Caldwell-Pope signs with Lakers, 1 year $18 Million

[RingsDontLie]

Read the article I linked in my post a few comments ago.

Most didn't because you even prefaced by saying it was pointless:

I understand theres zero risk with KCP given he was signed on a 1 year deal, but before too much of the kool aid is drunk, I believe you guys need to read this:

And cherry picking a few months out of the year to push a narrative is going to do you any favors. The NBA season doesn't start in February and lasts only three months. Pope shot 35% from three for the entire season.

Dude I'm a pistons fan, I suffered through 4 seasons of his inconsistent play. There is multiple threads with countless pages on the pistons board where we have discussed KCP to death, and the best arguments any pro-KCP fan had was that he "tried hard" or "he's a competitor", you don't pay $20m per season to someone for simply trying.

I haven't cherry picked anything, KCP may have shot the league average 35% last season but he did it shooting under 35% for half the season which is a fact. The season isn't 3 months long no, but to ignore the second half and focus only on the first in grossly inaccurate and deceitful.

Read the article and then discuss because you clearly haven't watched many Piston games (not that I blame you we suck) and the article really does go over his greatest strengths and weaknesses. KCP is a guy that will get you 20 one night on decent efficiency and then shoot 1-9 the next 3, there's a reason many of us are happy he's gone which you will see this season.


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Maybe he'll improve with Ball and what we are doing in LA. We will see. I'm honestly not impressed with Pope either. But if he can defend well like everyone says that will be much needed on this team.

[mcscotty]

I see KCP as an opportunity. He was in a bad situation in Detroit playing along side Reggie Jackson on a team built around 2 old school big men. This is the fresh start KCP needs. He's got the tools to succeed and youth is on his side. No way we should have passed on him.

[milesfides]

It's an opportunity for him. How is it an opportunity for the Lakers?

It's just hilarious how earlier in the year, we used to have arguments about whether Paul George and Gordon Hayward were worthy free agents. I guess not, but let's max out KCP?

Let's say he plays well. Great, so he eats a chunk out of "sacred" cap space. Let's say we try to trade him. But he's expiring, so teams that like him will just wait till the summer without giving up anything. What's the alternative, we take back a longer, worse contract(s)?

Also, and most importantly, 30+ mpg takes away from Jordan Clarkson, whom we need to showcase. It also indirectly takes away from Deng (since Ingram will exclusively play SF), so forget about Deng even remotely experiencing a comeback year - he won't have the chance. Not behind Ingram and Randle/Nance/Kuzma.

So we depreciate our assets that we need to assess or move in Deng, Clarkson, Randle.

It was just a dumb move. There's hardly a winning scenario with KCP, unless he becomes a manna-from-heaven superstar who takes our max. Good luck.

[TyCobb]

Hayward was your pipe dream, everyone grounded knew he was going to the Celtics. George wasn't a free agent. KCP...was luck. It was perfect scenario. Two open FA slots with the cap room from this and the Lopez trade and you have perfect setup heading into the following offseason.

Once Lonzo gets on the court it will be which two superstars are teaming up to play with him and Ingram all year while Golden State wins another one.

Relax.

[milesfides]

Gordon hayward ended up with the celtics, yeah, but pipe dream? He interviewed with other teams. We weren't among them. It's smug as hell to think everything pans out the way you think. Kevin Durant. Chris paul. Paul George. Jimmy butler. Now kyrie Irving. Demarcus Cousins. Etc. who called those moves? Who was right about those destinations?

What's annoying is the douche level of smugness around here after the fact. Amazing how so many people are right after the fact. Somebody gets one thing right and 100 things wrong? Enjoy your cookie. Nobody cares.

Paul George wasn't a free agent but he might as well have been. It was open range on this guy, and the Lakers/Magic messed it up.

And the Lakers have a perfect setup? What are you smoking in that pipe? Oh right, Pipe dream.

I'm perfectly relaxed, I just don't choose to be a homer and think that everything is going to be all right. I just call it as I see it. The front office made some mistakes, and KCP is one of them. Straight up.

[Sofa King]

Miles just rose his douche level up

[LAKESHOW]

Lonzo ball is the wildcard here. I truly believe in the description that he is a transformative player. He changes the whole atmosphere and demeanor of a team that he is on. He is not just a passer. But a willing passer. Everyone's awareness is up when on the break. Their eyes are looking. Their hands are ready. Their heads are turned. Zubac is an example. After dropping everything. After a few games, his game play turned up. Albeit slightly but it did. My only concern is injury. Youth and experience. But playing with this Jason kidd type player, will add to kcps game. I'm eager to see how much. We hit a home run with this draft.

[Marionettetc]

Pope has NBA level skill in shooting, ball handling and tenacity and competitiveness on defense.

Pope is not a shooter and his ball handling improved last season but it's far from being "NBA level", he will compete on defence every play though.

Read the article I linked in my post a few comments ago, he shows with statistics and even video breakdowns KCP's strengths and weaknesses.


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I think you might be overestimating how much our fan base is excited about the signing.

With the garbage fire we put on the court the last few years, I think we're mainly just relieved to have someone who will play basketball on a regular basis.

You mentioned in a later post you don't pay someone 20 million for just trying. Well, **** teams like the Lakers do

[Ball so hard]

Also, and most importantly, 30+ mpg takes away from Jordan Clarkson, whom we need to showcase. It also indirectly takes away from Deng (since Ingram will exclusively play SF), so forget about Deng even remotely experiencing a comeback year - he won't have the chance. Not behind Ingram and Randle/Nance/Kuzma.

Clarkson will still get his minutes; he'll likely get his minutes at the backup 2 and 1 spot. I don't think Ingram will play exclusively at the 3. At this point in time, almost no one plays exclusively at a given position. I could see Ingram playing 2-4. I don't see how KCP will affect Deng's minutes. The emergence of Kuzma complicates the Deng situation and not the addition of KCP. Minutes need to be divided among Ingram, Randle, Nance, Kuzma, and Deng. We could probably place Nance primarily as Lopez's backup. We now have 4 players competing for minutes; 2 of these players (Ingram and Randle) will play at least 30 min. Approximately 36 min--likely to be less as Ingram will probably play more than 30 min--would be left for Kuzma and Deng. As it currently stands, it really comes down to whether or not we should bench Kuzma in favor of showcasing Deng. Alternatively, we could attempt to trade Randle or Deng, preferably both.

So we depreciate our assets that we need to assess or move in Deng, Clarkson, Randle.

Deng is not an asset.

It was just a dumb move. There's hardly a winning scenario with KCP, unless he becomes a manna-from-heaven superstar who takes our max. Good luck.

It is merely dumb based on your flawed presupposition that KCP takes away minutes from Clarkson and Deng.

To name a few winning scenarios:
--KCP helps to minimize Lonzo's weakness on defense.
--An old adage (defense is contagious) - KCP's tenacity on defense should rub off on the young players (Clarkson included).
--We become a more competitive team with KCP as opposed to playing Clarkson and Deng big minutes.

[Mirjalovic]

how the **** KCP is a mistake when he's young and its only 1 year contract.

[dockingsched]

Gordon hayward ended up with the celtics, yeah, but pipe dream? He interviewed with other teams. We weren't among them. It's smug as hell to think everything pans out the way you think. Kevin Durant. Chris paul. Paul George. Jimmy butler. Now kyrie Irving. Demarcus Cousins. Etc. who called those moves? Who was right about those destinations?

the only free agent in your examples is Kevin Durant, its like you went out of your way to ignore this to make your post seem on point. For KD, everyone said that if he left OKC it would be for GSW. Woj even wrote an article saying as such months ahead of the decision. Everyone called that move.

What's annoying is the douche level of smugness around here after the fact. Amazing how so many people are right after the fact. Somebody gets one thing right and 100 things wrong? Enjoy your cookie. Nobody cares.

you're right, nobody cares, it was the worst kept secret all year. anyone paying attention knew that Boston was Hayward's most likely destination if he left Utah. Didn't take any special insight or analysis to conclude the lakers weren't anywhere in the picture.

Paul George wasn't a free agent but he might as well have been. It was open range on this guy, and the Lakers/Magic messed it up.

what does this even mean? Are we supposed to pretend that Kevin Pritchard wasn't in full control of George's desitnation? reports just came out that the cavs had a deal in place that Pritchard backed out of at the last second cause he wasn't getting the type of picks he ultimately wanted. Pritchard was always the one going to decide where George went, so how that makes it like if he's a free agent is confusing.

And the Lakers have a perfect setup? What are you smoking in that pipe? Oh right, Pipe dream.

I'm perfectly relaxed, I just don't choose to be a homer and think that everything is going to be all right. I just call it as I see it. The front office made some mistakes,

agreed, to me nothing has really changed with Magic/Pelinka. Still conserving cap space for the big free agent splash, its the same gmae plan.

and KCP is one of them. Straight up.

i guess this is the next argument you're going to take up and argue to death?

[mcscotty]

It's an opportunity for him. How is it an opportunity for the Lakers?

It's just hilarious how earlier in the year, we used to have arguments about whether Paul George and Gordon Hayward were worthy free agents. I guess not, but let's max out KCP?

Let's say he plays well. Great, so he eats a chunk out of "sacred" cap space. Let's say we try to trade him. But he's expiring, so teams that like him will just wait till the summer without giving up anything. What's the alternative, we take back a longer, worse contract(s)?

Also, and most importantly, 30+ mpg takes away from Jordan Clarkson, whom we need to showcase. It also indirectly takes away from Deng (since Ingram will exclusively play SF), so forget about Deng even remotely experiencing a comeback year - he won't have the chance. Not behind Ingram and Randle/Nance/Kuzma.

So we depreciate our assets that we need to assess or move in Deng, Clarkson, Randle.

It was just a dumb move. There's hardly a winning scenario with KCP, unless he becomes a manna-from-heaven superstar who takes our max. Good luck.

There are countless examples of players that have changed teams and turned around their careers. Who knew Nash was going to be the player he was when he went back to Phoenix? Who new IT was going to turn into a superstar in Boston? Are we just supposed to sit around with our thumbs up our butts waiting for the next Kareem, Chamberlain or Shaq. Might never happen. Even if it does, it might not work out. Building a team involves some skill and a lot of luck. You never truly know if things are going to work, but you're not getting anywhere unless you try. You're probably right in your assessment of KCP...... but you could be wrong. At least we've got a chance to see if it works. As for money, we'll cross that bridge when we get there. Don't know if you've noticed, but most teams are tapped out ATM.

[mcscotty]

Nothing is a sure thing. Not Lonzo... not Ingram... certainly not 2018. Consider KCP not only as an opportunity, but also diversification. He could very well be an important piece of a team in 2020 that's tearing it up in the west.

[milesfides]

There are countless examples of players that have changed teams and turned around their careers. Who knew Nash was going to be the player he was when he went back to Phoenix? Who new IT was going to turn into a superstar in Boston? Are we just supposed to sit around with our thumbs up our butts waiting for the next Kareem, Chamberlain or Shaq. Might never happen. Even if it does, it might not work out. Building a team involves some skill and a lot of luck. You never truly know if things are going to work, but you're not getting anywhere unless you try. You're probably right in your assessment of KCP...... but you could be wrong. At least we've got a chance to see if it works. As for money, we'll cross that bridge when we get there. Don't know if you've noticed, but most teams are tapped out ATM.

Sure, but you're gambling on what... four straight years of mediocrity from KCP?

Suddenly in his fifth year he takes the leap? That's the calculated risk Rob and Magic want to take, against all the substantial aforementioned downsides of signing him? Rob Pelinka would turn down Paul George, Russell Westbrook, or Lebron, for a good contract year out of KCP?

The Lakers cannot land two max free agents without renouncing KCP and Brook Lopez, among other necessary moves, such as moving both Randle and Clarkson or Deng.

If the Lakers were really committed to opening up two max slots, then their priority should be showcasing Randle, Clarkson, and Deng, not depreciating their value. The KCP hurts that key intermediate step. It's self-defeating. It's lose-lose. Even if he plays well, the upside is we're stuck with the bill. Again, there's no winning scenario with KCP.

[BeanBurrito]

Spoiler:

There are countless examples of players that have changed teams and turned around their careers. Who knew Nash was going to be the player he was when he went back to Phoenix? Who new IT was going to turn into a superstar in Boston? Are we just supposed to sit around with our thumbs up our butts waiting for the next Kareem, Chamberlain or Shaq. Might never happen. Even if it does, it might not work out. Building a team involves some skill and a lot of luck. You never truly know if things are going to work, but you're not getting anywhere unless you try. You're probably right in your assessment of KCP...... but you could be wrong. At least we've got a chance to see if it works. As for money, we'll cross that bridge when we get there. Don't know if you've noticed, but most teams are tapped out ATM.

Sure, but you're gambling on what... four straight years of mediocrity from KCP?

Suddenly in his fifth year he takes the leap? That's the calculated risk Rob and Magic want to take, against all the substantial aforementioned downsides of signing him? Rob Pelinka would turn down Paul George, Russell Westbrook, or Lebron, for a good contract year out of KCP?

The Lakers cannot land two max free agents without renouncing KCP and Brook Lopez, among other necessary moves, such as moving both Randle and Clarkson or Deng.

If the Lakers were really committed to opening up two max slots, then their priority should be showcasing Randle, Clarkson, and Deng, not depreciating their value. The KCP hurts that key intermediate step. It's self-defeating. It's lose-lose. Even if he plays well, the upside is we're stuck with the bill. Again, there's no winning scenario with KCP.

Randle and Deng don't even play the same position as KCP so that's a moot point. Up until the Ennis signing last week, we still needed another point-guard, even with Clarkson being able to take some minutes there. Clarkson is one of the worst defenders in the league and you want him to be a starter and have to take on the best guard of the other team on a nightly basis? How is that showcasing him? Let him go up against other backups preferably where he can do his thing and look better than he would have.

It's not lose-lose. We are stuck with the bill for one year, how is that lose-lose. If the Lakers are trading stuff this year, it's for expiring contracts more than likely. Well that is what they have here with KCP (which is why I don't think they would trade him), so it's more like a win-win. If he plays well this year and Rob/magic want to sign him over the cap if he fits next year's team then it is gravy.

[mcscotty]

There are countless examples of players that have changed teams and turned around their careers. Who knew Nash was going to be the player he was when he went back to Phoenix? Who new IT was going to turn into a superstar in Boston? Are we just supposed to sit around with our thumbs up our butts waiting for the next Kareem, Chamberlain or Shaq. Might never happen. Even if it does, it might not work out. Building a team involves some skill and a lot of luck. You never truly know if things are going to work, but you're not getting anywhere unless you try. You're probably right in your assessment of KCP...... but you could be wrong. At least we've got a chance to see if it works. As for money, we'll cross that bridge when we get there. Don't know if you've noticed, but most teams are tapped out ATM.

Sure, but you're gambling on what... four straight years of mediocrity from KCP?

Suddenly in his fifth year he takes the leap? That's the calculated risk the Lakers want to take, against all the substantial aforementioned downsides of signing him? You would turn down Paul George, Russell Westbrook, or Lebron, for a good contract year out of KCP?

The Lakers cannot land two max free agents without renouncing KCP and Brook Lopez, among other moves they have to make, such as moving both Randle and Clarkson or Deng.

If the Lakers were really committed to opening up two max slots, then their priority should be showcasing Randle, Clarkson, and Deng, not depreciating their value. The KCP hurts that key intermediate step.

Personally, I don't buy into this 2018 business. Unless Lonzo does indeed become Jason Kidd next season and Ingram becomes Durant, there are no two free agents gonna get us into the finals. We should be looking further down the horizon. Magic setting this date is almost akin to Jimmy's timeline of getting into the WCF within 2 years. Painting himself into a corner with unreasonable expectations. Personally, I'd be moving things a little slower and picking up smaller pieces along the way. We haven't really got a lot going for us as a franchise. But time is on our side, and we should be using it wisely.

[LAKESHOW]

We need not just talented. But motivated players. Can't say about George. He's been back east all these years. Well see this year. Bron? He's won in his hometown. Doesn't need anymore. The one free agent I know is truly motivated to a very high level. Westbrook. Cast aside and left behind. Pointed as the reason Durant could not win. Stuck with cheap ownership, trying their best to hold on with everyone gone. Ringless. Playing next to ball would supercharge his game. And all we need to do is point him at Kevin Durant, and the big dawg will attack. We must be pointed at the warriors. That is our mission. They should be the Goliath with whom we aim and focus our guns. A combo of free agents with Westbrook should be able to do it. And since he hasn't re signed with the thunder. That is telling indeed that money is not his #1 motivation.

[Jack Bauer]

Very underwhelmed with KCP.

Clarkson has been outplaying him in limited minutes.

[gts1]

Very underwhelmed with KCP.

Clarkson has been outplaying him in limited minutes.

We'll see... so far just looks like a waste of money and a roster spot. at least it's only one year

[Nightwing]

everybody is trashing ingram but no one bats an eye on kcp doesn't even worth 17 million to me.