2022 Offseason thread

[Jikkle]

Interesting read by PFF about the situations for second-year QBs. Fields would be #1, except he's not clearly the starter at this point.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-grading-situations-second-year-quarterbacks-zach-wilson-trevor-lawrence-justin-fields-2022

Really took note of Fields' situation. That's brutal. That kid has legit talent IMO, but I don't know how he's supposed to make the most of it. They're setting him up for failure as things stand now. They did add a bunch of OL in the draft, but none before the fifth round. And his WRs are Darnell Mooney, a third-round pick in Velus, and a couple guys who underperformed despite excellent opportunities in their first stops.

I take it you mean Lance would be #1 not Fields?

Outside a questionable offensive line which is currently impossible to tell if it's going to be awful or at least decent, Lance has everything you would want as a young QB. Running game, targets to throw too, a top offensive-minded coach, and a strong defense to keep the pressure off of you.

That's a large reason I've been bullish on him because he has the physical skill set and reportedly the mental skill set as well along with the work ethic needed to be great. He just needs the reps and to take a few lumps and I think he'll be great. But if he fails it'll be because of him not because of the situation around him barring the offensive line being a complete diaster.

[CrimsonCrew]

Interesting read by PFF about the situations for second-year QBs. Fields would be #1, except he's not clearly the starter at this point.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-grading-situations-second-year-quarterbacks-zach-wilson-trevor-lawrence-justin-fields-2022

Really took note of Fields' situation. That's brutal. That kid has legit talent IMO, but I don't know how he's supposed to make the most of it. They're setting him up for failure as things stand now. They did add a bunch of OL in the draft, but none before the fifth round. And his WRs are Darnell Mooney, a third-round pick in Velus, and a couple guys who underperformed despite excellent opportunities in their first stops.

I take it you mean Lance would be #1 not Fields?

Outside a questionable offensive line which is currently impossible to tell if it's going to be awful or at least decent, Lance has everything you would want as a young QB. Running game, targets to throw too, a top offensive-minded coach, and a strong defense to keep the pressure off of you.

That's a large reason I've been bullish on him because he has the physical skill set and reportedly the mental skill set as well along with the work ethic needed to be great. He just needs the reps and to take a few lumps and I think he'll be great. But if he fails it'll be because of him not because of the situation around him barring the offensive line being a complete diaster.

Yeah, sorry, read the Fields one last and then posted. Lance would be #2. Fields is far and away the last.

[thesack12]

I'm thrilled with the Verrett signing. I've been hoping he would be brought back on the cheap, since he went down in week 1 last season. Can't get any cheaper than what they got him for.

The only real potential downside to the signing I can see is if he Jason takes the roster spot of one of the younger developmental guys like Lenoir or Womack or even Castro Fields and they end up getting poached.

Even with that, Verrett still has CB1 upside if he's mildly healthy, so its a move more than worth making. As always with him, you hope for the best while all but expecting him to get hurt. His contract reflects that standpoint, so if he does wind up getting hurt again you really aren't out anything (unless you lose one of the young developmentals.)

Verrett also seems like he's a quality locker room guy and should be a nice veteran presence for the youth in that position group. He's also a guy you can't help but root for on an individual basis, he has loads of talent but the injury bug has unfortunately marred his career and his pocketbook.

Love this move. Verrett could easily wind up missing most of the season again, but if not he will probably prove himself as the best CB on the team.

[thesack12]

Interesting read by PFF about the situations for second-year QBs. Fields would be #1, except he's not clearly the starter at this point.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-grading-situations-second-year-quarterbacks-zach-wilson-trevor-lawrence-justin-fields-2022

Really took note of Fields' situation. That's brutal. That kid has legit talent IMO, but I don't know how he's supposed to make the most of it. They're setting him up for failure as things stand now. They did add a bunch of OL in the draft, but none before the fifth round. And his WRs are Darnell Mooney, a third-round pick in Velus, and a couple guys who underperformed despite excellent opportunities in their first stops.

I take it you mean Lance would be #1 not Fields?

Outside a questionable offensive line which is currently impossible to tell if it's going to be awful or at least decent, Lance has everything you would want as a young QB. Running game, targets to throw too, a top offensive-minded coach, and a strong defense to keep the pressure off of you.

That's a large reason I've been bullish on him because he has the physical skill set and reportedly the mental skill set as well along with the work ethic needed to be great. He just needs the reps and to take a few lumps and I think he'll be great. But if he fails it'll be because of him not because of the situation around him barring the offensive line being a complete diaster.

I agree with you here, but I will add that Lance is also missing probably the most important thing to being successful.... A clear path to the starting job.

I still tend to believe that Jimmy won't break camp with the 49ers, but considering how this saga has played out so far Jimmy suiting up week 1 as a 49er is still very much in play.

[Pattersonca65]

This is a bit concerning if true. Always take these with a grain of salt but it would complicate things this fall.

https://larrybrownsports.com/football/trey-lance-not-impressing-49ers-coaching-staff/596279

[Pattersonca65]

I'm thrilled with the Verrett signing. I've been hoping he would be brought back on the cheap, since he went down in week 1 last season. Can't get any cheaper than what they got him for.

The only real potential downside to the signing I can see is if he Jason takes the roster spot of one of the younger developmental guys like Lenoir or Womack or even Castro Fields and they end up getting poached.

Even with that, Verrett still has CB1 upside if he's mildly healthy, so its a move more than worth making. As always with him, you hope for the best while all but expecting him to get hurt. His contract reflects that standpoint, so if he does wind up getting hurt again you really aren't out anything (unless you lose one of the young developmentals.)

Verrett also seems like he's a quality locker room guy and should be a nice veteran presence for the youth in that position group. He's also a guy you can't help but root for on an individual basis, he has loads of talent but the injury bug has unfortunately marred his career and his pocketbook.

Love this move. Verrett could easily wind up missing most of the season again, but if not he will probably prove himself as the best CB on the team.

I like it too. Low risk if it doesn't work out again. Not worried much about him taking a younger guy's job. Those younger guys will have their chance in camp and in practice to prove they are ready to go. It isn't going to be Verrett holding them back

[CrimsonCrew]

So, the Matt Lombardo, Trey Lance thing. I don't put a whole lot of stock in it. Seems to be old news at the very best. A lot of these national media guys are running with Garoppolo still being on the team despite the fact that it is absolutely crystal clear that they intended to trade him. You don't get a press conference like Jimmy's last, saying goodbye, etc. without the FO having told him they were moving on before the surgery mucked all that up.

That said, Lombardo was on 95.7 to further clarify the initial comments, and I found some comments pretty striking.

"This all stems from a conversation that I had with an executive who's pretty tight with people within the 49ers organization," Lombardo explained. "Then following up with a couple of members of the coaching staff. The feeling around San Francisco, dating back to last summer during training camp, was a little bit of disappointment over the Trey Lance that arrived in training camp versus what they saw on film at North Dakota State from an arm-strength standpoint, from a deep-ball accuracy standpoint."

I really hope that isn't true. If it is, the only thing I can wonder is, what film were they watching? Lance is not an accurate deep ball thrower of the football. He's not Jimmy, where there's maybe a 10% chance he'll get it in the right spot past 20 yards. And he has it in him to throw a beautiful deep ball. But it's not the sort of thing he did regularly, and he rarely did it into tight coverage. If they wanted an accurate deep ball thrower, they should have gone with Fields. I think the odds of Lance every becoming an automatic deep ball thrower are pretty slim, and it's one of the primary reasons I favored Fields over him. Lance isn't nearly in Fields' ballpark as a thrower of the football, and it would be entirely unforgiveable if they didn't know that going in.

That's not to say Fields will be the better pro - especially given the absolutely awful situation the Bears are putting him in. Lance may very well be the faster processor, better decision-maker, and play better under pressure, but a number of those things are tough to gauge based on the relative level of competition he faced in college and the scheme he ran. We know Fields can get flustered under pressure. We don't really know about Lance because he wasn't pressured a whole lot.

Anyway, Lance is the guy, so of course I'm hoping he can continue to grow and develop. I liked a lot of what I saw in the Texans game, and hopefully he can build on that.

[wco81]

Mike Lombardi keeps saying, if Lance is looking good in practice, the 49ers would be talking it up.

The silence speaks volumes, he thinks.

[CrimsonCrew]

Mike Lombardi keeps saying, if Lance is looking good in practice, the 49ers would be talking it up.

The silence speaks volumes, he thinks.

I'm not sure I agree. There haven't been true practices yet. And the last time there were, Jimmy was the QB. They weren't going to undermine their injured, struggling QB on they playoffs by talking up the rookie backup.

At the end of the day, it's a lot of off-season nonsense. We'll see what happens in late summer and the fall.

[Dodub]

Mike Lombardi keeps saying, if Lance is looking good in practice, the 49ers would be talking it up.

The silence speaks volumes, he thinks.

The thing is, Mike Lombardo isn’t listening or he’s flat out lying to get attention. I personally think that he’s lying to get attention.

The defense did talk Lance up, that’s what matters. Those are the guys who Lance went against every day and Warner, Ward and others have talked Lance up.

Shoot, even when the team had open practices. The media was completely blown away by him. I remember wathcing these guys drool over what they were seeing.

The fact is that this topic is an easy way to get clicks. It’s lazy journalism.

[CrimsonCrew]

Just to clarify, Matt Lombardo is the guy with the recent Lance story. I think he's based in Philly. Mike Lombardi is a former coach and current media guy. Not sure if wco81 had a typo or if these guys both made recent comments.

[CrimsonCrew]

Re: the report, I can't see questions as to his arm strength. He's clearly got a very strong arm. Again, that doesn't mean he's a great deep passer, but he's clearly got more than enough arm strength.

[wco81]

Just to clarify, Matt Lombardo is the guy with the recent Lance story. I think he's based in Philly. Mike Lombardi is a former coach and current media guy. Not sure if wco81 had a typo or if these guys both made recent comments.

No it's Lombardi on his podcast.

[Jikkle]

When it comes to the Trey Lance talk it's best to look at the actions taken rather than what's supposedly being said behind closed doors.

You can't completely buy what the team tells you about Lance but while you don't want to dismiss someone saying he heard something because it's negative you also have to take it with some skepticism as well. That's why I don't want to just brush away what Lombardo said but it's also hard to really give it much credence when it's 2nd hand from some executive that is supposed to be tight with the 9ers coaches.

The fact of the matter is they kept Jimmy G from the moment Lance was drafted which means they knew he was raw and was going to need development. It's not like they were pushing Lance as the starter and he started to falter so they went back to Jimmy. They were consistent about going with Jimmy and Lance probably needed to be way above expectations for them to pivot from that.

The 2nd thing is despite the fact Jimmy G is still on the roster the plan was to trade him and the surgery is what sunk that plan. If Kyle had legitimate fears with Lance they would keep Jimmy and just sell "Lance was extremely raw out of college and we feel giving him more time to develop so he's in the best position to succeed for the future of our franchise." line.

The turning point I felt with Lance was the final drive before the half in the Texans game. I thought that's when Lance loosened up and started to get comfortable which translated into the rest of the game but more importantly I thought that's when Shanahan started to loosen up and figured out how to call the game for Lance as prior to that it just felt like Shanahan had no feel for what to do with Lance (ie Cardinals joke of a gameplan).

[Jikkle]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[CrimsonCrew]

Yeah, that seems more accurate.

[Jikkle]

Read on Twitter

Rumor I came across for the 1st two 9ers games.

Also, Mostert posted something on IG to the effect of "see ya week 17" so some think that's when the 9ers vs Dolphins matchup happens.

Panthers and Falcons would be a nice soft start for Lance despite the fact they are road games. But having two early road games just means more home games later so I'm good with that as well. Additionally, we play the Cardinals in Mexico which is one of their home games so that's another slight advantage we get with the schedule.

[CrimsonCrew]

Against my better judgment, I was eating some lunch at my desk and clicked on this link:

Watch on YouTube

Nothing all that much worth watching, but they were talking about how Lance squandered his opportunity by putting in a lackluster performance against the Chargers in the preseason last year. I can't really remember that one, but I watched the highlights on Youtube. I'll post them below if anyone is interested. Lance went 8-14 for 102 yards, 2 TDs, and an INT. Jimmy was 3-6 for 15 yards and an INT.

Now, it's highlights, so we only see one of Lance's incompletions. And it's entirely likely he missed some guys badly. I also don't have the benefit of the All-22 to see if he was missing open players. But generally speaking, he looked pretty good for an inexperienced player in his second appearance on an NFL field. His INT was a little high and hard over the middle to Sanu, but based on the view I had, Sanu really should have brought it in. It was similar to - but not as bad as - Garoppolo's INT that was high for Aiyuk earlier in the game. He had a similar incompletion to Samuel earlier in the game that was also a little high and behind, but Samuel probably should have caught it. Those are two of the six INTs, which were a little off, but not egregiously so.

He had several nice throws, including a deep ball to Sherfield and the TD to Benjamin. He was a little indecisive at times, and almost certainly held the ball too long, but he was also clearly going through his reads, looking off safeties, etc. He moved pretty well to evade pressure, and ran for a two-point conversion on a scramble, though it was called back on a hold. Just seemed odd to me that this game was cited as a missed opportunity. Again, for his stage of development, it seemed like a solid outing.

Watch on YouTube

[CrimsonCrew]

Grant Cohn copying me:

https://www.si.com/nfl/49ers/news/chris-simms-says-the-49ers-are-scared-to-start-trey-lance

Response to Simms. I will say, the Niners may be terrified, but you understand why they would be. Moving up for a QB was the right move. Now, you can absolutely argue that they were too aggressive, overpaid, and/or took the wrong QB. But if they want to be perennially competitive, having a great QB is the way to go about it. That said, there's a ton of risk involved in that. It is not an exaggeration to say that Shanahan and Lynch's future is riding on Lance. If he doesn't pan out, it's hard to see those guys being around in three years. And, of course, they'll have other opportunities, but those are guys who don't like to look dumb. So they should be terrified, but they should also know that Lance having success is the only path forward for them at this point.

[clyde21]

Mike Lombardi keeps saying, if Lance is looking good in practice, the 49ers would be talking it up.

The silence speaks volumes, he thinks.

why would the 49ers be talking it up? if anything they'd do the opposite to try and increase Jimmy G's value.

and, honestly, whether Lance looks great in practice or not is irrelevant. this is his job and the only way to find out is if he's the starter. you don't leverage 3 FRPs to trade up for Lance not to give him a clean shot as the starter regardless of how his deep balls look in practice.

also I don't buy that Shanahan wanted Mac Jones over Lance, isn't Shanahan the final decision maker, especially when it comes to the QBs?