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Pelinka and Final Decisions

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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#21 » by siFy » Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:52 am

SlimShady83 wrote:
siFy wrote:
SlimShady83 wrote:The real question is, how is this team going to be when Lebron retires? will we/Lakers have to rebuild, will we/Lakers have draft picks by then etc? going to be a tough rebuild IMO

If Pelinka is a little bit smart or whatever GM is going to be there in a short future he should trade LeBron still being good for another star or a good combo.


Trading Lebron is not going to happen buddy, not any GM going to do that.

Like if he can choose. There's always a first time and the GM should make the best for the franchise that hired him
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#22 » by Eric Bieniemy » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:47 pm

I'm just going to come out and say it: Pelinka is a damn fool for cosigning the Westbrook trade.

It's far worse than the Nash trade.

Doomed, as far as I'm concerned, fron the onset.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#23 » by Eric Bieniemy » Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:57 pm

James won a ring playing PG on a mildly talented team and leading the league in assists.

Why was he so adamant about the need for another "playmaker"?

Sure that championship team needed a penetrator, but as a guy who wants the ball in his hands so much, why would he feel so strongly about acquiring PG who also needs the ball?

Does James not want to play PG, not want the ball in his hands anymore?

That'd be a shame because he's still the best PG in the game and Davis needs his unique style of quarterbacking and unselfishness to truly be unlocked.

James' over-obsession with acquiring a PG and Davis' over-obsession with playing PF serve as exhibit A and B of examples of why you never let the inmates run the asylum.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#24 » by Kilroy » Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:53 pm

James won a championship at PG because he was a dominant athlete who could draw double teams and still score at will... He also had a team that could play solid D without forcing him to carry his load so he could preserve his strength for the playoffs... He's lost a step since last season and now seems to be having trouble staying healthy...
Now when he plays PG, he dribbles away most of the clock and hopefully finds an open look for someone or tries to bully-ball his way to an +1... He's become too predictable and the offense is too slow with him running it for too many plays... the league has gotten younger/quicker/better at switching D...
So now, we look a lot better with a more creative PG running things... Rondo, when he's on fire has us looking like a swiss watch... THT at times has us flowing better... We need motion, and LeBron at PG is the antithesis of that, at this point...
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#25 » by Eric Bieniemy » Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:55 pm

You're wrong here Kilroy.

James has played PG his entire career. That's his game. He'll be hard-pressed to change it.

Tucker's presence, over time, could snatch that role from him, but not yet. Right now, James needs to be the quarterback he's always been. Rondo needs to be his backup while they bring along Tucker and Reaves as secondary ballhandlers.

So, even with his lost step or two, he's still a main facilitator for an offense. If you see him over-dribbling or looking disjointed, it's because the team is disjointed.

Start James at PG alongside a penetrator like Tucker, sit Westbrook for 10 games and you'll see James' ability to run a plus offense ... even with his old man first step.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#26 » by tamaraw08 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:36 pm

Eric Bieniemy wrote:You're wrong here Kilroy.

James has played PG his entire career. That's his game. He'll be hard-pressed to change it.

Tucker's presence, over time, could snatch that role from him, but not yet. Right now, James needs to be the quarterback he's always been. Rondo needs to be his backup while they bring along Tucker and Reaves as secondary ballhandlers.

So, even with his lost step or two, he's still a main facilitator for an offense. If you see him over-dribbling or looking disjointed, it's because the team is disjointed.

Start James at PG alongside a penetrator like Tucker, sit Westbrook for 10 games and you'll see James' ability to run a plus offense ... even with his old man first step.

You asking Vogel to sit Westbrook for 10 games is like advising me to go Vegan... it’s not going to happen.
The 36 year old Lebron canNot carry this team for every single possession.It was reported that James tried to recruit Lillard but he declined. They got desperate and ended up with a ball dominant non shooting PG hoping to recreate what happened in Miami with Wade, another non shooting ball dominant guard. What they failed to realize is that Dewayne is so much smarter than Russ plus he is a much better defender. They also had one of the best 3&D player in Battier. They recruited Ariza but he got injured the second he signed his contract.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#27 » by Eric Bieniemy » Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:07 pm

tamaraw08 wrote:
Eric Bieniemy wrote:You're wrong here Kilroy.

James has played PG his entire career. That's his game. He'll be hard-pressed to change it.

Tucker's presence, over time, could snatch that role from him, but not yet. Right now, James needs to be the quarterback he's always been. Rondo needs to be his backup while they bring along Tucker and Reaves as secondary ballhandlers.

So, even with his lost step or two, he's still a main facilitator for an offense. If you see him over-dribbling or looking disjointed, it's because the team is disjointed.

Start James at PG alongside a penetrator like Tucker, sit Westbrook for 10 games and you'll see James' ability to run a plus offense ... even with his old man first step.

You asking Vogel to sit Westbrook for 10 games is like advising me to go Vegan... it’s not going to happen.
The 36 year old Lebron canNot carry this team for every single possession.It was reported that James tried to recruit Lillard but he declined. They got desperate and ended up with a ball dominant non shooting PG hoping to recreate what happened in Miami with Wade, another non shooting ball dominant guard. What they failed to realize is that Dewayne is so much smarter than Russ plus he is a much better defender. They also had one of the best 3&D player in Battier. They recruited Ariza but he got injured the second he signed his contract.

I'd bet against Vogel sitting Westbrook too. You're right about that.

That doesn't change the fact that he should though. If the singular goal is winning, benching Westbrook is addition by subtraction.

Add in the notion that at this rate Vogel will surely be fired, then sitting Westbrook to save his job and put the spotlight on Pelinka's decision to bring in Westbrook makes even more sense.

Turnovers alone are reason enough to bench Westbrook. When you add in his untimely shooting and poor defense, it becomes very justified.

If Vogel grows a pair and benches Westbrook he would be lauded for his bravery to play the guys who deserve to play.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#28 » by wco81 » Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:25 am

I know this was before Pelinka but did the Lakers let Randle walk or did they trade him?

Lot of ex-Lakers making good money, if not good players around the league -- Randle, Ingram, Ball, Russell, Caruso.

Should also be a fun matchup when the Lakers and Wizards play each other. KCP, Kuzma and Harrell are all key contributors and that team is playing well so far.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#29 » by Ball so hard » Wed Nov 24, 2021 5:05 pm

wco81 wrote:I know this was before Pelinka but did the Lakers let Randle walk or did they trade him?

Lot of ex-Lakers making good money, if not good players around the league -- Randle, Ingram, Ball, Russell, Caruso.

Should also be a fun matchup when the Lakers and Wizards play each other. KCP, Kuzma and Harrell are all key contributors and that team is playing well so far.


This was under Pelinka. If I remember correctly Randle asked the Lakers’ qualifying offer that made him an UFA. Randle felt disrespected when he was not prioritized when FA began.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#30 » by stan francisco » Thu Nov 25, 2021 3:46 pm

Eric Bieniemy wrote:I'm just going to come out and say it: Pelinka is a damn fool for cosigning the Westbrook trade.

It's far worse than the Nash trade.

Doomed, as far as I'm concerned, fron the onset.


Yeah, and we need to move on from it. That trade for them was a GM of the decade type of high score trade. Bradley Beal must’ve jumped up and down laughing like a mad man in disbelief for like the first week.

KCP, Kuzma and Harrell are three productive starter caliber players who play both ends of the court. Around their prime. That, for a dribbler who hogs the ball and doesn’t play defense?

Pelinka made the Wizards significantly better. I don’t mind it as it’s the east coast.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#31 » by Eric Bieniemy » Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:02 pm

stan francisco wrote:
Eric Bieniemy wrote:I'm just going to come out and say it: Pelinka is a damn fool for cosigning the Westbrook trade.

It's far worse than the Nash trade.

Doomed, as far as I'm concerned, fron the onset.


Yeah, and we need to move on from it. That trade for them was a GM of the decade type of high score trade. Bradley Beal must’ve jumped up and down laughing like a mad man in disbelief for like the first week.

KCP, Kuzma and Harrell are three productive starter caliber players who play both ends of the court. Around their prime. That, for a dribbler who hogs the ball and doesn’t play defense?

Pelinka made the Wizards significantly better. I don’t mind it as it’s the east coast.

I've given it a lot of thought, and I just don't see a Westbrook trade unless he starts to play really, really well.

They're stuck with him unless they cut him. In spite of his recent good play, an argument can be made that this team is better without Westbrook on it.

He is just so unreliable on a mental level.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#32 » by LAKESHOW » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:43 pm

The Odd thing. We played vs Westbrook during the playoffs. Houston was supposed to do somethin that year. When we played him, our defensive structure was to back off and let him shoot the ball. We won, moved on and won the Chip that year.
Its like our scouts never looked at that tape. AD. Bron. Pelinka. Just forgot how we played defense vs his game. Teams are now using that same tactics and going under screens, giving him space. Playing for the drive. Like... We invented that defense, and now its being used against us. Just not smart operation.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#33 » by tamaraw08 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:18 pm

stan francisco wrote:
Eric Bieniemy wrote:I'm just going to come out and say it: Pelinka is a damn fool for cosigning the Westbrook trade.

It's far worse than the Nash trade.

Doomed, as far as I'm concerned, fron the onset.


Yeah, and we need to move on from it. That trade for them was a GM of the decade type of high score trade. Bradley Beal must’ve jumped up and down laughing like a mad man in disbelief for like the first week.

KCP, Kuzma and Harrell are three productive starter caliber players who play both ends of the court. Around their prime. That, for a dribbler who hogs the ball and doesn’t play defense?

Pelinka made the Wizards significantly better. I don’t mind it as it’s the east coast.

Ramona Shellburn doubted if Rob actually knew the nuances of the salary cap before and she was not alone about questioning his abilities. Then he put the right pieces like Dwight, Green, Morris then all of a sudden many hailed him as Genius now this. :-?
Kobe loved this team and heavily recommended smart Agent who has a law degree to Jeannie.
It was reported that AD was the one who wanted Russ and that they met with Lebron the night before the trade. I just can't imagine Rob being totally on board with this and I'm betting he went to Jeannie and expressed his concerns about the fit. The CEO probably met with Lebron and AD and eventually relented upon assurances that the new big 3 would make it work. Pelinka then went on a mission to acquire shooters to space the floor. The problem was Jeannie only want to pay either either Caruso or THT and Klutch applied pressure to get their client a lucrative deal.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#34 » by wco81 » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:55 pm

Are the Lakers big on analytics?

Maybe there are staffers who are low profile which helps with personnel decisions.

AS for the salary cap, it's not rocket science and they can have a couple of business/math nerds in the front office too, just for that aspect.

NFL teams have those types, just to manage their salary caps. No football background, more MBA types.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#35 » by LAKESHOW » Fri Nov 26, 2021 7:21 pm

I heard that story about AD. That it was all him and his idea from the start. While that may be true, I don't know, Ultimately, it Falls on Pelinka. He is the titled person. He is the one, who holds the position. He is the one, with the nameplate on the door. He is the one, in charge of personnel. And he will take the fall, nobody gonna blame AD
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#36 » by euphorbus » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:40 pm

LAKESHOW wrote: He is the one, in charge of personnel. And he will take the fall


More likely, Frank Vogel will take the fall, if things do not turn around by mid-January.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#37 » by LAKESHOW » Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:58 pm

Yes. Vogel will get his
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#38 » by TylersLakers » Fri Nov 26, 2021 11:08 pm

You do have to take your superstars' opinion into the decision making. If they're banging the table and truly insistent on bringing in Westbrook - a good GM has to present the facts, go into why he wouldn't be a good fit, how much his analytics have dropped in recent years, etc. Present facts and try to change their mind. If it's not working - then you gotta make the deal.

Sure says something about LeBron and AD's decision making if that's truly what they thought.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#39 » by Eric Bieniemy » Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:13 am

TylersLakers wrote:You do have to take your superstars' opinion into the decision making. If they're banging the table and truly insistent on bringing in Westbrook - a good GM has to present the facts, go into why he wouldn't be a good fit, how much his analytics have dropped in recent years, etc. Present facts and try to change their mind. If it's not working - then you gotta make the deal.

Sure says something about LeBron and AD's decision making if that's truly what they thought.

I disagree. Some people, I suppose, just have more conviction than others.
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Re: Pelinka and Final Decisions 

Post#40 » by dockingsched » Sat Nov 27, 2021 6:40 pm

Enough people I respect who analyze the game film and data have been repeatedly talking how the lineups and sets run by this team are no where close to helping maximize the roster. My eyes tell me the same. Hope Vogel gets it right soon otherwise I’d be perfectly happy with them bringing someone else in before this season is lost.
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