Julius Randle Appreciation Thread

[TylersLakers]

The realism with Randle is this:

- Jump shot form has improved but it's not a threat. You still force him to shoot instead of driving left.

- Continues to have no right hand. Whenever he's in a pinch, he 98% of the time goes to his left hand, even if it's a more difficult shot.

- For as much as he has a "motor," it's turned off almost as frequently as turned on. You see him flying down the court after a rebound and finish with a dunk, and then you see him defensively not close out on a knock down shooter. And too frequently his effort is on a game-by-game basis. You usually know if Randle's going to have a good game or not after the first quarter.

- His mindset has improved where instead of being a guy who catches the ball and locks onto the basket, he's now more open to do a dribble hand off or swing it.

- His screen setting mentality is AWFUL. Again, like his motor, he can set killer screens on guards when he wants. He has no idea when to slip a pick and roll and when not to. He routinely doesn't make contact and is lazy. This is probably the area that infuriates me the most. If he had a mentality like Zubac when it came to setting screens, the starting line-up would be way more effective.

- Also, his attitude is a growing problem. It's a phenomenal thing to have when you're Kobe Bryant and your basketball IQ and fundamentals are through the roof, it's another when he gets pulled out of the game last night due to HIS mistakes that he made and you see him arguing with Luke Walton about it.

[Vesper]

Also, in terms of rim protection/defense, even if Ingram is a twig, don't you guys think even at age 19, Ingram can defend the 4 better than Randle can?

[lake_show]

Also, in terms of rim protection/defense, even if Ingram is a twig, don't you guys think even at age 19, Ingram can defend the 4 better than Randle can?

I think it partially looks that way because Randle doesn't always play with 100% effort. I think Randle is the better defender at the 4 when he's engaged, but when he's not engaged he's absolutely useless down there. Which could be a lot of times, depending on the game.

With Ingram, whether he gets a stop, or gets beat you're never worried about his defensive effort. Ingram is just a better all around defender. Randle has the tools to be really good at the 4, and has shown flashes with big defensive plays, but he lacks consistent effort. He gets bored, and stops playing.

[TyCobb]

It could be something as simple as lack of sleep with Julius right now.

[Vesper]

Also, in terms of rim protection/defense, even if Ingram is a twig, don't you guys think even at age 19, Ingram can defend the 4 better than Randle can?

I think it partially looks that way because Randle doesn't always play with 100% effort. I think Randle is the better defender at the 4 when he's engaged, but when he's not engaged he's absolutely useless down there. Which could be a lot of times, depending on the game.

With Ingram, whether he gets a stop, or gets beat you're never worried about his defensive effort. Ingram is just a better all around defender. Randle has the tools to be really good at the 4, and has shown flashes with big defensive plays, but he lacks consistent effort. He gets bored, and stops playing.

Defensively? His tools are limited imo.

He doesn't have good height or wingspan. Also, he doesn't read the defenses well nor does he have the workrate. With Ingram, you have a tree that can cover the area better and it's not like most Pfs can post up anyways these days well.

All the hate both MOzgov and Hibbert gets, you wonder why they both look like crap when they join us, even though they were both known for their defenses before coming here. I'm convinced, as long as Randle plays the 4, any center will look bad for us

[Princeinrevolt]

Also, in terms of rim protection/defense, even if Ingram is a twig, don't you guys think even at age 19, Ingram can defend the 4 better than Randle can?

I think it partially looks that way because Randle doesn't always play with 100% effort. I think Randle is the better defender at the 4 when he's engaged, but when he's not engaged he's absolutely useless down there. Which could be a lot of times, depending on the game.

With Ingram, whether he gets a stop, or gets beat you're never worried about his defensive effort. Ingram is just a better all around defender. Randle has the tools to be really good at the 4, and has shown flashes with big defensive plays, but he lacks consistent effort. He gets bored, and stops playing.

Defensively? His tools are limited imo.

He doesn't have good height or wingspan. Also, he doesn't read the defenses well nor does he have the workrate. With Ingram, you have a tree that can cover the area better and it's not like most Pfs can post up anyways these days well.

All the hate both MOzgov and Hibbert gets, you wonder why they both look like crap when they join us, even though they were both known for their defenses before coming here. I'm convinced, as long as Randle plays the 4, any center will look bad for us

Both Mozgov and hibbert looked terrible the year before they joined so you can't use that excuse...


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[TylersLakers]

It could be something as simple as lack of sleep with Julius right now.

I don't buy that at all. Frankly, he's an NBA player making millions of dollars a year. I would imagine she's not working, obviously. It's a woman's job, especially in a situation where he's an NBA player, to make it easy as possible on him. I'm sure he helps out as much as he possibly can, but I doubt she's making him stay up with the baby all night and then send him to a game.

I don't wanna start a whole big Male vs Female conversation as far as responsibilities, but I doubt he's compromised too much.

EDIT- I also want to add: It's pretty telling that in Kobe's speech, his praise of Vanessa was one of the first things he mentioned. "Holding down the family" so he could train, work, etc. I would imagine most players wives, girlfriends, etc do this.

What do I know? Maybe she makes him do everything and sits there with cucumbers on her eyes all day.

[Vesper]

I think it partially looks that way because Randle doesn't always play with 100% effort. I think Randle is the better defender at the 4 when he's engaged, but when he's not engaged he's absolutely useless down there. Which could be a lot of times, depending on the game.

With Ingram, whether he gets a stop, or gets beat you're never worried about his defensive effort. Ingram is just a better all around defender. Randle has the tools to be really good at the 4, and has shown flashes with big defensive plays, but he lacks consistent effort. He gets bored, and stops playing.

Defensively? His tools are limited imo.

He doesn't have good height or wingspan. Also, he doesn't read the defenses well nor does he have the workrate. With Ingram, you have a tree that can cover the area better and it's not like most Pfs can post up anyways these days well.

All the hate both MOzgov and Hibbert gets, you wonder why they both look like crap when they join us, even though they were both known for their defenses before coming here. I'm convinced, as long as Randle plays the 4, any center will look bad for us

Both Mozgov and hibbert looked terrible the year before they joined so you can't use that excuse...


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Mozgov Def Eff was 103 last season. This season, it's at 114.

Deng was at 105 last season and this season he is at 112.

Both Deng and Mozgov have their worst defensive rating in their career with us this season

[Slava]

From Pelton's ESPN insider article:

Randle’s development is a fascinating case study. According to NBAwowy.com, when playing power forward alongside one of the team’s traditional centers (Timofey Mozgov, Tarik Black and Ivica Zubac), he has shot about the same dismal percentage on 2-point attempts (43.6 percent) as he did in 2015-16 (43.5 percent). Randle’s improvement, then, can largely be traced to playing in smaller lineups with better floor spacing. When he’s the lone big man on the court, Randle shoots an incredible 65.8 percent on 2-point attempts.

Lineups with Randle as the lone big man have scored 113.1 points per 100 possessions, a mark bettered this season only by the Golden State Warriors (113.6). Unfortunately, the Lakers have given up 116.2 points per 100 possessions, as Randle doesn’t have the ability to anchor a defense as a center. His improved playmaking (Randle has doubled his assist rate this season) is encouraging, but Randle can only become a plus contributor if he scores efficiently as a power forward.

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/18541224/how-far-los-angeles-lakers-winning-nba

[Kilroy]

From Pelton's ESPN insider article:

Randle’s development is a fascinating case study. According to NBAwowy.com, when playing power forward alongside one of the team’s traditional centers (Timofey Mozgov, Tarik Black and Ivica Zubac), he has shot about the same dismal percentage on 2-point attempts (43.6 percent) as he did in 2015-16 (43.5 percent). Randle’s improvement, then, can largely be traced to playing in smaller lineups with better floor spacing. When he’s the lone big man on the court, Randle shoots an incredible 65.8 percent on 2-point attempts.

Lineups with Randle as the lone big man have scored 113.1 points per 100 possessions, a mark bettered this season only by the Golden State Warriors (113.6). Unfortunately, the Lakers have given up 116.2 points per 100 possessions, as Randle doesn’t have the ability to anchor a defense as a center. His improved playmaking (Randle has doubled his assist rate this season) is encouraging, but Randle can only become a plus contributor if he scores efficiently as a power forward.

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/18541224/how-far-los-angeles-lakers-winning-nba

The bigger question here is what are the other players doing in those lineups... Randle is never going to be your go-to volume scorer and everyone needs good floor spacing to shoot efficiently... So in those lineups where Randle struggles, is the rest of the team struggling too? My guess is yes...

We've spent a fair amount of time trying to figure out what lineup works best for Russell, and I think Randle's just had to sort of deal with what he's given. His ideal role is as second fiddle to a dynamic volume scorer. If you're asking him to anchor an offense, you're probably going to get a lot of hit and miss performances.

All of which to say, Randle's clearly still developing and still figuring out how to modify his game for the pros. His game has holes... So do the games of every (basically) 3rd year players... Especially 22yo 3rd year players. That said, he made great strides this season, and I'd say the holes in his game are not our main problem right now. Our main problem is we're treating Randle as second fiddle to Russell, but expecting him to carry the team like a the No1 option. We expect Randle to shine, but we really don't tailor lineups for him, or run plays that maximize his opportunities. We're giving him scraps and expecting 5 star meals.

Now he's injured too.

This team needs a dynamic volume scorer and an elite perimeter defender. Put those two things next to Randle and you'll get 20/10/5 from him on a consistent basis.

As it is, he's 13/8/4, leading the Starters in PER, Rebounds, and a close second in Assists, and basically tied with Young for second in points...
He's doing everything we need him to do and more.

[warren weel im]

If the Lakers are wise, they should be dealing Randle while he has potential left.