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I'm tired of the whining. Give Brandon Rush a chance before you cry about this deal. Honestly, neither of these guys (Bayless and Rush) have played an NBA minute. I think of Rush as a better and more consistent version of James Posey. A winner. Maybe Bayless is the next Gilbert Arenas, but how many championships does Gilbert have? How many does Posey have? Rush already won a championship on the NCAA level. I don't care about stat stuffers, I want a guy who wins his teams basketball games.

Rush is going to make this team and especially Granger a lot better. He's the Robin to Granger's Batman. A guy who can do a little bit of everything including playing stellar defense. Granger and Rush should be an awesome defensive swingman tandem. It also allows us to go with a lineup of Ford-Rush-Dunleavy-Granger-Hibbert which could be dangerous in stretches.

So without anything else, welcome Brandon Rush...

Perfect!

100% agreed.

Welcome Brandon and Big Roy!!!

Now we have the Rush tandem. He get's to play with his older brother. I like Jack's mental toughness. I don't really know how I feel about Hibbert but I will give him a shot.

i couldn't be more disappointed...i was so happy when we got bayless and now this..I'll be glad when Bird is fired.

PacersRule07 wrote:I'm tired of the whining. Give Brandon Rush a chance before you cry about this deal. Honestly, neither of these guys (Bayless and Rush) have played an NBA minute. I think of Rush as a better and more consistent version of James Posey. A winner. Maybe Bayless is the next Gilbert Arenas, but how many championships does Gilbert have? How many does Posey have? Rush already won a championship on the NCAA level. I don't care about stat stuffers, I want a guy who wins his teams basketball games.

Rush is going to make this team and especially Granger a lot better. He's the Robin to Granger's Batman. A guy who can do a little bit of everything including playing stellar defense. Granger and Rush should be an awesome defensive swingman tandem. It also allows us to go with a lineup of Ford-Rush-Dunleavy-Granger-Hibbert which could be dangerous in stretches.

So without anything else, welcome Brandon Rush...

No offense, but I think we have a right. We traded away a top 5 talent in this draft for about the 15th best talent. We traded a guy that could fit long-term for a guy that seems to only fit best with a head coach that won't be here after the upcoming season.


I take Gilbert Arenas 100 times out of 10 over James Posey, and surround him with talent that will help him win. James Posey doesn't win games. He simply signs with teams that win games and rides along. Big difference.



If we get more than just Jack, Rush, and McRoberts, I'm ok with it. If we get Rodriguez instead of McRoberts, I'm ok. If we get the #27 as well as McRoberts, I'm relatively ok with it.



If the deal ended up being Bayless and Diogu for Rush, Jack, Arthur, and McRoberts, I'll be pretty ok. If the deal ends up being Bayless and Diogu for Rush, Jack, and McRoberts, I'm not so sold.


It's not that I hate Rush. In fact, I like him. I just think that he could've been had a bit later, and isn't nearly as good as Bayless, who we were lucky that fell to us. I'm still hoping the deal falls apart, or that we get a better deal in the end.

Rush will be a good player for this team, no matter who the head coach is. He's the ultimate gel guy.

Maybe the experts think he's the better player, and maybe he is. However, are the experts right on everything? Absolutely not. You want to talk about Arenas, Arenas wasn't even rated a Top 10 player in his draft and didn't even get picked in the first round.

All I'm saying is give Rush a chance. I think you'll be surprised at just how better he makes this team.

Bayless could be better, but he also might now. I think it's hard to say this was a bad trade when neither has played an NBA minute, and Rush already has the winning record on Bayless.

Scoot McGroot wrote:James Posey doesn't win games. He simply signs with teams that win games and rides along. Big difference.

I'm sorry, but I can't agree with this at all.

Posey may not carry his team to the championship, but he wins games. He hits big shots, he defends, and he does all the little things that help a team win. I don't think you can say he rides along. That's absolutely not true. He's hit huge shots in the postseason and has played awesome defense. I think the Celtics may even lose the Finals if he's not on that team.

It seems to me that a lot of people were already looking for something to whine about, and this was just their easy ticket.

Jeff Van Gundy, "Resign James Posey. Huge impact, hit big shots, defensive tenacity. He was the force behind that team."

Nah, I was ecstatic. Bayless was a solid pick. Rush may be too, but not at the cost of Bayless. In addition to Bayless, it'd be great.


However, I disagree in general with your assessment. Other than Stan Van Gundy and his thoughts, I think Posey is a hanger-on. He didn't help Denver, Memphis, nor Houston win games for the first 7 years of his career, and he didn't help Miami win games when they lost in the 1st round in 06-07.


He's really been inflated for the fact he played for Miami and Boston the years they won the championship. He may have helped, but he sure ain't no 'Big Shot Rob' Horry.

Boston is going to resign james posey b/c he is a great role player...take away allen and garnett and he would win you 0 games..horrible move by Bird

So, suddenly Bayless is Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen? Hmmm...I don't remember him playing an NBA minute

I'm also not saying Rush is a clone of Posey, but he brings that type of game. Rush will be better than Posey because he will bring it every night. Kid's a winner. We need those type of guys.

Bayless's team underachieved all year (started as a Top 10) and got knocked out of the first round of the tourney. Know who else did that? Jamaal Tinsley. He had Budinger on that team too, so it's not like they didn't have the talent.

Too many people get caught up in rating and hype.

When the Colts took Bob Sanders, I remember looking at the t.v. and thinking, "Great, who the heck is this guy?" Some guy obviously drafted too high (it was in round 2). However, I looked at the highlights, and I saw, wow, this guy could be a player for us. Needless to say, he is.

I'm disappointed because I think that we have a lot of gel guys. In fact, our entire team is gel guys. We need a lead player. Granger has that talent, but not that mentality. I was thrilled with Bayless because he does have that mentality. I'm willing to give Rush credit and hope that he's a Tayshaun Prince type of player which is great, but I'd rather have Chauncey Billups you know? We have needed a guy that can take his guy off the dribble and get his shot whenever he needs it. I was so happy Bayless dropped. Now I'm bummed...and I even like Jarrett Jack.

We have TJ Ford. He's 25 years old. It's not like Tinsley is going to be playing for us anytime soon.

OK so Bayless hasn't played an NBA minute, you know who else hasn't played an NBA minute?
Ricky McDooglepants thats who! (with a nod to Dgrangerx33) do you really think that we don't have a right to be disappointed because a potential star got traded away for a likely role player and possible bust? Give me a break. This doesn't even have to do with Rush, we could have traded Bayless away for ANYBODY in the draft at that point and it would have been disappointing.

Raptor fan here that will now be watching all Pacer games. Tj and Rush backcourt? Thats great.

Orlock78 wrote:OK so Bayless hasn't played an NBA minute, you know who else hasn't played an NBA minute?
Ricky McDooglepants thats who! (with a nod to Dgrangerx33) do you really think that we don't have a right to be disappointed because a potential star got traded away for a likely role player and possible bust? Give me a break. This doesn't even have to do with Rush, we could have traded Bayless away for ANYBODY in the draft at that point and it would have been disappointing.

McRoberts is nothing more than filler...if they could've taken a gift certificate to Chili's instead they would've.

They wanted Rush, who I think they're projecting as the future starting 2 guard, and Jack as the backup point guard, who should be a good upgrade at that position. They also got two guys who will help the perimeter defense, which was a focus.

Yes, I would've preferred to keep Bayless, but my fear isn't that we didn't get two good productive players out of this deal...it's that Bayless may become a star.

I do hate the trade that brought you here, Brandon Rush, but welcome to the Pacers, and I will certainly keep an open mind about you.

I think Rush has a good chance of becoming a solid enough two guard for us, and we do need a solid two guard. I also think that Jack will be an upgrade for us at backup pg. Welcome to you as well, Jack.

Sigh...I just wish Bird had not fumbled away the unexpected chance to get a real difference-maker for a couple of guys who are most likely going to be role players on our perennially average team. Chances to get a real difference-maker don't come along very often.

Still, if you had told me a month ago that we would come out of this draft with Rush, Hibbert, and Jack, and that we'd have an upgrade at starting pg in Ford, and that our awful salary situation would be significantly improved, I'd have been pretty happy with that. I'm going to keep reminding myself of that, and after tonight I will try not grouse about trading Bayless.

PacersRule07 wrote:So, suddenly Bayless is Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen? Hmmm...I don't remember him playing an NBA minute

I'm also not saying Rush is a clone of Posey, but he brings that type of game. Rush will be better than Posey because he will bring it every night. Kid's a winner. We need those type of guys.

Bayless's team underachieved all year (started as a Top 10) and got knocked out of the first round of the tourney. Know who else did that? Jamaal Tinsley. He had Budinger on that team too, so it's not like they didn't have the talent.

Too many people get caught up in rating and hype.

When the Colts took Bob Sanders, I remember looking at the t.v. and thinking, "Great, who the heck is this guy?" Some guy obviously drafted too high (it was in round 2). However, I looked at the highlights, and I saw, wow, this guy could be a player for us. Needless to say, he is.

I don't get this. Rush was a junior on a well loaded team and a well coached team. Bayless was a freshman on a team that ended up coached half the season by a guy we desperately wanted out of Indy as an assistant in Kevin O'Neill. He almost never saw the actual coach of that team. Think that, and the fact they were led by two freshmen didn't have something to do with the fact they underachieved?

It's too much to compare their college situations, and it's too much to call Rush a Bob Sanders impact when Rush may have had great highlights, but Bayless looked even better.


And Rush better be better than Posey. If not, we got seriously hosed.


I think somebody's getting a little caught up in the fact that Brandon Rush played on a championship team with about 7 other guys that were drafted tonight. Hell, I think the Lakers just drafted Bill Self!

lol

It doesn't matter if Bayless was a 6th year senior. Great players find ways to win games. I never saw Bayless make him teamates better, and I surprisingly was able to catch like 4 Arizona games last season. You're telling me that a team of Bayless and Budinger shouldn't have beat Joe Alexander's WVU team and a bunch of misfits?

Rush may not have the numbers of Bayless, but give me a guy that wins games. That's what the Pacers had in the 90's, a group of guys that did a lot of the little things really well. Rush is a throw-back player like that.

I'm not saying Brandon Rush is Bob Sanders by any means, but what I am saying is that don't judge a player based on draft rankings and hype. Bob Sanders was one of the best players in that draft, and I guarantee you no one outside of NFL personnel and Big 10 coaches knew a thing about him. I sure didn't, and I study the draft. Apparently, other GM's didn't either.

If Championships are the ultimate goal, than yes, maybe I should judge people on how they win. I'm not watching to watch players play no defense in all-star games. It's why Derek Jeter will always be better than AROD in New York.

What makes Bayless better? Mock drafts? Chad Ford? Let them step on the NBA Court, and we'll see. Bayless might score better, but ultimately, he may not help teams win.

(See: Carmelo Anthony vs. Tayshaun Prince)