How are they going to trade Westbrook?

John Murdoch · Post #101 » by **John Murdoch** » Thu Dec 16, 2021 11:14 am

We are screwed, AD is not any better either

John Murdoch · Post #102 » by **John Murdoch** » Fri Dec 17, 2021 6:41 pm

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y46naqvm

TheHartBreakKid · Post #103 » by **TheHartBreakKid** » Fri Dec 17, 2021 9:48 pm

I posted this in the trade thread but I think it's more relevant here:

I don't see why people are so motivated to trade Russ. He doesn't have the best trade value right now and I don't believe there is anyone we could get that would make the team better right now. Even ignoring his market, his performance has been steadily improving and while there are still very valid concerns about him, it seems that he (and Vogel, and Lebron) are starting to atleast gel better than the start of the season.

We are 6-3 since Lebron has returned. 2 of those losses were very close games against the clippers and the 3ot against the Kings where the opposing team shot ridiculously well in crunch time. Westbrook has been 50% from the field and 38% from 3 during that time period.

Yes those numbers don't tell the whole story....spacing issues, high turnovers, questionable defense etc.

But the team also has had a top 5 defensive rating in this time period and seems to be gaining momentum. Despite his flaws Westbrook is probably the only other perimeter player we have other than Lebron that could get to the basket.

I know everyone is concerned about Westbrook at the end of games and in the playoffs, and rightfully so, but we should also be concerned about a worn out 37 year old Lebron at the end of games and in the playoffs if he is carrying all the ball handling duties. I think any trades that involves Westbrook that brings back better floor spaces but no playmakers is simply creating a new issue while trying to resolve an existing one.

In my opinion, our best chance this year will be if the team continues to gel with RW. The team defense is improving, and RW is atleast being more efficient. The next step, and it's a huge step, is if Westbrook can be more comfortable off the ball to the point that he could shoot more confidently and not as a last resort. If he manages to do that, I think he's a good enough shooter to atleast make the defense respect him out there. I really do believe it's a mindset issue more so than it his regarding his abilities.

and I'll add this note:

Lebron has the lowest Usage % right now than he's had all his career asides from his rookie year. He had his 6th highest usage last year.

I know some might thing this is a bad thing, but to me, this is one of Westbrook's perks that don't show up on the stat sheet. Lebron at this age simply can't be expected to dominate the ball like before. I don't have stats for this, but it seems like he is slower ever in starting the offense and the most likely to shoot contested jumpshots at the end of games, where he simply looks drained at times. We need someone who can penetrate the defense and keep that usage percentage low. Trading Westbrook might result in Lebron having more space and an easier time when he is dominating the ball, but it would surely result in him having to dominate the ball far more than he should at this stage of his career. Having someone like RW adds a whole other needed dimension to our offense and might result in CP3 or Curry actually having to exert defensive energy in a potential playoff matchup.

The more obvious solution to the RW end of game spacing problem is that that Vogel simply might have to sit Westbrook in the playoffs for certain offensive possessions at the end of games if he isn't confident to comfortably take open 3s, and I hope Vogel has the balls to do that and RW has the maturity to accept that.

Landsberger · Post #104 » by **Landsberger** » Sat Dec 18, 2021 8:59 pm

We haven't played the top teams yet. We have the hardest schedule in the league remaining with a .545 winning %.

Russell is a train wreck... Always has been. No reason to think that's changed. He's blinded so many with stats. The mistakes to trade balance for stats was a rookie mistake IMHO by the FO.

This team will have injuries and having a "rested LeBron" while sneaking into the playoffs isn't a way to do much other than get a first round ousting.

Is trading Westbrook a way to get better this year? Probably not. But I'd also try and trade Davis as well.... this would probably force Bron to ask for a Trade and Melo to want a buyout. It's the fastest way back to a championship in reality because this core will bleed us dry for a couple more years otherwise.

Hellcrooner · Post #105 » by **Hellcrooner** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 4:32 am

we need to trade westbrook and a couple second rounders and cash for Rubio and love A.s.a.p

thats it.

get those two, proceed to start wining games and if neither lebron or cristal unibrow miss the playoffs collect a ring.

easy as that.

danfantastk32 · Post #106 » by **danfantastk32** » Wed Dec 22, 2021 7:41 am

Landsberger wrote: Is trading Westbrook a way to get better this year? Probably not. But I'd also try and trade Davis as well.... this would probably force Bron to ask for a Trade and Melo to want a buyout. It's the fastest way back to a championship in reality because this core will bleed us dry for a couple more years otherwise.

I think you have to root for not making the playoffs under your scenario. If this team fails to make the playoffs, then I you might see the FO get bold enough to make wholesale changes. I don't see it until then. There's nobody up top with the eggs to trade AD (and subsequently Lebron). But even now, your talking about 'pennies on the dollar'. Now double the pain if this team fails to make the playoffs. We're gonna get a bunch of other team's crap deals, long contracts...with a draft pick or two peppered in.

I think our most realistic bet is to just suffer through this season, and the next. Besides being most realistic...I think it's going to be the least painful. We're not getting squat for any of these guys now....except we gotta make 40+ mil somehow work (say hello to tons of trash).

We swung big.....and struck out. I guess you gotta admire the FO for at least going for it. I think Westbrook was no-brainer dumb. It's disappointing to feel like you have a better pulse on the NBA than your front office at times....but I can't make excuses for what I feel was an extremely obvious derp move. At least he comes off the books after next season. Thank god we don't have him for 3-4 more years.

Landsberger · Post #107 » by **Landsberger** » Wed Dec 22, 2021 2:33 pm

danfantastk32 wrote:
Landsberger wrote: Is trading Westbrook a way to get better this year? Probably not. But I'd also try and trade Davis as well.... this would probably force Bron to ask for a Trade and Melo to want a buyout. It's the fastest way back to a championship in reality because this core will bleed us dry for a couple more years otherwise.

I think you have to root for not making the playoffs under your scenario. If this team fails to make the playoffs, then I you might see the FO get bold enough to make wholesale changes. I don't see it until then. There's nobody up top with the eggs to trade AD (and subsequently Lebron). But even now, your talking about 'pennies on the dollar'. Now double the pain if this team fails to make the playoffs. We're gonna get a bunch of other team's crap deals, long contracts...with a draft pick or two peppered in.

I think our most realistic bet is to just suffer through this season, and the next. Besides being most realistic...I think it's going to be the least painful. We're not getting squat for any of these guys now....except we gotta make 40+ mil somehow work (say hello to tons of trash).

We swung big.....and struck out. I guess you gotta admire the FO for at least going for it. I think Westbrook was no-brainer dumb. It's disappointing to feel like you have a better pulse on the NBA than your front office at times....but I can't make excuses for what I feel was an extremely obvious derp move. At least he comes off the books after next season. Thank god we don't have him for 3-4 more years.

I think the FO did what Bron wanted. No real NBA guy does what we did unless there were significant outside forces. Bron is like a mob boss with our FO.... He's going for his buddy's and guys like him... "me" players. Westbrook and Melo fit that to a tee.

If the Owner wanted to limit the generational damage to the franchise you'd move Davis sooner rather than later. He's entering Kevin Love territory IMHO. I think this guy is done by 30-32. He's not a leader, his game has peaked and he's on the floor as much as he is upright.

Riding this thing out to next year will put us in a deeper hole than the Kobe swing for the fences with Nash and Howard.... We could be crap for decade or longer.

I'm becoming less interested in the NBA... politics, the "modern 3 ball era" and too many players like Westbrook and Melo...

danfantastk32 · Post #108 » by **danfantastk32** » Fri Dec 24, 2021 7:42 pm

Landsberger wrote:
I'm becoming less interested in the NBA... politics, the "modern 3 ball era" and too many players like Westbrook and Melo...

I read what you said on the Laker/Spurs post...and it sorta boiled down to this comment, so I'll just reply here for both posts.

Kind of in agreement with you. I find myself missing games more frequently...and turning it off early, or starting it late. I think Lebron is one of the all-time greats of the game, but I don't really like "him". I've mentioned that Melo has always been one of my least favorite players in the NBA. Westbrook isn't far behind. Much like you said in the other post, there's nobody to root for on this team, and it's purely rooting for the franchise at this point. I find even the FO is hard to root for these days. I don't mind the politics when players / owners want to speak their mind on twitter, or whatnot. But let's keep it out from between the lines for 48 minutes please. And personally, after the silence regarding that sick regime out east, to keep the gravy train rolling......anything the NBA, or it's players wanna say just dribble, to me.

.....anyways...rant, rant, soapbox. Point is, I am pretty much in the same spot with ya. I actually got to sit courtside last game. Pretty freakin' sweet. I was right next to the Spurs bench, where the tiny Asian lady, Yori normally sits. She gave me her seats last night.Was alot of fun to see all the coaching stuff from Pop. Getting to sit 6-8 feet from where he was drawing plays, and assignments for guys was a treat.

But the game was pure rubbish, and I heard Dwight yelling defensive reads, and I gotta tell ya, I don't remember a single other player say anything. I'm sure I missed a thing or two....but this team doesn't talk, and doesn't care defensively. The offense is just ugly and stagnant. Totally no fun to watch. I got my bucket list item there. Sitting courtside at a Laker game has been a dream. And now that it's done.....I'm prob gonna put the Lakers far back, in terms of priorities, until we overhaul this thing. I got to see Westbrook drive and lose the ball/miss up close and personal....multiple times....and I'm good now.

Landsberger · Post #109 » by **Landsberger** » Sat Dec 25, 2021 1:51 am

danfantastk32 wrote:
Landsberger wrote:
I'm becoming less interested in the NBA... politics, the "modern 3 ball era" and too many players like Westbrook and Melo...

I read what you said on the Laker/Spurs post...and it sorta boiled down to this comment, so I'll just reply here for both posts.

Kind of in agreement with you. I find myself missing games more frequently...and turning it off early, or starting it late. I think Lebron is one of the all-time greats of the game, but I don't really like "him". I've mentioned that Melo has always been one of my least favorite players in the NBA. Westbrook isn't far behind. Much like you said in the other post, there's nobody to root for on this team, and it's purely rooting for the franchise at this point. I find even the FO is hard to root for these days. I don't mind the politics when players / owners want to speak their mind on twitter, or whatnot. But let's keep it out from between the lines for 48 minutes please. And personally, after the silence regarding that sick regime out east, to keep the gravy train rolling......anything the NBA, or it's players wanna say just dribble, to me.

.....anyways...rant, rant, soapbox. Point is, I am pretty much in the same spot with ya. I actually got to sit courtside last game. Pretty freakin' sweet. I was right next to the Spurs bench, where the tiny Asian lady, Yori normally sits. She gave me her seats last night.Was alot of fun to see all the coaching stuff from Pop. Getting to sit 6-8 feet from where he was drawing plays, and assignments for guys was a treat.

But the game was pure rubbish, and I heard Dwight yelling defensive reads, and I gotta tell ya, I don't remember a single other player say anything. I'm sure I missed a thing or two....but this team doesn't talk, and doesn't care defensively. The offense is just ugly and stagnant. Totally no fun to watch. I got my bucket list item there. Sitting courtside at a Laker game has been a dream. And now that it's done.....I'm prob gonna put the Lakers far back, in terms of priorities, until we overhaul this thing. I got to see Westbrook drive and lose the ball/miss up close and personal....multiple times....and I'm good now.

The last 5 years the NBA as a business has become very hard to respect in general and the ignoring of human rights issues in terms of one of their money streams is unforgivable IMHO. Either you're for human rights or not.... when you choose based on dollars your no better than the oppressors IMHO. Bron, specifically is the poster child for this. For him it's fashion... nothing more.

The game itself has become a mixture of chucking 35% shots and pick and roll. It's stale and formulaic. The game between 89-96 was similarly stale. It will come out of it. This is the 3rd generation of the single guy era. It too, will pass.

The Buss family needs to sell IMHO. This "run" will put the franchise in a decade long hole. Since the old man was terminal they have swung for the fences 3 times with each digging the hole deeper. We got one chip and I guess thats OK but the quality of the product has been hard to watch. Gathering together over the last 3 seasons the players I respect the least in 48 years of watching the NBA hasn't helped for me. Cousins, Westbrook, Melo and Howard. The only one missing is CP3 and maybe ML Carr.

I'll keep watching when I can. I'm not making plans around Laker games...that's for sure. In my line of work I get invited to the Box seats here in Phoenix a lot. I've gone 4 times this year. Not a fan of CP3 in the least (cannot be understated) but that team plays a nice game of basketball. I actually end up watching other sports on the 4 65" monitors in the suite more than I watch the game.... interestingly so does most everyone else.

thomas1897 · Post #110 » by **thomas1897** » Mon Dec 27, 2021 2:32 pm

Depends on how many years are left on his present contract will determine how the Laker Management will approach Mr. Westbrook. The lakers have a major issue beyond Russell Westbrook. The Team Chemistry of 2021-2022 roster has major issues and the construct is not working the contrast is the analytics say a completely different story. Westbrook, James and Davis contracts comprise 75% or more of the salary cap. Trading will depend on who you are building a championship team around. Management will have much to decide on going forward into future seasons.

tamaraw08 · Post #111 » by **tamaraw08** » Mon Dec 27, 2021 4:11 pm

thomas1897 wrote:Depends on how many years are left on his present contract will determine how the Laker Management will approach Mr. Westbrook. The lakers have a major issue beyond Russell Westbrook. The Team Chemistry of 2021-2022 roster has major issues and the construct is not working the contrast is the analytics say a completely different story. Westbrook, James and Davis contracts comprise 75% or more of the salary cap. Trading will depend on who you are building a championship team around. Management will have much to decide on going forward into future seasons.

Westbrook's contract expires after the '23 season which is just 2 seasons from now so it's not like this team would be this sorry state with him for several more years.
Most of us are lamenting on how this acquisition was a disaster and yes, it's been depressing but we ignore the fact that the 37 yr old Lebron could NOT carry this team on his own and they desperately needed someone to create some offense while he is on the bench.
The problem is, Russ has lost athleticism and continue to turn the ball over which lead to so much frustration from his teammates.

SweetTouch · Post #112 » by **SweetTouch** » Mon Dec 27, 2021 5:54 pm

**** it im riding with westbrook

All the media everyone is throwing shade at this dude

even young bucks who haven't accomplished jack **** in their lives Kat

I know LBJ and Westbrook are seeing all this and taking notes

BEazy · Post #113 » by **BEazy** » Mon Dec 27, 2021 7:03 pm

You know it's bad when you have 6 pages of ways on how to trade this trash ass player. This guy is up there with most hated Laker ever for me. Westbrook, Dwight (1st stint), Schroder, and Steve Nash in that order.

BEazy · Post #114 » by **BEazy** » Tue Dec 28, 2021 7:27 am

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Got to be the most infuriating player I've ever seen in a Lakers uniform. I've watched freaking Kwame Brown for crying out loud... :banghead:

euphorbus · Post #115 » by **euphorbus** » Tue Dec 28, 2021 3:27 pm

I notice that a lot of those plays were the result of Westbrook forcing things: passes, layups, drives to the basket with no way out. When you think about a genius like Magic Johnson, who had the most amazing court vision I have ever seen, and compare him to Westbrook...well, it's hard to believe Russell is playing for the same club, much less on a max contract.

Then you have his 3-point percentage: 30.4%. That is currently good for 180th place in the NBA among guards (minimum 20 games). Again, not worth a max contract in the current age of three-point bonanzas.

MoneyMo · Post #116 » by **MoneyMo** » Tue Dec 28, 2021 9:03 pm

Westbrook is an anchor

Read on Twitter

John Murdoch · Post #117 » by **John Murdoch** » Tue Dec 28, 2021 10:11 pm

SweetTouch wrote:**** it im riding with westbrook

All the media everyone is throwing shade at this dude

even young bucks who haven't accomplished jack **** in their lives Kat

I know LBJ and Westbrook are seeing all this and taking notes

We see you Russell , its too late ull be waived soon

kamaze · Post #118 » by **kamaze** » Wed Dec 29, 2021 3:45 pm

He makes more than Lebron good luck trading that contract. Lebron wanted him he's stuck with him.

Post #119 » by **Slava** » Wed Dec 29, 2021 4:07 pm

All you need is for a playoff thirsty team like Cleveland to start dropping out of the picture with PG injuries (Sexton, Rubio) and the owner would sit on the GM to get a dude like Westbrook to hold the fort and make the playoffs. The bigger challenge is to get useful pieces that are serviceable in return.

BlazersBroncos · Post #120 » by **BlazersBroncos** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 3:46 pm

Slava wrote:All you need is for a playoff thirsty team like Cleveland to start dropping out of the picture with PG injuries (Sexton, Rubio) and the owner would sit on the GM to get a dude like Westbrook to hold the fort and make the playoffs. The bigger challenge is to get useful pieces that are serviceable in return.

I really dont think this is the case. Cleveland plays good team basketball and disciplined defense, Russ is a freelance on both sides of the floor. Its a horrible fit.

Westbrook is untradable outside John Wall IMO.