2023 Trade Deadline Thread: Conley/VanVleet/Lowry/etc. (Updated thread)

[clipsfever]

Barf on Conley... I'd rather ram TMann into a quasi-point role for the rest of the season.

But am curious what the price on TJ McConnell is, if avail.

Between Reggie, Wall, Covington, Coffey... that's a nice arsenal of trade-salary at least

[KL2]

I’m happy that there is a notable source saying they’re looking for front court depth.

I’m on the fence with Conley. Other moves would help determine if it’s a hit or miss.

It sounds like they’re working on a couple trade scenarios.

[clipsfever]

Front Court -

John Collins - how low is the price for that Ballmer-sized contract?

Myles Turner - Avail? Cost?

Big Hartenstein - plug and play

Mason Plumlee - having his best season, becoming an excellent passer (over 3 per, 2.25+ A/TO ratio as a C) and is making his free throws mostly

Nerlens Noel - has had a good stretch with Duren and Stewart in-and-out

Gotta figure Orlando's "Project Wingspan" could ship somebody out without noticing... Bamba?

Olynyk - Ainge is in wheeler-dealer mode, needs to make space for Kessler... and rumors also have them possibly picking up John Collins

[mudsak]

The Clippers should try to wrangle the Knicks as a third team since Ainge loves draft picks and the Knicks have a bunch. See if the Clippers can swing getting Conley and Hartenstein. Or, if its just a two team trade then see if the Clippers can get one of Vanderbilt or Olynyk with Conley. Really not sure though what the Clippers need to give up for these trades to work.

I think it'll require a 3rd team to make it work. Clips salary situation is tough. Kennard is the only guy I see on that roster that I think both sides would agree on, and that's not enough salary to make it work. Who else do you see as potential additions in that move from the Clips roster? Roco? idk. If it has to be 2 players I'd assume some other moves are going to have to shake loose rosters across the league since the Jazz are at roster capacity. I think the Jazz are likely to be really busy at this deadline though.

[madmaxmedia]

The Clippers should try to wrangle the Knicks as a third team since Ainge loves draft picks and the Knicks have a bunch. See if the Clippers can swing getting Conley and Hartenstein. Or, if its just a two team trade then see if the Clippers can get one of Vanderbilt or Olynyk with Conley. Really not sure though what the Clippers need to give up for these trades to work.

I think it'll require a 3rd team to make it work. Clips salary situation is tough. Kennard is the only guy I see on that roster that I think both sides would agree on, and that's not enough salary to make it work. Who else do you see as potential additions in that move from the Clips roster? Roco? idk. If it has to be 2 players I'd assume some other moves are going to have to shake loose rosters across the league since the Jazz are at roster capacity. I think the Jazz are likely to be really busy at this deadline though.

Appreciate the input, but Kennard + RoCo for Conley + Hartenstein would send this board into absolute uproar. Somehow we'd end up even less athletic than before. Hartenstein is of interest mainly because we think we could get him for basically nothing. Conley can still play but isn't what we need and would only end up reducing Mann's minutes.

[TrueLAfan]

We have poor rebounding in our backcourt (other than PG). Wall, Luke, and Norm all barely grab a rebound every nine minutes, and Reggie is even worse. This is a place where we really miss Bev, who hit the boards hard. That failure reduces the value of Mook on our team, since Mook is (also) not a rebounder.

But Mook does other things well, only has one year left on his deal, and has positive trade value as a result. He and Luke could get us a pretty good player

[Wammy Giveaway]

At this point, I feel that Conley is a morale move. Nothing to do with needing a pass first point guard to satisfy the Clipper's awkward stance of having a traditional lineup (PG-SG-SF-PF-C). Really, this is just a trade meant to fix the team's currently low spirits and bad vibes. But the team is doing just fine, and I know this simply because the Clippers hadn't have an ejection yet. Had an ejection occurred in that horrible loss to Nuggets that featured three different Clippers with a technical foul, then yeah I would be more down for the Conley move.

The other worry is contract logic. Conley has a 2-year $22.6 million deal with the final year partially guaranteed. He has been a starter every team he went to, so on the Clippers he'd be no different. But the Clippers have struggled with finding a true point guard ever since they traded Paul. Starting a shooting guard/small forward in Mann at the point guard spot was the answer, the career high 30 PTS vs. lottery team Rockets in a must-win game to prevent from going under .500 and labeled a lottery team is evident of this. Players whose contract value in excess of $15 million are required to start - Conley coming off the bench - worse, being reduced to a locker room guy off-the-court and a DNP-CD on-the-court - as a $22.6 million per year for a role player making $1.9 million in Mann is a bad look from a financial perspective. But then you remember that Mann needs to start for Clippers to get wins because they have problems with point guard players in general. Now you risk Mann losing his determination by way of reduced playing time all in the name of a traditional lineup.

If the Clippers are willing to bring Conley at the value he's at just for chemistry purposes, something is wrong with them. They should hope he gets bought out instead.

Their devotion to chemistry could cause Clippers to punt this season as well. And I don't want that from a franchise that is trying to figure themselves out, albeit at a tortoises pace.

[wakelaunch1]

Front Court -

John Collins - how low is the price for that Ballmer-sized contract?

Myles Turner - Avail? Cost?

Big Hartenstein - plug and play

Mason Plumlee - having his best season, becoming an excellent passer (over 3 per, 2.25+ A/TO ratio as a C) and is making his free throws mostly

Nerlens Noel - has had a good stretch with Duren and Stewart in-and-out

Gotta figure Orlando's "Project Wingspan" could ship somebody out without noticing... Bamba?

Olynyk - Ainge is in wheeler-dealer mode, needs to make space for Kessler... and rumors also have them possibly picking up John Collins

Like Collins, Turner, Plumlee, and Noel. Noel or Plumlee might be the better bargain. Would love to move on from Morris, Zubac, Jackson, and Wall.

[wakelaunch1]

We have poor rebounding in our backcourt (other than PG). Wall, Luke, and Norm all barely grab a rebound every nine minutes, and Reggie is even worse. This is a place where we really miss Bev, who hit the boards hard. That failure reduces the value of Mook on our team, since Mook is (also) not a rebounder.

But Mook does other things well, only has one year left on his deal, and has positive trade value as a result. He and Luke could get us a pretty good player

Agreed Mook has gotten worse at defense and is the worst rebounding big. He should never be in a small ball 5 lineup.

Maybe a Rozier/Plumlee for Morris/Jackson/Coffey


http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2pc3av32

[esqtvd]

smdh

[Clemenza]

Great another old, small, and injury prone player who makes big bucks -Just what we need. But even if you were to land him you still have to somehow relieve PG & Kawhi of their point guard duties which won't be easy to do considering the power they have on this team. Conley, if healthy, wouldn't even be able to be "Conley" on this team.

[Scoundreldays]

Great another old, small, and injury prone player who makes big bucks -Just what we need. But even if you were to land him you still have to somehow relieve PG & Kawhi of their point guard duties which won't be easy to do considering the power they have on this team. Conley, if healthy, wouldn't even be able to be "Conley" on this team.

I'm convinced PG and Kawhi are not good fits for eachother and one has to go (unlikely due to what we gave up). Both have similar skills and are ball dominant. I don't think any point guard is going to help because the ball will mostly be in their hands.

From what I remember with the Raptors Kawhi was really the only ball dominant player and usually had Vanvleet or Lowry plus Gasol who were great at facilitating. Again it won't happen but the best move would be to trade PG for a facilitator if they want Kawhi maximized.

Although I wouldn't pick Conley due to once again his age and he is injury prone. I honestly don't know who would be a good pick outside of taking a chance with the younglings. Maybe Vanvleet?

[Captain Ballmer]

We have poor rebounding in our backcourt (other than PG). Wall, Luke, and Norm all barely grab a rebound every nine minutes, and Reggie is even worse. This is a place where we really miss Bev, who hit the boards hard. That failure reduces the value of Mook on our team, since Mook is (also) not a rebounder.

But Mook does other things well, only has one year left on his deal, and has positive trade value as a result. He and Luke could get us a pretty good player

While the Zubac&Morris fit hasn't been there from the beginning, we can't make an accurate assessment of neither Zu nor Mook. Zubac is an old-school, heavy-footed player, we need to play an athletic forward at #4 to complete him. Let's take a look at their league long combos below, of which at least one of them is slow-footed old style;

Aaron Gordon for Jokic
Giannis for B.Lopez
Zion for Valanciunas
Jerami Grant for Nurkic
Jaren Jackson Jr for S.Adams
Evan Mobley for Jarret Allen

All slow footed Bigs in the league are paired with athletic freaks. If Zubac is our 5, we gotta trade for John Collins type because Morris&Batum gives the most inefficient pairing in today's league. We could solve the rebounding problem, also have a big that would be an effective transition partner. Great fit. Trade Mook with incentives for that type of player.

Another option is to trade Zu and get a skilled center that can be more effective on the half court, effectively exploit the paint to open from Morris & Batum's shot threat. Ayton? Turner? Vucevic?

I think consistent scoring threat from paint area is the biggest issue for us. You either increase the tempo for transitions to score effectively in the paint or get skilled players to do it. Morris/Batum&Zubac pairing destined to loose. Unfortunately Morris&Batum athleticism level severly declined while Zubac's offensive development stalled.

For Conley, I'm all for it. We need PG off the ball, focused on scoring and Defense. Conley could help a lot with high IQ, low turnover game and definitely makes it easier for us to get more efficient games from PG13. Also, as with Rondo-Wall and Beverley, Conley has yet to fall to a level of scoring threat that has fallen so low that rivals ignore it.

Conley-Kawhi-PG13-Collins-Zubac. Batum and one of Reggie-Luke and Morris/Covington on the bench is more than enough 8 men playoff rotation. Yes, I'm ok to trade sell high T.Mann for Ayton-Collins-Turner level returns.

[Ballings7]

We have poor rebounding in our backcourt (other than PG). Wall, Luke, and Norm all barely grab a rebound every nine minutes, and Reggie is even worse. This is a place where we really miss Bev, who hit the boards hard. That failure reduces the value of Mook on our team, since Mook is (also) not a rebounder.

But Mook does other things well, only has one year left on his deal, and has positive trade value as a result. He and Luke could get us a pretty good player

While the Zubac&Morris fit hasn't been there from the beginning, we can't make an accurate assessment of neither Zu nor Mook. Zubac is an old-school, heavy-footed player, we need to play an athletic forward at #4 to complete him. Let's take a look at their league long combos below, of which at least one of them is slow-footed old style;

Aaron Gordon for Jokic
Giannis for B.Lopez
Zion for Valanciunas
Jerami Grant for Nurkic
Jaren Jackson Jr for S.Adams
Evan Mobley for Jarret Allen

All slow footed Bigs in the league are paired with athletic freaks. If Zubac is our 5, we gotta trade for John Collins type because Morris&Batum gives the most inefficient pairing in today's league. We could solve the rebounding problem, also have a big that would be an effective transition partner. Great fit. Trade Mook with incentives for that type of player.

Another option is to trade Zu and get a skilled center that can be more effective on the half court, effectively exploit the paint to open from Morris & Batum's shot threat. Ayton? Turner? Vucevic?

I think consistent scoring threat from paint area is the biggest issue for us. You either increase the tempo for transitions to score effectively in the paint or get skilled players to do it. Morris/Batum&Zubac pairing destined to loose. Unfortunately Morris&Batum athleticism level severly declined while Zubac's offensive development stalled.

For Conley, I'm all for it. We need PG off the ball, focused on scoring and Defense. Conley could help a lot with high IQ, low turnover game and definitely makes it easier for us to get more efficient games from PG13. Also, as with Rondo-Wall and Beverley, Conley has yet to fall to a level of scoring threat that has fallen so low that rivals ignore it.

Conley-Kawhi-PG13-Collins-Zubac. Batum and one of Reggie-Luke and Morris/Covington on the bench is more than enough 8 men playoff rotation. Yes, I'm ok to trade sell high T.Mann for Ayton-Collins-Turner level returns.

Well said.. The frontcourt is a long-term season and playoffs problem unless playing small and engaged and on a run and can get away with it by match ups. Otherwise, the hybrid forwards and wings have to play big every game to compensate for the flaws of Morris and Zubac.

Trading some depth and future for Collins and Conley would actually be a nice pair of moves to "refresh" the team.

Would like to keep Batum, Mann, Covington and Powell for the bench.. but two of them probably would have to go, and would be Mann/Covington probably.

[clipsfever]

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/35441254/2023-nba-trade-deadline-western-conference-deal-predictions
(subscriber)

--
"Trade we would like to see:
Jason Preston, Brandon Boston Jr., Covington, Amir Coffey, a 2028 top-five-protected first to the Raptors for Fred VanVleet, Dalano Banton and Juancho Hernangomez. The Clippers will send a 2028 and 2029 second to Toronto if the first in 2028 is not conveyed.

Trade exceptions: $9.7 million

Cash available: $6.4 million (to send and receive)

Salary info and restrictions:

The Clippers have an open roster spot and are projected to pay a $144.7 million tax penalty.

The Clippers are responsible to pay 15% of the remaining salary (not including the player option year) to Reggie Jackson and Kawhi Leonard if either player is traded.

Draft assets:

The Clippers owe Oklahoma City unprotected first-round picks in 2024 and 2026. The Thunder have the right to swap firsts in 2023 and 2025.

The Clippers are allowed to trade a first-round pick in 2028 or 2029, but not both.

The Clippers have six second-round picks available to use in a trade."

[Clemenza]

I know everyone wants another big on this team but I'm waiting on some quality Diabate minutes on this team. He's long overdue. I think he'll be apart of the 2nd half of the season as he will swap spots with Brown since he has like 40 games eligible for the main team as Brown has almost used all his 50 games up.

[Scoundreldays]

I know everyone wants another big on this team but I'm waiting on some quality Diabate minutes on this team. He's long overdue. I think he'll be apart of the 2nd half of the season as he will swap spots with Brown since he has like 40 games eligible for the main team as Brown has almost used all his 50 games up.

I was wondering why he wasn't tried much but that makes sense to use Brown for the first half.

[Roscoe Sheed]

If Conley could play the way he always plays against the Clippers, I would trade any player on the team besides Kawhi and PG for him.

He would be a first ballot hall of famer if he only played against the Clippers.

[esqtvd]

If Conley could play the way he always plays against the Clippers, I would trade any player on the team besides Kawhi and PG for him.

He would be a first ballot hall of famer if he only played against the Clippers.

Basketballwise, we need a 4/5 more than a 1. Zu has no backup and Morris is the weak link in the starting 5. Either Mann or Reggie will be adequate.

KL-PG-Reggie: plus+9.6
KL-PG-Mann: plus+8.0

But the Clippers have had a basketball IQ and leadership deficit ever since Chris left. Kawhi complained about it almost from the first but unfortunately he doesn't have the makeup to do anything about it. Pat Bev, Lou, Trezz, PG and Reggie have been our team leaders but they don't quite have the Right Stuff either. The Clips [rightly] shipped off Tobias for the same reason rather than give him a [near-]max contract.

Anyway, basketball IQ and leadership are what we're lacking and that's what Conley still has some of--that Right Stuff. It's all on Ballmer now, if he wants to roll the dice on what's left of Kawhi's and PG's prime. In the end it's HIS team and HIS future.


Frankly, Reggie did a better job quarterbacking the makeshift second unit tonight than faux-point guard Mann ever could, so for that reason alone, Mann should remain the starter. It's not that we need a point guard, it's that we need a leader--Kawhi and PG need a leader!--and that's where Conley would fit in.

[PeteyPablo]

Conley had a solid stat line last night 17 and 9.