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The offense and what it's supposed to be

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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#21 » by QRich3 » Sat Dec 28, 2019 2:06 am

Kawhi and George are excellent passers, that's not it. The Bucks might not have a single player with their passing skills and their ball movement is crisp all of the time, same for the Celtics a lot of the time, or even the Heat. And don't make it about Doc vs other coaches either, he's a great offensive coach and so many of his teams had that type of movement. Hell, I'm saying the current bench does.

You're focusing too much on who starts and who doesn't, when Shamet and Green play with them at other points in the game, the ball still sticks. It's not about shuffling line ups.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#22 » by esqtvd » Sat Dec 28, 2019 3:16 am

QRich3 wrote:Kawhi and George are excellent passers, that's not it. The Bucks might not have a single player with their passing skills and their ball movement is crisp all of the time, same for the Celtics a lot of the time, or even the Heat. And don't make it about Doc vs other coaches either, he's a great offensive coach and so many of his teams had that type of movement. Hell, I'm saying the current bench does.

You're focusing too much on who starts and who doesn't, when Shamet and Green play with them at other points in the game, the ball still sticks. It's not about shuffling line ups.



I'll agree provisionally, having already acknowledged that introducing Shamet and/or J-Myke to the equation gives you three legit offensive players on the court, a perhaps critical mass. But they haven't played together enough yet to make a judgment. I'll also agree that we need to gin up an offensive scheme of some sort in the next five to six weeks.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#23 » by esqtvd » Fri Jan 3, 2020 3:02 am

still a long way until April and still not able to assess what we've got completely

just try to get healthy and keep racking up the Ws

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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#24 » by esqtvd » Tue Jan 7, 2020 10:15 pm

You make do with whatever the front office gives you. :dontknow:

Clippers learning to live, for now, without a ‘pure’ point guard
Coach Doc Rivers isn't happy about the Clippers' 15.8 turnovers per game, which he attributes to the team's lack of a true point guard.

https://www.ocregister.com/2020/01/07/clippers-learning-to-live-for-now-without-a-pure-point-guard/?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_content=tw-InsideSoCalSpts&utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_medium=social

    “Without ever having the benefit of seeing these guys play, (coach) Doc (Rivers) does a ton of preparation with his staff,” Lawrence Frank said. “But we’re gonna learn a lot over the first two and a half, three months of the season. You can look at a roster and say, ‘I think the holes are gonna be here or here,’ and you could be completely off.


    “What Doc does, he puts guys in position to succeed and play to their strengths. So what may, on the board, look like, ‘Oh, we lack this position,’ well, maybe he’s gonna make those adjustments and it won’t be there.”

    ...

    According to ESPN’s Bobby Marks, the Clippers were set to fully guarantee Derrick Walton Jr.’s contract Tuesday. In Rivers’ eyes, the 6-foot Walton is “one of the only guys on our team that you can actually call a point guard,” but he’s inexperienced and has played sparingly.

    Otherwise, the bulk of playmaking duties have gone to non-point guards.

    Leonard, a dynamic wing, and Lou Williams, a reserve guard known for his scoring, both are averaging career highs in assists, with 5.1 and 6.3 per game, respectively. And George, a forward, is averaging 3.7 assists per game, the second highest tally he’s had.

    But all three are averaging career highs in turnovers too, with Leonard (3.3), Williams (3.2) and George (3.3) combining for almost 10 of the Clippers’ average 15.8 turnovers per game — 25th most in the NBA.

    “The turnover thing, going into the year without having a true point guard, I thought we may be a little higher in turnovers,” Rivers said. “That has happened. I don’t like turnovers … I would take away the turnovers if we could, I just don’t know if we can.”

    Rivers said Sunday he was proud of Patrick Beverley’s development as an in-game manager, revealing that he’s started to give the fiery guard his play sheet — something he’s previously shared only with established point guards Rajon Rondo and Chris Paul.

    “He’s the one guy who knows what we want to run the most,” Rivers said, allowing, however, that Beverley is “not a pure point guard, but he’s doing his best.”

    Rivers appreciates Landry Shamet’s efforts as ball-handler, he doesn’t think the second-year sharpshooter’s strengths are best served at point, despite his success playing the position at Wichita State.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#25 » by 50CalClips » Tue Jan 7, 2020 10:43 pm

esqtvd wrote:...
    “What Doc does, he puts guys in position to succeed and play to their strengths. So what may, on the board, look like, ‘Oh, we lack this position,’ well, maybe he’s gonna make those adjustments and it won’t be there.”

    ...


Eeesh, that comment is not aging well.

Lets hope by March...
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#26 » by esqtvd » Tue Jan 7, 2020 10:44 pm

26-12
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#27 » by 50CalClips » Tue Jan 7, 2020 10:57 pm

esqtvd wrote:...
    But all three are averaging career highs in turnovers too, with Leonard (3.3), Williams (3.2) and George (3.3) combining for almost 10 of the Clippers’ average 15.8 turnovers per game — 25th most in the NBA.

    “The turnover thing, going into the year without having a true point guard, I thought we may be a little higher in turnovers,” Rivers said. “That has happened. I don’t like turnovers … I would take away the turnovers if we could, I just don’t know if we can.”
...

Glen, with his classic facepalm-inducing comments, yikes.

Note to the Writer/Editor...
That's "6th most" Turnovers in the NBA, or "25th worst"... not "25th most."
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#28 » by esqtvd » Tue Jan 7, 2020 11:17 pm

50CalClips wrote:
esqtvd wrote:...
    But all three are averaging career highs in turnovers too, with Leonard (3.3), Williams (3.2) and George (3.3) combining for almost 10 of the Clippers’ average 15.8 turnovers per game — 25th most in the NBA.

    “The turnover thing, going into the year without having a true point guard, I thought we may be a little higher in turnovers,” Rivers said. “That has happened. I don’t like turnovers … I would take away the turnovers if we could, I just don’t know if we can.”
...

Glen, with his classic facepalm-inducing comments, yikes.

Note to the Writer/Editor...
That's "6th most" Turnovers in the NBA, or "25th worst"... not "25th most."


That's why she's at the Orange Counter Register, I guess. :oops:


Since we're #6 in pace and also a top 5 rebounding team, the TOs are pretty much offset. We're the 5th-rated offense overall.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1

With all the games missed and next to no practice, panic is not warranted at this time. Bev's responsibilities as PG are growing, and if he can come through, the TOs will improve. Only 1 less TO per game would get us to about the middle of the pack.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#29 » by esqtvd » Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:54 pm

migod

I knew it was a trend but it's a completely different game

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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#30 » by wco81 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:27 am

That's just for the Rockets right?

Hmm, probably not.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#31 » by esqtvd » Thu Jan 16, 2020 11:21 pm

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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#32 » by NippySudz » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:23 am

Doc said he tweaked the offense a bit to play to the strength of kawhis skillset. I'm not an x and o guy but judging from previous mention of letting Beverly orchresteated the offense, the ball is not in kawhis hands all the time and having to bring it up court. Which probably means he's not as exhausted.

Beverly has avg ~7 assist the last few games.


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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#33 » by QRich3 » Fri Jan 17, 2020 10:39 am

Lou asking for switches into KD last postseason left a mark on him apparently :lol:

It's true the offense has looked better lately, it's still stale at times, but it seems guys are moving more off ball, they're using Shamet for all the classic Doc shooter-coming-off-curls plays, and all of that in turn generates better spacing and cleaner pick'n'rolls with room for the big men to roll, Kawhi getting the ball closer to his spots, etc.

This is looking closer to the way I expected the offense to evolve, just a tad later than I thought it would. Hopefully things keep moving when George comes back.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#34 » by TheNewEra » Fri Jan 17, 2020 3:31 pm

QRich3 wrote:Lou asking for switches into KD last postseason left a mark on him apparently :lol:

It's true the offense has looked better lately, it's still stale at times, but it seems guys are moving more off ball, they're using Shamet for all the classic Doc shooter-coming-off-curls plays, and all of that in turn generates better spacing and cleaner pick'n'rolls with room for the big men to roll, Kawhi getting the ball closer to his spots, etc.

This is looking closer to the way I expected the offense to evolve, just a tad later than I thought it would. Hopefully things keep moving when George comes back.



Beverly taking command of things like he should and he should keep doing it even with PG comes back. Bring a bit of that superstars usage down a bit and get guys easy buckets. He has so much energy he should not be passing it off and running into corners
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#35 » by clipperlover » Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:35 pm

Outside of being a horrific defender, Milos would have been terrific for this team.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#36 » by esqtvd » Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:48 pm

clipperlover wrote:Outside of being a horrific defender, Milos would have been terrific for this team.


5.0 turnovers per 36 minutes his last season here.
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#37 » by esqtvd » Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:55 pm

interesting argument
backed with facts

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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#38 » by esqtvd » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:20 am

esqtvd wrote:
50CalClips wrote:
esqtvd wrote:...
    But all three are averaging career highs in turnovers too, with Leonard (3.3), Williams (3.2) and George (3.3) combining for almost 10 of the Clippers’ average 15.8 turnovers per game — 25th most in the NBA.

    “The turnover thing, going into the year without having a true point guard, I thought we may be a little higher in turnovers,” Rivers said. “That has happened. I don’t like turnovers … I would take away the turnovers if we could, I just don’t know if we can.”
...

Glen, with his classic facepalm-inducing comments, yikes.

Note to the Writer/Editor...
That's "6th most" Turnovers in the NBA, or "25th worst"... not "25th most."


That's why she's at the Orange Counter Register, I guess. :oops:


Since we're #6 in pace and also a top 5 rebounding team, the TOs are pretty much offset. We're the 5th-rated offense overall.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=-1

With all the games missed and next to no practice, panic is not warranted at this time. Bev's responsibilities as PG are growing, and if he can come through, the TOs will improve. Only 1 less TO per game would get us to about the middle of the pack.




Over the last 15 games, the Clips are down to 13.3 TOs per game, good for a tie with HOU for 10th.

HT: Adam Ausland

ADD: over the last 15 games: Bucks 21st @ 14.3 TOpg, Lakers 24th @ 15.4 TOpg

https://stats.nba.com/teams/traditional/?sort=TOV&dir=-1&Season=2019-20&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&LastNGames=15
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#39 » by Clippers2020 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:05 am

The Bucks are averaging 119.8 points per game.
The Clippers are averaging 115.8 point per game.
That is close enough, considering the Clippers are built for the playoffs and led by the best playoff performer in the NBA.....while the Bucks are not built for the playoffs and Giannis is not a proven champion.
The Bucks play their best level of basketball in the regular season, because their leader is more suited to the regular season....
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Re: The offense and what it's supposed to be 

Post#40 » by QRich3 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:32 am

I don't really buy the narrative that the Bucks are a better regular season team than a playoffs team. It's just based on recency bias because of last year's postseason, and they were this close to beat a Raptors team that was one of the best PS defenses ever.

This year they're even better, they're steamrolling the whole league, and they're the overwhelming favorites to win it all. If we managed to get to the Finals and ended up meetin them, we'd be the clear underdog and as things are now, I wouldn't feel confident at all.

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