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ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT

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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#201 » by Quake Griffin » Wed May 26, 2021 2:20 pm

I think we're struggling to admit that this is a badly put together roster.

Pat Bev is not a PG and is not the defensive stalwart he used to be. He's more annoying to Clippers fans now than he is to opposing teams.

Marcus Morris is the Clayton Kershaw of role players. He sucks in the playoffs. I'm not sure why he is viewed as some defender or one of the guys who can stop Luka? Is it because his face looks a little more mean and Charles Oakley-ish? Well, looking mean doesn't stop Luka nor does it hit wide open threes.

Like Zub but he is a liability in this series.

Reggie is trash.


There's a lot of names here that once carried a level of respect for what they did as role players/ back ups. They're lesser versions of themselves on the Clippers. Their "leaders" are a top 6 to 8 ish player and a top 20 player who is really a top 40 player when it's playoff time.

Kawhi is a ceiling raiser that probably needs a quality roster around him in all ways. Not just names that used to be tough/ gritty/ etc. etc.

This team needed Kawhi to come here. But they needed him to come here with the 2019 roster as it was.....with the bevy of picks and the malleability that we had at that point to help the team make serious moves to add if need be. He is simply not enough of a floor raiser. His 41 didn't really put us in any position to win anything last night.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#202 » by Quake Griffin » Wed May 26, 2021 2:32 pm

Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#203 » by madmaxmedia » Wed May 26, 2021 2:34 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:I think we're struggling to admit that this is a badly put together roster.

Pat Bev is not a PG and is not the defensive stalwart he used to be. He's more annoying to Clippers fans now than he is to opposing teams.

Marcus Morris is the Clayton Kershaw of role players. He sucks in the playoffs. I'm not sure why he is viewed as some defender or one of the guys who can stop Luka? Is it because his face looks a little more mean and Charles Oakley-ish? Well, looking mean doesn't stop Luka nor does it hit wide open threes.

Like Zub but he is a liability in this series.

Reggie is trash.


There's a lot of names here that once carried a level of respect for what they did as role players/ back ups. They're lesser versions of themselves on the Clippers. Their "leaders" are a top 6 to 8 ish player and a top 20 player who is really a top 40 player when it's playoff time.

Kawhi is a ceiling raiser that probably needs a quality roster around him in all ways. Not just names that used to be tough/ gritty/ etc. etc.

This team needed Kawhi to come here. But they needed him to come here with the 2019 roster as it was.....with the bevy of picks and the malleability that we had at that point to help the team make serious moves to add if need be. He is simply not enough of a floor raiser. His 41 didn't really put us in any position to win anything last night.


The talent level on this team is certainly good enough to win 2 rounds, if not be a favorite. But the whole is definitely not more than the sum of the parts, and in crucial moments has actually been less. And I agree the construction is the biggest issue.

I don’t blame the role players too much, they are who they are. It is a big problem that as a roster, we have little youth among them though.

I agree with your description of Kawhi as a ceiling riser as opposed to a floor raiser.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#204 » by madmaxmedia » Wed May 26, 2021 2:40 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.


A guy like Doncic can be almost impossible to stop sometimes, but I couldn’t believe how many easy baskets the Mavs got in the 4th quarter.

OTOH, the Mavs were able to keep Kawhi from good opportunities in the 2nd half.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#205 » by clipperlover » Wed May 26, 2021 2:44 pm

How this team responds to this adversity in Game 3 will be the determining factor in this series. Luka and Porzingis have never closed out a team in a playoff series. So, they have not had the pressure on them. Things have been easy for them so far. I remember the Lob City Clips going up 2-0 and then losing 4 straight.

I am not writing this team or this series off. When they got behind in the 3rd instead of taking advantage of the Bonus, they were fighting an uphill battle the rest of the way. If they come back and win this series, then that can be the catalyst for a deep run. Every other series in the West is most likely going to go 6-7, so we just need to take it one game at a time.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#206 » by NickP » Wed May 26, 2021 2:46 pm

NippySudz wrote:
Clemenza wrote:
NippySudz wrote:Lakers show real championship meddle. They responded. Credit to the Lakers. I love that response to adversity. I just wish our team delivered the same way.

Shout out to lifelong clipper fans. You guys been dealing with this pain. I'm a kawhi fan so I've just adopted this team.

I can't say I have experienced much pain from a team losing than these last two years. I'm on the east coast. I stay up to watch all these games. Takes a lot of effort just to see the team lose and not give effort.

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Bron is the ultimate tank and cheat code. He's a leader and a force on the court. We don't have that.

What I saw yesterday seem to do with more of Anthony davis taking onus and responding to the call. I think Kawhi did his job. I thought PG did well, but yeah, there was nothing in our team that showed we had to take game 2 seriously. I mean Kawhi kinda of did it through his play, 30 points at half shows you he really wants it. But man. I thought PG needed to match his effort, PG played well, but it needed to be a lebron/Dwade or Lebron/Kyrie kind of game where both guys needed to score 80 points combined for us to win this game.

I agree with the overall sentiment of your comment but have to disagree with PG doing more. PG had 28 points on 12 of 22 shooting. I think what we're seeing is Lue getting outcoached by Carlisle.
Yes Reggie gives us point but we're losing on defense what we gain in his offense. Mann has to be the guy guarding Luka.
I'm not liking Morris at all. He's the fake tough guy on this team and he needs to actually start finding his way in the paint if he's going to contribute.
Ibaka needs to start. I had this fear when Ibaka got injured and missed so many games that Lue will find comfort in Zu starting.
But a lot of this is on Lue and his poor choice of players.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#207 » by SK21209 » Wed May 26, 2021 2:47 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.


It's both. I can't give you a cite to a specific source but there is significant data out there showing that you can't really impact an opponent's 3P% with your defense, all you can really do is try to limit the number of attempts. If Luka is going to take a bunch of step-back 3s and hit them at 40% there's nothing you can do because doubling to prevent that will just give someone else a high percentage look at the rim or an open 3. At this point, the best strategy may be to stay home on shooters and play a more traditional P&R coverage. Force Luka to beat us with a high volume of mid rangers and floaters.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#208 » by NickP » Wed May 26, 2021 2:48 pm

clipperlover wrote:How this team responds to this adversity in Game 3 will be the determining factor in this series. Luka and Porzingis have never closed out a team in a playoff series. So, they have not had the pressure on them. Things have been easy for them so far. I remember the Lob City Clips going up 2-0 and then losing 4 straight.

I am not writing this team or this series off. When they got behind in the 3rd instead of taking advantage of the Bonus, they were fighting an uphill battle the rest of the way. If they come back and win this series, then that can be the catalyst for a deep run. Every other series in the West is most likely going to go 6-7, so we just need to take it one game at a time.

Nah. This team doesn't take adversity well at all. Lue has shown us that he's not willing to think outside the box. Unless that happens we're pretty much done.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#209 » by madmaxmedia » Wed May 26, 2021 2:58 pm

clipperlover wrote:How this team responds to this adversity in Game 3 will be the determining factor in this series. Luka and Porzingis have never closed out a team in a playoff series. So, they have not had the pressure on them. Things have been easy for them so far. I remember the Lob City Clips going up 2-0 and then losing 4 straight.

I am not writing this team or this series off. When they got behind in the 3rd instead of taking advantage of the Bonus, they were fighting an uphill battle the rest of the way. If they come back and win this series, then that can be the catalyst for a deep run. Every other series in the West is most likely going to go 6-7, so we just need to take it one game at a time.


For whatever reason, I think we’ll actually win Game 3. Not that it’s assumed or anything, but if so I think Game 4 will determine the season. The Mavs will do everything they can to step on our necks, 1-3 instead of 2-2 means everything at that point.

Based on previous results, I guess you’d be a fool to expect us to find that extra gear, summon that extra strength and resolve, find a way to take their best shot and then punch back, etc. in such a Game 4, but I’m still hoping.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#210 » by MartinToVaught » Wed May 26, 2021 3:09 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:This team needed Kawhi to come here.

Even Kawhi staying in Toronto would have been better than this.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#211 » by Quake Griffin » Wed May 26, 2021 3:19 pm

madmaxmedia wrote:
clipperlover wrote:How this team responds to this adversity in Game 3 will be the determining factor in this series. Luka and Porzingis have never closed out a team in a playoff series. So, they have not had the pressure on them. Things have been easy for them so far. I remember the Lob City Clips going up 2-0 and then losing 4 straight.

I am not writing this team or this series off. When they got behind in the 3rd instead of taking advantage of the Bonus, they were fighting an uphill battle the rest of the way. If they come back and win this series, then that can be the catalyst for a deep run. Every other series in the West is most likely going to go 6-7, so we just need to take it one game at a time.


For whatever reason, I think we’ll actually win Game 3. Not that it’s assumed or anything, but if so I think Game 4 will determine the season. The Mavs will do everything they can to step on our necks, 1-3 instead of 2-2 means everything at that point.

Based on previous results, I guess you’d be a fool to expect us to find that extra gear, summon that extra strength and resolve, find a way to take their best shot and then punch back, etc. in such a Game 4, but I’m still hoping.

Game 3 should be the most free this team has ever played.

This team SHOULD be more loose and actually make open threes when they have the chance. From that perspective, I am interested.
Nonetheless, I haven't seen anything that says, defensively, we can stop them, or we can slow them down when we need to in order to win a series against them.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#212 » by Clemenza » Wed May 26, 2021 3:23 pm

I woke up feeling much better than last night.. LOL

This isn't over folks. One more shot to make this a series on Friday. Mavs have to continue that hot shooting if possible. Their building will be packed and the eyes will be on them. Time to play worry free and let it all hang out. How about letting Luka get his offensively -which he's going to do anyways- but cutting his assist down by clamping up on THJ, Kiebler, Brunson, and Finney-Smith. That's the real issue is the role players shooting lights out. Sit Pat Bev and limit Reggie, Morris, and Zu. It time for Mann, Kennard, Cousins... hell throw Coffey & Jay Scrubb in the mix. Who gives a sh*t at this point. Find the spark and the hungry player because there's only one game left to make this a series. Cut all the traditional "postseason vet laden" bullsh*t out and let it hang.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#213 » by MartinToVaught » Wed May 26, 2021 3:30 pm

To all the hockey fans on here: anyone else think this Clippers team is a lot like the current Edmonton Oilers? Even with the McDavid/Draisaitl duo, they're still hopeless in the playoffs because the stars are inconsistent when it matters, the rest of their roster outside of Darnell Nurse and Puljujarvi sucks, and their coach is a moron.

They just got swept by Winnipeg in the first round despite leading every game of the series in expected goals (based on the quality of their scoring chances). This includes Game 3, where they had a 4-1 lead in the third period and ended up losing 5-4 in OT. Eerily Clipperesque.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#214 » by og15 » Wed May 26, 2021 3:34 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.

It's both, but my bigger concern about the defense is actually inside the arc. Mavs are shooting 58% on 2PT shots. It was a layup line last night, everyone could get to the basket when they wanted. It wasn't a situation of "oh Luka is just warping the defense". No, Hardaway, Kleber, Porzingis, Brunson, everyone got to the basket off the dribble.

In terms of the shooting, yes, the variance has also hurt the Clippers as their similar shots aren't dropping as well, but what about the layup line?

Game 2:
Dallas Wide Open:
10/16 (62.5%)
Dallas Open:
5/13 (38.5%)
Total:
15/29 (51.7%)

Clippers Wide Open:
5/14 (35.7%)
Clippers Open:
6/12 (50.0%)
Total:
11/26 (42.3%)


Game 1:
Dallas Wide Open:
5/10 (50%)
Dallas Open:
10/22 (45.5%)
Total:
15/32 (46.9%)


Clippers Wide Open:
7/19 (36.8%)
Clippers Open:
4/15 (26.7%)
Total:
11/34 (32.4%)
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#215 » by TravisScott55 » Wed May 26, 2021 3:44 pm

Need a better supporting cast
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#216 » by Mr B » Wed May 26, 2021 3:49 pm

TheNewEra wrote:Just have to stay away from basketball content until Friday. Losing game 3 will break my love for basketball

Don’t forget, the Mavs will also have an arena that will be at near full capacity. There will be 15,000+ screaming Mavs fans in the building.


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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#217 » by Roscoe Sheed » Wed May 26, 2021 3:50 pm

Quake Griffin wrote:Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.

it's not luck- but you can't expect Doncic and Porzingis to keep hitting 35 footers or for Porzingis to hit 2 three pointers that both all over the rim. On the other hand, you can't expect them to miss so many free throws either.

The Clippers need to somehow try to loosen up and start raining some 3s of their own- particularly Morris, PG, Beverley and Kawhi.

Also- try at all costs not to switch on screens. I know sometimes you have to, but at least try very hard not to.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#218 » by Quake Griffin » Wed May 26, 2021 4:04 pm

og15 wrote:
Quake Griffin wrote:Also, can we stop talking about the Mav's shooting as if it is luck? Can we stop just posting their percentages as if they're lucky and no team ever gets this hot.

They're NBAers who are wide open and playing as "underdogs" that the whole NBA world actually wants to see win. Their shots are gonna rip the net when they are open. This is not a hard concept.

It is not their shooting. It is our defense.

It's both, but my bigger concern about the defense is actually inside the arc. Mavs are shooting 58% on 2PT shots. It was a layup line last night, everyone could get to the basket when they wanted. It wasn't a situation of "oh Luka is just warping the defense". No, Hardaway, Kleber, Porzingis, Brunson, everyone got to the basket off the dribble.

In terms of the shooting, yes, the variance has also hurt the Clippers as their similar shots aren't dropping as well, but what about the layup line?

Game 2:
Dallas Wide Open:
10/16 (62.5%)
Dallas Open:
5/13 (38.5%)
Total:
15/29 (51.7%)

Clippers Wide Open:
5/14 (35.7%)
Clippers Open:
6/12 (50.0%)
Total:
11/26 (42.3%)


Game 1:
Dallas Wide Open:
5/10 (50%)
Dallas Open:
10/22 (45.5%)
Total:
15/32 (46.9%)


Clippers Wide Open:
7/19 (36.8%)
Clippers Open:
4/15 (26.7%)
Total:
11/34 (32.4%)

Thank you for these stats.

I know my eyes saw that on wide open shots and I wanted evidence to back it up.
Thank you.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#219 » by Bob8 » Wed May 26, 2021 4:24 pm

clipperlover wrote:How this team responds to this adversity in Game 3 will be the determining factor in this series. Luka and Porzingis have never closed out a team in a playoff series. So, they have not had the pressure on them. Things have been easy for them so far. I remember the Lob City Clips going up 2-0 and then losing 4 straight.

I am not writing this team or this series off. When they got behind in the 3rd instead of taking advantage of the Bonus, they were fighting an uphill battle the rest of the way. If they come back and win this series, then that can be the catalyst for a deep run. Every other series in the West is most likely going to go 6-7, so we just need to take it one game at a time.


Luka has played many more important and more difficult games than this series, where real D is still allowed. Believing that this is new to him is totally wrong. Pressure in Europe is 10 times bigger than here. And he has won more or less everything there. Pressure won't stop him, Clippers must stop him.
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Re: ROUND 1, GAME 2: Mavericks @ Clippers Tuesday 7:30PM PDT 

Post#220 » by TrueLAfan » Wed May 26, 2021 4:29 pm

I feel like I’m saying this over and over—and everyone here seems to get it. It’s the defense, stupid. People are talking about shooting--but it's overall defense. Look, just keep Tim Hardaway from getting the ball in open space so much. He is killing us. Maxi Kleber is hurt and isn't hyper athletic; don't tell me we can't force him into more more difficult shots or keep the ball out of his hands a little more. og15's stats are telling; Dallas is getting easier shots inside the arc. The whole Dallas team is. And they are barbecuing us. We talk about Doncic playing well—and he’s playing better than his already good season numbers for the most part. But so is Kawhi—and, yes, so is Paul George. Our problems is with the Mavericks not named Luke Doncic.

And, yeah, someone--anyone!--other than Pg and Kawhi needs to score a few points. A week ago, I wrote this:

Instead of having two primary players and two bench players that were almost singularly focused on offense, we’ve got two primary players, a 20-25 mpg (hopefully) outstanding playmaker, and 4-6 guys that can give you 10-15 pts a game on a given night. Last year, we wanted 45-50 a game out of Kawhi and PG, and then needed 35 more out of Trezz and Lou. This year, I think we’ve got the same expectations—we hope to get 45-50 out of our A and B stars, and 35 more out of three of Morris, Ibaka, Reggie, Zu, or Batum.


Well, we’re getting almost 60 a game out of our two stars. But those other players? Nobody is stepping up. Nobody. I think what I said is right—we need 35 points out of our #3, #4, and #5 scorers. With our current lineup, that shouldn’t be that hard. That’s what Reggie, Serge, and Marcus averaged during the season. In this series, they’ve scored 40 points total. Batum is at his normal level--but we need more. Serge is hurt, so I kind of give him a pass. But Zu isn’t scoring. Reggie looks bad. I have no idea what’s wrong with Morris; he’s just nowhere to be found.

Otoh—Tim Hardaway Jr. is a nice player. He’s a solid 15-18 ppg player—who is averaging almost 25 against us now. Brunson, Finney-Smith, and Kleber averaged 29.5 a game in the season; they’re averaging 32 in the series. With Hardaway, that’s almost 12 points more a game. I mean, I just don’t get it. We’re talking about defending Luke Doncic—and, occasionally, containing Porzingis. Those guys aren’t beating us. Hardaway, Brunson, Finney-Smith, and Kleber (and Josh Richardson) are. It should be something we can deal with—for f--- sake, who is harder to contain, Luka Doncic or Tim Hardaway Jr.? How hard is laying a body on Maxi Kleber when he goes inside? Dallas isn’t doing anything special to shut down or slow down PG and Kawhi. They’re just forcing us to play as a team and make second unit players step up. They're blocking passing lanes. they're playing physically enough to the shooters out of rhythm. If only we had done or were doing the same thing.
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