Keeping Stanley Johnson & Darren Collison

[Kingdibs19]

Like what I saw from Stanley Johnson and Collison. If the Lakers were fully healthy and they kept both than what would the roster be and who would be cut ?

IT, Deandre and Rondo could all go IMO.

[NBAWestFan]

Lakers need a 3 and D guy at a minimum like Stanley Johnson.
Lakers need to get younger and put guys on the court that are going to hustle on both ends of the court.

Losing games is one thing but watching other teams out hustle this team night in and night out is hard to watch.

[Slava]

Any two of these can go:

IT
DeAndre
Bazemore
Ellington
Monk

[Slava]

one down

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[Freighttrain]

I saw more in one game out of Johnson & Collison than I saw in 10 days from Isaiah. I never really understood why we signed him in the first place. Perhaps because of the covid protocol and our lack of point guards at the time, but even then the fit was never really there. It wasn't in 2018 and it isn't now. Collison has a great feel and intuition l for the game. He still looked rusty and needed to adjust to everything, but he seems to be positive. Johnson was already guarding Harden and he showed more commitment and willingness than any of the players out there. The only question is whether they will adjust fast enough to Vogel's defensive system with the pressure rising and our need to win games asap. We still haven't figured out who we really are but our next 5-10 games are critical if we want to stay out of the play-in games, which is strange considering we're only near January.

[Ball so hard]

Still not sure about Stanley. If he’s not completely inept on offense he’d be an upgrade over Baze. The two are pretty similar… solid defense and next to nothing on offense. Stanley has been even worse than Baze on offense throughout his career.

[BEazy]

I mean right now we need more defense than offense. I'd keep Johnson and Collison. Both of them probably serve a better purpose to the team than Kent Bazemore and DeAndre Jordan. I'm praying Rob can find something for WestTrash so we can go into the new year with some hope for this season.

[Ball so hard]

I mean right now we need more defense than offense. I'd keep Johnson and Collison. Both of them probably serve a better purpose to the team than Kent Bazemore and DeAndre Jordan. I'm praying Rob can find something for WestTrash so we can go into the new year with some hope for this season.

Stanley is basically Baze though. I get that we’re basically throwing darts at this point though. Just about everyone agrees DJ is useless.

[zuju]

Stanley is a big wing we need.

Neither Ariza or Melo can play the 3 anymore. They have lost not only 1 step but a few step. It is torturing to ask them to defend the younger wings.

If we keep Collison aslo, which I think we should, we have to dumb 2 players. Bradley is one I would pick and the other would be Ellington or Bazemore depending on how Vogel wants the team look. To balance out the team, Ellington may have the edge.

Nunn will be the odd man out. You can't move WB. Rondo provides that veteran mastermind presence. Collison is just better than Nunn in any facet of the game.

So trading Nunn is what I believe a workable way to adjust the roster. I would like the Lakers to trade for a wing or a big. Josh Jackson or Mo Bamba would be great with the former one being more realistic. Josh has dog in him, good defender, long and athletic and can hit open 3s. Him and Stanley would be enough to take on any defensive assignment from 1-3 or even 4. Another wing I would consider is Lance Stephenson who offers very much everything we need from defense to shooting.

Hold on. Don't get me wrong. I am not keeping DJ either. waive him and sign a big who is younger. Biyombo, Patton or Harry Giles would all be tried via 10-day contracts. Keep whoever fit in better. Giles can play both 4 & 5, grab rebounds and shoot some 3s. He has vision on the court as well. I personally prefer him over the other 2.

Yes, 4 new players mid season may be a lot. I wouldn't mind getting rid of both Ellington and Bazemore for both Stanley and Lance too. If we find the outgoing players are negative presence, why not?

[tamaraw08]

Lakers need a 3 and D guy at a minimum like Stanley Johnson.
Lakers need to get younger and put guys on the court that are going to hustle on both ends of the court.

Losing games is one thing but watching other teams out hustle this team night in and night out is hard to watch.

Johnson is an effort guy who plays defense, there's no 3 in his game, if there is, he wouldn't be playing in the G-league. His career % from there is under 30%

[tamaraw08]

Any two of these can go:

IT
DeAndre
Bazemore
Ellington
Monk

Wayne has struggled the past 3 games but was shooting at 39% from 3 before Dec 15. Even if you count the last 3-5 horrible games, he still shooting at 36.8% and most of us fans are lamenting that they could have gotten Hield who is shooting 37% right now.
Monk is shooting 36% and 45% overall which is not bad but is too short to guard multiple positions, same could be said with IT and Collisson.

[Slava]

Any two of these can go:

IT
DeAndre
Bazemore
Ellington
Monk

Wayne has struggled the past 3 games but was shooting at 39% from 3 before Dec 15. Even if you count the last 3-5 horrible games, he still shooting at 36.8% and most of us fans are lamenting that they could have gotten Hield who is shooting 37% right now.
Monk is shooting 36% and 45% overall which is not bad but is too short to guard multiple positions, same could be said with IT and Collisson.

Neither monk nor Ellington can defend or play make so they are entirely one dimensional. Collision can at least play the lead guard if he is not completely cooked.

[stan francisco]

Stanley is a big wing we need.

Neither Ariza or Melo can play the 3 anymore. They have lost not only 1 step but a few step. It is torturing to ask them to defend the younger wings.

If we keep Collison aslo, which I think we should, we have to dumb 2 players. Bradley is one I would pick and the other would be Ellington or Bazemore depending on how Vogel wants the team look. To balance out the team, Ellington may have the edge.

Nunn will be the odd man out. You can't move WB. Rondo provides that veteran mastermind presence. Collison is just better than Nunn in any facet of the game.

So trading Nunn is what I believe a workable way to adjust the roster. I would like the Lakers to trade for a wing or a big. Josh Jackson or Mo Bamba would be great with the former one being more realistic. Josh has dog in him, good defender, long and athletic and can hit open 3s. Him and Stanley would be enough to take on any defensive assignment from 1-3 or even 4. Another wing I would consider is Lance Stephenson who offers very much everything we need from defense to shooting.

Hold on. Don't get me wrong. I am not keeping DJ either. waive him and sign a big who is younger. Biyombo, Patton or Harry Giles would all be tried via 10-day contracts. Keep whoever fit in better. Giles can play both 4 & 5, grab rebounds and shoot some 3s. He has vision on the court as well. I personally prefer him over the other 2.

Yes, 4 new players mid season may be a lot. I wouldn't mind getting rid of both Ellington and Bazemore for both Stanley and Lance too. If we find the outgoing players are negative presence, why not?

I agree with some of that. Lance? No thanks. What would we do with another ball dominant and off-the-ball challenged old dude who doesn’t play defense?

We need hard nosed and smart defense as well as young legs. Collison and Johnson make sense.

The two I’d sacrifice to make room for Stanley Johnson and Collison would be Bazemore and the poorest defending guard not named Regular Season Rondo. When Nunn is back and since IT was released (phew!), I’d guess Ellington. Bradley gives great defensive regular season minutes and also steps it up in the playoffs.

Josh Jackson and Mo Bamba and Giles? Sign me up if the deal is reasonable.

[slifersd]

If we need to cut two players to make room for those two, DeAndre Jordan is the obvious first cut. DJ has been effectively useless in every way imaginable since he signed here. I don't want to see his big lazy ass moping around like he thinks he is still in lob city again. Second cut, if we absolutely insist on keeping Westbrook around and play him big minutes, then cut Rondo loose. A team doesn't need this many non shooters and it's not like Rondo is making any real impact anyway.

[Ball so hard]

The thing that I’ve noticed with Ellington is that he doesn’t get a ton of open looks. Our offense doesn’t create easy shots for anyone, which is a bit odd considering we have both Lebron and Russ who are above average at setting up teammates. Ellington is incredibly efficient when his feet are set. AD being out certainly doesn’t help Ellington…this is when his shooting percentage began to dip. We need our star players to elevate everyone else and that certainly has not happened. Ellington is obviously not a great defender, but there’s no one on this team that can cover for him… one of the many problems with this team. We do not have complementary players.

[zuju]

If we need to cut two players to make room for those two, DeAndre Jordan is the obvious first cut. DJ has been effectively useless in every way imaginable since he signed here. I don't want to see his big lazy ass moping around like he thinks he is still in lob city again. Second cut, if we absolutely insist on keeping Westbrook around and play him big minutes, then cut Rondo loose. A team doesn't need this many non shooters and it's not like Rondo is making any real impact anyway.

If we cut DJ and no big comes in, we have no enough big to play with. So, a one big for one big is what I see we should do.

Rondo is at the very least a respectable shooter. His play making was what we lack last season. His presence in the playoff is far more valuable than we think even if there is no playoff rondo anymore.

[euphorbus]

The thing that I’ve noticed with Ellington is that he doesn’t get a ton of open looks. Our offense doesn’t create easy shots for anyone, which is a bit odd considering we have both Lebron and Russ who are above average at setting up teammates. Ellington is incredibly efficient when his feet are set.

So far as I can see, the only player on the team who sets an honest-to-God screen is Dwight Howard. I see Monk helping to free up other players all the time, but not in the traditional way to which I am referring. Watch how he puts up both arms, then moves off to get open himself. Ellington does some of that, too, but as you say, he needs more help.

Golden State is amazing the way Curry and company weave through multiple screens to get open. LA just does not have that kind of motion offense. They try to make up for it in part with a fast pace.

[tamaraw08]

The thing that I’ve noticed with Ellington is that he doesn’t get a ton of open looks. Our offense doesn’t create easy shots for anyone, which is a bit odd considering we have both Lebron and Russ who are above average at setting up teammates. Ellington is incredibly efficient when his feet are set. AD being out certainly doesn’t help Ellington…this is when his shooting percentage began to dip. We need our star players to elevate everyone else and that certainly has not happened. Ellington is obviously not a great defender, but there’s no one on this team that can cover for him… one of the many problems with this team. We do not have complementary players.

Wayne and Reaves are 2 of my favorite players in the team and yes I agree, their offense are not geared towards setting up AND setting off-ball weakside screens for shooters. Yes, they'll run 1-2 curl plays for Ellington per game but that's about it .
This bothered me last season, I think it was December too when BOTH KCP and Caruso where red hot at above 43% from 3 and were getting minimal touches. Makes me wonder if having Hield would have helped much.
btw, i agree with you, that Stanley Johnson is pretty much equivalent Kent Bazemore, some fans here might forget Ariza and Reaves should be back in a few days too.

[tamaraw08]

The thing that I’ve noticed with Ellington is that he doesn’t get a ton of open looks. Our offense doesn’t create easy shots for anyone, which is a bit odd considering we have both Lebron and Russ who are above average at setting up teammates. Ellington is incredibly efficient when his feet are set.

So far as I can see, the only player on the team who sets and honest-to-God screen is Dwight Howard. I see Monk helping to free up other players all the time, but not in the traditional way to which I am referring. Watch how he puts up both arms, then moves off to get open himself. Ellington does some of that, too, but as you say, he needs more help.

Golden State is amazing the way Curry and company weave through multiple screens to get open. LA just does not have that kind of motion offense. They try to make up for it in part with a fast pace.

Good observation. Aside from post up plays, setting screens are getting to be a thing of the past and yet the Warriors are doing great at it, heck I see even Steph set screens and I don't know why Lebron who would have been a great screener bec of his wide body don't even try to give picks.

[Dr Aki]

DAJ
Bazemore
Rondo

in that order