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Confirmed: Frank Vogel has agreed to deal to become new head coach, Kidd will be assistant

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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways 

Post#61 » by Landsberger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:16 am

Hangman_52 wrote:Lakers are so stupid. Bring in players who totally don't fit the system that Walton coaches. Had the team rolling until lots of injuries took over the team. Then blame him for their own mistakes. Get rid of the whole front office. They are pure ****


Not sure I follow. Coaches.... good ones anyway, coach the players they have around the skillsets they have. You put your players in the best position to succeed. Not just sit back and wait for the FO to get the exact players you have to have to succeed. That's completely backwards. Pop changed his entire offensive and defensive schemes many times based on the players. The triangle was modified differently for Kobe/Shaq than it was for Pau/Kobe/Lamar and on and on.

Luke was hired at a time when we couldn't hire much of anyone. We had no true path to the playoffs then and it was a different front office. Not surprising he's leaving quite frankly. I wish him good luck in Sac but this team has a very narrow window to succeed and he just isn't the guy to take a team deep in the playoffs IMHO. The decision was made to roll the dice and go for it with vets in a short timeframe. Like it or not it's about LeBron and who ever we get in the offseason more than it is about the guys we have now. Not sure I like it (I have been giving it until this offseason) but it is what it is.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#62 » by myersia » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:17 am

Alright guys maybe we should we think Lue...this article kind of made me think of him different http://www.espn.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/18318471/the-unique-dynamic-lebron-james-cavs-coach-tyronn-lue


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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways 

Post#63 » by Kilroy » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:18 am

Landsberger wrote:
Hangman_52 wrote:Lakers are so stupid. Bring in players who totally don't fit the system that Walton coaches. Had the team rolling until lots of injuries took over the team. Then blame him for their own mistakes. Get rid of the whole front office. They are pure ****


Not sure I follow. Coaches.... good ones anyway, coach the players they have around the skillsets they have. You put your players in the best position to succeed. Not just sit back and wait for the FO to get the exact players you have to have to succeed. That's completely backwards. Pop changed his entire offensive and defensive schemes many times based on the players. The triangle was modified differently for Kobe/Shaq than it was for Pau/Kobe/Lamar and on and on.

Luke was hired at a time when we couldn't hire much of anyone. We had no true path to the playoffs then and it was a different front office. Not surprising he's leaving quite frankly. I wish him good luck in Sac but this team has a very narrow window to succeed and he just isn't the guy to take a team deep in the playoffs IMHO. The decision was made to roll the dice and go for it with vets in a short timeframe. Like it or not it's about LeBron and who ever we get in the offseason more than it is about the guys we have now. Not sure I like it (I have been giving it until this offseason) but it is what it is.


I think you conveniently ignored the Phil Jackson era...
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways 

Post#64 » by Landsberger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:25 am

Pythagoras wrote:
tamaraw08 wrote:
Pythagoras wrote:If we replace Luke with Lue I’m going to vomit.


Would you please enlighten me on why you hate Lue?
Pls be specific about the coaching moves that he made that made you sick. thank you


Cleveland was an abysmal defensive team during his entire tenure. Lakers have been far better defensively under Luke. Then there is also the issue that he played LeBron a gazillion minutes at age 32 and 33. And Cleveland looked completely inept when LeBron wasn’t on the court. LeBron is not the player he was in Cle. I have severe doubts he has the ability to competently coach when he doesn’t have an historically dominant James carrying him.


You seem to be of the mind that coaches are rigid and do not adjust to their personnel. Luke was in many ways but he was showing a little movement however it was obvious to me he was pretty far from being able to navigate a playoff series. I think he will be fine elsewhere but if all he's got in the GS offense then he will not. That system is unique to that group of personnel and will not drive another group to their success based just on the system.

To the specifics of your post about defense, offense and minutes etc. Don't you think that Lue was reacting to his personnel? Those last couple of years it was an injury fest there with a very limited bench. Clowns like JR were involved too.

I'm not advocating for Lue to be sure but I wouldn't think he's a step backwards either.

What we need is an experienced coach who's run many different offenses and defenses IMHO.... not one who's had success in just one. Our personnel will be unique to us and we need a coach that can maximize that over installing someone else's successful system based on their personnel.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#65 » by zimpy27 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:29 am

The hate for Lue seems to be purely because it aligns with LeBron. He is not a bad coach.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#66 » by Danny Darko » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:30 am

zimpy27 wrote:The hate for Lue seems to be purely because it aligns with LeBron. He is not a bad coach.


Do explain that in depth please.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#67 » by Michael Lucky » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:33 am

zimpy27 wrote:The hate for Lue seems to be purely because it aligns with LeBron. He is not a bad coach.

Sorry but simply having lebron run point and have everyone else stand along the perimeter doesnt make you a good coach. And yes that is how it was for the majority of Cavs games.

I have no idea what kind of cosch Lue would be simply because he has never been allowed to coach. That isnt going to change now.

I'll pass....
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#68 » by Kilroy » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:35 am

zimpy27 wrote:The hate for Lue seems to be purely because it aligns with LeBron. He is not a bad coach.


He's not a terribly good one either though... If Luke was firable... What is Lue?

But yeah, not going to lie... The idea that my Lakers are becoming no more than Cavs West doesn't really sit too well with me...

Like I said, I thought we were better than that... It makes me question how much LeBron really gives a **** about this organization...

Is it all just about aligning his legacy with the guys he wants to statistically best?

It also makes you think that teams don't really matter a whole lot... If LeBron can come in and remake the Lakers of all teams, into a clone of his other teams, then maybe being fans of a team rather than certain players, is just outdated...
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways 

Post#69 » by Landsberger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:37 am

Kilroy wrote:
Landsberger wrote:
Hangman_52 wrote:Lakers are so stupid. Bring in players who totally don't fit the system that Walton coaches. Had the team rolling until lots of injuries took over the team. Then blame him for their own mistakes. Get rid of the whole front office. They are pure ****


Not sure I follow. Coaches.... good ones anyway, coach the players they have around the skillsets they have. You put your players in the best position to succeed. Not just sit back and wait for the FO to get the exact players you have to have to succeed. That's completely backwards. Pop changed his entire offensive and defensive schemes many times based on the players. The triangle was modified differently for Kobe/Shaq than it was for Pau/Kobe/Lamar and on and on.

Luke was hired at a time when we couldn't hire much of anyone. We had no true path to the playoffs then and it was a different front office. Not surprising he's leaving quite frankly. I wish him good luck in Sac but this team has a very narrow window to succeed and he just isn't the guy to take a team deep in the playoffs IMHO. The decision was made to roll the dice and go for it with vets in a short timeframe. Like it or not it's about LeBron and who ever we get in the offseason more than it is about the guys we have now. Not sure I like it (I have been giving it until this offseason) but it is what it is.


I think you conveniently ignored the Phil Jackson era...


Not at all. I noted the Triangle above.

You think the Triangle was rigidly followed in the 2 Chicago 3peats?..... in the 2 Laker runs? It was a framework but the execution was changed multiple times for Shaq, Kobe, Jordan, Pippen, Odom and Pau. In fact I'd say that the Triangle was altered almost completely away from it's true form for Kobe in the last 2 chips. Phil altered the defenses as well. This is specifically what we didn't see from Luke.

During the era we had 2 dominant players here at all times. The times we didn't Phil was on sabbatical ironically (or maybe not). Point being we filled in with compliant players with vet minimum contracts. This group was assembled with ping pong balls and moves to undo other moves that were severely limiting(Mozgov). You don't have the luxury of picking and choosing in those situations compared to having two superstars and a team in the top 2-3. You have to move the system to the talent and Luke seemed to have issues with that.

None of this is to say that we don't just repeat this again with a coach LeBron likes. I was just addressing the idea that Luke's so called failure was do solely to the FO not getting GS clone talent in here. It's just a little more complicated than that and our FO complicates it even more.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#70 » by Michael Lucky » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:38 am

Kilroy wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:The hate for Lue seems to be purely because it aligns with LeBron. He is not a bad coach.


He's not a terribly good one either though... If Luke was firable... What is Lue?

But yeah, not going to lie... The idea that my Lakers are becoming no more than Cavs West doesn't really sit too well with me...

Like I said, I thought we were better than that... It makes me question how much LeBron really gives a **** about this organization...

Is it all just about aligning his legacy with the guys he wants to statistically best?

It also makes you think that teams don't really matter a whole lot... If LeBron can come in and remake the Lakers of all teams, into a clone of his other teams, then maybe being fans of a team rather than certain players, is just outdated...

Not to mention Lue is going to implement the same system with a Lebron out of his prime. How is that the answer to anything?
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#71 » by dockingsched » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:46 am

In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#72 » by BoogieTime » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:03 am

I thought you guys would save us from ourselves
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#73 » by Michael Lucky » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:15 am

dockingsched wrote:In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?

No one is arguing this. Our roster isnt at all fit for that system and that is a major problem when hiring a coach who has done it that way only, even if justified.

The firing of Luke was pointless. The good coaches have jobs in the league and arent available.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#74 » by dockingsched » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:20 am

Michael Lucky wrote:
dockingsched wrote:In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?

No one is arguing this. Our roster isnt at all fit for that system and that is a major problem when hiring a coach who has done it that way only, even if justified.


The problem with your argument, or at least how you’re arguing, is that your mixing up someone who hasn’t proven themselves with a different style vs someone unwilling to use a different style. I don’t believe there’s any evidence to suggest Lue would insist on the same style, which your previous posts claim without any basis.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#75 » by Kilroy » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:21 am

Michael Lucky wrote:
dockingsched wrote:In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?

No one is arguing this. Our roster isnt at all fit for that system and that is a major problem when hiring a coach who has done it that way only, even if justified.

The firing of Luke was pointless. The good coaches have jobs in the league and arent available.


Well for clarity sake, it's sounding more like Luke wanted out more than got fired... That said, he should have never gotten the heat he did this season...
It just made no logical sense for his job to be on the line when the team was over-achieving for much of the season...
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#76 » by Landsberger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:33 am

Kilroy wrote:
Michael Lucky wrote:
dockingsched wrote:In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?

No one is arguing this. Our roster isnt at all fit for that system and that is a major problem when hiring a coach who has done it that way only, even if justified.

The firing of Luke was pointless. The good coaches have jobs in the league and arent available.


Well for clarity sake, it's sounding more like Luke wanted out more than got fired... That said, he should have never gotten the heat he did this season...
It just made no logical sense for his job to be on the line when the team was over-achieving for much of the season...


From what I'm seeing/reading it sounds like Luke wanted to know about an extension and his job security. When he didn't get the answer he wanted he wanted out. Thats' a little different. I could be missing the boat here but the posts about the meeting lead me to believe this was about extend me or someone else will.

As for his performance. I didn't see any growth in his approach or decisions in his tenure. Was he horrible? Not specifically, but he wasn't growing either.

This season we "overachieved" when we had Bron and "underachieved" when we didn't it seems. We got him back but the FO/Bron blew the team up mentally at the deadline.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#77 » by ScHoolBoy B » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:43 am

I swear to God if these idiots hire Lue...i may not watch next season at all.
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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching searchh 

Post#78 » by Pythagoras » Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:00 am

dockingsched wrote:In fairness to Lue, who I’m not a fan of...with how good Lebron was, the level and type of talent around him, and the success they had, is there even an argument that Lue should’ve coached that team any differently?


Running an iso heavy system around LeBron/Kyrie with shooters is not an issue. The issue is he had two other All Stars on the team yet the team looked completely lost whenever LeBron wasn’t on the floor. Additionally, LeBron led the league in MPG at age 32/33 both years. He’s not going to be able to ride a 35 year 38 min/night for 70+ games. And this doesn’t even address his defense being awful.
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Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#79 » by AmusingFiddle » Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:13 am

The GB is pathetic. Majority were bad mouthing Luke and the moment he leaves; the Laker FO is stupid for letting him go..TF

I know this looks bad with Magic quitting.

I have said this in another forum before; we are most probably signing a big time player this offseason. Unless something crazy happens, there is a superstar signing with us.

As for the Lakers POBO gig. It is undoubtedly the most coveted job in the league. A team with great young players, a top 3 player, and cap space. Who wouldn’t want that job.


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Re: Luke and Lakers part ways; Rob will lead coaching search 

Post#80 » by H00PDREAMS » Sat Apr 13, 2019 2:24 am

I think Kobe snatching the throne from Magic sounds more and more believable. No Lue though. Absolutely not.
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