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Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers

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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#41 » by Ball so hard » Fri Jan 3, 2020 4:54 pm

tamaraw08 wrote:
stan francisco wrote:
JVL wrote:
No way we can make FVV work. I just don't see how.

Obviously the better pick, but Collison is doable and I doubt he declined at all since last year.


No way, why? Stranger three team deals have happened around ASB in the past for an expiring rental like FVV. He thinks they will keep Lowry over him as they won’t be able to afford both. The question is, what can we do to make TOR happy?

KCP and Cook? Daniels? Who’s the third team and the player from a third team? I don’t know, because I’m not in the know of inside NBA GM rumors. Pelinka knows all the potential suitors.

THT stays.

Do it Pelinka.


Where did hear that FVV is thinking that Toronto will keep Lowry over him? Kyle is 33 years old, actually same age as Rondo and his 3 pt shot has been shaky esp in the playoffs all his career. He is also much more expensive and if they truly wants to keep him, they would have extended him for several years and not just for another season.
About Collison, I followed this guy's career since his early UCLA days. He is solid, not reckless, plays good defense and yes he is accurate from the 3pt line but my concern is that his release is not as smooth and the main reason he looks good % wise is that he is a VERY SELECTIVE shooter. He NEVER SHOT MORE THAN 4 3pt shots/game in his entire career of 708 games. He is also no longer that explosive as he barely attacks the rim when needed.


He made up the bolded part. Collison is probably better than any PG we have... can't be too picky here. If Collison wants to come here, we should do it in a heartbeat.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#42 » by Beethoven » Fri Jan 3, 2020 4:54 pm

lazybatman wrote:
Beethoven wrote:I don't know how much faith he has in his religion to keep him a man of integrity but I can see Ballmer offering him incentives and cash under the table to entice him to the hobos.


And what's stopping us from doing that for him and Grizzlies.

ok i just thought Ballmer had the money and would do it without giving i t a thought ..didnt know Jeanie had the same capacity
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#43 » by Ball so hard » Fri Jan 3, 2020 4:59 pm

lazybatman wrote:
Beethoven wrote:I don't know how much faith he has in his religion to keep him a man of integrity but I can see Ballmer offering him incentives and cash under the table to entice him to the hobos.


And what's stopping us from doing that for him and Grizzlies.


This sounds like conspiracy theory. There's zero proof that Ballmer has done any illegal under the table deal. It would also be quite stupid for us to engage in illegal activities just to acquire Andre freaking Igoudala. If you're going to attempt to cheat, at least make it worthwhile.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#44 » by Sedale Threatt » Fri Jan 3, 2020 8:51 pm

stan francisco wrote:No way, why?

stan francisco wrote:KCP and Cook? Daniels?


You just answered your own question.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#45 » by myersia » Fri Jan 3, 2020 10:39 pm

This should be an easy decision. He might not even start for clips
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#46 » by Landsberger » Sat Jan 4, 2020 1:19 am

If you look at what situations created Collison's stats that everyone is projecting verbatim here you'd understand that it was as the primary ball handler and in a fairly ball dominant role. Starting him relegates him to a floor spacer or it puts LeBron off the ball... which I would contend isn't happening. If we get him the perfect role for him would be as LeBron's primary relief off the bench.. a change of pace ball handler who can finish and shoot. Otherwise he's just another floor spacer.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#47 » by thebigbird » Sat Jan 4, 2020 2:54 pm

Landsberger wrote:If you look at what situations created Collison's stats that everyone is projecting verbatim here you'd understand that it was as the primary ball handler and in a fairly ball dominant role. Starting him relegates him to a floor spacer or it puts LeBron off the ball... which I would contend isn't happening. If we get him the perfect role for him would be as LeBron's primary relief off the bench.. a change of pace ball handler who can finish and shoot. Otherwise he's just another floor spacer.

In 2013/2014, Mario Chalmers averaged 66.1 touches per game, 4.25 seconds per touch, and 4.0 dribbles per touch. Last year in Indiana, 63.7 touches per game, 5.13 seconds per touch, and 4.7 dribbles per touch. If Mario Chalmers handled the ball that much starting with Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, and prime LeBron, Collison sill have no problem getting plenty of touches with old man LeBron and no other ball dominant wing in the starting lineup. The narrative that lebron turns everyone into "floor spacers" isn't accurate and needs to die.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#48 » by tamaraw08 » Sat Jan 4, 2020 8:41 pm

thebigbird wrote:
Landsberger wrote:If you look at what situations created Collison's stats that everyone is projecting verbatim here you'd understand that it was as the primary ball handler and in a fairly ball dominant role. Starting him relegates him to a floor spacer or it puts LeBron off the ball... which I would contend isn't happening. If we get him the perfect role for him would be as LeBron's primary relief off the bench.. a change of pace ball handler who can finish and shoot. Otherwise he's just another floor spacer.

In 2013/2014, Mario Chalmers averaged 66.1 touches per game, 4.25 seconds per touch, and 4.0 dribbles per touch. Last year in Indiana, 63.7 touches per game, 5.13 seconds per touch, and 4.7 dribbles per touch. If Mario Chalmers handled the ball that much starting with Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, and prime LeBron, Collison sill have no problem getting plenty of touches with old man LeBron and no other ball dominant wing in the starting lineup. The narrative that lebron turns everyone into "floor spacers" isn't accurate and needs to die.

Yes copying the successful formula formula in Miami would make sense but it seems like Lebron also has a personal agenda of leading the league in assists. Its working well against most average and good teams but the concern is if the team can sustain this for the next 60 games and if it would work against tougher defensive teams esp the Clippers.
The main question too is identifying the greatest need especially for the playoffs. Is it a starting backcourt partner or a bench playmaker who can create and generate points for this team when Lebron sits? Can Collison provide the former or the latter? Can he do both?
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#49 » by thebigbird » Sat Jan 4, 2020 10:27 pm

tamaraw08 wrote:
thebigbird wrote:
Landsberger wrote:If you look at what situations created Collison's stats that everyone is projecting verbatim here you'd understand that it was as the primary ball handler and in a fairly ball dominant role. Starting him relegates him to a floor spacer or it puts LeBron off the ball... which I would contend isn't happening. If we get him the perfect role for him would be as LeBron's primary relief off the bench.. a change of pace ball handler who can finish and shoot. Otherwise he's just another floor spacer.

In 2013/2014, Mario Chalmers averaged 66.1 touches per game, 4.25 seconds per touch, and 4.0 dribbles per touch. Last year in Indiana, 63.7 touches per game, 5.13 seconds per touch, and 4.7 dribbles per touch. If Mario Chalmers handled the ball that much starting with Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, and prime LeBron, Collison sill have no problem getting plenty of touches with old man LeBron and no other ball dominant wing in the starting lineup. The narrative that lebron turns everyone into "floor spacers" isn't accurate and needs to die.

Yes copying the successful formula formula in Miami would make sense but it seems like Lebron also has a personal agenda of leading the league in assists. Its working well against most average and good teams but the concern is if the team can sustain this for the next 60 games and if it would work against tougher defensive teams esp the Clippers.
The main question too is identifying the greatest need especially for the playoffs. Is it a starting backcourt partner or a bench playmaker who can create and generate points for this team when Lebron sits? Can Collison provide the former or the latter? Can he do both?

I'm pretty against point guard Lebron. I just don't like it. In the regular season it's fine because they'll be able to rack up wins against the bad and average teams, but when LeBron goes passive pass-first against the top teams we struggle. He has to be in attack mode come playoff time for the Lakers to go far.

I think Collison can do both. The last two playoffs with Indiana he averaged around 30 mpg. Lebron will probably play around 37-38 mpg. So even if Collison plays every single non-LeBron minute that's around 20 mpg with him where he can be the secondary ballhandler. The two big holes I see in the roster right now are a wing defender and a secondary ballhandler. If LA finds a way to get Collison and Iggy they'll be in business.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#50 » by Landsberger » Sat Jan 4, 2020 11:22 pm

If anyone thinks LeBron isn't going to initiate 90% of the time he's in the game they haven't been watching the last 8 years. On top of that to think that somehow Collison would be better at it in the playoffs is laughable. The thought that Bron goes passive against top teams ignores completely how many championship series he's been in (you have to play good teams to get to championships) and the kind of teams he's taken there in the past.

Hey... I could be wrong here. I'm sure there is some completely irrelevant advanced stat that will show that LeBron should be standing in the corner while Collison has the ball instead of him...
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#51 » by thebigbird » Sun Jan 5, 2020 1:31 am

Landsberger wrote:If anyone thinks LeBron isn't going to initiate 90% of the time he's in the game they haven't been watching the last 8 years. On top of that to think that somehow Collison would be better at it in the playoffs is laughable. The thought that Bron goes passive against top teams ignores completely how many championship series he's been in (you have to play good teams to get to championships) and the kind of teams he's taken there in the past.

Hey... I could be wrong here. I'm sure there is some completely irrelevant advanced stat that will show that LeBron should be standing in the corner while Collison has the ball instead of him...

I'm talking about how he's played against top teams this season. Obviously he hasn't been passive against top teams in the past. You don't make 8 straight finals by being passive. But this season he has been. He was passive in both Clipper games.

The only person talking about advanced stats is you. The idea behind playing Collison with LeBron isn't to keep him from initiating the offense. It's to get his game back to where it's been the past 8 seasons. He's controlling the ball a lot more than he has in the past, and it's because there isn't a secondary ballhandler for him to play with. I know you don't like me, but I imagine I've watched more Lebron over the past 5 years than anyone else on this subforum. He is handling the ball too much. He is going to get worn out doing this at 35 years of age. Also, he doesn't have a great handle so you don't want him bringing it up every possession in the playoffs. All you need is someone to bring the ball up the court and at least be a playmaking threat. They don't have that in Bradley/Green.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#52 » by Landsberger » Sun Jan 5, 2020 1:49 am

I wish the "ignore" feature on this forum included when someone else responds to someone on your "ignore" list. :lol:
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#53 » by Dr Aki » Mon Jan 6, 2020 2:20 am

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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#54 » by kblo247 » Mon Jan 6, 2020 2:50 am

Makes sense because they know DJ is in basketball shape and he’s okay with starting or coming off a bench.

I would gladly give up Bradley for him or Cook
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#55 » by lazybatman » Wed Jan 8, 2020 11:48 pm

Ball so hard wrote:
lazybatman wrote:
Beethoven wrote:I don't know how much faith he has in his religion to keep him a man of integrity but I can see Ballmer offering him incentives and cash under the table to entice him to the hobos.


And what's stopping us from doing that for him and Grizzlies.


This sounds like conspiracy theory. There's zero proof that Ballmer has done any illegal under the table deal. It would also be quite stupid for us to engage in illegal activities just to acquire Andre freaking Igoudala. If you're going to attempt to cheat, at least make it worthwhile.


Proof : Lou Williams, 4 times rookie of the year, on an 8 mil contract. We got KCP @ 7 mil, and Danny Green @ 15 mil, and nobody's saying either is overpaid.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#56 » by dAdo dA dEvil » Thu Jan 9, 2020 4:39 am

lazybatman wrote:
Ball so hard wrote:
lazybatman wrote:
And what's stopping us from doing that for him and Grizzlies.


This sounds like conspiracy theory. There's zero proof that Ballmer has done any illegal under the table deal. It would also be quite stupid for us to engage in illegal activities just to acquire Andre freaking Igoudala. If you're going to attempt to cheat, at least make it worthwhile.


Proof : Lou Williams, 4 times rookie of the year, on an 8 mil contract. We got KCP @ 7 mil, and Danny Green @ 15 mil, and nobody's saying either is overpaid.


So Lou Williams is a rookie for 4 years? Sound like a conspiracy theory then. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#57 » by lazybatman » Sat Jan 11, 2020 7:41 pm

dAdo dA dEvil wrote:
lazybatman wrote:
Ball so hard wrote:
This sounds like conspiracy theory. There's zero proof that Ballmer has done any illegal under the table deal. It would also be quite stupid for us to engage in illegal activities just to acquire Andre freaking Igoudala. If you're going to attempt to cheat, at least make it worthwhile.


Proof : Lou Williams, 4 times rookie of the year, on an 8 mil contract. We got KCP @ 7 mil, and Danny Green @ 15 mil, and nobody's saying either is overpaid.


So Lou Williams is a rookie for 4 years? Sound like a conspiracy theory then. :lol: :lol: :lol:


6th man - 3 times. You get the point.
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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#58 » by stan francisco » Mon Jan 13, 2020 12:32 pm

tamaraw08 wrote:
stan francisco wrote:
JVL wrote:
No way we can make FVV work. I just don't see how.

Obviously the better pick, but Collison is doable and I doubt he declined at all since last year.


No way, why? Stranger three team deals have happened around ASB in the past for an expiring rental like FVV. He thinks they will keep Lowry over him as they won’t be able to afford both. The question is, what can we do to make TOR happy?

KCP and Cook? Daniels? Who’s the third team and the player from a third team? I don’t know, because I’m not in the know of inside NBA GM rumors. Pelinka knows all the potential suitors.

THT stays.

Do it Pelinka.


Where did hear that FVV is thinking that Toronto will keep Lowry over him? Kyle is 33 years old, actually same age as Rondo and his 3 pt shot has been shaky esp in the playoffs all his career. He is also much more expensive and if they truly wants to keep him, they would have extended him for several years and not just for another season.
About Collison, I followed this guy's career since his early UCLA days. He is solid, not reckless, plays good defense and yes he is accurate from the 3pt line but my concern is that his release is not as smooth and the main reason he looks good % wise is that he is a VERY SELECTIVE shooter. He NEVER SHOT MORE THAN 4 3pt shots/game in his entire career of 708 games. He is also no longer that explosive as he barely attacks the rim when needed.



Collison would be awesome. FVV would spell dynasty potential. Get him, Rob!

It was in the wiretap a few months back. I believe he said he was open to new adventures, or something along those lines. Then there were comments here about their ability to keep both.

I was in minority when I brought it up, but I think if Toronto have brains, which unfortunately they do, they’ll keep FVV long term over Lowry — if forced to make the choice. The consensus around here seemed to be that Lowry would undoubtedly be their choice, despite his age. Lowry is a two-way impact player.

Get FVV now! Somehow. Involve four teams if necessary. Five.

He’s a dog. Plays hard nosed defense. Makes the big shot. Plays off the ball. Doesn’t take up space or hog the ball. Knocks down the three. Is young and still improving. Seems humble, too.

PG: James[34], Bradley, Rondo, Cook
SG: Caruso[28], Pope, Daniels, THT
SF: Kuzma[28], Green, THT, Caroline
PF: Davis[34], Kuzma, Dudley, Cacok
C: McGee[24], Howard, Kostas, (DMC)

Go huge: PG James | SG Kuz | SF Davis | PF Cousins | C Howard

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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#59 » by stan francisco » Mon Jan 13, 2020 12:36 pm

Ball so hard wrote:
tamaraw08 wrote:
stan francisco wrote:
No way, why? Stranger three team deals have happened around ASB in the past for an expiring rental like FVV. He thinks they will keep Lowry over him as they won’t be able to afford both. The question is, what can we do to make TOR happy?

KCP and Cook? Daniels? Who’s the third team and the player from a third team? I don’t know, because I’m not in the know of inside NBA GM rumors. Pelinka knows all the potential suitors.

THT stays.

Do it Pelinka.


Where did hear that FVV is thinking that Toronto will keep Lowry over him? Kyle is 33 years old, actually same age as Rondo and his 3 pt shot has been shaky esp in the playoffs all his career. He is also much more expensive and if they truly wants to keep him, they would have extended him for several years and not just for another season.
About Collison, I followed this guy's career since his early UCLA days. He is solid, not reckless, plays good defense and yes he is accurate from the 3pt line but my concern is that his release is not as smooth and the main reason he looks good % wise is that he is a VERY SELECTIVE shooter. He NEVER SHOT MORE THAN 4 3pt shots/game in his entire career of 708 games. He is also no longer that explosive as he barely attacks the rim when needed.


He made up the bolded part. Collison is probably better than any PG we have... can't be too picky here. If Collison wants to come here, we should do it in a heartbeat.


No, I did not make that up, thank you. I don’t lie or make **** up. Apologies are due and will humbly accepted.

See wiretap.

PG: James[34], Bradley, Rondo, Cook
SG: Caruso[28], Pope, Daniels, THT
SF: Kuzma[28], Green, THT, Caroline
PF: Davis[34], Kuzma, Dudley, Cacok
C: McGee[24], Howard, Kostas, (DMC)

Go huge: PG James | SG Kuz | SF Davis | PF Cousins | C Howard

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Re: Woj: Darren Collison considering coming out of retirement, interested in Lakers and Clippers 

Post#60 » by stan francisco » Mon Jan 13, 2020 12:49 pm

Sedale Threatt wrote:
stan francisco wrote:No way, why?

stan francisco wrote:KCP and Cook? Daniels?


You just answered your own question.


Well, to think that Klutch couldn’t work a suitor, and convince KCP to drop his NTC for a long term deal in TOR or elsewhere (NYC) would be to think they have suddenly changed their ways.

KCP has played well lately.

Also, Pelinka is a serious CBA technician. I would not be surprised if he’s already figured out a way. I would not be surprised if he pulls a big trade by the ASB. I hope whatever it is, that it nets us FVV. I think he’s the perfect starting PG for this team.

All three mentioned above and Rondo and Caruso and Kuzma proved their worth against OKC in the last game (when LBJ wasn’t hogging the ball).

PG: James[34], Bradley, Rondo, Cook
SG: Caruso[28], Pope, Daniels, THT
SF: Kuzma[28], Green, THT, Caroline
PF: Davis[34], Kuzma, Dudley, Cacok
C: McGee[24], Howard, Kostas, (DMC)

Go huge: PG James | SG Kuz | SF Davis | PF Cousins | C Howard

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