Game 11: Chiefs at Seattle

[Bulltalk]

We just can't stop them on the ground today.

Oh well...

[Bulltalk]

How disappointing of a showing. We missed Mike Williams a lot today. And our defensive front was just lacking in almost every way. We have to look to the draft and FAcy to shore up our defensive front this coming off-season.

[Sweezo]

How disappointing of a showing. We missed Mike Williams a lot today. And our defensive front was just lacking in almost every way. We have to look to the draft and FAcy to shore up our defensive front this coming off-season.

Honestly, heading into next season...the defensive front is probably the least porous part of the defense IMO. Like any position on the team, it could use an upgrade, but...

When Seattle had Bryant/Mebane/Cole healthy, they were one of the top teams in the league against the run. The pass rush was decent with Clemons/Brock at the LEO position. And when people started dropping like flies the team brought Siavii in who plays like a decent backup, Curry made some plays at DE, and Balmer showed he could be a decent backup to Bryant. While the group as a whole needs depth, this group isn't the team's biggest problem:

LEO: Clemons/Curry
DT: Mebane/Cole/Siavii
DE: Bryant/Balmer

That said, the LBs stink. For the last couple years many of us have thought "if Tatupu can just stay healthy he make a difference." Well, he doesn't any more. I don't know if he's worn down/hurt and less productive, or if his career is on the decline, but he doesn't make the plays he used to.

Curry makes a big play every once and awhile, but is and likely always will be a liability in pass coverage, and he looks at his best when he's rushing the QB/getting into the backfield. He needs to be put in a position he does that exclusively.

Hawthorne is a decent player, but I think he needs some help out there.

The DBs have also been a big disappointment. Trufant is probably not a #1 CB any more. Jennings seems easily confused, still has poor ball awareness, and I'll be happy to see him go. Lewis is a very strong special teamer, but his coverage skills are nothing worth mentioning. Thurmond has talent and promise but has a long ways to go. I don't know if it is a lack of talent or coaching but our CBs seem to give a lot of separation and do very poorly when covering a WR who goes in motion.

Now, one thing the roster turnover in the offseason shows me is Schneider/Carroll aren't afraid to make changes when players don't fit what they want to do. While they may have been intrigued by Jennings' size at one point, hopefully a season of watching him suck will convince them that he isn't the fit they thought he was.

Offensively, the same probably goes for Butler. He's got good speed and gets separation, but has the size of a slot receiver and NOT someone who you should throw a deep fade to. Maybe he should be moved to a team where he is a better fit, and we can go after another WR to put opposite BMW with Obomanu/Stokely over coming in when needed. No, I didn't forget about Tate...until he shows he can run a route I'm not counting on him to do much of anything.

[Sweezo]

How disappointing of a showing. We missed Mike Williams a lot today. And our defensive front was just lacking in almost every way. We have to look to the draft and FAcy to shore up our defensive front this coming off-season.

Even if we had BMW, he'd need some help. Forcing the ball to him means he takes shot after shot, which wears him down and/or flat out injures him to the point where he can't play.

We need another big WR out there to relieve some of the pressure on BMW, and also increase the margin of error for whatever QB we throw out there. Matt hasn't been perfect on many of his completions to BMW, but he hasn't really had to be. With Butler, if the pass isn't perfect upfield it's not going to be a completion.

[Bulltalk]

Interesting take on our LBing corp. I still think we need a real strong DE in the draft. I do agree, however, that Mebane, Cole, Red Bryant (a DT, really), and Balmer are good enough as a unit on the inside of the line to turn our attentions elsewhere. I agree that IF a real strong DB prospect falls to us in the 2nd round, we'd have to consider them. Same could be said for WR, RB, or OLman.

But I DO think a QB or DE is in the cards for us in the 1st round. Just MO. There are a bunch of potentially quality DE's in next spring's draft. A lot fewer QB's.

[Sweezo]

Interesting take on our LBing corp. I still think we need a real strong DE in the draft. I do agree, however, that Mebane, Cole, Red Bryant (a DT, really), and Balmer are good enough as a unit on the inside of the line to turn our attentions elsewhere. I agree that IF a real strong DB prospect falls to us in the 2nd round, we'd have to consider them. Same could be said for WR, RB, or OLman.

But I DO think a QB or DE is in the cards for us in the 1st round. Just MO. There are a bunch of potentially quality DE's in next spring's draft. A lot fewer QB's.

But are those DE's built for a 4-3 or a 3-4? I'm not familiar with the top DE prospects out there off the top of my head...are you looking at someone early in the draft to replace Bryant or Clemons as a starter?

I think a big reason why Clemons is successful at the LEO spot is because there are three big **** next to him occupying blockers and concentrating on the run. The reason our front four worked well when Red was healthy was because he is a DT. Replace him with a traditional 4-3 DE, and I think that exposes the interior of the line while also reducing Clemons' effectiveness as a pass rusher. Adding bulk on the outside makes Cole look better and means less pressure on Mebane IMO.

Now, while Cole has looked pretty good against the run...he's not really a pass rush guy. Mebane and Bryant both seem to do fairly well against the run and bulling their way towards the QB from time to time. If the team were able to add a topflight DT to put between Mebane and Bryant, I think THAT could really be a difference maker.

That would give us Balmer/Bryant/Siavii as depth guys...

Who would that be? No idea. Most of the best DE/DT types in mock drafts are slated to go before we would pick if the season ended today, while many of the best DE/OLB types are slated to go right about where we are in the first round.

Not that mock drafts mean squat, either now or closer to the draft. But I can see why people think players like Nick Fairley will be picked before we would get a chance to do so.

[Bulltalk]

I'd like Clemons and a great rookie DE on the outside, and Mebane, Cole, and Balmer on the inside, and possibly Bryant going both ways, or something. That's pretty good quality and depth on the DL. I'd still be fine with our LBing corp for now.

Jennings...please go. lol Thurmond and Trufant your starting CB's, plus a few others on the roster currently, plus a draft pick. Thomas...we're covered. lol Maybe one more year of Milloy, and patchwork the rest at S.

That's kind of the D for me as of now.

I like Okung and Unger as lock-starters on the OL. Keep Polumbus, probably one of either Pitts or Andrews, and it will just be interesting to see how they handle Locklear and Spencer. Not sure yet, myself. If a strong OLman falls to us in the 2nd round, I'd consider. Certainly would look for a bargain there in the 4th and 5th rounds.

It's effing hard to tell about our running game. Of course we want it to be better. Of course we'd love a great RB. But I'm not sure how much of it all has to do with our run blocking, at least in getting it to an adequate level.

Carlson has been a disappointment this year. No doubt. Not ready to give up on him yet, though.

Want a new potential franchise QB like last year.

Deon Butler is chained up in my doghouse now. That guy's got to do a lot to get back into my good graces. I'd consider a WR in FAcy or in the 2nd round if a real potential talent fell to us there.

Just musings as to where I'm at now.

[Danny Darko]

I agree with Sweezo-

I think it's our LB & CB crew that needs a rehaul the most.

Lofa should either be a backup ala DD Lewis or cut loose after the season. As smart as he is the initial knocks on size and speed are apparent with deterioration of his knee. I can't see him regaining his youthful over achievement.

Heater might be a decent MLB, but struggles on the outside

Hill- who knows if he has anything in the tank, so considering his character issues- later to him.

Thurmond will be much better for his experience and his knee will be much better next year. You never get that overdrive gear back the first year after reconstructive surgery. I'd bank on him being a factor next year.

Jennings best be gone period.

Tru had moments this year, but I'd feel more comfortable if he wasn't viewed as an automatic starter and took a pay cut.

The good news is the draft seems to be filled with corner options this year.

On O we have to make Locklear go away and find a stud OG, as well. If we got Mankins that would surely help. I wish we could see Andrews at RT for a while to see if he's our man there or not.

Dissapointed in our WR's today. Also regardless of that debacle I think it's apparent that Matt isn't going to become the second coming of Kurt Warner so we best plan for the future.

back to the Andrew Luck discussion, yeah, I do wish we could steal him, but the Bills probably won't take any package for him even if we offer the farm.

[Danny Darko]

re DE's- if a super awesome value was there I'd take him regardless of his fit in our weird scheme simply because Brock looks good in our scheme and he's a fairly traditional DE.

I think Tate will ease your distaste for Butler when after another offseason of route running.

[Sweezo]

I was thinking about looking up the Seahawks' defensive run stats before and after Red's injury, but thankfully Danny O'Neil did the legwork for me:

Through the first 22 quarters of this season, the Seahawks allowed an average of 3.3 yards per carry by their opponents. Why is that time frame significant? Because those were the 22 quarters that Red Bryant played before suffering a season-ending knee injury at the end of the first half in Oakland. Since then, Seattle has given up an average of 5.1 yards per carry, and on Sunday the Chiefs ran for 270 yards -- the most rushing yards Seattle has allowed in any game in 10 years.

That's staggering. Granted, Red's only one player, but he's a key piece of the defense. I don't know that we could find a DE in the draft that could have that kind of impact.

[Danny Darko]

true, though I'd like to see Cole factored into that

[Bulltalk]

All that said and thought, the NFL is a passing league now. The three most important positions are QB, then probably a tie between LT and DE. We got our stud LT, now it's time to get our stud QB and DE. Let's get the most important positions taken care of first, and then work outward from there. We're rebuilding now, like it or not, even though in our bad division we're "contending".

I will say this, however. If a stud CB falls to us in the 2nd round, I won't be arguing if they nab him. Not like I felt about taking Curry over Sanchez.