The Board Man Cometh!! Kawhi Leonard Signs 3 Year (2+1), $103 Million Deal

Ranma · Post #221 » by **Ranma** » Wed Jul 4, 2018 10:49 pm

Remember that Shams Charania tends to report from the players' perspective. It's interesting that the Deputy Mayor of the City of Los Angeles is a Clippers fan. Shannon Sharpe is a moronic meathead who doesn't know the meaning of what breaking news is. If Woj broke a story on Twitter, we'd have confirmation by other reporters within 15 minutes from different sources. Shams breaking the Cousins signing with Golden State by an hour more than qualifies.

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Ranma · Post #222 » by **Ranma** » Wed Jul 4, 2018 11:31 pm

Also, keep in mind that Adrian Wojnarowski tends to report from the teams' perspective. Part 2 of his podcast segment starts off with Bobby Marks discussing how Rod Thorn and Jerry West compared notes as general managers. West is cited as not being perfect when he once recommended Brandon Armstrong from Pepperdine University in relation to the Nets acquiring him along with Richard Jefferson in the deal with the Rockets for Eddie Griffin.

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donemilio21 · Post #223 » by **donemilio21** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 12:11 am

This is all good news of course. But (given Kawhi is healthy) can we even offer more than Celtics, sixers or lakers to trade for him?
A lot can happen in one year, and if we can trade for him, we should.
Considering spurs already have 11 players under contract and will probably resign Parker and Anderson, plus their draft picks, we cant give multiple players without getting a 3rd team involved. So we'll have to deal multiple draft picks.

wco81 · Post #224 » by **wco81** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 12:15 am

If he doesn't play next season, would teams still line up to offer him the max?

They could of course make the contracts contingent on passing exams but really sounds like there would be no substitute for seeing him play a season after this injury, and seeing him perform at the MVP levels he was at in 2016-17 season.

Ranma · Post #225 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 12:16 am

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wco81 · Post #226 » by **wco81** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 12:42 am

I remember when Tobias got his extension from the Magic, some people raised some eyebrows.

Then he was traded to Detroit and now has pretty much lived up to the contract, if not exceeded it.

I don't think Clippers now have too many other assets to do a big trade do they?

Yet I see that they're expected to have about $70 million in cap space next year. So they should be in the market for Kawhi.

But maybe it would be advantageous to have the inside track by having him on the team this year and work on him for months, the way the Thunder seems to have done with PG13.

Ranma · Post #227 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 2:44 am

donemilio21 wrote:This is all good news of course. But (given Kawhi is healthy) can we even offer more than Celtics, sixers or lakers to trade for him?
A lot can happen in one year, and if we can trade for him, we should.
Considering spurs already have 11 players under contract and will probably resign Parker and Anderson, plus their draft picks, we cant give multiple players without getting a 3rd team involved. So we'll have to deal multiple draft picks.

The Spurs have been asking for the sun, moon and stars from the Lakers, Celtics and 76ers but none of them have budged. It sounds like San Antonio is waiting for one of those teams to panic, but with each passing day, their leverage is being diminished.

The Clippers can't really compete with any of the 3 aforementioned teams if any or all of them decide to meet the Spurs' asking price, but that is unlikely to ever happen with the currently high demands. The hope is that the Spurs will eventually come down to Earth and take our offer as other teams are scared off by the prospect of only renting him for a single season before he departs in free agency. The Lakers feel that they have the inside track on him in free agency and, thus, aren't inclined to give up valuable assets to acquire him much like when they were reluctant to trade for Paul George.

There'll even come a point where it won't be worthwhile for the Clippers to pursue Kawhi in trade. With the uncertainty of not knowing what he actually wants to do along with this mysterious health ailment, he's already a risky proposition as is. However, the potential high payoff in reward is practically worth it, especially with our current situation of being a middling franchise. Even if it blows up in our faces, it might serve as a push to go full rebuild albeit at an extremely expensive cost.

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Ranma · Post #228 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 3:03 am

wco81 wrote:If he doesn't play next season, would teams still line up to offer him the max?

They could of course make the contracts contingent on passing exams but really sounds like there would be no substitute for seeing him play a season after this injury, and seeing him perform at the MVP levels he was at in 2016-17 season.

I'm inclined to think that teams would still line up to woo him with a max-contract offer just because they'd have to in order to be viewed as serious bidders for his services. Of course, that would depend on the medicals that they'd have to release to such suitors. If Kawhi's camp isn't releasing any medical details, that just signals to other teams that there is something seriously wrong with him and no team would pursue him as a max-level free agent.

I'm going to assume that Kawhi will play at some point during next season in order to make sure that he'll be a free agent, plus, from my understanding, the pain is supposedly manageable to play with. It's the long-term consequences of exposing himself to physical stress and aggravating his condition of possible deterioration that has he and teams worried.

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wco81 wrote:I remember when Tobias got his extension from the Magic, some people raised some eyebrows.

Then he was traded to Detroit and now has pretty much lived up to the contract, if not exceeded it.

I don't think Clippers now have too many other assets to do a big trade do they?

Yet I see that they're expected to have about $70 million in cap space next year. So they should be in the market for Kawhi.

But maybe it would be advantageous to have the inside track by having him on the team this year and work on him for months, the way the Thunder seems to have done with PG13.

There's been some rumblings that the Clippers may be hesistant to re-sign Tobias Harris to a long-term contract as unreasonable as that may sound presumably because of maintaining flexibility to pursue free agents starting in the summer of 2019 and beyond. Harris is undoubtedly our most valuable trade chip, but even he has limited value given that he's on the last year of his contract for this coming season before becoming an unrestricted free agent himself. Still, having his Bird rights would be key in retaining him as well as pursuing other free-agent targets.

Our draft picks are less valuable now since they've been used on players that the Spurs may not have as much need for if they were to have made the selections themselves, so it's not like we can package them along with Danilo Gallinari's contract to make for an enticing offer. Maybe if the kids show something, that will up their respective trade value but it could also mean less of a likelihood to deal for Kawhi especially with reduced time left on his current contract.

Quake Griffin · Post #229 » by **Quake Griffin** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 3:06 am

Ranma wrote:
donemilio21 wrote:This is all good news of course. But (given Kawhi is healthy) can we even offer more than Celtics, sixers or lakers to trade for him?
A lot can happen in one year, and if we can trade for him, we should.
Considering spurs already have 11 players under contract and will probably resign Parker and Anderson, plus their draft picks, we cant give multiple players without getting a 3rd team involved. So we'll have to deal multiple draft picks.

The Spurs have been asking for the sun, moon and stars from the Lakers, Celtics and 76ers but none of them have budged. It sounds like San Antonio is waiting for one of those teams to panic, but with each passing day, their leverage is being diminished.

The Clippers can't really compete with any of the 3 aforementioned teams if any or all of them decide to meet the Spurs' asking price, but that is unlikely to ever happen with the currently high demands. The hope is that the Spurs will eventually come down to Earth and take our offer as other teams are scared off by the prospect of only renting him for a single season before he departs in free agency. The Lakers feel that they have the inside track on him in free agency and, thus, aren't inclined to give up valuable assets to acquire him much like when they were reluctant to trade for Paul George.

There'll even come a point where it won't be worthwhile for the Clippers to pursue Kawhi in trade. With the uncertainty of not knowing what he actually wants to do along with this mysterious health ailment, he's already a risky proposition as is. However, the potential high payoff in reward is practically worth it, especially with our current situation of being a middling franchise. Even if it blows up in our faces, it might serve as a push to go full rebuild albeit at an extremely expensive cost.

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How is that point not right now?

Outside of the one year recruiting trip angle and the idea that it would convince Tobias to stick around, I can't see many more positives to trading for him at this point and I can see way more pitfalls/ landmines.

Ranma · Post #230 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 3:15 am

Quake Griffin wrote:How is that point not right now?

Outside of the one year recruiting trip angle and the idea that it would convince Tobias to stick around, I can't see many more positives to trading for him at this point and I can see way more pitfalls/ landmines.

That's the thing. It signals to me that the Spurs are aren't really interested in what we have. Maybe they figure are our offer will always be available to them, but it's clear that they have their sites sights set on the treasure trove of young assets the Lakers, Celtics and Sixers each possess.

I don't get the sense that the Clippers and what we have to offer is a priority in San Antonio. The Spurs may be playing it risky with the stubborn tactic of holding out for the best a sweetheart offer to materialize, but they're apparently willing to lose out on what we have to offer we've presented currently in favor of what the other teams could theoretically offer.

Wammy Giveaway · Post #231 » by **Wammy Giveaway** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 6:37 am

An injury riddled season, preceded by a championship campaign four years ago while notching Finals MVP. This feels so familiar. Why do I get the sense that a Kawhi Leonard trade, just to remain relevant, is history repeating itself?

Let me remind you of a time when the Clippers, in San Diego, acquired a player just like Leonard. Bill Walton, Finals MVP with Portland Trailblazers in 1977, joined the Clippers by sitting out the final year of his contract to protest the incompetent treatment of his and other injured players by the Blazers front office. He actually wanted a trade out of Portland after suffering a broken foot - once in the middle of the season, the second in Game 2 of the 1978 NBA Playoffs - but the Blazers held out, supposedly for fear of making one of their rivals stronger. By the time he was a free agent for the 1979-80 season, he was a complete shell of himself, playing 14, 33, 55 and 67 games with the Clippers in this exact order. When Walton joined the Celtics in their 1987 title run, he was on a minutes restriction, averaging less than 9 minutes per game for the playoffs.

Leonard has what may be a chronic injury. He may have sat out 95% of the season because he was unhappy with the Spurs and their mismanagement. He wants a trade, and nobody's going after him because San Antonio wants a Godfather offer in an attempt to sabotage their playoff strategy. Spurs may be planning a lottery backfire because Leonard has a competitive attitude. Clippers trade for Leonard, they could find themselves in the middle of the pack with their star acquisition sitting out most of the season and end up with another 13th pick. It would be Bill Walton all over again for the Clippers. And the playoff drought will only increase.

And what of the Spurs asking price from the Clippers. What if their trade puts the Spurs back into the limelight as a prime championship contender?

My advice: give up the chase. Tank. Rebuild. Turn your youth into chips. Advertise to your trading partners they'll be back in the playoffs within two years if they accept the trade. The veterans could then rebuild their value for other teams to bite, or if they actually do well, carry the Clippers into the playoffs as a dark horse.

The Clippers should be playing spoiler, not beggars.

Ranma · Post #232 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 8:33 am

Wammy Giveaway wrote:An injury riddled season, preceded by a championship campaign four years ago while notching Finals MVP. This feels so familiar. Why do I get the sense that a Kawhi Leonard trade, just to remain relevant, is history repeating itself?

I don't get the "Fukai" reference nor do I necessarily buy that Kawhi Leonard is in the same shape of despair that Bill Walton proved to be when he joined the San Diego Clippers, but then again, who knew that Walton's career trajectory would trend down shortly after joining the Clips? Wammy Giveaway actually paints a compelling narrative where the Klaw and the Big Red Head share distinct similarities in NBA career paths up to this point.

Walton sat out the season before getting his wish to be traded to the the Clippers. While it remains to be seen what Kawhi will do for the upcoming 2018-19 NBA season, he missed practically the entire 2017-18 season by playing in only 9 games before pushing for a trade to Los Angeles, where the Clippers happen to reside now. Walton joined the former Buffalo Braves franchise in San Diego during his age 27 season. Leonard just turned 27 years-old last week in late June.

Both certainly were considered unique characters who didn't conform to normal conventions during their respective playing careers with Walton being the more outspoken of the two while Leonard is the more closed-off personality. Both also had MVP-quality seasons preceding serious injury with degenerative concerns.

Who knows if Kawhi will continue to follow a similar path as his more verbose predecessor, but Walton did eventually find his way into the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame while Leonard still has some work to do before receiving such an honor?

Ranma · Post #233 » by **Ranma** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 9:06 am

The Spurs are apparently asking for the rights to swap picks in addition to getting draft choices in order to circumvent the Stepien Rule that limits teams' ability to trade first-round-draft picks in consecutive seasons. This would theoretically allow San Antonio access to high draft picks in consecutive seasons without having to tank their own seasons.

However, Wojnarowksi reports that the Spurs do not want to rebuild. They want draft picks and players who can help them in the playoffs now. Well, Danilo Gallinari might qualify as that type of player. I'm just saying.

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Captain Ballmer · Post #234 » by **Captain Ballmer** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 11:05 am

There is no way I would be satisfied with a trade we send both rooks along with Tobias for Kawhi.

Remember PG and Cousins trades, Spurs don't even has the same ground as Sacto&Indy have, one year left superstar who also don't even wanna be with you for a single game. That factor alone obviously balances the difference between KL and PG&Cousins. The value even more decreases with Kawhi's questionable health.

We should give them only one of rooks along with Sin and Gallo. Maybe add lottery protected first if Kawhi gives you enough signals for possible extension.

We should keep Tobias as much as we can, he's becoming a top 30 player with great attitude. If we put Tobias instead of Gallo, then i would take the pick and the rook from table and add boban or wesley for salary match purposes.

This shape of Kawhi&Spurs' position doesn't deserve both rooks&tobias. Thats all.

Post #235 » by **mkwest** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 9:45 pm

REPORT: Clippers are Kawhi Leonard’s Preferred Destination But Spurs View LAC’s Assets as ‘****’

Tom Haberstroh: “So which team does Kawhi suit up for next year? Who do you think is the leader in the clubhouse to get his services?”

Mike C. Wright: Well, contrary to, and I don’t know if it’s changed. I think that’s what happened. Things have changed. But the Lakers are not Kawhi’s preferred destination anymore. He wants to go to the Clippers. He doesn’t want to go and be second fiddle to LeBron. That’s what I was told. And I was by somebody that would know. And so right now, the Clippers are where he wants to go. But I’m also told, like you know, I talked to people within the Spurs organization and they’re like ‘well yea he wants to go to the Clippers but their assets are **** at this point’. That’s what I was told.

Wright: The Spurs demands on a trade are just… I wouldn’t say unrealistic but teams are not gonna do that deal right now. They’re just not.

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Post #236 » by **mkwest** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 9:53 pm

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Wammy Giveaway · Post #237 » by **Wammy Giveaway** » Thu Jul 5, 2018 10:10 pm

Ranma wrote:I don't get the "Fukai" reference...

Kawhi shares the same sound as the Japanese word, "kawaii" (かわいい), which means tiny or cute. Hence, "fukai" (不快) is its antonym, meaning unpleasant or discomfort.

Google Translate: https://translate.google.com/#ja/en/%E4%B8%8D%E5%BF%AB

Was actually trying to make a rhyme out of it.

esqtvd · Post #238 » by **esqtvd** » Fri Jul 6, 2018 3:45 am

not to get political but half the news we get is fake and half is not :lol:

RealGM:

Kawhi Leonard's Preference Between Lakers, Clippers Remains Disputed
JUL 5, 2018 8:42 PM

The preferred destination of Kawhi Leonard remains one of the most hotly contested subjects amongst well-regarded members of the media.

Shams Charania reported on The Herd on Tuesday that the Clippers remained in the picture for Leonard following the arrival of LeBron James with the Lakers.

In a podcast on Wednesday, Adrian Wojnarowski indicated that Leonard now finds the Clippers less appealing with James joining the Lakers as he wouldn't want to play for the less glamorous franchise in Los Angeles with the game's biggest star on the Lakers.

Michael C. Wright went in the opposite direction on Thursday to indicate that Leonard now prefers the Clippers over the Lakers.

"The Lakers are not Kawhi's preferred destination anymore," said Wright on the Back to Back Podcast. "He wants to go to the Clippers. He doesn't want to go be second fiddle to LeBron. That's what I was told and I was told by somebody who would know.

"Right now, the Clippers are where he wants to go.

"I talk to people within the Spurs organization and they're like 'Yeah, he wants to go to the Clippers but their assets are (expletive) at this point.'

"I almost think there probably is going to be a dark horse team that nobody expected to come in and pull off that trade for Kawhi."

Wright added that once James went to the Lakers, it was reported that Leonard was open to re-signing with the 76ers if he's traded there.

esqtvd · Post #239 » by **esqtvd** » Fri Jul 6, 2018 3:53 am

DieHardFan wrote:There is no way I would be satisfied with a trade we send both rooks along with Tobias for Kawhi.

Remember PG and Cousins trades, Spurs don't even has the same ground as Sacto&Indy have, one year left superstar who also don't even wanna be with you for a single game. That factor alone obviously balances the difference between KL and PG&Cousins. The value even more decreases with Kawhi's questionable health.

We should give them only one of rooks along with Sin and Gallo. Maybe add lottery protected first if Kawhi gives you enough signals for possible extension.

We should keep Tobias as much as we can, he's becoming a top 30 player with great attitude. If we put Tobias instead of Gallo, then i would take the pick and the rook from table and add boban or wesley for salary match purposes.

This shape of Kawhi&Spurs' position doesn't deserve both rooks&tobias. Thats all.

Damn right. Me loves some Pat Bev, but otherwise, speaking of the future, Tobias, #11, and #13 is all we got. It would be like trading an arm for a leg.

Vae Victus · Post #240 » by **Vae Victus** » Fri Jul 6, 2018 5:11 am

Just gotta have faith in the Logo.

Have the team turn in a strong season with wonderful growth/development in the youth, and pray that Logo can pull off a trade for a 3rd disgruntled star at the deadline or next FA as well as sign 2 max FAs.

Maybe by next year Kawhi wants to run his own team in LA rather than play in Lebron's shadow. Then sign Kyrie or Butler and the team is set with lots of options to improve.

Clips atm dont really have any assets to give up atm. Just gotta hope their rookies go all Donovan Mitchell or something.