Doc out!!!!!!!!!

[Roscoe Sheed]

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I agree. I watched him say it.
Doc deflecting blame again?

No one could see that coming.

On this rare occasion, I agree with Skip. Even if Doc believes that, he shouldn't have said it publicly.

They basically have to trade Simmons- he is a huge liability in the post-season. However, throwing him under the bus doesn't help his trade value- that's for sure and also makes Doc look like he is passing the blame onto Simmons- even if warranted, makes Doc look bad.

Unless you see the DIRECT quote, NEVER believe the media. That's not what was asked, it's not what was answered.

Rivers was asked after the series whether he believed Simmons could be the point guard on a championship team.

“I don’t even know the answer to that right now,” Rivers said.

Simmons scored just five points in the game and was unplayable at times in the series due to his free throw shooting. Even when he was in the game, he feared shooting the ball.

"Unplayable," lol.

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End of story. Ben has to get "into the gym" and fix the problems with his game. THAT'S what he said. Everybody knows that if Ben is allowed to be Ben, he can be part of a championship team--just not as the 2nd best and 2nd highest-paid player. Or as your point guard. Unless he gets real. I follow the Sixers. Doc took the heat for Ben all year, hoping the light would go on. Instead it fell down a well.

Rivers defended Simmons over his shooting struggles this season. But after Simmons became such a playoff liability, Rivers no longer could keep up the political correctness. Philly could look to trade Simmons, but they might not get great value for him anymore. Simmons has four years left on his $177 million contract extension.

I was watching the interview live- so I know the context of the response. I still think he shouldn't have said it publicly or at least clarified that with work on his shooting and post moves, he could be a strong contributor.

[nickhx2]

personally i'm at the point of casual observation and i've been there for a long while. it's a nice place to be, i guess, after all that's occurred with doc.

i think i just wanted other people to see that we, as clipper fans, weren't crazy after all when it came to doc. and now that that's a reality, i guess there isn't really much else left to sift through, unless you like poking at wreckage.

[NippySudz]

personally i'm at the point of casual observation and i've been there for a long while. it's a nice place to be, i guess, after all that's occurred with doc.

i think i just wanted other people to see that we, as clipper fans, weren't crazy after all when it came to doc. and now that that's a reality, i guess there isn't really much else left to sift through, unless you like poking at wreckage.

we've been vindicated. Honestly though, I thought the sixers was going to pull it through. I made the same mistake I did last year. Lying to myself saying there's no way Doc is going to lose to the hawks with Joel Embiid, an MVP candidate to trae young and the atlanta hawks. I mean, Trae is good, but I thought there was no way. That skill level between the two teams was a WIDE gap, wider than Nugger-Clippers in 2020.

Yet, he managed to get it done. I truly can't believe it. It's comical at this point. Like truly comical. It's amazing to see someone so STUBBORN at their job. Doc is such a horndog for anyone who can score. Seth Curry was their leading scorer for the series yes, but hew was getting cooked by huerter. Maybe you shouldn't have subbed him in when you have a two point lead. I'm just saying lol.

[MartinToVaught]

I was watching the interview live- so I know the context of the response. I still think he shouldn't have said it publicly or at least clarified that with work on his shooting and post moves, he could be a strong contributor.

Doc went from comparing Simmons to Magic, to coddling Simmons by making excuses for his lack of aggression on offense, to throwing Simmons under the bus after Game 7 in a futile attempt to avoid taking any of the blame himself.

And we wonder why his former players never have anything good to say about him.

[NickP]

personally i'm at the point of casual observation and i've been there for a long while. it's a nice place to be, i guess, after all that's occurred with doc.

i think i just wanted other people to see that we, as clipper fans, weren't crazy after all when it came to doc. and now that that's a reality, i guess there isn't really much else left to sift through, unless you like poking at wreckage.

we've been vindicated. Honestly though, I thought the sixers was going to pull it through. I made the same mistake I did last year. Lying to myself saying there's no way Doc is going to lose to the hawks with Joel Embiid, an MVP candidate to trae young and the atlanta hawks. I mean, Trae is good, but I thought there was no way. That skill level between the two teams was a WIDE gap, wider than Nugger-Clippers in 2020.

Yet, he managed to get it done. I truly can't believe it. It's comical at this point. Like truly comical. It's amazing to see someone so STUBBORN at their job. Doc is such a horndog for anyone who can score. Seth Curry was their leading scorer for the series yes, but hew was getting cooked by huerter. Maybe you shouldn't have subbed him in when you have a two point lead. I'm just saying lol.

One thing for sure is doc's stubbornness. He was playing all bench lineups which led the Hawks back in games they had no business winning.
Yes players miss shots and free throws and commit turnovers. But there's something wrong with the coach when all you have to show is one chip with the extraordinary talent at your disposal.

[nickhx2]

yeah i mostly thought they would win anyway because they were just better.

but i guess this series loss really shows you that you cannot screw around in the playoffs. it's all about matchups and exploitation and you will be punished by an inferior team if you do not adjust.

[Quake Griffin]

The Simmons comment wouldn’t stick out if he didn’t slurp him before the season and if he didn’t act like sitting him was preposterous. Then when they lose, he can’t even back him up.

That’s the worst kind of leadership - a guy who will gas you to do something and then when it fails, he’s nowhere to be found...or worse, he’s throwing you under the bus.

I feel vindicated for sure.
Our choking in year’s past is no longer bad juju or the curse of Sterling.

It’s just an F+ POBO and an F+ coach with a hint of slick huckster, a shot of conniving snake oil salesman and a tablespoon of living off of a 2008 super team.

[esqtvd]

On this rare occasion, I agree with Skip. Even if Doc believes that, he shouldn't have said it publicly.

They basically have to trade Simmons- he is a huge liability in the post-season. However, throwing him under the bus doesn't help his trade value- that's for sure and also makes Doc look like he is passing the blame onto Simmons- even if warranted, makes Doc look bad.

Unless you see the DIRECT quote, NEVER believe the media. That's not what was asked, it's not what was answered.

Rivers was asked after the series whether he believed Simmons could be the point guard on a championship team.

“I don’t even know the answer to that right now,” Rivers said.

Simmons scored just five points in the game and was unplayable at times in the series due to his free throw shooting. Even when he was in the game, he feared shooting the ball.

"Unplayable," lol.

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End of story. Ben has to get "into the gym" and fix the problems with his game. THAT'S what he said. Everybody knows that if Ben is allowed to be Ben, he can be part of a championship team--just not as the 2nd best and 2nd highest-paid player. Or as your point guard. Unless he gets real. I follow the Sixers. Doc took the heat for Ben all year, hoping the light would go on. Instead it fell down a well.

Rivers defended Simmons over his shooting struggles this season. But after Simmons became such a playoff liability, Rivers no longer could keep up the political correctness. Philly could look to trade Simmons, but they might not get great value for him anymore. Simmons has four years left on his $177 million contract extension.

I was watching the interview live- so I know the context of the response. I still think he shouldn't have said it publicly or at least clarified that with work on his shooting and post moves, he could be a strong contributor.

Having followed them all year--and I listen to the brutal WIP in Philadelphia--all I can say is Doc fell on his sword for Ben all year. I got context up the wazoo. They've been after Ben in Philly EVERY SUMMER to get his game together. And after the Hawks started Hack-a-Shaq, Ben collapsed--not only refusing to shoot but RUNNING AWAY FROM THE BALL--turning his back to the ballhandler.

Ben let him down bigtime. Doc is furious and has a right to be. I'M furious--I couldn't believe what I was seeing tonight. If last year's Clipper collapse was gutless [it was], Ben's was on another level. PG kept firing.

That he sent a tiny shot across Ben's bow is not only right but necessary. The consensus in the sports media AND IN PHILLY is to dump Ben yesterday. And meanwhile, Doc [and Barkley lol] got Embiid finally realizing his potential, and the Sixers won the #1 seed after getting SWEPT by a dysfunctional Celtics team last year in the FIRST ROUND with virtually the same roster.


People are entitled to their snickers but these are the facts. I had no faith in this team and they're my hometown team. Doc got the maximum out of Timid Tobias and Seth Curry, and the rest of the roster was kids and past-their-primes like Howard, Mike Scott and...wait for it, GM geniuses lol...George Hill, who was less than zero.

Daryl Morey is the one who has work to do. Or Ben come in and says, ok Doc, we'll play it your way.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-playoffs-ben-simmons-passes-025715806.html

Ben Simmons might've just played his way out of favor in Philadelphia, for good.

Simmons disappeared in a jarring way during the Sixers' seven-game series against the Hawks, refusing to shoot the ball and looking tentative in a way we've never seen before. He seemed afraid of scoring.

And those problems reached a head in Game 7 on Sunday night, when Simmons made the most inexcusable decision I've ever seen on a basketball court.

With 3:30 to go in the fourth quarter and the Sixers trailing by two, Simmons spun off Danilo Gallinari and found himself wide open on the right side of the hoop. Trae Young started to help off his man, but Ben Simmons is Ben Simmons and Trae Young is Trae Young.

Here's what Simmons did:


Unacceptable.

I've been a big Simmons fan for a long time. I like the way he pushes the pace, I love his creativity and vision on fastbreaks, and I love his defensive tenacity. There's so much to like.

But this is the final straw on his reluctance to be an offensive force. It's inexcusable.

Sixers fans couldn't believe what they'd seen

Doc took the fall for Kahwi and PG's record collapse last year. Damned if he'll do it again for Ben Simmons, who let him down much worse.

[NippySudz]

personally i'm at the point of casual observation and i've been there for a long while. it's a nice place to be, i guess, after all that's occurred with doc.

i think i just wanted other people to see that we, as clipper fans, weren't crazy after all when it came to doc. and now that that's a reality, i guess there isn't really much else left to sift through, unless you like poking at wreckage.

we've been vindicated. Honestly though, I thought the sixers was going to pull it through. I made the same mistake I did last year. Lying to myself saying there's no way Doc is going to lose to the hawks with Joel Embiid, an MVP candidate to trae young and the atlanta hawks. I mean, Trae is good, but I thought there was no way. That skill level between the two teams was a WIDE gap, wider than Nugger-Clippers in 2020.

Yet, he managed to get it done. I truly can't believe it. It's comical at this point. Like truly comical. It's amazing to see someone so STUBBORN at their job. Doc is such a horndog for anyone who can score. Seth Curry was their leading scorer for the series yes, but hew was getting cooked by huerter. Maybe you shouldn't have subbed him in when you have a two point lead. I'm just saying lol.

One thing for sure is doc's stubbornness. He was playing all bench lineups which led the Hawks back in games they had no business winning.
Yes players miss shots and free throws and commit turnovers. But there's something wrong with the coach when all you have to show is one chip with the extraordinary talent at your disposal.

This series was lost in game 4 and game 5. When they blew those double digit leads iirc. Game 7 was just the summation of it all, but they lost the series in those games. Blaming Ben Simmons for this is just pathetic. Ben is who he is. He didn't put ben in a position to succeed. He should have yanked ben those two games when hack-a-ben was happening. It probably wouldn't have rattled his confidence.

Instead he just plays him and they lose. Game 6, he didn't have to worry about hack a ben, because the refs did the coaching for doc Ben simmons waas in foul trouble so they forced doc's hand. Otherwise, they would have lost in six games too.

[NippySudz]

[clipperlover]

Having followed them all year--and I listen to the brutal WIP in Philadelphia--all I can say is Doc fell on his sword for Ben all year. I got context up the wazoo. They've been after Ben in Philly EVERY SUMMER to get his game together. And after the Hawks started Hack-a-Shaq, Ben collapsed--not only refusing to shoot but RUNNING AWAY FROM THE BALL--turning his back to the ballhandler.

Ben let him down bigtime. Doc is furious and has a right to be. I'M furious--I couldn't believe what I was seeing tonight. If last year's Clipper collapse was gutless [it was], Ben's was on another level. PG kept firing.

That he sent a tiny shot across Ben's bow is not only right but necessary. The consensus in the sports media AND IN PHILLY is to dump Ben yesterday. And meanwhile, Doc [and Barkley lol] got Embiid finally realizing his potential, and the Sixers won the #1 seed after getting SWEPT by a dysfunctional Celtics team last year in the FIRST ROUND with virtually the same roster.


People are entitled to their snickers but these are the facts. I had no faith in this team and they're my hometown team. Doc got the maximum out of Timid Tobias and Seth Curry, and the rest of the roster was kids and past-their-primes like Howard, Mike Scott and...wait for it, GM geniuses lol...George Hill, who was less than zero.

Daryl Morey is the one who has work to do. Or Ben come in and says, ok Doc, we'll play it your way.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-playoffs-ben-simmons-passes-025715806.html

Ben Simmons might've just played his way out of favor in Philadelphia, for good.

Simmons disappeared in a jarring way during the Sixers' seven-game series against the Hawks, refusing to shoot the ball and looking tentative in a way we've never seen before. He seemed afraid of scoring.

And those problems reached a head in Game 7 on Sunday night, when Simmons made the most inexcusable decision I've ever seen on a basketball court.

With 3:30 to go in the fourth quarter and the Sixers trailing by two, Simmons spun off Danilo Gallinari and found himself wide open on the right side of the hoop. Trae Young started to help off his man, but Ben Simmons is Ben Simmons and Trae Young is Trae Young.

Here's what Simmons did:


Unacceptable.

I've been a big Simmons fan for a long time. I like the way he pushes the pace, I love his creativity and vision on fastbreaks, and I love his defensive tenacity. There's so much to like.

But this is the final straw on his reluctance to be an offensive force. It's inexcusable.

Sixers fans couldn't believe what they'd seen

Doc took the fall for Kahwi and PG's record collapse last year. Damned if he'll do it again for Ben Simmons, who let him down much worse.

Come on TVD. The Sixers didn't hire Doc to see Simmons not progress and/or regress.

The media is no longer covering for Doc. His career is being re-examined now. His one title gave him cover because he was the first black coach since K.C. Jones to win an NBA Title. The media wasn't going to tarnish what he accomplished even when signs indicated he was overrated. He was protected from scrutiny. Now, with black coaches leading 3 of the 4 Conference Finals teams and Doc's team choking again, Doc has lost his protection from media scrutiny. He is getting taken to task now because people are looking back at his past failures. Here is what is getting examined:

1. 5 Game 7 playoff losses at home (most of coach)
2. Losing 3 of 4 Home games with #1 seeded team
3. Huge leads blown when control of the series a was moments away
4. Similarities between this collapse and the two prior collapses over the last 6 seasons

His former teammate Olden Polynice has called him out for living off the one Title .

I found this article which made me look up some things I didn't realize: https://www.nba.com/clippers/news/doc-rivers-talks-clippers - The Article is from the season prior to Doc getting hired. Doc mentions how good the Clippers D was. So, I looked it up and compared:

2012-2013 Clips (Del Negro) - Opponents PPG - 4th, D Rating - 8th, Net Rating 3rd (+7.1)
2013-2014 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 14th , D Rating - 9th, Net Rating 2nd (+7.2)
2014-2015 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 16th, D Rating - 15th, Net Rating 2nd (+6.9)
2015-2016 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 7th, D Rating - 6th, Net Rating 6th (+4.4)
2016-2017 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 12th, D Rating - 12th, Net Rating 4th (+4.5)
2017-2018 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 24th, D Rating - 20th, Net Rating 18th (+0.0)
2018-2019 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 25th, D Rating - 21st, Net Rating 13th (+0.8)
2019-2020 Clips (Doc) - Opponents PPG - 13th, D Rating - 5th, Net Rating 2nd (+6.3)
2020-2021 Clips (Lue) - Opponents PPG - 4th, D Rating - 8th, Net Rating 2nd (+6.4)

Interpret those numbers how you want, but it doesn't appear Doc made this team better defensively than when Del Negro was the coach. Sure, the offensive rating went up, but the net rating never truly improved. Score more give up more.

[nickhx2]

i remember there was one year the lob city teams were pretty solid both ways (looks like the 2015 one noted above) but the rest of the time they were always middling or so on defense. and that was due to personnel, which was due to doc's personnel moves. re-signing jamal crawford and overplaying him well beyond his years one of the biggest factors in that.

[MartinToVaught]

The media is no longer covering for Doc. His career is being re-examined now. His one title gave him cover because he was the first black coach since K.C. Jones to win an NBA Title. The media wasn't going to tarnish what he accomplished even when signs indicated he was overrated. He was protected from scrutiny. Now, with black coaches leading 3 of the 4 Conference Finals teams and Doc's team choking again, Doc has lost his protection from media scrutiny.

I'd argue that Doc's protection over the years has less to do with race and more to do with the fact that he was a broadcaster on TNT and ABC and knows how to suck up to the media. He was part of their club, so they coddled him in a way that they don't do for other coaches.

I think another factor is just markets. The national media doesn't care enough about small markets (Orlando) or west-coast teams that aren't the Lakers/Warriors to do their homework, so a lot of his failures were swept under the rug or lazily blamed on the players because of that. And Doc's Mickey Mouse ring in 2008 bought him a free pass in Boston. Now that he's failed miserably in a big east-coast market, he can't hide from the criticism anymore.

[NippySudz]

it's amazing. I for sure thought, Doc would receive a lot of flack from the media come monday morning, but it didn't happen. Once again, Doc manages to scoop under the radar and deflect blames to his players and the media actually accepts this answer. Its unbelievable and very frustrating that Doc can continue getting away with coaching malpractice and not have to answer for it.

[MartinToVaught]

it's amazing. I for sure thought, Doc would receive a lot of flack from the media come monday morning, but it didn't happen. Once again, Doc manages to scoop under the radar and deflect blames to his players and the media actually accepts this answer. Its unbelievable and very frustrating that Doc can continue getting away with coaching malpractice and not have to answer for it.

Doc was getting roasted by the media earlier in the series for blowing those leads, though. That's already more criticism than he ever faced before this year.

[nickhx2]

eh, at the end of the day he's not our problem anymore. and he'll always be on the other side in any future encounters, so we're good pretty much no matter what happens. happy to have it be that way.

[Quake Griffin]

LOL at defending Doc in 2021.

How does Chris Rock say it:
This is like looking at OJ standing over another dead white girl and OJ saying, "I know what you're thinking."
-_-

This year was his fault.
Last year was his fault. And Kawhi performed well in games 5 and 6 last year and it wasn't enough to outrun his **** coaching. The idea that Kawhi and PGs Game 7 performance are why this team choked 3 games in a row is preposterous.

They're all his fault.
Time for him to start accepting responsibility. Don't blame deflect. Don't try to say the year isn't a total loss. Hold the L and say you need to get better as a coach.

[Clemenza]

Doc should've sat out a year or two before jumping back into the mix like he did. I know Philly was a good fit for him on paper as they already had star players in place which is what he likes but the same issues crept up as the lights got brighter despite him having the better team. The same blown leads, adjustments/certain players needing to sit, another nepotism angle at his disposal -even though Curry played pretty well but couldn't defend, etc. Of course Simmons gets alot of the blame and also low key Embiid is still never in good shape but the fact that Doc keeps finding himself in these same situations over and over and over again if finally rearing its ugly head.

[NickP]

Doc should've sat out a year or two before jumping back into the mix like he did. I know Philly was a good fit for him on paper as they already had star players in place which is what he likes but the same issues crept up as the lights got brighter despite him having the better team. The same blown leads, adjustments/certain players needing to sit, another nepotism angle at his disposal -even though Curry played pretty well but couldn't defend, etc. Of course Simmons gets alot of the blame and also low key Embiid is still never in good shape but the fact that Doc keeps finding himself in these same situations over and over and over again if finally rearing its ugly head.

The issue with Doc is his ego. That he has this huge ego can be attributed to the fact that he has powerful friends in the media. He's built great relationships while in the media booth and they've been carrying this label of a "great coach" for Doc. Not even their criticism really sounds like criticism.
The only criticism offered was a very thinly veiled one be Kenny Smith last night. He said a coach can never give him (Smith) confidence but he can sure take it away. Maybe he was alluding to the Doc and Ben Simmons situation.
Over the years, Doc has heard nothing but praises for him. He thinks with his BLM activism, he's now Teflon coated.
Even SVG who is otherwise so outspoken will only murmur or whisper about this or that pertaining to Doc. You'd think Doc and not PJ or Pop are the best coaches ever to coach this game.
Sad but true.

[MartinToVaught]

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Geez, the Sixers' ownership must have loved this spin from the con man since he's repeating it today. And why is Doc calling anyone out for wanting to take shortcuts to success? He's the one who quit on the Celtics because he felt like he was above coaching through a rebuild anymore.