Week 11 - OAKLAND @ Detroit - Nov 22nd

[GoRapstheoriginal]

Yeah that was frustrating! Sigh!

[Twinkie defense]

From Jimmy Durkin's game grades:

"playing DJ Hayden over David Amerson continues to be a head-scratcher. Per PFF, Amerson was the team’s best player in pass coverage Sunday, while Hayden was the worst. Time to adjust the depth chart."

I agree.


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[HMFFL]

Very disappointing and frustrating loss like others have been this season.
The season has still been a bright one so I'm staying positive.
When we do lose, I remind myself about our draft position, so that does help.

[Quake Griffin]

From Jimmy Durkin's game grades:

"playing DJ Hayden over David Amerson continues to be a head-scratcher. Per PFF, Amerson was the team’s best player in pass coverage Sunday, while Hayden was the worst. Time to adjust the depth chart."

I agree.


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especially with Nate Allen back.

I''ve held out for DJ for a while. I'm no longer sipping the kool-aid.
let Amerson and Carrie work.

[benchmobbin02]

From Jimmy Durkin's game grades:

"playing DJ Hayden over David Amerson continues to be a head-scratcher. Per PFF, Amerson was the team’s best player in pass coverage Sunday, while Hayden was the worst. Time to adjust the depth chart."

I agree.


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especially with Nate Allen back.

I''ve held out for DJ for a while. I'm no longer sipping the kool-aid.
let Amerson and Carrie work.

They already started doing this in the second half. Hayden was playing slot with Amerson and Carrie on the outside. In this defense that is what these guys are most suited for. Hayden is our best slot corner strictly due to the fact that he is smaller, more agile and quicker then the other corners. Plus that puts our best players on the field. Hayden is still gonna get like 40 snaps a game cuz that is what a nickel corner normally gets.

[Twinkie defense]

Hayden isn't even the nickel right now... what do you call the seventh DB. He's in the penny package ?

[Quake Griffin]

Gil Brandt – Verified account ‏@Gil_Brandt

DBs w/ most passes defensed:

Amerson 19
Darby 19
Gilmore 18
House 17
M.Peters 15
Joseph 15
Norman 15
Mathieu 14
J.jenkins 13
Breaux 13
2:25 PM - 2 Dec 2015


_______________________________________

Gil Brandt ✔@Gil_Brandt
DBs w/ highest burn %

R. Parker 69%
Hayden 68%
A.Blake 66%
M.jenkins 66%
T.Johnson 66%
Browner 64%
J.Taylor 64%
Cockrell 63%
4:29 PM - 2 Dec 2015

[benchmobbin02]

Hayden isn't even the nickel right now... what do you call the seventh DB. He's in the penny package ?

Your right after the Detroit game, which is where my comment came from, they benched Hayden. He was getting burned and drawing too many flags. But an interesting thing happened in the Tennessee game. After 3 quarters of watching Nieko Thorpe look like a high school walk-on in the nickel Hayden was back on the field in the nickel.

I'm not saying Hayden is good or that we should keep him or that there aren't better guys out there. What I am saying is he is better then Thorpe and a better option at nickel then the rookies at this point.

[benchmobbin02]

I was wrong. I looked at the film again and Hayden is in but they are in dime sets. I didn't see that Woodson was playing in the box. He is actually on the line of scrimmage which kinda of hid his # when looking at the traditional football angle. So Hayden only playing when we have 6 DBs in the game. My bad.

[FNQ]

I'd prefer him over Thorpe in dimes too.. if Thorpe "gets it", we have a CB4. If Hadyen "gets it", we have a starting CB.

[Twinkie defense]

Thorpe definitely hasn't shined. Maybe Hayden will play more in nickel and dime sets but pushing him to the end of the bench is a way to try to shake him out of it - gushing praise obviously didn't help.


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[benchmobbin02]

But that's the thing...In nickel sets the 5 guys last week were Carrie, Amerson, Allen, Woodson/Mays and Thorpe and when we ran dime they added Hayden. So Hayden was lowered to cb4. I don't think that anyone that ever came in contact with Hayden ever gushed praise on him. Only fans making comments and on forums. We'll see how the depth chart looks next week to see if Thorpe played himself back to the bench and/or this was a one game sitting for Hayden for him to "get it".

BTW, Mays was the main Safety sub used over Asante this week and looked decent in coverage.

[Quake Griffin]

http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=ken+norton+prises+dj+hayden

[benchmobbin02]

Yeah, that was Oct 22 coming off the Broncos game where he was our best corner and going into the San Diego game where he played well again. We didn't see a real drop in his play til week 9 in Pitt where we didn't have Carrie and Brown went nuts. My point being that the praise can hardly be seen as a reason or catalyst for the poor play. In fact he had his two best games of the year after that.

Regardless of that, I think we have the right two guys starting now and I think we all hope that Hayden can be a plus contributor as the nickel or dime back. Would really be nice to have solid play from the secondary as we head into our season ending division games.

[Quake Griffin]

Oh.

You should make your points more clear.

Because the one that said, "I don't think that anyone that ever came in contact with Hayden ever gushed praise on him," wasn't true.

[FNQ]

http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=ken+norton+prises+dj+hayden

My theory: Hayden looked better in years 1 and 2 because we had crappy WRs in practice. Thus, confidence boosted, played better. Hayden was getting tooled by Cooper and Crabtree in practice (rightfully so) and the Raiders staff made the guess that Hayden is an emotional player who plays on momentum. For Warriors fans, think a year 1-3 Harrison Barnes. So they tried talking him up in the media. Well, it didnt work, because not only has he consistently been beat, he's not make any adjustments to what he's doing. So at this point he's more of a roster flier than a guy we should be looking at for legitimate contributions.

It sucks because he showed quite a bit of promise in year 1 and 2. Some DBs take time to adjust to the speed of the NFL game, as Hayden had no problem ballhawking in Houston. But that was likely because he was a top-caliber college athlete and had time to not only keep up with WRs, but turn on softer thrown balls. Sadly the adjustment has not been made and we have to hope there's a serious committment by him to improving, otherwise we're looking at a wasted pick. The silver lining is that we'd be one team among many who wasted picks in the 1st round of 2013.

[Twinkie defense]

I don't think DJ Hayden has EVER looked very good.

CBs are sure a crapshoot in the draft though, maybe the thing to do is take waivers on some late round CB prospects every single season.

[benchmobbin02]

There is no blue print. We have tried thru the draft, high and low picks, vet FAs and waiver wire guys with varied degrees of success. We just have to keep evaluating talent and keep a system so we know what we're scouting for and the guys we acquire can grow into it.

[FNQ]

Too many factors, and too many 1st round DBs wind up busting.. I'm usually not on board with drafting DBs in the 1st 2 rounds.

That said, Hayden showed great recovery speed and was just having problems locating the ball, and he did that extremely well in college. And that's exactly where he's at now, but now teams know he's not locating well so they feel confident at throwing at him. The potential to be really good is still there, but unlocking it after 3 years of stagnation is getting more unlikely by the day.