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Official 2015 Starting QB Watch

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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#41 » by LyricalRico » Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:50 pm

Ruzious wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if tonight is his last game as a Skin. Things have gotten so bad that he goes into blank stare mode. I doubt anyone on the team believes in him anymore. It's better for him and everyone else if he moves on to another team - preferably one that will use the Pistol offense - though he's got to agree to play it - which he seemed to refuse to after his rookie year. Trade him for a 7th round pick - just get him off the team.


:nod:

Agree with the sentiment, but who's gonna trade for him?

Earlier this year I really wanted them to decline the option and then trade him during the draft. There wasn't much after Winston/Mariota in this year's class, so a healthy RG3 without his 2016 option picked up should have garnered at least a mid-round pick IMO.

Now? Nobody's going to risk RG3 getting injured (especially with the beating he's already taking in preseason) and then having $16M in dead cap weight next year. If anybody does think he can be rehabilitated, I'm guessing they'd rather wait for him to fail, get benched, get cut, and then pick him up for peanuts in the offseason.

Ruzious wrote:Now watch him play phenominally against Baltimore.


As ironic as that would be, I just can't see it happening. Forget the lack of an NFL skillset, he doesn't even strike me as the type of cat that would go nuts just to prove people wrong. He's too passive-aggressive. He'd rather make sarcastic "I just work here" comments in press conferences and imply blame on others.

Nah, he's gonna stink it up (again), Kirk is gonna play well (again), and ESPN 980 is gonna be PURE GOLD next week! :D
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#42 » by LyricalRico » Sat Aug 29, 2015 1:19 am

[tweet]https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/637403101503209472[/tweet]

:o
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#43 » by Ruzious » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:17 pm

LyricalRico wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/637403101503209472[/tweet]

:o

That is bizarre - and apparently it's the same neurologist that previously cleared him. Just another conundrum with the Skins and RG3. Well, it clears the way for Cousins to step up and grab the job away - but he's going to have to play really well. What a mess it'll be if RG3 misses the last 2 preseason games and starts on Week 1.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#44 » by FreeBalling » Sun Aug 30, 2015 8:03 pm

Ruzious wrote:
LyricalRico wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/adamschefter/status/637403101503209472[/tweet]

:o

That is bizarre - and apparently it's the same neurologist that previously cleared him. Just another conundrum with the Skins and RG3. Well, it clears the way for Cousins to step up and grab the job away - but he's going to have to play really well. What a mess it'll be if RG3 misses the last 2 preseason games and starts on Week 1.


With the pending lawsuits in the NFL regarding concussions I can see why the Redskins would want to protect Robert Griffin as much as possible. I wanted to see Robert play because it's possible he still might have something left in the tank.

Cousins didn't look exceptionally sharp last night. I can't say I was really impressed with his style of play . He's a very erratic passer and almost seems like he has a little Rex Grossman in him. he's a very erratic.

This isn't what people want to hear but I think McCoy manages the offense a lot better then Griffin or Cousins. however I would have to see what Colt would do against the first team defense .
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#45 » by FreeBalling » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:27 am

WJFK is reporting The Redskins are moving on from Robert Griffin III. I bet there was some type a blowup in the Griffin camp that led to this series of events .
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#46 » by LyricalRico » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:56 am

FreeBalling wrote:WJFK is reporting The Redskins are moving on from Robert Griffin III. I bet there was some type a blowup in the Griffin camp that led to this series of events .


I also think the recent "I don't have to prove anything, I'm the best QB on this roster" and "I just work here" press conferences also contributed to this tipping point. The team basically has a 52+1 culture - 52 guys held to one standard where they have to earn their jobs, and then a completely separate standard for the owner's pet RG3 who was going to start no matter what. You can't run a team like that, and now we have a football man in the GM role who's apparently decided to nip this nonsense in the bud.

It's just too bad that McCloughan didn't recognize the inevitable and take a stand 6 months ago. Then they could have declined Griffin's option, traded him for a mid-round pick, and spent the whole summer in a true competition between Kirk and Colt. Now, they wasted most of the offseason with RG3 practicing with the first team, and have to scramble to get Kirk ready.

That said, them cutting RG3 would completely restore my hope in the franchise because it would be the first time in 20 years that we knew for sure that the front office was operating completely independently of the owner. That's the only part of this tragedy that will have been worth it.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#47 » by Ruzious » Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:14 pm

Cousins started off poorly, but considering the circumstances, I thought the rest of his play more than made up for it. I think it's too early in his career to label him a Rex Grossman. This will be the first time in his career that it's his team - which makes a big difference. My guess is he proves to be a solid but unspectacular starting QB. And if they develop an outstanding running game - that might be enough.

Colt's a nice backup and did a houdini act twice to avoid sacks and complete passes. I don't think he has a strong enough arm and a strong enough body to last more than a few games as a starter. Good backup. Actually, I think he's been over the course of his career - more erratic than Cousins.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#48 » by Ruzious » Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:26 pm

LyricalRico wrote:
FreeBalling wrote:WJFK is reporting The Redskins are moving on from Robert Griffin III. I bet there was some type a blowup in the Griffin camp that led to this series of events .


I also think the recent "I don't have to prove anything, I'm the best QB on this roster" and "I just work here" press conferences also contributed to this tipping point. The team basically has a 52+1 culture - 52 guys held to one standard where they have to earn their jobs, and then a completely separate standard for the owner's pet RG3 who was going to start no matter what. You can't run a team like that, and now we have a football man in the GM role who's apparently decided to nip this nonsense in the bud.

It's just too bad that McCloughan didn't recognize the inevitable and take a stand 6 months ago. Then they could have declined Griffin's option, traded him for a mid-round pick, and spent the whole summer in a true competition between Kirk and Colt. Now, they wasted most of the offseason with RG3 practicing with the first team, and have to scramble to get Kirk ready.

That said, them cutting RG3 would completely restore my hope in the franchise because it would be the first time in 20 years that we knew for sure that the front office was operating completely independently of the owner. That's the only part of this tragedy that will have been worth it.

I guess the implication is that the Skins had something to do with the "change" in diagnosis from the neurologist - which I think sounds crazy. I understand that folks don't want to give the Skins the benefit of the doubt on things, but I'm not seeing how they did anything wrong re the neurologist's decisions. The one thing GMSM did wrong was obligating the Skins (or whoever trades for 3) to RG3 next year if he ends up injured - as Robert seems as clueless as any QB I've ever seen in understanding how to protect himself. They did the right thing in giving him a chance to prove himself. They knew the odds were low, but considering the investment they made in him and his still very good physical ability, it made sense to give him a chance. I don't think they've lost anything by giving him that chance.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#49 » by FreeBalling » Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:13 pm

Ruzious wrote:Cousins started off poorly, but considering the circumstances, I thought the rest of his play more than made up for it. I think it's too early in his career to label him a Rex Grossman. This will be the first time in his career that it's his team - which makes a big difference. My guess is he proves to be a solid but unspectacular starting QB. And if they develop an outstanding running game - that might be enough.

Colt's a nice backup and did a houdini act twice to avoid sacks and complete passes. I don't think he has a strong enough arm and a strong enough body to last more than a few games as a starter. Good backup. Actually, I think he's been over the course of his career - more erratic than Cousins.



Ruzious, my Rex comment pertained to a fearless thrower. Whether that''s good or bad time will tell. However, Cousins has no issue throwing the deep timing pass.


Now we need some victories....I love wins.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#50 » by Dark Faze » Tue Sep 1, 2015 3:21 pm

I just want to know why we never went back to the 2012 offense. That's all I want to know. You can't say because he doesn't want to run it. You run it, if he doesn't comply, then you void his contract.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#51 » by Ruzious » Tue Sep 1, 2015 5:43 pm

Dark Faze wrote:I just want to know why we never went back to the 2012 offense. That's all I want to know. You can't say because he doesn't want to run it. You run it, if he doesn't comply, then you void his contract.

It's a valid question. And I think the answer ultimately goes to the root of a lot of problems in the Snyder era - no legitimate GM. Start from post-injury offseason - Robert made a determination that the Pistol wasn't safe for him. He discussed it with the Shannys and probably Snyder, and the determination was to go along with Robert's wishes - afterall, they didn't want to risk their future - kid just came off arguably THE BEST ROOKIE YEAR BY A QB in NFL HISTORY, so there was zippy chance they'd void his contract - especially since it was a bargain price at the time. I don't think any of the parties understood the difficulty he'd have switching to a traditional offense. And that's what a good GM would/should know. A good GM would have smartened up all parties concerned - and advised that they use the pistol with small adjustments to protect the QB - and told them it's no less safe than being a dead duck in the pocket. Just my opinion.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#52 » by Dark Faze » Tue Sep 1, 2015 9:22 pm

Agreed. I understand why they went away from it in 2013 coming off the injury--but after how that mess ended up looking, I don't know how you hire Gruden with the idea that a traditional west coast offense, drop back QB system was the answer. Should have immediately went back to 2012 concepts imo.

Thats the thing that I dislike about all this. Never got a chance to see if 2012 offense would have failed on the field. No complaints if it eventually got plugged the hell up but the league, but never happened. We dropped it for really weird reasons and then went to a system that doesn't utilize his skill set at all.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#53 » by LyricalRico » Wed Sep 2, 2015 12:58 am

Dark Faze wrote:I just want to know why we never went back to the 2012 offense. That's all I want to know. You can't say because he doesn't want to run it. You run it, if he doesn't comply, then you void his contract.


You're forgetting about the owner. He sided with the Griffin camp against the Shanahan's and the spread/read-option, and then specifically hired his next coach with the intent of making Griffin a pocket passer. It's taken the situation getting this toxic to get his attention and make change possible.

Ruz is right - had a guy like McCloughan been in place in 2012 then maybe things end up differently. At least it's becoming clear that we have that we finally have football people running the organization, which bodes well for whoever ends up being the QB of the future.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#54 » by FreeBalling » Wed Sep 2, 2015 1:21 am

Ruzious wrote:
Dark Faze wrote:I just want to know why we never went back to the 2012 offense. That's all I want to know. You can't say because he doesn't want to run it. You run it, if he doesn't comply, then you void his contract.

It's a valid question. And I think the answer ultimately goes to the root of a lot of problems in the Snyder era - no legitimate GM. Start from post-injury offseason - Robert made a determination that the Pistol wasn't safe for him. He discussed it with the Shannys and probably Snyder, and the determination was to go along with Robert's wishes - afterall, they didn't want to risk their future - kid just came off arguably THE BEST ROOKIE YEAR BY A QB in NFL HISTORY, so there was zippy chance they'd void his contract - especially since it was a bargain price at the time. I don't think any of the parties understood the difficulty he'd have switching to a traditional offense. And that's what a good GM would/should know. A good GM would have smartened up all parties concerned - and advised that they use the pistol with small adjustments to protect the QB - and told them it's no less safe than being a dead duck in the pocket. Just my opinion.


Well said Ruz...I agree will your comments. In the read option, the QB is considered a running back. We can fault Robert for wanting to protect his quality of life after football.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#55 » by Ruzious » Wed Sep 2, 2015 3:22 am

Griffin carried 120 times as a rookie, and that was probably more than ideal. But Russell Wilson carried 118 times last season and didn't seem the worse for wear. He just does it smartly and slides really well. I think a QB like Griffin - who doesn't slide well in the pocket - is just as much at risk trying to be a pocket QB than he is playing the read option. It's just a matter of limiting your risks. When someone like Ngata has you in his tracks running full speed - slide before contact. Live to fight another play.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#56 » by Dark Faze » Wed Sep 2, 2015 1:14 pm

Yea, his complete inability to protect himself is the most disheartening thing about his game atm. Even going back to last year when he scrambled and then dislocated his ankle--you can call that a freak injury, but a guy with good body control is not going to come down on his ankle at an odd angle like that.

But anyway, at the end of the day, I consider the Griffin failure to be an organizational one and not just drafting a bust.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#57 » by LyricalRico » Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:52 pm

Washington’s decision to bench Robert Griffin III came down to a couple of key points, according to a report, neither of which was concussion-related.

This report comes by way of Liz Clarke of the Washington Post. In it, she details how general manager Scot McCloughan, owner Daniel Snyder, President Bruce Allen and head coach Jay Gruden came to an accord regarding the decision to start Kirk Cousins over RG3, according to someone close to the deliberations.

“Cousins gave the Redskins a better chance to win in 2015 than Griffin, whose struggles in Gruden’s timing-based offense were increasingly evident.

“And Gruden risked losing credibility with the team if he continued to preach competition and award starting jobs to the victors at every position except quarterback.”


This story is much more believable than anything we’ve heard or seen coming out of Washington since an independent neurologist’s out-of-the-blue decision to pull Griffin from the lineup before Week 3 of the preseason.


Now for the most important point:

And, if the report is indeed true, then perhaps there is actually hope for change in Washington.


http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/report-decision-to-bench-rg3-came-down-to-two-key-points/ar-AAe95WW?li=BBgzzfc

:pray: :pray: :pray:
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#58 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:42 pm

I'm a little confused by Liz' article. She makes her findings sound like a revelation, but what other reasons are there to bench your QB? He stunk, and the other guy seems to give you a better chance to win. And of course you're going to piss off teammates if you don't make the move. It would piss off anyone who cares about the team. That's common sense.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#59 » by LyricalRico » Fri Sep 11, 2015 5:00 pm

Ruzious wrote:I'm a little confused by Liz' article. She makes her findings sound like a revelation, but what other reasons are there to bench your QB? He stunk, and the other guy seems to give you a better chance to win. And of course you're going to piss off teammates if you don't make the move. It would piss off anyone who cares about the team. That's common sense.


I think it's more about the fact that it's ONLY football that's playing into the decision. Unlike last year when apparently Cousins was better in camp, but Griffin was still the starter. Or when the team was 2-0 with McCoy but Griffin still resumed starting. Or even this spring when for no apparent reason Gruden contradicted his own statement that it would be a QB competition and named Griffin the starter.

None of those decisions (much like many of the others over the past 20 years) seemed to be based on football, so it's definitely noteworthy IMO if football is going to be the basis for all of their decisions going forward.
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Re: Official 2015 Starting QB Watch 

Post#60 » by Ruzious » Fri Sep 11, 2015 5:07 pm

LyricalRico wrote:
Ruzious wrote:I'm a little confused by Liz' article. She makes her findings sound like a revelation, but what other reasons are there to bench your QB? He stunk, and the other guy seems to give you a better chance to win. And of course you're going to piss off teammates if you don't make the move. It would piss off anyone who cares about the team. That's common sense.


I think it's more about the fact that it's ONLY football that's playing into the decision. Unlike last year when apparently Cousins was better in camp, but Griffin was still the starter. Or when the team was 2-0 with McCoy but Griffin still resumed starting. Or even this spring when for no apparent reason Gruden contradicted his own statement that it would be a QB competition and named Griffin the starter.

None of those decisions (much like many of the others over the past 20 years) seemed to be based on football, so it's definitely noteworthy IMO if football is going to be the basis for all of their decisions going forward.

Yeah, but that was when Griffin hadn't had enough time to learn the completely new system. You're always going to give the incumbent starting QB some time to do that.
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