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How is Frank any better than GM Doc?

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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#141 » by MartinToVaught » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:04 am

Yet another reminder that our front office gave PG $190 million and Marcus Morris $64 million to melt down in playoff games. Can this franchise at least pretend to care about winning?
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#142 » by wco81 » Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:39 am

I don't think there is too much to criticize playing Jackson, even in those first two Dallas games where people were calling for Mann to get minutes.

After all he's on a vet minimum.

But he's balling out in the playoffs. I think fair to say, even before Kawhi got injured, Clippers needed his offense.

He's going to get at least as much as Morris' deal, if not from the Clippers, someone else will give him a bigger role. Last year he played 14 minutes in the Bubble playoffs, shot well.

This year, he's averaging over 30 minutes on Curry-esque efficiency and 3PA volume. Of course teams will wonder if he can do it again and again at age 31 so he may not get a 4 or 5 year deal.

So he's like the third or fourth best player on a team which has reached the WCF for the first time in franchise history. Again it will be interesting to see what happens to him.

Batum is also shooting high efficiency. Another vet minimum ring chaser who's proving his worth in the playoffs. Again, older guy and questions if he can do it again.

Clippers can afford them all. But if they tie up their cap for too long, the contracts may become albatrosses.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#143 » by esqtvd » Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:57 am

wco81 wrote:I don't think there is too much to criticize playing Jackson, even in those first two Dallas games where people were calling for Mann to get minutes.

After all he's on a vet minimum.

But he's balling out in the playoffs. I think fair to say, even before Kawhi got injured, Clippers needed his offense.

He's going to get at least as much as Morris' deal, if not from the Clippers, someone else will give him a bigger role. Last year he played 14 minutes in the Bubble playoffs, shot well.

This year, he's averaging over 30 minutes on Curry-esque efficiency and 3PA volume. Of course teams will wonder if he can do it again and again at age 31 so he may not get a 4 or 5 year deal.

So he's like the third or fourth best player on a team which has reached the WCF for the first time in franchise history. Again it will be interesting to see what happens to him.

Batum is also shooting high efficiency. Another vet minimum ring chaser who's proving his worth in the playoffs. Again, older guy and questions if he can do it again.

Clippers can afford them all. But if they tie up their cap for too long, the contracts may become albatrosses.



Cornered again. Just like 2016. Over the sal cap. In win-now mode. Either pay up or try to replace rotation players with minimum wage rejects off the street. Plus Ibaka and Rondo have player options and nobody out there will pay them more.

But we have all summer to cry in our beer. ;-) Let's save this on the pile of shi*t to whine about.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#144 » by nickhx2 » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:46 am

i believe we have reggie's bird rights but not batum's. i expect batum to try to make some money on a final contract elsewhere and he deserves it.

reggie i think the team just has to pay up for. he's too valuable. that said, i could see the team letting him go, knowing it'll have to pay mann some big money at some point. but given he's a second round pick i'm not sure that we have matching rights if he's offered something big, iirc
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#145 » by Woodsanity » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:04 pm

I thought the only bad move Frank made was getting Luke Kennard. Otherwise I think he did a good job. Anything I am missing? I mean Clips are in the WCF without Kawhi. Clearly something was done correctly. Ty Lue also ended up being better than expected.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#146 » by nickhx2 » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:08 pm

skipping mpj in favor of jerome robinson, but by all accounts that was a jerry west move. don't know how the FO really works but if the logo is super high on someone, hard to say no.

that said, he was projected to be late lotto, so frank lawrence definitely could have tried to move back and accrued a bit of value.

it's looking like mpj might just be some one-dimensional scorer with attitude problems (i guess how it's always been, right?) so maybe losing out on him isn't the biggest deal. BUT, he certainly would have had more trade value than robinson, and having that value in your pocket when you've expended most other things is a big time deal. it's not impossible to see a scenario where we might've been able to keep shai, because okc coveted mpj instead.

i think the kennard move at the time was criticized for good reason, and if we had to do it again today (not knowing what he might be in the playoffs) we'd still criticize it. it's looking better, now, though.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#147 » by MartinToVaught » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:31 pm

Woodsanity wrote:I thought the only bad move Frank made was getting Luke Kennard. Otherwise I think he did a good job. Anything I am missing? I mean Clips are in the WCF without Kawhi. Clearly something was done correctly. Ty Lue also ended up being better than expected.

It helps that PG finally got over the mental hurdle, Reggie has had the playoff run of his life, Mann has developed beyond anyone's wildest expectations, and Kennard has managed to contribute in the playoffs after a largely terrible regular season.

I'll admit I was wrong about the Lue hire. He's not Doc 2.0 like I feared he would be. He's turned out to be Bizarro World Doc who adjusts and closes out series. Now, if those adjustments could start happening before Game 3, that would be great. :lol:

It was still fair to question the front office because, let's face it, they made some big mistakes (such as drafting Jerome), the team was coming off a brutal playoff failure last year and the regular season was a roller-coaster. Let's not revise history and pretend there wasn't cause for concern.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#148 » by Woodsanity » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:56 pm

MartinToVaught wrote:
Woodsanity wrote:I thought the only bad move Frank made was getting Luke Kennard. Otherwise I think he did a good job. Anything I am missing? I mean Clips are in the WCF without Kawhi. Clearly something was done correctly. Ty Lue also ended up being better than expected.

It helps that PG finally got over the mental hurdle, Reggie has had the playoff run of his life, Mann has developed beyond anyone's wildest expectations, and Kennard has managed to contribute in the playoffs after a largely terrible regular season.

I'll admit I was wrong about the Lue hire. He's not Doc 2.0 like I feared he would be. He's turned out to be Bizarro World Doc who adjusts and closes out series. Now, if those adjustments could start happening before Game 3, that would be great. :lol:

It was still fair to question the front office because, let's face it, they made some big mistakes (such as drafting Jerome), the team was coming off a brutal playoff failure last year and the regular season was a roller-coaster. Let's not revise history and pretend there wasn't cause for concern.

I forgot Marcus Morris is also a pretty sub-par contract but not the worst deal. At worse you would give Frank around a C+, pretty average job or if your being generous around a B-/B which would be above average. For PG its important to note that he only truly developed the playoff choker label last season. He was good on the Pacers in the postseason. In Okc he was playing hurt.

Last playoffs he was utterly pathetic, I think PG really must have loss all his confidence last playoffs for some reason because this postseason he is playing way better.
twix2500 wrote:If Lebron went to NY and Melo to Miami, Melo would have a trophy and Lebron would not.

Tiesto_Lakers wrote:The more I watch basketball, the more I realize that Kobe, in his absolute prime (2006-2008), was a top 2 player of all-time, only second to Jordan.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#149 » by nickhx2 » Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:20 pm

a lot of people derided paul george for speaking up about his mental struggles but it's pretty clear he was being honest, and that it did indeed affect him greatly.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#150 » by Clemenza » Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:05 pm

Woodsanity wrote:
MartinToVaught wrote:
Woodsanity wrote:I thought the only bad move Frank made was getting Luke Kennard. Otherwise I think he did a good job. Anything I am missing? I mean Clips are in the WCF without Kawhi. Clearly something was done correctly. Ty Lue also ended up being better than expected.

It helps that PG finally got over the mental hurdle, Reggie has had the playoff run of his life, Mann has developed beyond anyone's wildest expectations, and Kennard has managed to contribute in the playoffs after a largely terrible regular season.

I'll admit I was wrong about the Lue hire. He's not Doc 2.0 like I feared he would be. He's turned out to be Bizarro World Doc who adjusts and closes out series. Now, if those adjustments could start happening before Game 3, that would be great. :lol:

It was still fair to question the front office because, let's face it, they made some big mistakes (such as drafting Jerome), the team was coming off a brutal playoff failure last year and the regular season was a roller-coaster. Let's not revise history and pretend there wasn't cause for concern.

I forgot Marcus Morris is also a pretty sub-par contract but not the worst deal. At worse you would give Frank around a C+, pretty average job or if your being generous around a B-/B which would be above average. For PG its important to note that he only truly developed the playoff choker label last season. He was good on the Pacers in the postseason. In Okc he was playing hurt.

Last playoffs he was utterly pathetic, I think PG really must have loss all his confidence last playoffs for some reason because this postseason he is playing way better.

It was actually two really bad games and one subpar game against Dallas and one ugly game against the Nuggets which was game 7. He actually had a few 30 point games in the bubble. Not even remotely close to the level of what Ben Simmons just did who is literally afraid to shoot the ball
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#151 » by Woodsanity » Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:46 pm

Clemenza wrote:
Woodsanity wrote:
MartinToVaught wrote:It helps that PG finally got over the mental hurdle, Reggie has had the playoff run of his life, Mann has developed beyond anyone's wildest expectations, and Kennard has managed to contribute in the playoffs after a largely terrible regular season.

I'll admit I was wrong about the Lue hire. He's not Doc 2.0 like I feared he would be. He's turned out to be Bizarro World Doc who adjusts and closes out series. Now, if those adjustments could start happening before Game 3, that would be great. :lol:

It was still fair to question the front office because, let's face it, they made some big mistakes (such as drafting Jerome), the team was coming off a brutal playoff failure last year and the regular season was a roller-coaster. Let's not revise history and pretend there wasn't cause for concern.

I forgot Marcus Morris is also a pretty sub-par contract but not the worst deal. At worse you would give Frank around a C+, pretty average job or if your being generous around a B-/B which would be above average. For PG its important to note that he only truly developed the playoff choker label last season. He was good on the Pacers in the postseason. In Okc he was playing hurt.

Last playoffs he was utterly pathetic, I think PG really must have loss all his confidence last playoffs for some reason because this postseason he is playing way better.

It was actually two really bad games and one subpar game against Dallas and one ugly game against the Nuggets which was game 7. He actually had a few 30 point games in the bubble. Not even remotely close to the level of what Ben Simmons just did who is literally afraid to shoot the ball


Well we always knew Simmons was offensively inept. PG is a 2nd option on a contender or a 1st option on a good but not great team. He is way better than Simmons lets be honest.
twix2500 wrote:If Lebron went to NY and Melo to Miami, Melo would have a trophy and Lebron would not.

Tiesto_Lakers wrote:The more I watch basketball, the more I realize that Kobe, in his absolute prime (2006-2008), was a top 2 player of all-time, only second to Jordan.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#152 » by MartinToVaught » Sat Oct 30, 2021 4:32 am

Just a reminder that OKC is getting a very high lottery pick for free after this season because our front office is among the worst in the league. They actually took what was one of the best three-point shooting teams in recent memory and turned it into an unwatchable mess full of players who can't shoot.
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Re: How is Frank any better than GM Doc? 

Post#153 » by og15 » Sat Oct 30, 2021 4:43 am

We don't need this reminder

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