Heat - Pacer trade

[Hoops23]

Heat receives Tins and Foster

Pacer receives Banks and Blount

[notque]

I'd rather us just sit tinsley than to lose foster for nothing.

What do the numbers come out like? Do we at least get cap room out of this?

[FreeRon]

We would get Blount's $7-8 million contract for the next two years and Banks $4-5 million for the next three. It would save us a little this year, a lot next year considering Jeff will be a FA, and the same the third year. To me, though, we can save almost that much buying out Tinsley and not lose Jeff in the process. Banks brings as many problems as we've had with Tinsley, and I'm not 100% sure I wouldn't be better in the NBA than Blount is. That seems like an exaggeration, but I can't for the life of me figure out how a guy's lasted that long in the NBA being the opposite of a Jeff Foster.

[APerna]

No way I'd agree to that.

If we are going to give up Foster in any deal to Miami, we need to get Haslem.

[Dunthreevy]

No way I'd agree to that.

If we are going to give up Foster in any deal to Miami, we need to get Haslem.

My thoughts exactly. If there's some way we could get Haslem, we NEED to do it.

[basketballwacko2]

Replace Foster with Rasho and i'd probably do that, Rasho and JT for Banks and Blount, we save about $2.4 million on that deal this yr but take an extra yr with Blount, but since he is expiring at the end of the 2009-10 season I don't think we'd have any trouble moving him next summer.

[cdash]

No way. Not even if you replace Foster with Rasho.

[count55]

I terms of actual committed money, this would cost us about $3.0mm more, but that does assume that we wouldn't re-sign Foster.

In any deal with Miami for JT, we know we would at least have to take back Banks. This is the only way to minimize the impact of Droopy's 2011 salary on their 2010 strategy. If the big contract we get back is Blount, then the expiring I would be willing to part with is Daniels. I might consider Rasho (which we could do after Sept 9, if I read the rules correctly), but that would be far from a sure thing.

It's far more likely that if they were to insist on either Rasho or, specifically, Foster, that I would insist on Haslem instead of Blount. In fact, if Miami insisted on Foster, but were only offering Blount, then I'd want a future draft pick before including Foster. I understand Miami might find that prohibitive, but throwing Foster in for basically nothing is worse, in my mind, than buying out Jamaal.

[bballpacen]

No way I'd agree to that.

If we are going to give up Foster in any deal to Miami, we need to get Haslem.

I am not rushing to get rid of Tinsley... I am not willing to take on salary, but I would also not be willing to take on dead weight either... Especially if Foster is included... I want to get a player back... and Haslem would have to be it...

[bballpacen]

It's far more likely that if they were to insist on either Rasho or, specifically, Foster, that I would insist on Haslem instead of Blount. In fact, if Miami insisted on Foster, but were only offering Blount, then I'd want a future draft pick before including Foster. I understand Miami might find that prohibitive, but throwing Foster in for basically nothing is worse, in my mind, than buying out Jamaal.

A man of wisdom... If they dont want to give up Haslem or a first... so be it, then I would be willing to stand pat for the moment... I dont feel that we need to rush into some move...

[CableKC]

I am in favor of Rasho+Tinsley for Banks+Haslem. With a Foster/Haslem/Hibbert rotation....we would be a top 3 Offensive Rebounding team!

[cdash]

I am in favor of Rasho+Tinsley for Banks+Haslem. With a Foster/Haslem/Hibbert rotation....we would be a top 3 Offensive Rebounding team!

That I would go for. That fills two huge holes for Miami (or helps anyway), fills a need for us as a post-scoring power forward, and rids us of Tinsley. Works for me. Banks can run the point for the Mad Ants for all I care, he is only involved because the Suns were dumb enough to give him a generous contract.

[Wizop]

I went to a Pacer affair yesterday at Larry Bird's Brown county ranch for season ticket holders who renewed quickly. I saw five players there: Foster, Dunleavy, Rush, Hibbert, and McRoberts. (it is possible that half the group was invited Saturday and another group is going Sunday and will see different players.) Anyway, I got the sense yesterday that with JO gone and Tinsley headed out Foster has stepped up to fill the here's how we do things in Indiana role. I've reduced the probability of a Foster trade significantly. I now think it'd take a offer we couldn't refuse to move him now.

I suppose the likelihood would increase at the trading deadline as offers could be better and we'd know whether we were in playoff contention. it's way too early to speculate how agressively we should try to resign him next summer but we might want to exceed the MLE or even offer starter's money.

[greenway84]

Indiana Trade Incoming Players
Udonis Haslem - Needed PF
Mark Blount - Not Tinsley
Keith Bogans or Reddick - Role player

WHY IND: Rid ourselves of Tinsley, get a needed pf

Miami Trade Incoming Players
Shawne Williams - Young, Exp
Jamaal Tinsley - Needed starting PG
Rasho Nesterovic - Needed starting C, Huge Exp
Brian Cook - Role player, Exp

WHY MIA: Lot of Exp, Obtain two starting players of much needed position, Get some depth and young pieces.

Orlando Trade Incoming Players
Marcus Banks - Needed backup PG
IND 2nd - Potentially high pick

WHY ORL: Gets the backup pg they've been looking for for cheaper than Tinsley without the off court issues. They get what should be a good pick.

[CableKC]

Indiana Trade Incoming Players
Udonis Haslem - Needed PF
Mark Blount - Not Tinsley
Keith Bogans or Reddick - Role player

WHY IND: Rid ourselves of Tinsley, get a needed pf

Miami Trade Incoming Players
Shawne Williams - Young, Exp
Jamaal Tinsley - Needed starting PG
Rasho Nesterovic - Needed starting C, Huge Exp
Brian Cook - Role player, Exp

WHY MIA: Lot of Exp, Obtain two starting players of much needed position, Get some depth and young pieces.

Orlando Trade Incoming Players
Marcus Banks - Needed backup PG
IND 2nd - Potentially high pick

WHY ORL: Gets the backup pg they've been looking for for cheaper than Tinsley without the off court issues. They get what should be a good pick.

Not bad....I'm not sure how much the Magic want to get a backup PG/SG like Banks....but for Frontcourt reasons....I don't think that they would want to get rid of Blount along with Haslem.

[greenway84]

Well as far as miami front court they would be getting back Cook, and Rasho.
Tinsley>Banks
Rasho>Blount
Shawne, Cook<Haslem
Not too mention this gives a bunch of Cap space that they keep talking about.

[greenway84]

This trade based off Hoopshype.com salaries would look like this assuming no players are resigned or added. Just based on what the traded players would alter their current salaries.

Miami Team Salary
2008/2009
Before trade: 63,888,839
After Trade: 62,500,798
08/09 savings= 1,388,041

2009/2010
Before trade: 45,893,701
After Trade: 41,531,201
08/09 savings= 4,362,500

2010/2011
Before trade: 21,901,243
After Trade: 24,761,243
08/09 costs= 2,860,000

08/09 + 09/10 combined savings = 5,750,541
5,750,541
- 2,860,000 10/11 costs
total savings of 2,890,541

They key to this is Miami saves almost 6 million before the big free agency. Not too mention over the course of all the players included in the trade they save almost 3 million and upgrade at PG, and C.

[count55]

Actually, from Miami's point of view, this deal hurts them on the cap. The year they are concerned about is the 2010/2011 season, where Tinsley's salary is $2.9mm higher than Banks'. The $21.9mm you show is kind of misleading because that, effectively, is only DWade and Banks. They would almost certainly pick up the options on Beasley, Chalmers, and Daequan Cook, which would add another $8.0mm in salaries. They also have $4.4 owed to James Jones, but it's partially unguaranteed. Also, they'll most likely either re-sign Marion, or, I believe their preference might be to deal him this season for a Josh Howard-type $10mm player (plus expring filler) which would put them around $40mm in salaries.

Their goal is to be able to offer a max contract to someone besided Wade, so they'd have to have at least $20.0 of unrestricted capspace. Depending on who/where they draft next year, what players they sign/acquire over the next couple years, that $2.9mm extra for JT could mean the difference between being able to offer a max contract to a guy like LeBron, Bosh, or Amare or not.

If they make a move for Tinsley, they will have to have decided that Tinsley can play, and that he's worth that risk of not being able to fulfill that 2010 strategy.