building the team up

fredjones20 · Post #1 » by **fredjones20** » Fri Feb 1, 2008 9:05 pm

reading a chat with j.a. adande on espn.com he said that the griz are trying to follow the "portland" model in building teams...trade away stars or players with long contracts for expiring contracts and draft picks...this makes me think why shouldnt the pacers follow suit?

trade away a j.o. or murphy or dunleavy..who all have long contracts for players who might not be as good now but will be off the books and give us space to sign f.a. and get some draft picks along the way to help a struggling team...obviously 1 trade is not going to help i think its going to take time as well and i think this could be the way to do so

Post #2 » by **mizzoupacers** » Fri Feb 1, 2008 9:47 pm

I read somebody somewhere who made a really good point about the Blazers and rebuilding...they have an extremely deep-pocketed owner who was willing to absorb some pretty big financial losses to help turn things around more quickly.

Portland was able to dump Zach Randolph because their owner was willing to buy out Steve Francis, and they were able to get the pick they used on Brandon Roy by taking on Raef Lafrentz for two years.

Although I think the Simons have been terrific owners, I can't see them absorbing those kinds of losses.

I want to see the Pacers rebuild, but rebuilding is seldom as easy as the Trailblazers are making it look. Not only does it seem extremely unlikely to me that the Pacers can withstand the same financial hits as Portland, but it also seems unlikely that we would ever in the space of two drafts have a #1, a #2, and a #6 pick, and be able to parlay them into a potential all-time great center, a solid double-double power forward, and a guy who makes the All-Star team in his second season.

Post #3 » by **Grang33r** » Fri Feb 1, 2008 10:15 pm

www.absolutepacers.com (no clue how credible it is, i just came across it today) reports that Peter Vescey tells them that the only "untouchable" is Mike Dunleavy Jr. I know it sounds weird but Vescey has probably the most knowledge on the Pacers then anyone in the press. He knows everything about us before anyone does. Maybe.... maybe this is just a hint that we are working on a big deal with O'Neal and Granger?

I never really thought of it until i read this.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #4 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 1:23 am

Grang33r wrote:www.absolutepacers.com (no clue how credible it is, i just came across it today) reports that Peter Vescey tells them that the only "untouchable" is Mike Dunleavy Jr. I know it sounds weird but Vescey has probably the most knowledge on the Pacers then anyone in the press. He knows everything about us before anyone does. Maybe.... maybe this is just a hint that we are working on a big deal with O'Neal and Granger?

I never really thought of it until i read this.

If we trade Granger and don't get the most unbelievable steal ever I will not watch another game this year. I will lose all faith in Larry Bird.

Obviously, I would still be a Pacer fan. But this would just destroy any faith I have in the Pacers front office.

writerman · Post #5 » by **writerman** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 3:13 am

or trade him for picks and expirings. He's never going to be healthy again, IMO.

Find some way, any way, to get rid of Murphy and Tinsley.

Keepers; Dun, Danny, Rush, Foster, Shawne, Quis, and maybe Ike and Travis. And other than Danny and Dunleavy--who has turned into our best player--all the rest are tradeable.

Build through the draft. Slow, but eventually we will be successful again.

Anyone else, move them in any way possible.

Post #6 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 3:29 am

writerman wrote:or trade him for picks and expirings. He's never going to be healthy again, IMO.

Granger's on a cheap contract and he IS healthy. Why would you trade him for expirings or claim he's not healthy??????

writerman · Post #7 » by **writerman** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 3:48 am

Scoot McGroot wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Granger's on a cheap contract and he IS healthy. Why would you trade him for expirings or claim he's not healthy??????

Sorry if I wasn't clear--I was talking about Jermaine.

Post #8 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 3:52 am

Ah, that's a whole other story. It looked like you were continuing the conversation about Granger that other posters had started.

Post #9 » by **Grang33r** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 4:04 am

DGrangeRx33 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

If we trade Granger and don't get the most unbelievable steal ever I will not watch another game this year. I will lose all faith in Larry Bird.

Obviously, I would still be a Pacer fan. But this would just destroy any faith I have in the Pacers front office.

I agree. And honestly, i'd go a little bit farther then that. If they deal Granger, there better be another deal with it if not 2 more. If they deal Granger for like Barbosa or something, they better have plans already set in stone of making deals with O'Neal and Tinsley too. If they wanna over haul this roster like that, they better not stop with just one deal.

ajizzle · Post #10 » by **ajizzle** » Sat Feb 2, 2008 1:19 pm

I had suggested the Gasol-Laker deal for JO, except w/ the addition of Radmanovic to make the contracts match... but a lot of fans didn't like it. And for good reason...

But unfortunately, that the harsh reality when dealing stars in the NBA, and Gasol probably has more value than JO at this point. If we trade JO, we're probably not gonna get more than $0.75 to the dollar for him, and that could be an overestimation.

I love JO, and I would actually rather see him have success here, but the Griz got 2 1st-rdrs, a 2nd, an 2 expirings worth $10 mil, and a decent combo G. That's picks, youth, and cap space: THE TRIFECTA! I hope we can do better, but it's not likely...

Post #11 » by **mizzoupacers** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:02 pm

I wouldn't try to trade JO while he is injured, we would get low-balled something fierce.

I think it's better to sit him for a good long time (I'd be fine with the rest of this season), try to get him healthy again, and then revisit it.

If worst comes to worst and he doesn't ever get healthy again, then we get lottery picks each summer while he fails to earn his huge salary, and then in two years we clear $20+ million off the payroll. Seems to me like that fits in OK with a long-range rebuild-through-the-draft plan.

If we decide to completely rebuild, it's Murphy and Tinsley who are freaking going to kill us, not O'Neal.

Post #12 » by **mizzoupacers** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 4:07 pm

ajizzle wrote:I love JO, and I would actually rather see him have success here, but the Griz got 2 1st-rdrs, a 2nd, an 2 expirings worth $10 mil, and a decent combo G. That's picks, youth, and cap space: THE TRIFECTA! I hope we can do better, but it's not likely...

Ehh, they got crap, they got two dimes, a nickel, and maybe a quarter for a dollar bill.

The one worthwhile thing Memphis did get was a ton of instant cap space. If they can do something with that cap space next summer, then the Grizzlies won't be completely screwed.

Post #13 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Mon Feb 4, 2008 11:11 pm

ajizzle wrote:
But unfortunately, that the harsh reality when dealing stars in the NBA, and Gasol probably has more value than JO at this point. If we trade JO, we're probably not gonna get more than $0.75 to the dollar for him, and that could be an overestimation.

I don't know, Gasol has played just about as many games as JO has over the past 4 years. They've both been injured for essentially 4 years straight.