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2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread

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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1281 » by aaron_gray » Sat Feb 21, 2015 1:48 am

kblo247 wrote:You telling me we couldn't even invest in Plumpee who is a cheap Mihm like player and honestly better than any draftee or Ed Davis? The only saving grace is that Javale Mcgee may be bought out. If he is, we need to make an offer for an athletic center. There isn't one draftee who can help us. Okafor is slow and plodding on D, has Baby fat, and won't play more than 25 mins or 60 nba games in his physical shape. Towns is worse off than that because he can't even average double digit point consistently and while he has some instincts, he has a lot of mental checkout moments. And stein has a health concern, all the intensity in the world, but is less polished than most on o, kinda like Deandre Jordan lite.

The most depressing part of this deadline was it was clear this team has no plan. There is none. Lets not overlook or sugarcoat, you can all get mad at me for saying it, but I'm right. Just like how all of you got mad at me for saying the Nash trade was garbage after it was done unless if Nash wanted to be an uber Steve Kerr. Guess what, I was right then too. Like with saying Brown was better coach than Scott this summer too. Letting Pau go for nothing and not even getting any second rounders back when Prigioni was good for two was hard to swallow. This is a debacle.

In the nba it is better to be mediocre than awful. Being awful doesn't help us. The Cavs weren't awful when they got Bron, simply mediocre by east standards. The fact is any free agent worth a damn, not Love as he isn't worth what he wants especially the max, will join this team with its bad coaching and lack of direction and assets. You need some B guys that are actual investments. You can't have a D guy like Wes and Ed to tell a free agent come in, or pay 15mil for a pick to a C guy like Lin. You have to go out and invest in the B guys like Dragic, Deandre, Rondo, Monroe, etc and it has to be investing in two B guys with a bunch of C and few D guys to support them to get a meeting with Bron. Don't get it twisted, I wasn't ranting, I was being honest yesterday, and honestly the only reason we got a meeting with an A guy in Melo last year was as Stephen a Smith said, Melo did it because another A guy in Kobe asked.

This really doesn't help us long term to waste our time on a fifth pick or purposely trying to lose. So yes I'm going to be disagreed with when I say it, like I documented before I was disagreed with about Nash and coachi, but I hope Hill, Booz, and Nick blow the tank up and beat Phili those two games. I rather not waste time on potential or guys who aren't close to NBDL level fitness, let alone nba fitness. I want to invest in 2-3 B guys with all our cap space and actual commitment to those guys with multiple years, and then offer the room to a C. We need two of Rondo, Monroe, Matthews, Tobias, Deandre, Dragic and so on as we have no shot, and deserve no shot at a meeting with Marc or Aldeidge this summer. Then we still need to get a Gerald Green or Kosta Kufos with the room as opposed to wasting time on Ed and Wes who aren't full time rotation guys.

Sig it, quote it, be mad whatever, I'm just being honest, and saying we don't have a plan or assets and we can't do what we did last year


There is a plan, which is not to freak out about a traditional rebuild like a grandpa who doesn't trust computers. The draft isn't perfect not because the prospects are untalented, but rather because the teams that drafted these prospects didn't have the infrastructure and openings to develop him. This should not be a worry with the Lakers, as you can see that the 2nd round talent is getting better every game (we can delve into that with more detail later).

Kevin Love is better than every free agent on your list, and i don't think it's even that debatable. For all the crap Love gets about nonexistent help defense, it's not like Monroe is Hibbert lite or something. DeAndre has a glaring flaw, Rondo has the same flaw just not as glaring and an actually even more glaring flaw while Dragic is the only one who I feel like can compare with Love in terms of talent. Love is a decent post defender really, and he is a player you can build your offense around. He can shoot 3s, and unlike Ryan Anderson, he has a real post game, which he dominated Ryan Kelly with last time they played. At the end of the day though, I'm with you on not wanting him for fit with Randle, and people need to stop saying that you try to make it work if he wants to come. There's something called opportunity cost.

Also, when you list free agent targets, don't list guys for what they've done. List them for what you think they're going to be. If you think Monroe is only going to get better, fine, list him as a B guy worthy of a max. Don't list Rondo, who is only going to decline from now on and who's shown that he don't give a damn when the team starts losing.
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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1282 » by kblo247 » Sat Feb 21, 2015 2:13 am

Don't get me wrong, we were planless and mediocre when we wasted years of Kobe's prime. But to me that was different. Even when Kobe went on tirade that kickstarted Jerry to get more involved and spend, I knew it was different. Kobe was so good we only needed 1 player. Lord bless PAu, but he was a B+/A- guy when he came and that's what we needed. Kobe was that great and LAmar was a B, not a second option but a B level guy who put up double doubles and raised his averages every postseason. Fish was a C+, never great and always steady. Ariza, Luke, and all were all C players with varied skills. Kobe was sop great that D leaguers, Odom, and Alton was mediocre and over 500 so they only needed a A/B guy that was borderline all star status to push them over; now however we are bad and 27 year old Kobe ain't walking thru the door

This team does not have the Kobe that team had who could chase down anybody 1-3, grab double digit boards, score 40-60, get 6-8 assists, and play 40 plus minutes with a scowl on his face. We don't have a LAmar who could sleepwalk to double digit boards, score double digit points, run the brerun the O, be a one man fastbreak off the glass coast to coast. We don't even have a Luke equivalent from those down years when he was starting and was a 10/4/4/1 average nightly.

I think we need 2 guys. I stick to the fact that I would not turn down a 1 or 2 pick, but that they aren't ready and won't help, and that 3-5 are even worse. To me even if you got 1-2, Okafor and Russell IMO, the fact is Okafor needs to be behind a vet and Russell is probably a sg when he enters ala Oliadapo .

We need a couple things IMO ...
2 B Guys - Rondo, Dragic, Love, Tobias, MAtthews, Jennings, Hibert, Love (not close to mac), Monroe

* We need 2 because Kobe's diminished. He can contribute in a role like when he returned, but not in Scotts old role he tried to overuse him in. We need Kobe from 99-00 production levels

Room Exception -- Gerald Green or Kosta Kufos

* We don't need two worse versions of them. Wes will never get how to control his body and shoot on the way down or score every night like. Gerald. Memphis let Ed go because he will never be as strong, as big, protect the rim as well, box out as well, or be as physical as Kufos.

We need to develop Clarkson some more, but also cut the plug on some others where needed. And as it pertains to Randle, yes he was hurt, but if he isn't a gym working with Grover and killing himself ala Blake when he missed the first year, you got to dangle him for a guy like Cousins or Russ if KD is truly frustrated by him and talks about wanting to leave
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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1283 » by kblo247 » Sat Feb 21, 2015 2:44 am

[quote="aaron_gray]here is a plan, which is not to freak out about a traditional rebuild like a grandpa who doesn't trust computers. The draft isn't perfect not because the prospects are untalented, but rather because the teams that drafted these prospects didn't have the infrastructure and openings to develop him. This should not be a worry with the Lakers, as you can see that the 2nd round talent is getting better every game (we can delve into that with more detail later).

Kevin Love is better than every free agent on your list, and i don't think it's even that debatable. For all the crap Love gets about nonexistent help defense, it's not like Monroe is Hibbert lite or something. DeAndre has a glaring flaw, Rondo has the same flaw just not as glaring and an actually even more glaring flaw while Dragic is the only one who I feel like can compare with Love in terms of talent. Love is a decent post defender really, and he is a player you can build your offense around. He can shoot 3s, and unlike Ryan Anderson, he has a real post game, which he dominated Ryan Kelly with last time they played. At the end of the day though, I'm with you on not wanting him for fit with Randle, and people need to stop saying that you try to make it work if he wants to come. There's something called opportunity cost.

Also, when you list free agent targets, don't list guys for what they've done. List them for what you think they're going to be. If you think Monroe is only going to get better, fine, list him as a B guy worthy of a max. Don't list Rondo, who is only going to decline from now on and who's shown that he don't give a damn when the team starts losing.[/quote]

Love isn't worth his max. I didn't say I wouldn't take him. You'll never find a post where I say that. I always say he is not a max player, not. A superstar, a bad defender, and stat pads. That's not incorrect. He even showed as much when Bron was out and he looked like his wolves self, big numbers, lots of losses. HE isn't a leader or best player material. I'd take him with another guy, but not him and him alone unless if he has a blood oath with Westbrook to force his way here.

And if I listed Rondo, hes a A off what hes done, which is more than a PAul based on success. I have him based off on actuality which is a B. There is only two A free agents, 3 if Bron opts out to go with MArc and Aldridge
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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1284 » by aaron_gray » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:42 am

kblo247 wrote:
Love isn't worth his max. I didn't say I wouldn't take him. You'll never find a post where I say that. I always say he is not a max player, not. A superstar, a bad defender, and stat pads. That's not incorrect. He even showed as much when Bron was out and he looked like his wolves self, big numbers, lots of losses. HE isn't a leader or best player material. I'd take him with another guy, but not him and him alone unless if he has a blood oath with Westbrook to force his way here.

And if I listed Rondo, hes a A off what hes done, which is more than a PAul based on success. I have him based off on actuality which is a B. There is only two A free agents, 3 if Bron opts out to go with MArc and Aldridge


Wow we're going to debate Rondo vs Paul. Aside from the textbook point guard stuff, the defense, the decent 3 point shooting, the handles that would make the crowd go ooh, whipping passes around the court and hitting guys, being renown for not turning it over, here's the one thing that I think separated CP3 from the other primary ball handlers: his ability to take over at the end of games. The CP3 I remember would post up 16 ft from the basket and just dominate. He had a mid-range jumper that wouldn't miss and a willy swim move that he went to at times. You couldn't stop him. He was probably the most clutch player of the 12-13 season.
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Your turn to defend Rondo.

In terms of Love, he was worth something like 24 million last year according to the armchair.
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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1285 » by kblo247 » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:58 am

Rondo is a champion, Paul ain't

Rondo has stepped up in the playoffs and took over a series to the point wade tried to break his freaking arm. Paul for all his vaunted regular season glory has gotten dominated by Billups, played even by Conley, beaten like a drum and washed by Parker in their multiple meetings when the real season occurs. And when Deron was deron, he outright was Derons individual bitch. He is no superstar in the playoffs to the point that he kills his guy. He's no kobe vs manu or michael vs clyde. There's a reason why he taps out at the second round every year with one of the best players there is in Blake or with Peja/Tyson/West ... He doesn't step it up when it is the real season and his floppy play isn't rewarded and his magic alley oops go away

I'm the guy who will always take rondo over paul in a series and Parker over every Pg in the league
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Re: Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1286 » by TwoStarz » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:49 am

kblo247 wrote:Rondo is a champion, Paul ain't

Rondo has stepped up in the playoffs and took over a series to the point wade tried to break his freaking arm. Paul for all his vaunted regular season glory has gotten dominated by Billups, played even by Conley, beaten like a drum and washed by Parker in their multiple meetings when the real season occurs. And when Deron was deron, he outright was Derons individual bitch. He is no superstar in the playoffs to the point that he kills his guy. He's no kobe vs manu or michael vs clyde. There's a reason why he taps out at the second round every year with one of the best players there is in Blake or with Peja/Tyson/West ... He doesn't step it up when it is the real season and his floppy play isn't rewarded and his magic alley oops go away

I'm the guy who will always take rondo over paul in a series and Parker over every Pg in the league
LOL, sorry that's the only thing this post deserves, which is a laugh

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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1287 » by Pointgod » Sat Feb 21, 2015 3:20 pm

kblo247 wrote:You telling me we couldn't even invest in Plumpee who is a cheap Mihm like player and honestly better than any draftee or Ed Davis? The only saving grace is that Javale Mcgee may be bought out. If he is, we need to make an offer for an athletic center. There isn't one draftee who can help us. Okafor is slow and plodding on D, has Baby fat, and won't play more than 25 mins or 60 nba games in his physical shape. Towns is worse off than that because he can't even average double digit point consistently and while he has some instincts, he has a lot of mental checkout moments. And stein has a health concern, all the intensity in the world, but is less polished than most on o, kinda like Deandre Jordan lite.

The most depressing part of this deadline was it was clear this team has no plan. There is none. Lets not overlook or sugarcoat, you can all get mad at me for saying it, but I'm right. Just like how all of you got mad at me for saying the Nash trade was garbage after it was done unless if Nash wanted to be an uber Steve Kerr. Guess what, I was right then too. Like with saying Brown was better coach than Scott this summer too. Letting Pau go for nothing and not even getting any second rounders back when Prigioni was good for two was hard to swallow. This is a debacle.

In the nba it is better to be mediocre than awful. Being awful doesn't help us. The Cavs weren't awful when they got Bron, simply mediocre by east standards. The fact is any free agent worth a damn, not Love as he isn't worth what he wants especially the max, will join this team with its bad coaching and lack of direction and assets. You need some B guys that are actual investments. You can't have a D guy like Wes and Ed to tell a free agent come in, or pay 15mil for a pick to a C guy like Lin. You have to go out and invest in the B guys like Dragic, Deandre, Rondo, Monroe, etc and it has to be investing in two B guys with a bunch of C and few D guys to support them to get a meeting with Bron. Don't get it twisted, I wasn't ranting, I was being honest yesterday, and honestly the only reason we got a meeting with an A guy in Melo last year was as Stephen a Smith said, Melo did it because another A guy in Kobe asked.

This really doesn't help us long term to waste our time on a fifth pick or purposely trying to lose. So yes I'm going to be disagreed with when I say it, like I documented before I was disagreed with about Nash and coachi, but I hope Hill, Booz, and Nick blow the tank up and beat Phili those two games. I rather not waste time on potential or guys who aren't close to NBDL level fitness, let alone nba fitness. I want to invest in 2-3 B guys with all our cap space and actual commitment to those guys with multiple years, and then offer the room to a C. We need two of Rondo, Monroe, Matthews, Tobias, Deandre, Dragic and so on as we have no shot, and deserve no shot at a meeting with Marc or Aldeidge this summer. Then we still need to get a Gerald Green or Kosta Kufos with the room as opposed to wasting time on Ed and Wes who aren't full time rotation guys.

Sig it, quote it, be mad whatever, I'm just being honest, and saying we don't have a plan or assets and we can't do what we did last year


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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1288 » by Pointgod » Sat Feb 21, 2015 3:49 pm

aaron_gray wrote:Kevin Love is better than every free agent on your list, and i don't think it's even that debatable. For all the crap Love gets about nonexistent help defense, it's not like Monroe is Hibbert lite or something. DeAndre has a glaring flaw, Rondo has the same flaw just not as glaring and an actually even more glaring flaw while Dragic is the only one who I feel like can compare with Love in terms of talent. Love is a decent post defender really, and he is a player you can build your offense around. He can shoot 3s, and unlike Ryan Anderson, he has a real post game, which he dominated Ryan Kelly with last time they played. At the end of the day though, I'm with you on not wanting him for fit with Randle, and people need to stop saying that you try to make it work if he wants to come. There's something called opportunity cost.

Also, when you list free agent targets, don't list guys for what they've done. List them for what you think they're going to be. If you think Monroe is only going to get better, fine, list him as a B guy worthy of a max. Don't list Rondo, who is only going to decline from now on and who's shown that he don't give a damn when the team starts losing.


You just dismissed half of the top 10 free agents that are available next summer :lol: So if you're not going to go after 1 of them, then who should the Lakers sign with their cap space? Marc Gasol and Aldridge aren't going to leave so who do we target. I could point out the flaws in every single player, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't sign them.
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Re: Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1289 » by kblo247 » Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:37 pm

TwoStarz wrote:
kblo247 wrote:Rondo is a champion, Paul ain't

Rondo has stepped up in the playoffs and took over a series to the point wade tried to break his freaking arm. Paul for all his vaunted regular season glory has gotten dominated by Billups, played even by Conley, beaten like a drum and washed by Parker in their multiple meetings when the real season occurs. And when Deron was deron, he outright was Derons individual bitch. He is no superstar in the playoffs to the point that he kills his guy. He's no kobe vs manu or michael vs clyde. There's a reason why he taps out at the second round every year with one of the best players there is in Blake or with Peja/Tyson/West ... He doesn't step it up when it is the real season and his floppy play isn't rewarded and his magic alley oops go away

I'm the guy who will always take rondo over paul in a series and Parker over every Pg in the league
LOL, sorry that's the only thing this post deserves, which is a laugh

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Yeah a laugh at Paul's failures. Never seen a third round, missed the playoffs a third of his career, and

Paul vs Conley
20/7/6 vs 14/7/3
20/7/4 vs 17/8/4
23/6/4 vs 17/8/4

Paul vs Billups
17/10/4 vs 23/7/4

Paul vs Parker
24/11/4 vs 19/6/4
13/9/4 vs 17/8/3

Paul vs Westgod
23/12/4 vs 28/9/6

Paul vs Steph
17/9/4 vs 23/8/4

The vaunted best at his position pg, has never in his life truly dominated his matchup or a series when called upon. Kobe beats Manus ass in the playoffs, MJ did it to Drexler, Isiah broke his foot off in Dennis Johnson, and so on. The fact is Paul doesn't have a superstar impact and is wither washed or beaten by people who he is supposedly better than.


And for kicks Deron is 15-6 all time vs cp3,
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Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1290 » by aaron_gray » Sun Feb 22, 2015 6:56 am

Pointgod wrote:
You just dismissed half of the top 10 free agents that are available next summer :lol: So if you're not going to go after 1 of them, then who should the Lakers sign with their cap space? Marc Gasol and Aldridge aren't going to leave so who do we target. I could point out the flaws in every single player, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't sign them.


I'm not saying don't target them, just stating that Love isn't as overrated as everyone suggests.
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Re: Re: Re: 2015 Lakers Trade Deadline thread 

Post#1291 » by TwoStarz » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:56 am

kblo247 wrote:
TwoStarz wrote:
kblo247 wrote:Rondo is a champion, Paul ain't

Rondo has stepped up in the playoffs and took over a series to the point wade tried to break his freaking arm. Paul for all his vaunted regular season glory has gotten dominated by Billups, played even by Conley, beaten like a drum and washed by Parker in their multiple meetings when the real season occurs. And when Deron was deron, he outright was Derons individual bitch. He is no superstar in the playoffs to the point that he kills his guy. He's no kobe vs manu or michael vs clyde. There's a reason why he taps out at the second round every year with one of the best players there is in Blake or with Peja/Tyson/West ... He doesn't step it up when it is the real season and his floppy play isn't rewarded and his magic alley oops go away

I'm the guy who will always take rondo over paul in a series and Parker over every Pg in the league
LOL, sorry that's the only thing this post deserves, which is a laugh

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Yeah a laugh at Paul's failures. Never seen a third round, missed the playoffs a third of his career, and

Paul vs Conley
20/7/6 vs 14/7/3
20/7/4 vs 17/8/4
23/6/4 vs 17/8/4

Paul vs Billups
17/10/4 vs 23/7/4

Paul vs Parker
24/11/4 vs 19/6/4
13/9/4 vs 17/8/3

Paul vs Westgod
23/12/4 vs 28/9/6

Paul vs Steph
17/9/4 vs 23/8/4

The vaunted best at his position pg, has never in his life truly dominated his matchup or a series when called upon. Kobe beats Manus ass in the playoffs, MJ did it to Drexler, Isiah broke his foot off in Dennis Johnson, and so on. The fact is Paul doesn't have a superstar impact and is wither washed or beaten by people who he is supposedly better than.


And for kicks Deron is 15-6 all time vs cp3,
how does any of this prove that rondo, who can't even shoot 50% from the line is any better than cp3. Rondo is an offensive liability, even in his best days dude was a liability regardless of what his numbers say. Celtics were a better offensive team with the dude off the court. On the other hand, cp3 has consistently led one of the best offensive teams in the league. You picking a guy that doesn't even needed to be guarded in the half court over cp3 is in fact a joke. Your posts are so biased its ridiculous. Whatever pushes your agenda further I suppose

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