to be traded. That wouldn't be my first or second choice.

I'd have no problem giving Turner $30 million for 5 years with the 5th year maybe $10 million guaranteed. I can't see the Pacers paying Luxury Tax, so something will have to be done. I expect Mathurnin to have a good season so then the team has a problem to decide who to keep. Let's hope they don't make another bone head move like the Jonathon Bender over Brad Miller choice years ago.

Love Myles and think that he's the best center for this core.

That said, what do you think are the chances he does a Jalen Brunson and signs for less than market value? I think the stars are aligned enough for the FO to pull it off.

OnFire wrote:Love Myles and think that he's the best center for this core.

That said, what do you think are the chances he does a Jalen Brunson and signs for less than market value? I think the stars are aligned enough for the FO to pull it off.

he'll be an UFA so his agents will be able to check his options. I'd say there's a non-zero chance he'd listen to the front office saying if we pay you more than X we're going to have to trade some players to get total payroll below the apron. but a trade of Nembhard, Nesmith, or Toppin to eliminate the crunch wouldn't surprise or disappoint me.

OnFire wrote:Love Myles and think that he's the best center for this core.

That said, what do you think are the chances he does a Jalen Brunson and signs for less than market value? I think the stars are aligned enough for the FO to pull it off.

I think the only way he takes meaningfully less is if Indy is willing to give him a no trade clause as part of his new contract. Even then, if you’re Indy, so you want to give him 3/$80 or 4/115 if it means giving him a no trade clause? And still having to trade one or more guys to stay under the tax?