Kawhi on draft day...?

TylersLakers · Post #41 » by **TylersLakers** » Tue Mar 27, 2018 2:32 pm

You guys are insane. I'd make that deal in a heartbeat and I'd throw in Kuzma as well if they were willing to take Deng.

Sign PG, re-sign Randle.

Considering the trade would be Deng, Ingram, Kuzma, 1st round pick (from Cleveland) and 2nd round pick (from Denver) for Kawhi and Brandon Paul. Paul has a team option, so decline him.

PG: Lonzo Ball (7.5M)/
SG: Paul George (31M)/ Josh Hart (1.7M)/
SF: Kawhi Leonard (21M)/
PF: Julius Randle (16M)/
C: Thomas Bryant (1.4M)

We would still have 23M in cap space, plus the room exception afterwards (around 4.5M) to add to the roster for next season. Lopez on a 1 year deal for 10M deal would be great. Add another wing in Will Barton or bring back KCP?

San Antonio would never take on Deng, though. Especially in a Kawhi deal.

Post #42 » by **milesfides** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:49 am

You can't get a young MVP and DOPY candidate without giving up something. He is the best candidate for the next best player in the world.

You're not flipping junk for him. Sorry, that's just not happening.

As much as it hurts to lose Brandon Ingram, remember to try to keep things in perspective: he's probably not going to be the best player in the world. Second, the wing position is the deepest in the league (Lebron, George, Durant, Klay, Butler all are free agents by next summer); if we have Kawhi and say, Paul George, where does that put Ingram - on the bench?

Brandon Ingram might be the sacrificial lamb required to give us a real chance to build a contender.

larry14r · Post #43 » by **larry14r** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:59 am

milesfides wrote:You can't get a young MVP and DOPY candidate without giving up something. He is the best candidate for the next best player in the world.

You're not flipping junk for him. Sorry, that's just not happening.

As much as it hurts to lose Brandon Ingram, remember to try to keep things in perspective: he's probably not going to be the best player in the world. Second, the wing position is the deepest in the league (Lebron, George, Durant, Klay, Butler all are free agents by next summer); if we have Kawhi and say, Paul George, where does that put Ingram - on the bench?

Brandon Ingram might be the sacrificial lamb required to give us a real chance to build a contender.

Especially the Spurs won't give us that chance because they are not moving him.

stan francisco · Post #44 » by **stan francisco** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:56 am

I'm not giving up anything for Leonard until I see him dominate again as he did pre injury. Not buying in blindly, definitely not giving up Ingram without knowing what for.

Post #45 » by **milesfides** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 5:58 pm

Well, Kawhi would have to pass the physical, or the Lakers can void the trade. Pretty simple and straightforward, and several major trades recently were rescinded because of failed physicals. I wouldn't do the trade either unless he absolutely checks out.

Also, the Spurs could very well move on with Kawhi, as they are doing now. It's Pop's way or the highway. The Spurs have no problem trading away players or passing on players who don't fit their culture, and Kawhi seems doing exactly that, as reported by Woz and other sources. He's unquestionably disconnected from the team.

And of course, Brandon Ingram is an ideal Pop/Spurs player. The Spurs never were a superstar team. Based on the reports, it seems like Kawhi is looking for more than being Pop's footsoldier, and God bless him and anybody else who has the means and opportunity to determine his own destiny.

TheHartBreakKid · Post #46 » by **TheHartBreakKid** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:39 pm

stan francisco wrote:I'm not giving up anything for Leonard until I see him dominate again as he did pre injury. Not buying in blindly, definitely not giving up Ingram without knowing what for.

Yeah.....you can't give up an asset as valuable as Ingram for Kawhi when his situation is so uncertain. But the Spurs also won't trade Kawhi for Ingram if he's back and doing his thing, unless the relationship is really that damaged and he asks out. Either way, such a trade won't happen on draft day. The Lakers simply won't do that trade until after free agency regardless of Kawhi status, and they would be idiotic to do it before seeing him return. And a physical isn't enough....he could always pass a physical but simply not be the same player when it comes to in game competition. I give this no chance of happening in the next offseason.

If Kawhi is to be a Laker, it'll happen after he returns next year and proves himself to still be an allstar level player. At that point, IF and only IF the relationship with the Spurs is damaged and irreperable and he demands a trade, I think you would see the Lakers pursue him, and even then, our offer is more likely to start with a resigned Randle rather than Ingram. If we have a max spot ready for Kawhi in that scenario, we really have no incentive to part with Ingram for a guy who is about to be a free agent and clearly upset in his situation (a lot of assumptions being made of course).

TheHartBreakKid · Post #47 » by **TheHartBreakKid** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 6:45 pm

Also, like I said, I see the Kawhi situation playing in a way that makes a trade extremely unlikely this summer, and by the time a trade is actually reasonably possible, (lets say next december after seeing a couple of months of Kawhi play), we easily could be talking about an Ingram who is averaging 20/5/5 on a team on pace to make the playoffs, and I think at that point, even the biggest supporters of this move would agree that Ingram is untouchable for someone like Kawhi.

danfantastk32 · Post #48 » by **danfantastk32** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:51 pm

I also don't wanna do this trade just to get Kawhi. Whats the point? He's gonna be past it right around the time our guys are peaking.

IF.....big if. IF we sign Randle, and then that forces PG and Lebron to take a cut, I could agree to a trade for Kawhi....but it would have to include Deng. Deng, Kuz, Ingram, and our Cle-pick.

I think the Spurs do this. They are stacking old-guys around Kawhi. If he leaves, they just blow it up. Time to rebuild. Ingram, Kuz, and a first round pick go a long way in doing that. They won't be contending for a bit, so Deng's contract doesn't affect some time-line.

This would free up enough salary on the Lakers to give everyone the $$$ they so desperately desire. With PG13, Lebron, and Kawhi...you have to honestly wonder how much time Ingram and Kuz would get. It makes sense. We prob get Lopez back for midlevel exemption, after he takes a look at that roster.

Ball, PG, Kawhi, Lebron, Lopez..with Randle playing 5 and 4, and Hart. Quite a squad. Built to win now. <------still wouldn't do it if I don't see Kawhi play. And def wouldn't do it unless Lebron and PG were committing.

kobe_vs_jordan · Post #49 » by **kobe_vs_jordan** » Fri Mar 30, 2018 9:56 pm

I love Brandon Ingram as a prospect but I would send him plus Deng and filler for Kawhi in a heartbeat. Even with injury, Kawhi was impact player by all metrics in his limited time this season. Not like Kawhi was playing hurt and looking like a shell of himself.

NPZ · Post #50 » by **NPZ** » Sat Mar 31, 2018 1:23 pm

briansaddleback wrote:Trade Ingram?

Get the rope

Watch on YouTube

Post #51 » by **milesfides** » Sat Mar 31, 2018 6:41 pm

danfantastk32 wrote:I also don't wanna do this trade just to get Kawhi. Whats the point? He's gonna be past it right around the time our guys are peaking.

And when our guys peak, what does that mean? The young core of the 76ers, Celtics, Timberwolves, Jazz, and even the Nuggets have clearly or arguably outplayed ours.

You only win the championships with MVP's, and really, nobody on our team has shown that kind of talent yet. If you're able to get Kawhi, you do it, then the timeline simply advances. You don't want to gut the roster, but let's not get it backwards.

Beethoven · Post #52 » by **Beethoven** » Sat Mar 31, 2018 7:09 pm

NPZ wrote:
briansaddleback wrote:Trade Ingram?

Get the rope

Watch on YouTube

HAHA! I knew someone would finally know!

:fistbump:

danfantastk32 · Post #53 » by **danfantastk32** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 4:09 am

milesfides wrote: And when our guys peak, what does that mean? The young core of the 76ers, Celtics, Timberwolves, Jazz, and even the Nuggets have clearly or arguably outplayed ours.

I'd argue all those teams you've just mentioned have a year or two on us. I don't know the Celtics belong in that list, btw. It's hard to say exactly what our ceiling is...but we're def a bit younger than those other teams you mentioned (NBA years).

milesfides wrote:You only win the championships with MVP's, and really, nobody on our team has shown that kind of talent yet. If you're able to get Kawhi, you do it, then the timeline simply advances. You don't want to gut the roster, but let's not get it backwards.

I hear it. It's hard to argue with getting a talent like Kawhi. I just don't know what Kawhi by himself is supposed to do for us. We're slightly better than Portland?

Like I said....I'd make the trade if we completely abandoned the youth, and went Big-Three. But by itself, I think our long plan looks better with Ingram.

Post #54 » by **milesfides** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 5:00 am

Kawhi is both an MVP and DOPY candidate. Can’t stress that enough. Portland doesn’t have anybody like that. The closest comparison would be Lebron (in the past) or Anthony Davis (now).

No player by himself can win anything. But you look at the common denominator. The team with the best players win. Again and again. Surefire hall of famers. Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Lebron, etc. there’s a reason why they win multiple championships, while everybody else loses.

If you start thinking, “well, we can’t get Kevin Durant, but we’ll get Paul George” you already lost the championship. George needs to be your 2nd or even 3rd best player.

Well, “Durant is getting older,” doesn’t mean anything either. So much elite young talent right now. Anthony Davis just turned 25 a few weeks ago. Embiid 24. Giannis 23. Towns 22. Simmons 21. And every other year, the league gets some exceptional talent.

If we can’t get Kawhi or Anthony Davis, then we need to pivot and keep tanking all the way until we get the very best talent, or our own guys take a very big jump.

Re-signing Randle, Lopez, etc...sorry that’s not going to win you anything. Getting Kawhi with capspace is everything, because these guys themselves know it better than anybody else, which is why top players have been jumping ship to team up.

MachoMan · Post #55 » by **MachoMan** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 5:39 pm

things looking rough for San Antonio and Kawhi.....Rob needs to be on the phone trying to bring Kawhi and "his group" to LA! I move/offer anything on the roster for Kawhi. Kawhi on roster spikes odds that Lebron & PG-13 come to LA this summer.....which spikes the odds that the Lakers are in the Finals next season.

Revived · Post #56 » by **Revived** » Tue Apr 3, 2018 1:31 am

Themaster007_v2 wrote:If you were to ask me this before Kawhi's injury, absolutely. However, you don't see many great players bounce back to their old form (Russ was probably the last person that came back from a serious injury that didn't lose a step). I've seen it way too often than not for players to recover to their old form. What makes it tough is the fact that he's going to demand a max deal and I'm not quite sure if his body will handle the style of play the Lakers have been pushing for.

Love, George, Kyrie, etc all looked the same after returning from injuries.

Revived · Post #57 » by **Revived** » Tue Apr 3, 2018 1:32 am

PKABOOICU wrote:There are only about 5 guys ins the League I'd trade Ingram for. Giannis, Towns, Embiid, Simmons, Porzingis. Thats it.

Come on man, really?

Replace that with Anthony Davis and it’s much better.

Themaster007_v2 · Post #58 » by **Themaster007_v2** » Tue Apr 3, 2018 2:38 am

Revived wrote:
Themaster007_v2 wrote:If you were to ask me this before Kawhi's injury, absolutely. However, you don't see many great players bounce back to their old form (Russ was probably the last person that came back from a serious injury that didn't lose a step). I've seen it way too often than not for players to recover to their old form. What makes it tough is the fact that he's going to demand a max deal and I'm not quite sure if his body will handle the style of play the Lakers have been pushing for.

Love, George, Kyrie, etc all looked the same after returning from injuries.

The thing that worries me about Kwahi is the fact that he's had multiple setback in his recovery. He's been out for practically the entire year and I have read on 2-3 occasions during the process that he has had some issues. You don't hear these reports from Hayward or Boogie in regards to progress. I just worry that the injury will turn him into Grant Hill/Derrick Rose where the body just won't cooperate.

Post #59 » by **Kilroy** » Tue Apr 3, 2018 3:32 am

Revived wrote:
PKABOOICU wrote:There are only about 5 guys ins the League I'd trade Ingram for. Giannis, Towns, Embiid, Simmons, Porzingis. Thats it.

Come on man, really?

Replace that with Anthony Davis and it’s much better.

Wouldn't trade ingram for Towns Embiid or Zinger right now either... Just Giannis and Davis... Towns has all the talent in the world but looks like he's lacking the coordination to take it to the next level... If he does he'll be a top 5 big in the NBA, but he's not there yet... Zinger has been exposed, and Embiid's great right now, but he's as fragile as a Ferrari on a Faberge Egg...

Ingram's just starting to scratch his potential. Give him another year and then talk about trading him.

danfantastk32 · Post #60 » by **danfantastk32** » Tue Apr 3, 2018 5:09 am

milesfides wrote:Kawhi is both an MVP and DOPY candidate. Can’t stress that enough. Portland doesn’t have anybody like that. The closest comparison would be Lebron (in the past) or Anthony Davis (now).

No player by himself can win anything. But you look at the common denominator. The team with the best players win. Again and again. Surefire hall of famers. Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Lebron, etc. there’s a reason why they win multiple championships, while everybody else loses.

If you start thinking, “well, we can’t get Kevin Durant, but we’ll get Paul George” you already lost the championship. George needs to be your 2nd or even 3rd best player.

Well, “Durant is getting older,” doesn’t mean anything either. So much elite young talent right now. Anthony Davis just turned 25 a few weeks ago. Embiid 24. Giannis 23. Towns 22. Simmons 21. And every other year, the league gets some exceptional talent.

If we can’t get Kawhi or Anthony Davis, then we need to pivot and keep tanking all the way until we get the very best talent, or our own guys take a very big jump.

Re-signing Randle, Lopez, etc...sorry that’s not going to win you anything. Getting Kawhi with capspace is everything, because these guys themselves know it better than anybody else, which is why top players have been jumping ship to team up.

I get what your saying. I just think your underestimating Ingram.

I'll say it again: If you are gonna get Lebron and whoever....and we gotta trade Ingram for Kawhi to make it a 'three-headed monster" I can't complain with it. Your going all in to win now. Fair enough. I still want to know what the heck is going on with Kahwi before I make that trade personally...but if you don't, I won't hold it against you.

But if your gonna trade Ingram for Kawhi in a vacuum...no thanks. Kawhi does us little on his own. We're just a somewhat better team than we are now. The difference between PG and Kawhi....is we don't have to ship off Ingram for PG. He's just a pure addition.

Kawhi needs to be resigned next year. He's gonna want the max. So if you sign Kawhi...you gotta get all your eggs this offseason. Kawhi for Ingram needs to be the LAST move. Not the first, or second.