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https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/37424110/sources-bucks-fire-coach-mike-budenholzer-early-exit

Please, please fire Lue. We'll consider that a good season.

NBA is a tough town

Lol, Ty Belichick ain't getting fired man. According to ESPN and all the major Sports Network, he has done a marvelous job this season.

Lue isn't going anywhere plus he has the perfect excuse with PG & Kawhi hurt throughout the season and missing games in playoffs. Really we just need to rid him of Morris Sr. and he'll be fine

Clemenza wrote:Lue isn't going anywhere plus he has the perfect excuse with PG & Kawhi hurt throughout the season and missing games in playoffs. Really we just need to rid him of Morris Sr. and he'll be fine

Excuse or reason? In my world, missing your top two guys for the most important parts of the season, doesn't sound too flimsy to me.

I don't claim to know good from bad coaching. But given the team's success on those few games when the two superstars played, it would seem there is ample empirical evidence that the team suffered without them. Also, I am just wondering, does Lue get any credit for using Westbrook for positive results (or is it all Russ and no coaching?).

Russ' success was the result of not being on the worst possible roster for him and getting away from the toxic fanbase/media that treated him like crap. It had nothing to do with Lue.

Kelphus wrote:

Clemenza wrote:Lue isn't going anywhere plus he has the perfect excuse with PG & Kawhi hurt throughout the season and missing games in playoffs. Really we just need to rid him of Morris Sr. and he'll be fine

Excuse or reason? In my world, missing your top two guys for the most important parts of the season, doesn't sound too flimsy to me.

I don't claim to know good from bad coaching. But given the team's success on those few games when the two superstars played, it would seem there is ample empirical evidence that the team suffered without them. Also, I am just wondering, does Lue get any credit for using Westbrook for positive results (or is it all Russ and no coaching?).

I don't think anybody has an explanation for Ty shittcanning RoCo, but Covington's production and plus/minus blew dogs when he did get some PT. Clearly Ty thought that even at max, RoCo could not move the needle whereas Marcus and Batum HAVE moved the needle in the past, so he stuck with them.

Good coaches don't play musical chairs: Ty built 35-year-old Russ back up from the $%*&pile and 22-year-old Bones Hyland too and stuck with them through the playoffs--and they paid off. Ty also got the absolute max out of a declining Marcus and Reggie. Reggie might not even be in the league next year and if Marcus didn't have a $17M contract, he'd be hard pressed to latch on somewhere at the league minimum.

The G-Leaguers were unplayable, and didn't even earn the few minutes they did get. Coffey was even worse in his 9 starts and the non-garbage time he did get.

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional?PerMode=Per100Possessions&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&TeamID=1610612746&dir=D&sort=PLUS_MINUS

Was it 25 [or 35?] different starting lineups this year? It was a joke. Ty was at his wits' end not only day to day, but hour to hour. Is Kawhi even playing tonight? He'll let you know at 3PM.

Ty made the best of an impossible situation...that might not get any better next year.


That said, a change for the sake of change probably couldn't hurt, but here's the thing--Kawhi and PG can opt out next summer and Ballmer's House of Kawhi Cards goes *poof*. This next season is a one-way ticket, I think, and bringing in a new coach and a new system just triples the chaos.

Looking at Ballmer's history with Microsoft and the Clippers so far, he's just not a bold dice-roller. Or the "Buck Stops Here" type. He'll let events dictate to him. If Kawhi wants Nick Nurse, it'll happen. If Kawhi remains his usual sphinx-like self, neither happy nor unhappy, neither staying or going next summer, Ballmer will just run it back.

Make no mistake--Kawhi Leonard owns the Clippers, not Steve Ballmer.

Clemenza wrote:Lue isn't going anywhere plus he has the perfect excuse with PG & Kawhi hurt throughout the season and missing games in playoffs. Really we just need to rid him of Morris Sr. and he'll be fine

mostly agree, but if the front office had a brain they'd see

A. lue will go to the grave playing favorites to the detriment of the team
B. that excuse doesn't fly because even with both those guys on the floor they had mega issues against the teams they needed to be beating to feel like we had a good chance. and instead we lost i think the majority of the key games against those key opponents, due to mostly the same issues over and over again (ones lue seemingly refused to address).

basically saying yeah, but also that i wouldn't bet that getting rid of marcus morris alone will solve much of anything if he's gonna do his 4-guard, 5-guard trashcan lineups again while cutting out covington or overplaying -impact favorites

nickhx2 wrote:

Clemenza wrote:Lue isn't going anywhere plus he has the perfect excuse with PG & Kawhi hurt throughout the season and missing games in playoffs. Really we just need to rid him of Morris Sr. and he'll be fine

mostly agree, but if the front office had a brain they'd see

A. lue will go to the grave playing favorites to the detriment of the team
B. that excuse doesn't fly because even with both those guys on the floor they had mega issues against the teams they needed to be beating to feel like we had a good chance. and instead we lost i think the majority of the key games against those key opponents, due to mostly the same issues over and over again (ones lue seemingly refused to address).

basically saying yeah, but also that i wouldn't bet that getting rid of marcus morris alone will solve much of anything if he's gonna do his 4-guard, 5-guard trashcan lineups again while cutting out covington or overplaying -impact favorites

our roster without Kawhi and PG is trashcan
that's a duh, bruh
that is true of every team
because they are built around their superstars

are you watching the playoffs bruh
NBA 2023


LeBron-AD
Embiid-Beard
Boston with the Jaylen and the other Jaden or Jayson guy or whatever
KD-Booker
Steph-plus-anybody
Joker-plus-anybody
Jimmy Buckets-plus-anybody

We had Kawhi fully healthy for ONE game and we WON it.





Robert Covington?
I mean, ROBERT COVINGTON??


I mean, let's just don't even do this

We could do better but also easily worse than Ty Lue, so I'm not really concerned about whether he stays or goes. Given our health we were losing in the 1st round no matter what.

Besides Kawhi and PG, we have a couple of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are/could be star-level players (Mann, Powell, Westbrook), and a bunch of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are quality NBA starters (but mostly too old for 2000 minutes a season.) And a couple of Jack and the Beanstalk magic beans that could potentially develop into something, but still far from being rotation level players on a good NBA team (I still have no idea whether Brandon Boston is the next mini-Brandon Ingram or a taller Jay Scrubb.) I guarantee if any of our young guys could defend semi-consistently on an NBA court and not bleed points, they'd get minutes if only for their energy alone (hopefully next year?)

Two outliers from those groups are Zu (our Old Faithful but outdated) and Bones (rotation level but not a starting NBA point guard.) I think Bones could potentially develop into a solid NBA starter but just as or more likely to always be a off-the-bench scorer/ 3PT shooter. Zu will always be an effective part of a center tandem, but not more than that.

We bemoan Paul George's inconsistency (which is a fair point), but he still averaged 23.8/6/5 for us. No one else comes close to Kawhi and PG's production over a season or even for a single playoff series.

madmaxmedia wrote:We could do better but also easily worse than Ty Lue

I'd say it would be very difficult to do worse than Lue. He doesn't run an offense, doesn't make adjustments, doesn't value defense, gives the worst player on the roster 30 minutes per game "because he felt like it," the list goes on.

Frank's platitudes about taking the regular season more seriously mean nothing when we're keeping the coach who throws games away and pretends it's because he's "experimenting."

madmaxmedia wrote:We could do better but also easily worse than Ty Lue, so I'm not really concerned about whether he stays or goes. Given our health we were losing in the 1st round no matter what.

Besides Kawhi and PG, we have a couple of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are/could be star-level players (Mann, Powell, Westbrook), and a bunch of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are quality NBA starters (but mostly too old for 2000 minutes a season.) And a couple of Jack and the Beanstalk magic beans that could potentially develop into something, but still far from being rotation level players on a good NBA team (I still have no idea whether Brandon Boston is the next mini-Brandon Ingram or a taller Jay Scrubb.) I guarantee if any of our young guys could defend semi-consistently on an NBA court and not bleed points, they'd get minutes if only for their energy alone (hopefully next year?)

Two outliers from those groups are Zu (our Old Faithful but outdated) and Bones (rotation level but not a starting NBA point guard.) I think Bones could potentially develop into a solid NBA starter but just as or more likely to always be a off-the-bench scorer/ 3PT shooter. Zu will always be an effective part of a center tandem, but not more than that.

We bemoan Paul George's inconsistency (which is a fair point), but he still averaged 23.8/6/5 for us. No one else comes close to Kawhi and PG's production over a season or even for a single playoff series.

Man, I'm probably the biggest BJ stan that's not family, friend or acquaintance of his, but I can't see the Ingram comparison.

A taller Lou Williams with better defense (namely due to athleticism and length) is what I have his peak pegged as, but I'll gladly take Ingram.

ejftw wrote:

madmaxmedia wrote:We could do better but also easily worse than Ty Lue, so I'm not really concerned about whether he stays or goes. Given our health we were losing in the 1st round no matter what.

Besides Kawhi and PG, we have a couple of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are/could be star-level players (Mann, Powell, Westbrook), and a bunch of guys that at their best moments can lead you into thinking they are quality NBA starters (but mostly too old for 2000 minutes a season.) And a couple of Jack and the Beanstalk magic beans that could potentially develop into something, but still far from being rotation level players on a good NBA team (I still have no idea whether Brandon Boston is the next mini-Brandon Ingram or a taller Jay Scrubb.) I guarantee if any of our young guys could defend semi-consistently on an NBA court and not bleed points, they'd get minutes if only for their energy alone (hopefully next year?)

Two outliers from those groups are Zu (our Old Faithful but outdated) and Bones (rotation level but not a starting NBA point guard.) I think Bones could potentially develop into a solid NBA starter but just as or more likely to always be a off-the-bench scorer/ 3PT shooter. Zu will always be an effective part of a center tandem, but not more than that.

We bemoan Paul George's inconsistency (which is a fair point), but he still averaged 23.8/6/5 for us. No one else comes close to Kawhi and PG's production over a season or even for a single playoff series.

Man, I'm probably the biggest BJ stan that's not family, friend or acquaintance of his, but I can't see the Ingram comparison.

A taller Lou Williams with better defense (namely due to athleticism and length) is what I have his peak pegged as, but I'll gladly take Ingram.

Yeah really early on that's what he sort of looked like to me, probably more in appearance than anything else. I do see him more as a 2/3 than say a 1/2 like Lou. But we'll see.

If Clippers trade Lue to Bucks, they can get a draft pick back. But there is a catch: they will be barred from acquiring any Bucks players for the rest of the season.

Second catch: as they are over the 2nd apron, Clippers are barred from acquiring new players in any way, shape or form without trading some of their players first.

Do you want a draft pick to replenish your assets and better your trade offer, or do you want Antetokounmpo so that Clippers could have a Fantastic Four of their own?

Mike Budenholzer, Frank Vogel, and Nick Nurse - All Fired

The only coaches not named Kerr to win an NBA Title since 2016. All won within the last 3 years.

The Bucks don't have a tradeable first until 29, and they won't give that up for Ty...but if they do, it'll be a no brainer.

I'd give up Ty for an unprotected swap in 28 and 29 personally.

Hire Vogel, bring back Kalamian, Cassell and Atkinson to the bench.

Suns fired Monty Williams.

Can Lue please be next?

Lmao at all the Lue hate. I don't want to see him go, but I'm more than fine moving on from Frank and bringing in Bob Myers.

TucsonClip wrote:Lmao at all the Lue hate.

Were you expecting people to be thrilled with four-guard lineups, Marcus Morris getting thirty minutes per game, and isoball straight out of 1992?

TucsonClip wrote:Lmao at all the Lue hate. I don't want to see him go, but I'm more than fine moving on from Frank and bringing in Bob Myers.

Not even Alvin Gentry got this level of hate