When is Lonzo coming back?

[TyCobb]

Randle: % of FGA by distance 0-3 feet, 57% of his shots
Randle: % of 2PT FG that are assisted, 62%

Previous years?

2016: % of FGA by distance 0-3 feet, 47.4% of his shots, % of 2PT FG that are assisted, 45%
2017: % of FGA by distance 0-3 feet, 43.7% of his shots, % of 2PT FG that are assisted, 48.9%

It's not a surprise to see Randle post a career best FG% of 55.8%.

FTrate? Increased.
Defensive rebound %? Decreased.
Total rebound %? Decreased.
AST%? Decreased.
STL%? Decreased.
BLK%? Increased.
USG%? Increased.

Essentially, we have a very limited player who is now getting spoon fed at the rim. The only difference is he doesn't take as many games off defensively as he has throughout his young career.

____________

As for Lonzo... he does more than just pass, pass, pass...
He feeds the right guy at the right time. He creates transition opportunities with his speed. He plays defense the best on the team. We are #1 in pace with the #3 toughest SOS. He leads the team in rebounding and assists. He has the highest BBIQ on the team. He is a threat from 3 point range. He has the 2nd most blocks (31) on the team behind Lopez (44). He has the 2nd most steals (42) on the team behind KCP (52). And he clearly makes everyone better. All while being the youngest player on the team.

[Kilroy]

Whatever... You know the complete team stats as well or better than anyone, and your eye-test is probably as good as anyone's too... Not even worth justifying the cherry-pick...
Randle's as good as gone anyway.

[TyCobb]

Read on Twitter

TBH, I'm with Pop. I hate most advanced stats and I used to always post this, "Statistics are used much like a drunk uses a lamppost: for support, not illumination." - Vin Scully

Now with that said, I do find it hard to believe 'it's not even debatable' about Randle being the best player this season for the Lakers. I still believe he is the toughness and heart of this team, and the other night he really let me down. He is a mismatch with his strength and power, and as he gets more NBA experience he'll be able to be much more effective. I think we can keep Randle as long as we can get Clarkson the hell outta here by the trade deadline. He is more replaceable than Randle is. We'll see though.

[Landsberger]

____________

As for Lonzo... he does more than just pass, pass, pass...
He feeds the right guy at the right time. He creates transition opportunities with his speed. He plays defense the best on the team. We are #1 in pace with the #3 toughest SOS. He leads the team in rebounding and assists. He has the highest BBIQ on the team. He is a threat from 3 point range. He has the 2nd most blocks (31) on the team behind Lopez (44). He has the 2nd most steals (42) on the team behind KCP (52). And he clearly makes everyone better. All while being the youngest player on the team.

I’m assuming this is for me. If you understood my post, I said nothing negative about Ball. Stats in relation to others on a last place team are just that. The pass pass pass comment wasn’t about him. Did you even read it? In fact it basically supports your assertions minus the stats. I’ll clear it up for you. I was pointing out the system (Luke counting passes) and it’s inflexible nature and how a system that puts Ball in positions where his best talent helps us the most is better for us.....all of us.

[TyCobb]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

[Landsberger]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

[TyCobb]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

Well, I'm going to go with BBIQ. It's 'elite'. His understanding of the game of basketball is incredible. He has all the intangibles that you look for out of your PG. His defense... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. His rebounding... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. This is all relative to his position. But I'm going to say, regardless of position, his passing and BBIQ, both offensively and defensively, is 'elite'. I'd argue it's the most important aspect. He is like a coach on the floor, and again, relative to his age and position, it's seriously impressive.

We don't need to change any kind of system, just the construction of the roster. We have to fill it out with high BBIQ shooters and versatile defenders. It was so easy to predict he would end up on the Lakers because he is Walton's dream player. Fast paced, get the ball moving, defense, just everything you want for someone running the offense and leading the defense. We all agreed that PG is one of the most difficult jobs in the NBA because of the depth of the position.

Once we add Bron and George, then you just fill out the bench with players like Nance, Looney, Hart, etc.

[Kilroy]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

I was thinking about this too... I'm starting to wonder about Luke's system with regard to our young guys...
I think for guys like Ingram and Randle, and maybe JC... The Org... Not sure if it's Luke, Pelinka or Magic is telling them to play a certain way and then not really maximizing the system for the role they're playing, or at least not for the version of the role they're capable of playing...
Seems to true for Lonzo too to a certain extent...
Even Kuz seems to have been told to try to emulate Kobe... When that's clearly not ever going to be his wheelhouse...

I just feel like the talent is there, but for whatever reason they just aren't really meshing... Maybe it is a system issue more than an individual talent issue.

We've all bitched about the rotations... I've complained about Ball not having a bigger role in the half court offense... Also about Ingram completely changing his approach this season to an iso-heavy, almost a Randle-esque bully-ball, mode instead of a more jump shooter mode... They told Randle to get lean and work on his mobility... Then they made him a C.
Ball seems a lot more Kidd than Curry... Maybe the Golden State model isn't the best for him...

Honestly, I'd love to start seeing some Ingram/Ball PNR's going on... Or at least with Kuz...

[No name]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

How many players have multiple "elite" "top level" skills in "comparison to the rest of the league"? How many had them through 30 games?

To answer your question, he is an elite passer. I'd also say that his rebounding is elite in comparison to other guards, let alone point guards. He's smart enough to put himself in a position to succeed in those aspects.

[shakes0]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

Besides passing I'd say he is already elite at rebounding and setting the tempo and he is well on his way to achieving elite status as a defender.

[One Love]

Balls best attribute is his “team first mentality”... You guys remember Russell... Any of you ever play ball in college or over sea’s... Second, he sets up the offense... Third, he sets up his teammates... Fourth, Ball is the 2nd leading PG rebounder in the league as a rookie, behind Westbrook, too... Fifth, defense...

Kid can play boys & all the right players in the NBA see it... Why are so many NBA players giving this humble kid love... Simple, “kid can ball”...

[Landsberger]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

Well, I'm going to go with BBIQ. It's 'elite'. His understanding of the game of basketball is incredible. He has all the intangibles that you look for out of your PG. His defense... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. His rebounding... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. This is all relative to his position. But I'm going to say, regardless of position, his passing and BBIQ, both offensively and defensively, is 'elite'. I'd argue it's the most important aspect. He is like a coach on the floor, and again, relative to his age and position, it's seriously impressive.

We don't need to change any kind of system, just the construction of the roster. We have to fill it out with high BBIQ shooters and versatile defenders. It was so easy to predict he would end up on the Lakers because he is Walton's dream player. Fast paced, get the ball moving, defense, just everything you want for someone running the offense and leading the defense. We all agreed that PG is one of the most difficult jobs in the NBA because of the depth of the position.

Once we add Bron and George, then you just fill out the bench with players like Nance, Looney, Hart, etc.

I think, at this stage, he's one of the top 3 playmakers in the open court.... easily. Yes, he rebounds but individual rebound numbers are for video games IMHO. Team rebounding is important. I'm not a big fan of individual assist stats either. With that said he rebounds very well for a guard. He has a very good understanding of how to play team defense as well. This is in the context of a poor defensive team for the most part however.

My larger point was how to use what he does at a top level better to help the rest of our team.... not debate endless assertions of greatness or stats. I'm not, nor have I ever, thought he was not important to the team, rather I think where he's important is not being focused on enough. I think we can agree that Lonzo on the weak side at the 3 point line waiting for Ingram to set up his man and drive and kick isn't where he helps the team the most. Same can be said of Randle's tunnel vision drive or else play at times. Pick and roll is maybe a better way to get Lonzo to get those guys easier shots.

Everyone knows I wasn't a huge fan of Russell or his use in our offense. In his limited play in NJ he's upped his average not by dropping 3's everywhere or even jumpers. He's in a system that gets him in the paint for easier shots. It's evident in his shot selection this year. More shots from where it's easier equals a higher overall shooting percentage and more points. Same for Lonzo, he needs sets that put him moving toward the hoop rather than passing and rotating to the 3 point line while Luke counts passes before he says shoot. I don't think our talent (or anyone else's except GS's) fits the GS system. That system didn't make those players.... the players made that system. Luke needs to address our team's talents and adjust the system.... or maybe even create one over just borrowing one.

[OzCastiel]

Balls best attribute is his “team first mentality”...

[stan francisco]

"Lonzo has one significant NBA to level talent. It's a very important one but it's still just one."

I think it was the intro... lol

What are his top nba talents. You guys usually call them “elite”.... I say passing. He’s already one of the better passers in the game. I can’t think of anything else that he’s top level(elite) at in comparison to the rest of the league at this point. Enlighten me.

Larger point, why not change the system to better take advantage of this?

Well, I'm going to go with BBIQ. It's 'elite'. His understanding of the game of basketball is incredible. He has all the intangibles that you look for out of your PG. His defense... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. His rebounding... pretty damn close to elite for a PG. This is all relative to his position. But I'm going to say, regardless of position, his passing and BBIQ, both offensively and defensively, is 'elite'. I'd argue it's the most important aspect. He is like a coach on the floor, and again, relative to his age and position, it's seriously impressive.

We don't need to change any kind of system, just the construction of the roster. We have to fill it out with high BBIQ shooters and versatile defenders. It was so easy to predict he would end up on the Lakers because he is Walton's dream player. Fast paced, get the ball moving, defense, just everything you want for someone running the offense and leading the defense. We all agreed that PG is one of the most difficult jobs in the NBA because of the depth of the position.

Once we add Bron, then you just fill out the bench with players like Nance, Looney, Hart, etc.

Amen.

[TyCobb]

Read on Twitter

[stan francisco]

When is our 19 year old elite NBA defender PG coming back?

That's the most striking thing with Lonzo.

We're 15-12 with him 1-8 without him. Thats also a strikingly strong argument for his defense, along with the team defensive stats with/without him.

[Robot Rock]

When is our 19 year old elite NBA defender PG coming back?

That's the most striking thing with Lonzo.

We're 15-12 with him 1-8 without him. Thats also a strikingly strong argument for his defense, along with the team defensive stats with/without him.

He's a jack of most trades.

[stan francisco]

When is our 19 year old elite NBA defender PG coming back?

That's the most striking thing with Lonzo.

We're 15-12 with him 1-8 without him. Thats also a strikingly strong argument for his defense, along with the team defensive stats with/without him.

He's a jack of most trades.

An elite Jack at individual defense (not just blocks and steals but he also collapses on the low post effectively, blinsights opposing bigs in the lane), but also his team defense is very good.

Rebounding, outlet passing, running the break, running the half court set offense, shooting the three, attacking the hoop (wish he did it more). He is elite in many areas already and he hasn't even played a full season. At 21, in a year, his threes will fall at a high clip.

Most younger posters seem to only look at the scoring column, don't seem to think defense matters. Lol

With Lonzo outlet passing, let's try to get some stops, outrun the league.

[LakersLegacy]

We only need to catch the Jazz, Nuggets and Clippers to sneak into the play-offs

We don’t have a lotto pick. The yucky Celtics do. Let’s plummet the value of that pick.

Hurry back Lonzo

15-12 with you. The baby Lakers gonnna Lake. Saw you dancing on social media post. And you are traveling with the team. Get Wins!

[Dr Aki]

We only need to catch the Jazz, Nuggets and Clippers to sneak into the play-offs

We don’t have a lotto pick. The yucky Celtics do. Let’s plummet the value of that pick.

Hurry back Lonzo

15-12 with you. The baby Lakers gonnna Lake. Saw you dancing on social media post. And you are traveling with the team. Get Wins!

that's a pretty big ask