Around the NBA II

[Captain Ballmer]

Watching the Boston - Milwaukee game now. We can't put anything better than what Celtics did against Bucks. So imaginable healthy Kawhi&Clippers for the rest of 2021 playoffs finals against Bucks... I'd think Bucks got their ring anyway.

We need physicality, energy, athleticm so bad.

[nickhx2]

Watching the Boston - Milwaukee game now. We can't put anything better than what Celtics did against Bucks. So imaginable healthy Kawhi&Clippers for the rest of 2021 playoffs finals against Bucks... I'd think Bucks got their ring anyway.

We need physicality, energy, athleticm so bad.

you mean we need to swindle atlanta into taking morris for john collins?

oh, what a dream that would be

[NippySudz]

then please go

Genius, have you noticed how the traffic on this Board has declined. Congratulations, many have taken you up on your invitation already. You will soon be king of all you survey.

The traffic has declined because we're out of the playoffs, I'd reckon that has more to do with it. It's not just our boards, other teams boards that are not lakers go through the same thing when their team is eliminated. It's normal.

[Captain Ballmer]

Watching the Boston - Milwaukee game now. We can't put anything better than what Celtics did against Bucks. So imaginable healthy Kawhi&Clippers for the rest of 2021 playoffs finals against Bucks... I'd think Bucks got their ring anyway.

We need physicality, energy, athleticm so bad.

you mean we need to swindle atlanta into taking morris for john collins?

oh, what a dream that would be

He definitely fits into the profile but wouldn't be my number one target. That dude wants usage, something we can't give when we healthy. Also he misses so many games occasionally, sometimes its his eye, then it's quad, ankle, finger etc.

My list would be;

Higher profile; M.Turner, C. Wood, J.Collins, B.Portis
Lower profile; J.Hayes, Jalen Smith, Obi Toppin

[esqtvd]

Tom, the Board just isn't as fun. I am so bored by this stuff. Hence, why bother posting. One of these days maybe the mods will crack down so we can get back to talking basketball and we can set up an "I hate Rivers (son and father)" board where such people can thrive.

Yah, the old Scout board died the same way. The bad drives out the good.

Our game threads often get unreadable whenever we get behind by 10--and it's because Ty Lue is really Doc Rivers. And when we win, it's because he isn't.

[esqtvd]

Watching the Boston - Milwaukee game now. We can't put anything better than what Celtics did against Bucks. So imaginable healthy Kawhi&Clippers for the rest of 2021 playoffs finals against Bucks... I'd think Bucks got their ring anyway.

We need physicality, energy, athleticm so bad.

you mean we need to swindle atlanta into taking morris for john collins?

oh, what a dream that would be

He definitely fits into the profile but wouldn't be my number one target. That dude wants usage, something we can't give when we healthy. Also he misses so many games occasionally, sometimes its his eye, then it's quad, ankle, finger etc.

Collins does always seem to be angry. Or hurt. Or both.

[nickhx2]

Watching the Boston - Milwaukee game now. We can't put anything better than what Celtics did against Bucks. So imaginable healthy Kawhi&Clippers for the rest of 2021 playoffs finals against Bucks... I'd think Bucks got their ring anyway.

We need physicality, energy, athleticm so bad.

you mean we need to swindle atlanta into taking morris for john collins?

oh, what a dream that would be

He definitely fits into the profile but wouldn't be my number one target. That dude wants usage, something we can't give when we healthy. Also he misses so many games occasionally, sometimes its his eye, then it's quad, ankle, finger etc.

My list would be;

Higher profile; M.Turner, C. Wood, J.Collins, B.Portis
Lower profile; J.Hayes, Jalen Smith, Obi Toppin

ya, you're not wrong if he wants a bigger role and it seems like he's had some gripes along the way with trae young for whatever reason.

[og15]

Chris Paul would look really nice running point guard with Paul George and Kawhi as the 2/3 on the team, can you imagine? Not realistic, but man, basically what the Clippers need at PG, control pace, make timely shots. Sometimes you don't realize what you have until you don't have it, then you say, hmm, that was nice.

[NippySudz]

Tom, the Board just isn't as fun. I am so bored by this stuff. Hence, why bother posting. One of these days maybe the mods will crack down so we can get back to talking basketball and we can set up an "I hate Rivers (son and father)" board where such people can thrive.

Yah, the old Scout board died the same way. The bad drives out the good.

Our game threads often get unreadable whenever we get behind by 10--and it's because Ty Lue is really Doc Rivers. And when we win, it's because he isn't.

WIth all due respect, you guys are living in delusion. If it was not for the doc talk at this current time in the season, this board will not be active. Go check the other team boards. Allow me to give you one for example. Portland Trailblazers. Until a year ago was a perennial playoff contender.

viewforum.php?f=28

At the time of the posting, they only have two threads that have been updated in the last two weeks. You guys need to stop screaming hell and brimstone anytime someone posts something you don't like. Relax, that's not what killing this board. In reality, this place is a relic of the past in some respects. It was here before social media was here, and through the great reporting that this site does, it still has a space in social media and message boards, but lets be honest, twitter, reddit, and the like have replaced the social forums. This place just happens to be one of the last man standing. We're in changing times. I enjoy this board though, I love reading the comments on here.

[Roscoe Sheed]

Chris Paul would look really nice running point guard with Paul George and Kawhi as the 2/3 on the team, can you imagine? Not realistic, but man, basically what the Clippers need at PG, control pace, make timely shots. Sometimes you don't realize what you have until you don't have it, then you say, hmm, that was nice.

true- however, CP3 is somehow better at age 37 than his early 30s. I wish he would have changed his diet and fitness regime earlier in his career. Seemed like he pulled a hamstring or some other odd injury every other game often due to poor fitness in the playoffs with the Clippers. Still have a sour taste in my mouth regarding that. I will only cheer for the Suns vs the Warriors if that series occurs. I really don't like Booker or Crowder either.

[esqtvd]

Tom, the Board just isn't as fun. I am so bored by this stuff. Hence, why bother posting. One of these days maybe the mods will crack down so we can get back to talking basketball and we can set up an "I hate Rivers (son and father)" board where such people can thrive.

Yah, the old Scout board died the same way. The bad drives out the good.

Our game threads often get unreadable whenever we get behind by 10--and it's because Ty Lue is really Doc Rivers. And when we win, it's because he isn't.

WIth all due respect, you guys are living in delusion. If it was not for the doc talk at this current time in the season, this board will not be active. Go check the other team boards. Allow me to give you one for example. Portland Trailblazers. Until a year ago was a perennial playoff contender.

viewforum.php?f=28

At the time of the posting, they only have two threads that have been updated in the last two weeks. You guys need to stop screaming hell and brimstone anytime someone posts something you don't like. Relax, that's not what killing this board. In reality, this place is a relic of the past in some respects. It was here before social media was here, and through the great reporting that this site does, it still has a space in social media and message boards, but lets be honest, twitter, reddit, and the like have replaced the social forums. This place just happens to be one of the last man standing. We're in changing times. I enjoy this board though, I love reading the comments on here.

With all due respect, there used to be a lot more quality contributors like Mr Kelphus who just don't come around any more. The bad drives out the good, and the game threads in particular turn into a toxic waste dump at the first sign of trouble.

Like Los Angeles itself, those in charge here consider everything acceptable, short of burning the place down. But the quality of life has fallen dramatically.

[esqtvd]

Chris Paul would look really nice running point guard with Paul George and Kawhi as the 2/3 on the team, can you imagine? Not realistic, but man, basically what the Clippers need at PG, control pace, make timely shots. Sometimes you don't realize what you have until you don't have it, then you say, hmm, that was nice.

true- however, CP3 is somehow better at age 37 than his early 30s. I wish he would have changed his diet and fitness regime earlier in his career. Seemed like he pulled a hamstring or some other odd injury every other game often due to poor fitness in the playoffs with the Clippers. Still have a sour taste in my mouth regarding that. I will only cheer for the Suns vs the Warriors if that series occurs. I really don't like Booker or Crowder either.

Yes, I too feel this is not the CP3 of Lob City. He was still a good playoff performer but was not the leader he is now--and in fairness Blake and the others were not willing to be led like Booker, Crowder and this young Suns crew.

[og15]

Chris Paul would look really nice running point guard with Paul George and Kawhi as the 2/3 on the team, can you imagine? Not realistic, but man, basically what the Clippers need at PG, control pace, make timely shots. Sometimes you don't realize what you have until you don't have it, then you say, hmm, that was nice.

true- however, CP3 is somehow better at age 37 than his early 30s. I wish he would have changed his diet and fitness regime earlier in his career. Seemed like he pulled a hamstring or some other odd injury every other game often due to poor fitness in the playoffs with the Clippers. Still have a sour taste in my mouth regarding that. I will only cheer for the Suns vs the Warriors if that series occurs. I really don't like Booker or Crowder either.

He's definitely declined in comparison, can't get to the basket at the same level or consistently, defense is still sharp, but a little lower, iso skills against quicker defenders are nowhere close to before, etc. What is happening is that players are always boosted for winning.

Jason Kidd went from a choker in the West because competition was stiffer to a great winner in the East because relative to East competition, his Nets teams were the most talented. If he had those same Nets teams in the West they would have been out in round 1 or 2, and he gets no winning boost.

Paul of course has been impressive in maintaining a high level as his age, he's an outlier, but he's also on a better and more balanced team that's more receptive to him and more suited to his skills. Paul until he got to the Rockets never played alongside an All-Star or higher level SG or SF, and that's the type of player that helps maximize him. Suns have the wings the Clippers never had, Ayton unlike DJ has touch and is a better defender, and Booker is more durable than Blake and as a guard has some shot creation and explosive scoring advantages. Booker's defense going to the next level has been a big plus for them.

Lob city was too weak on the wing and in depth. If Lob City was Paul/Dynamic SG/Long Versatile Defensive Wing/Defensive Stretch 4/Defensive C with touch and scoring ability + decent bench, they also would have been much better, especially since the league was transitioning to pace and space during their time.

[Roscoe Sheed]

Chris Paul would look really nice running point guard with Paul George and Kawhi as the 2/3 on the team, can you imagine? Not realistic, but man, basically what the Clippers need at PG, control pace, make timely shots. Sometimes you don't realize what you have until you don't have it, then you say, hmm, that was nice.

true- however, CP3 is somehow better at age 37 than his early 30s. I wish he would have changed his diet and fitness regime earlier in his career. Seemed like he pulled a hamstring or some other odd injury every other game often due to poor fitness in the playoffs with the Clippers. Still have a sour taste in my mouth regarding that. I will only cheer for the Suns vs the Warriors if that series occurs. I really don't like Booker or Crowder either.

He's definitely declined in comparison, can't get to the basket at the same level or consistently, defense is still sharp, but a little lower, iso skills against quicker defenders are nowhere close to before, etc. What is happening is that players are always boosted for winning.

Jason Kidd went from a choker in the West because competition was stiffer to a great winner in the East because relative to East competition, his Nets teams were the most talented. If he had those same Nets teams in the West they would have been out in round 1 or 2, and he gets no winning boost.

Paul of course has been impressive in maintaining a high level as his age, he's an outlier, but he's also on a better and more balanced team that's more receptive to him and more suited to his skills. Paul until he got to the Rockets never played alongside an All-Star or higher level SG or SF, and that's the type of player that helps maximize him. Suns have the wings the Clippers never had, Ayton unlike DJ has touch and is a better defender, and Booker is more durable than Blake and as a guard has some shot creation and explosive scoring advantages. Booker's defense going to the next level has been a big plus for them.

Lob city was too weak on the wing and in depth. If Lob City was Paul/Dynamic SG/Long Versatile Defensive Wing/Defensive Stretch 4/Defensive C with touch and scoring ability + decent bench, they also would have been much better, especially since the league was transitioning to pace and space during their time.

I agree with most of what you are saying- the Suns are better suited to CP3's skillset. However, I haven't noticed much of a physical dropoff- in fact he seems to have lost weight and is more fit and therefore less prone to injury.

[TrueLAfan]

Kidd realized his weaknesses too; he was always a smart player, and was able to make adjustments and improvements that kept him a top flight PG after his physical skills were in decline. I saw him play when he was a high school senior and it was truly a man among boys thing--not just because he was Jason Kidd sized at 17/18, but because he was already a well rounded player. His pull up perimeter game was not good when he was young--he got everything by using his physicality. He shot .325 from three in his first 10 years--then got good from behind the line (.369 for his final nine years) and got better with the improved passing lanes he saw.

CP3 would help any team right now. I don't want to rehash Lob City's weaknesses--but I will say that we could be a lot better than that team was with a lesser player than Chris Paul. We've got leadership and ball movement; I'd rather have a no frills guy at PG.

[og15]

Kidd realized his weaknesses too; he was always a smart player, and was able to make adjustments and improvements that kept him a top flight PG after his physical skills were in decline. I saw him play when he was a high school senior and it was truly a man among boys thing--not just because he was Jason Kidd sized at 17/18, but because he was already a well rounded player. His pull up perimeter game was not good when he was young--he got everything by using his physicality. He shot .325 from three in his first 10 years--then got good from behind the line (.369 for his final nine years) and got better with the improved passing lanes he saw.

CP3 would help any team right now. I don't want to rehash Lob City's weaknesses--but I will say that we could be a lot better than that team was with a lesser player than Chris Paul. We've got leadership and ball movement; I'd rather have a no frills guy at PG.

Yup, Kidd also had great longevity due to improving skills, defense and IQ. That's what differentiates a Kidd from for example a Westbrook who has good size, is still very athletic, but his skills and IQ are not at the level to make him effective into an older age.

What I was referring to though was early 2000 Kidd, he was on Phoenix and consistently losing in the 1st or 2nd round, then went to the East where his ECF opponent was worse than the first round opponent he would play in the WC.

true- however, CP3 is somehow better at age 37 than his early 30s. I wish he would have changed his diet and fitness regime earlier in his career. Seemed like he pulled a hamstring or some other odd injury every other game often due to poor fitness in the playoffs with the Clippers. Still have a sour taste in my mouth regarding that. I will only cheer for the Suns vs the Warriors if that series occurs. I really don't like Booker or Crowder either.

He's definitely declined in comparison, can't get to the basket at the same level or consistently, defense is still sharp, but a little lower, iso skills against quicker defenders are nowhere close to before, etc. What is happening is that players are always boosted for winning.

Jason Kidd went from a choker in the West because competition was stiffer to a great winner in the East because relative to East competition, his Nets teams were the most talented. If he had those same Nets teams in the West they would have been out in round 1 or 2, and he gets no winning boost.

Paul of course has been impressive in maintaining a high level as his age, he's an outlier, but he's also on a better and more balanced team that's more receptive to him and more suited to his skills. Paul until he got to the Rockets never played alongside an All-Star or higher level SG or SF, and that's the type of player that helps maximize him. Suns have the wings the Clippers never had, Ayton unlike DJ has touch and is a better defender, and Booker is more durable than Blake and as a guard has some shot creation and explosive scoring advantages. Booker's defense going to the next level has been a big plus for them.

Lob city was too weak on the wing and in depth. If Lob City was Paul/Dynamic SG/Long Versatile Defensive Wing/Defensive Stretch 4/Defensive C with touch and scoring ability + decent bench, they also would have been much better, especially since the league was transitioning to pace and space during their time.

I agree with most of what you are saying- the Suns are better suited to CP3's skillset. However, I haven't noticed much of a physical dropoff- in fact he seems to have lost weight and is more fit and therefore less prone to injury.

You did mention compared to his 30's, but if you go back and watch Clippers CP3 in isolation compared to now, you'll see that even though he had lost his top level athleticism from his early New Orleans days, he still had enough blow by speed on the perimeter to get by quick players. Right now he's mainly going to use pick and roll or he'll hunt for a switch on a big or slower perimeter defender (eg Luka).

[Roscoe Sheed]

Kidd realized his weaknesses too; he was always a smart player, and was able to make adjustments and improvements that kept him a top flight PG after his physical skills were in decline. I saw him play when he was a high school senior and it was truly a man among boys thing--not just because he was Jason Kidd sized at 17/18, but because he was already a well rounded player. His pull up perimeter game was not good when he was young--he got everything by using his physicality. He shot .325 from three in his first 10 years--then got good from behind the line (.369 for his final nine years) and got better with the improved passing lanes he saw.

CP3 would help any team right now. I don't want to rehash Lob City's weaknesses--but I will say that we could be a lot better than that team was with a lesser player than Chris Paul. We've got leadership and ball movement; I'd rather have a no frills guy at PG.

Yup, Kidd also had great longevity due to improving skills, defense and IQ. That's what differentiates a Kidd from for example a Westbrook who has good size, is still very athletic, but his skills and IQ are not at the level to make him effective into an older age.

What I was referring to though was early 2000 Kidd, he was on Phoenix and consistently losing in the 1st or 2nd round, then went to the East where his ECF opponent was worse than the first round opponent he would play in the WC.

He's definitely declined in comparison, can't get to the basket at the same level or consistently, defense is still sharp, but a little lower, iso skills against quicker defenders are nowhere close to before, etc. What is happening is that players are always boosted for winning.

Jason Kidd went from a choker in the West because competition was stiffer to a great winner in the East because relative to East competition, his Nets teams were the most talented. If he had those same Nets teams in the West they would have been out in round 1 or 2, and he gets no winning boost.

Paul of course has been impressive in maintaining a high level as his age, he's an outlier, but he's also on a better and more balanced team that's more receptive to him and more suited to his skills. Paul until he got to the Rockets never played alongside an All-Star or higher level SG or SF, and that's the type of player that helps maximize him. Suns have the wings the Clippers never had, Ayton unlike DJ has touch and is a better defender, and Booker is more durable than Blake and as a guard has some shot creation and explosive scoring advantages. Booker's defense going to the next level has been a big plus for them.

Lob city was too weak on the wing and in depth. If Lob City was Paul/Dynamic SG/Long Versatile Defensive Wing/Defensive Stretch 4/Defensive C with touch and scoring ability + decent bench, they also would have been much better, especially since the league was transitioning to pace and space during their time.

I agree with most of what you are saying- the Suns are better suited to CP3's skillset. However, I haven't noticed much of a physical dropoff- in fact he seems to have lost weight and is more fit and therefore less prone to injury.

You did mention compared to his 30's, but if you go back and watch Clippers CP3 in isolation compared to now, you'll see that even though he had lost his top level athleticism from his early New Orleans days, he still had enough blow by speed on the perimeter to get by quick players. Right now he's mainly going to use pick and roll or he'll hunt for a switch on a big or slower perimeter defender (eg Luka).

True- he is always hunting for switches- however, I do recall him pulling up for jumpers when bigs switched on him more than driving to the basket even during his time with the Clippers.

On a side note, I think teams switch far too easily. I know you run the risk of giving up semi-open jump shots by trying to stay on your man, but I think you should at least try when there are such glaring mismatches.

Seeing some of this action makes me concerned about keeping Kennard. I know he has improved to an extent, but I see teams ruthlessly seeking mismatches and feel like he would be hunted against high level playoff teams.

[og15]

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[nickhx2]

dude, cmon, russell lol

[esqtvd]

Paul of course has been impressive in maintaining a high level as his age, he's an outlier, but he's also on a better and more balanced team that's more receptive to him and more suited to his skills. Paul until he got to the Rockets never played alongside an All-Star or higher level SG or SF, and that's the type of player that helps maximize him.

Along with CP3, Blake and DJ ate up 2/3 of the salary cap. 2/3 DOA before you even start filling out the rest of the roster. CP is still killing it at 37. Blake and DJ were washed at 30.

CP3 wanted a change of scenery but IMO forced a trade from the Clippers to get away from Blake. Shortly thereafter, Ballmer signed Blake to a near-max contract a Clipper For Life. After Blake promptly failed his audition as the Clippers new leader within a month, Ballmer promptly packed his sorry ass off to NBA Siberia [the Pistons].

If you look me up on the internet, I'm not a basketball coach, I'm a student of history. This is how it went down. Chris was not yet the good and selfless leader he is now. And Blake and DJ did not become the good soldiers for Chris they needed to be until now--once it's way too late.

I'm gonna cheer for Chris to win it all. He's doing it right.