Chris Paul to the Rockets

[JGOJustin]

yeah, i would have been fine with austin starting. the problem was that jj redick was often near useless when he didn't get to play alongside chris paul.

Tbh JJ's time with LAC whether he was on the bench or starting was coming to an end and for me personally it couldn't have come at a sooner time.

His ascension and value to LAC's offense brought about some bad habits for us.

If he could have done that stuff in the 4th quarter instead of vanishing at halftime, history might be different.

Not even just that.

If you watched LAC from the time he got here until the time he left this past summer, the offense became increasingly JJ centric. He went from being a floor spacer and a good team defender to a guy that we ran a ton of Floppy and DHO action with, and while that was good for the course of 82 games, the habits that that built wasn't. Bringing DJ and Blake especially away from the basket to free up Redick wasn't ideal at all but it became a very real habit for us and we got away with it until playoff time, where he's playing wings with size that blow up everything that we'd try to do come playoff time and his looks became far less cleaner.

I've probably said this before but he became so good that it became counterproductive. What JJ Redick became with us brought blake away from the basket more, and provided us with habits that were going to be hard to break come playoff time. Combine that with his age and lack of size length and athleticism, and I for one am glad that he didn't return and wanted him moved sooner tbh

[og15]

How much of the action was actually floppy? If we're running high screen and roll, we're pulling the bigs away from the basket, if we're running horns, we're pulling them away. I can't agree that there was some negative impact on the bigs offensively because of running plays for Redick. The bigs being closer to the basket to set up plays, what would that have done though? After setting a screen, they can position themselves closer to the basket, so it doesn't prevent them. I can agree that when that option become ineffective, then you are using up a couple of seconds on the shot clock to set him up for not valuable return and that can hurt.

Let's look at it though, since we're talking playoffs and the effect in later seasons. Redick's first season was 13-14, he played just 35 regular season games, he was fine in the playoffs, a little struggle vs OKC. 14-15 was just his second season, he adjusted well vs SA and played well to end the series, and he started well vs Houston, but of course we know the last three games with him and all the other supporting cast guys falling off a click in shooting. Okay, so if we're saying by 15-16 we started relying too much on Redick plays, maybe, but Blake missed most of the season that year and Redick was the second option for most of the year. in a starting lineup with Mbah, Pierce and DJ.

Against Portland, he did very well at home, was bad on the road, and then was fairly good in the last two games without Paul and Blake. Paul and Blake missed the end of that series, and in the games they played, Blake was mostly ineffective and it was Paul and Redick that were consistent offensive performers in both of their two wins.

This past season, he got shut down, Ingles was his kyrptonite, he was bad in the games Blake played, he was bad in the games he didn't play, but I didn't really see any inherent issue due to overly relying on Redick. Austin being out and playing injured reduced the alternate options early, and that was a problem. A healthy Austin actually would have changed things, allowing Doc to reduce Redick's minutes (and some people would probably still call nepotism despite Redick sucking). I just don't really see the pattern of how that was a detriment in the post-season. The only relevant post-seasons with Redick were 13-14 and 14-15. The last two post-seasons, the injuries to the best player(s) overshadowed anything else.

[wco81]

Lets see what happens during the season, whether spacing becomes an issue because one of the best shooters in the league from distance is gone.

CP3 was also an effective shooter from 3.

[og15]

Lets see what happens during the season, whether spacing becomes an issue because one of the best shooters in the league from distance is gone.

CP3 was also an effective shooter from 3.

Spacing might actually be better. While it was great to have two 5+ 3PA/40%+ 3PT shooters in the starting lineup, that was counteracted by having Luc, a low volume only corner 3PT shooter along with them.

Blake started taking 3.0 3PA/G over the last 30 games, Gallo is a far superior shooter to Luc or Barnes. Austin is actually a good spot up shooter, I've been highlighting this since the second half of the 15-16 season. Beverley is a good shooter, Teodosic is supposed to be a good shooter, Lou is a good shooter, and Dekker can shoot from outside.

The spacing actually seems like it will be better as teams won't have anyone to play off. Playing off Austin is not a good idea as he's a guy who will hit 7, 8 3's if you give him the open shots. Also giving him a lot of space allows him to attack at the defender with some momentum. All the other guys from 1-3, teams won't play off them.

Add to that Blake taking 3-4 3PA on 33-34%+ 3PT and there should be a lot of space.

[QRich3]

Yeah it's gonna be real interesting to see how the team's dynamic shapes up, but spacing should be the least of our problems. Specially interested in seeing Blake's shooting progress, and his two man game with DJ. But can't wait to see how they use guys like Milos and Lou too. Can't wait to watch the whole dynamic of team tbh.

We're most likely gonna struggle on defense though, big time.

[TucsonClip]

Spacing should be better because of the floor balance due to passing (at least thats what we are being told). We were a very efficient offense with the starters on the floor the last five seasons. However, ball movement allows guys more freedom on offense via cuts, ball reversals, duck ins, ect. Thats what we are being told is going to happen, so well see once the team takes the floor. That bodes well for Blake, as he clearly is at his best when he is the primary distributor.

[Wammy Giveaway]

Watch on YouTube

The first sixteen minutes of it.

So, what does this say about Chris Paul leaving?

[nickhx2]

you watched this vid and purposely let stephen a smith yell at you for 16 whole minutes?

[Wammy Giveaway]

you watched this vid and purposely let stephen a smith yell at you for 16 whole minutes?

I can handle 16 minutes, why can't you?

[nickhx2]

it's not that one can't handle him. it's me asking why you would subject yourself to such a tortuous waste of time.

[Wammy Giveaway]

it's not that one can't handle him. it's me asking why you would subject yourself to such a tortuous waste of time.

Tell me, who would you rather I get resources from, Clipper beat writers, people who actually work for the team? All they're gonna give me is biased answers.

I don't care who I get my resources from. Just because I said I started out a Lakers fan in a long ago post, which I have since denounced, oh, you can't trust me. You think I'm on a wild smear campaign chase. You think I'm a Warriors spy, is that it? Is it!?

[Ranma]

I'm obligated to say that, like nickhx2, I find Stephen A. Smith to be as distasteful and credible as Peter Vecsey, whom I don't particularly like. However, both Smith and Vecsey have provided scoops in the past and do have connections as former beat writers. As such, they're mouthpieces for players and/or executives in providing bad information from time to time along with using their respective platforms in trying to sell their own brand of speculation in attempts to sensationalize stories in order to boost their credibility.

That said, Smith seems to confirm Michael Eaves' Facebook report of discord between Doc and CP3 and some of my own suspicions. Unlike nickhx2, I consider Eaves to be credible. Like Smith, Eaves is obviously connected and partial to Chris Paul's camp, so we have to keep that in mind whenever they talk about CP3. Smith has proven to be wrong on multiple occasions, but that typically happens when he makes his own personal analysis of situations. He seems to be correct more frequently when claiming reports from his connections.

In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Jerry West being competitive and wanting to outduel Magic Johnson in "eclipsing" the Lakers with the Clippers, but I've heard that elsewhere as well. I found it interesting and near unbelievable that the Clippers supposedly offered Chris Paul the max only for him to turn it down to go with Houston. Discord with Doc Rivers and the direction of the Clippers under his leadership was cited as a key reason, but Smith noted his sources told him that Blake Griffin would not have re-signed if Paul had returned. Once CP3 departed, the Clippers purportedly then offered Griffin the max and BG re-signed even though Paul was the preferred choice.

Also, according to Smith, the discord between Doc and Paul not only occurred over Doc not pulling the trigger on the Melo-for-Austin trade but also over CP3 not joining the team's contingent to pitch to Kevin Durant during his free agency. Paul is apparently close to Durant and supposedly knew that KD did not want to join the team in large part due to Paul and Griffin butting heads as well as Paul and DeAndre Jordan also not being on the same page.

There're plenty of reasons why I prefer Paul over Griffin and Jordan, for that matter, but one that stands out is that he has more drawing power to free agents than BG and DJ combined. It also doesn't hurt that he's more competitively driven with an indomitable will than either of the bosom buddies.

How true is all of this? I'm not sure, but all of it lines up with other things I've been hearing along with my own thoughts. Those thoughts include Russell Westbrook, LeBron James, and Paul George all being likely possibilities for Los Angeles either with the Lakers and/or Clippers.

[Ranma]

Tell me, who would you rather I get resources from, Clipper beat writers, people who actually work for the team? All they're gonna give me is biased answers.

I don't care who I get my resources from. Just because I said I started out a Lakers fan in a long ago post, which I have since denounced, oh, you can't trust me. You think I'm on a wild smear campaign chase. You think I'm a Warriors spy, is that it? Is it!?

Relax, Wammy. I think nickhx2 has more issues with Stephen A. Smith's credibility in this particular instance than he does with anything against you. To be honest, nick has a point given Smith's spotty record and talent evaluation acumen or lack thereof.

With regards to sources, I tend to favor Ramona Shelburne, Adrian Wojnarowski, Brian Windhorst, Shams Charania, and Zach Lowe.

[nickhx2]

i mean honestly for me this doesn't really have anything to do with his credibility, even though he's shown a good lack of it.

but the guy is a talking head who is trying to sell you a hot take, not journalistic integrity. and he's yelling at you the whole time. i'm just asking why you're buying it and why you'd let yourself be yelled at when you can go read articles from other people who are more respectable. and quieter.

[Wammy Giveaway]

but the guy is a talking head who is trying to sell you a hot take, not journalistic integrity. and he's yelling at you the whole time. i'm just asking why you're buying it and why you'd let yourself be yelled at when you can go read articles from other people who are more respectable. and quieter.

What do you want me to do?

This is how I do my findings: first I go to YouTube or Google and type Clippers. Any video, podcast or article that has a talking point with enough six-degree connections to research further, no matter how loud, obnoxious or mind-controlling it may seem, gets relayed here for you to talk about. You're trying to make it sound like I'm forbidden to reference any source material that ridicules, embarrasses, tarnishes, or otherwise destroys whatever good will the Clippers are trying to accomplish. This would mean I'm only allowed to post stuff that comes from Clipper-centric websites like Clips Nation, Clipperblog, Clipperholics, and so on because they are the closest to the Clippers and they only get on their good side. Any site that has a broad NBA scope like ESPN is off-limits because they know nothing better than to make the Clippers feel bad about themselves.

By restricting myself to just a select few beat writers who won't do harm to the Clippers, it hinders my ability as a sports observer from acquiring a stereoscopic view of a complex franchise. I want to get the Clippers story from both sides, a little bit from the good, a little bit from the bad. As a podcaster, I must pursue this method.

[esqtvd]

@Wammy: Thx for the link
@Ramna: Thx for the summary, I hate videos
@Nick: Thx for the LOL


As for Stephen A, I've been hitting his radio show a bit lately. He's passionate and has unique content. Like Howard Cosell, who used to win polls simultaneously as Most Favorite and Least Favorite Sportscaster. Frankly, I think people's take on him says more about them than about Stephen A, another sports Rorschach test.

As for CP, James Harden put it right the other day, that when the opt-out deadline was approaching, Chris just seemed so damned unhappy. I strongly doubt there was any one issue or factor that drove his decision to bail:


Chris had done his best for 4 years here, and there was no light at the end of the tunnel--in fact there was less light than ever with JJ leaving. Indeed, his shortcomings in the OKC and Houston series are to blame as much as anything anyone else did to keep us from ever escaping the second round.

It also didn't help that this was no band of brothers--also, I'm sure, why Kevin Durant joined GSW's God Squad. Chris is a family man and he and KD just don't fit in with the majority of the young millionaires of the NBA, who live like sailors on leave. Neither do many NBAers share CP's deep throat approach to the game--in fact he got Austin's back in seperate game incidents when Baby Doc called out Blake and DJ for a lack of focus. [Why I find the nepotism narrative questionable if not bogus. Austin is more a kindred spirit than most of the roster.]


So the point is, Chris was unhappy on every level, professionally and personally, both in the long term and day-to-day. He'd done his best, the team as capped out would never overcome its lack of depth, and frankly, the BG/DJ permanent bachelor party was not CP's style. He wanted off.

And Chris was so spiritually and mentally miserable, he jumped without a parachute, as you know. Ballmer offered him EVERYTHING. CP blows out his knee this year with the Rockets, he gets nothing. Chris was the reverse DB Cooper--he jumped out of his own plane, and left 200 million dollars in it.

Nobody pushed him, not Blake, or Doc, and certainly not Austin Rivers. If Chris wanted any of them gone, Steve Ballmer would have snapped his fingers. Chris Paul is the Clipper franchise's only Hall of Famer and he has at least 2 and maybe 5 productive years left. They won't be spent as a Clipper.


And if I'm making Chris Paul the hero of the story, no, not really. CP3 is probably my favorite sports hero of all time, of all my teams, but he's kind of a drag. For everyone's sake, his, ours, and his team's--it's better he jumped.

[Ranma]

Read on Twitter

[Wammy Giveaway]

Read on Twitter

A play on words, but a fitting title to add to Ranma's retweet of Justin Russo's:

Before Chris Paul
- Clippers relocated to San Diego, California from Buffalo, New York in 1978. Donald Sterling became owner in 1981.
- Regular season record is 948-1726 since relocation to San Diego, 834-1594 under Sterling's ownership. Playoff record is 9-14 (0.391). 18 coaches(!).
- In 1999 lockout season, Clips record of 9-41, considered lowest of all time for not hitting the 10-win mark, is the equivalent of 18-64 when aggregated to 82 games.
- From 1976-1991, Clippers were in the middle of a 15-year playoff drought beginning in Buffalo. Average drought gap for Clippers is 7.25 years between playoff visits.
- All playoff visits were 1st round exits, except for 2006 where they were 2nd round. In chronological order, 7th, 7th, 8th, 6th.
- Three of four playoff matches became conference finalist or further at the Clipper's expense:

1. 1992 - Utah Jazz, 5 games, Western Conference Finals
2. 1996 - Utah Jazz, 3 games, NBA Finals
3. 2006 - Phoenix Suns, 7 games, Western Conference Finals

With Chris Paul
- Paul's arrival to Clippers could not have been possible without David Stern. Controversy ensued with conflict of interest claims when he responded in calm "basketball reasons." He was also supposedly angry at Lakers for Andrew Bynum's clothesline to J.J. Barea along with Phil Jackson's failure to 3-peat. This incident would mark the second time the former NBA commissioner helped Donald Sterling to "clean up his act." That didn't last very long when Adam Silver progressed as commissioner in 2014 and ousted Sterling for racist remarks.
- Regular season record is 313-163. Playoff record is 24-56 (0.300). Only two coaches: Vinny Del Negro and Doc Rivers.
- Under Paul, average regular season record is 52.16 wins (53.83 in 82), 27.16 losses (28.16 in 82).
- In 2012 lockout season, Clips record of 40-26 is the equivalent of 50-32 when aggregated to 82 games.
- Two time Pacific Division winners, 2013 and 2014. Have never won a banner of any kind until his arrival.
- Playoff visits were no higher than 2nd round exit. In chronological order, 5th, 4th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th.
- Four of six playoff matches became conference finalist at the Clipper's expense:
1. 2012 - San Antonio Spurs (2nd round), 4 game automatic sweep, Western Conference Finals
2. 2013 - Memphis Grizzlies (1st round), 6 games, Western Conference Finals
3. 2014 - Oklahoma City Thunder (2nd round), 6 games, Western Conference Finals
4. 2015 - Houston Rockets (2nd round), 7 games under 3-1 collapse, Western Conference Finals

Expectations Of Without Chris Paul
Average regular season record without Paul is 28.72 wins (29 in 82), 52.3 losses (53 in 82). Everyone expects Clips to return to those perennial losing levels, along with a massive playoff drought gap. Look at New Orleans Pelicans, who have not recovered since trading for Paul to acquire Anthony Davis in the 2012 NBA draft. All they have to show for it was a 1st round exit to Golden State Warriors.

Chris Paul was a magical lucky charm who instantly turned losers like Clippers into respectable teams. Without him, they will be struggling mightily in all of sports let alone their own league and the western conference just to be loved and respected. Adam Silver is unlike David Stern in that he doesn't play favorites. Any mistakes the Clippers make, they will have to publicly own up to and accept responsibility.

In other words, they're on their own.

[Ranma]

With Chris Paul
- Paul's arrival to Clippers could not have been possible without David Stern. Controversy ensued with conflict of interest claims when he responded in calm "basketball reasons." He was also supposedly angry at Lakers for Andrew Bynum's clothesline to J.J. Barea along with Phil Jackson's failure to 3-peat. This incident would mark the second time the former NBA commissioner helped Donald Sterling to "clean up his act." That didn't last very long when Adam Silver progressed as commissioner in 2014 and ousted Sterling for racist remarks.
- Regular season record is 313-163. Playoff record is 24-56 (0.428). Only two coaches: Vinny Del Negro and Doc Rivers.

I +1'ed your post for the numbers breakdown, which I always appreciate from you, but you miscalculated the Clippers' postseason record with Chris Paul. 24-56 is actually a win percentage of .300, not .428.

Expectations Of Without Chris Paul
Average regular season record without Paul is 28.72 wins (29 in 82), 52.3 losses (53 in 82). Everyone expects Clips to return to those perennial losing levels, along with a massive playoff drought gap. Look at New Orleans Pelicans, who have not recovered since trading for Paul to acquire Anthony Davis in the 2012 NBA draft. All they have to show for it was a 1st round exit to Golden State Warriors.

Chris Paul was a magical lucky charm who instantly turned losers like Clippers into respectable teams. Without him, they will be struggling mightily in all of sports let alone their own league and the western conference just to be loved and respected. Adam Silver is unlike David Stern in that he doesn't play favorites. Any mistakes the Clippers make, they will have to publicly own up to and accept responsibility.

In other words, they're on their own.

While I certainly think the Clippers are not as good without Paul than they would be with him, there are other factors at play besides the "magical lucky charm" factor. The team has better ownership and organizational structure, which by themselves are significant factors that should keep the Clips from going through the extended years of futility under Sterling's ownership.

Doc may still find a way to squander the team's on-court assets and the Clippers need to show they can overcome the shortcomings that have plagued them previously such as injuries and constant whining to officials, but on paper, they have the makings of a playoff team.

[Wammy Giveaway]

I +1'ed your post for the numbers breakdown, which I always appreciate from you, but you miscalculated the Clippers' postseason record with Chris Paul. 24-56 is actually a win percentage of .300, not .428.

Let the records show that Wammy Giveaway acknowledges the mathematical miscalculation pointed out by Ranma in the previous post and accepts the inadvertent oversight. Whoops...

(See, it's not that hard, Clippers. Everybody makes mistakes. It's only bad when you continue to blame others for your own misfortunes, or to punish yourselves for failing to be perfect. Nobody's perfect. Just be good, and everything will be okay.)

Doc may still find a way to squander the team's on-court assets and the Clippers need to show they can overcome the shortcomings that have plagued them previously such as injuries and constant whining to officials, but on paper, they have the makings of a playoff team.

Don't forget laziness, another Doc trait. I totally forgot to mention that part of the reason for the Clippers slippage in the standings was not taking lottery teams seriously. The Warriors became a playoff team in 2012-13 for this exact reason. While I'll give them the benefit of the doubt in that the Warriors surprise climb happened under Vinny Del Negro's watch, there was still this attitude of empty entitlement, especially with the Doc-Austin nepotism factor.