Coaching and GM Changes - Update: Vogel fired, Pelinka next?

[sonnyhill]

Why the hell does this team always leak these things out? There can't be more than a handful of people in the room when Phil makes that suggestion and yet somehow this still gets leaked out?! At this point, I am starting to wonder if Jeanie is the one who wants these rumors leaked out. Clown show

Pretty obvious the team is deliberately leaking to Woj so he gives them favorable coverage, started with leaking to him that Vogel was getting fired.

I remember Jeannie a Woj report, then a couple of days later Woj wrote a scathing article of how bad the Lakers have been Post Kobe, citing their bad losses etc. Then there was silence from both camps, then boom Woj now have exclusive scoops about the Lakers, which players and coaches they sign waay ahead of any reporters.

From the 2013-2015 season thru the 2015-2016 season, Kobe's final years with the Lakers, the team failed to win 30 games in any of those seasons and post Kobe Bryant, the Lakers only had winning records in 2019-2020 and 2020-2021.

In the recent LA Times article, it sure sounded like Jeanie wants to keep the core of Westbrook, LeBron and AD, regardless of what Phil is advocating.

Is Pelinka even empowered to construct the roster and hire a head coach?

Similar to the Knicks (big market team relying on the pull and luster of the big city where the franchise is located), the Lakers are no longer only stuck in mediocrity, but have now become inept at acquiring big name free agents (and Jeanie is whining about the luxury tax). LaMarcus Aldridge (very disturbing article: https://fadeawayworld.net/nba-media/the-reason-why-lamarcus-aldridge-rejected-the-lakers-6-years-ago-they-didnt-talk-enough-about-basketball) and Kawaii Leonard, both rejected signing with the Lakers.

More objective criticism of the Laker organization:

Watch on YouTube

[slifersd]

Why the hell does this team always leak these things out? There can't be more than a handful of people in the room when Phil makes that suggestion and yet somehow this still gets leaked out?! At this point, I am starting to wonder if Jeanie is the one who wants these rumors leaked out. Clown show

Pretty obvious the team is deliberately leaking to Woj so he gives them favorable coverage, started with leaking to him that Vogel was getting fired.

That is one of my biggest concerns. This Lakers management seems more interested in running their own PR firm than a basketball team. Everything they do is about saving faces, covering their asses and getting the media to like them. And yet, nobody seems to want to actually take the time to understand what the team needs to be successful. When a company's management isn't even focused on making the company better, that company is in deep trouble. We are, unfortunately, there right now. Sorry state of affairs for our beloved franchise man.

[slifersd]

Pretty obvious the team is deliberately leaking to Woj so he gives them favorable coverage, started with leaking to him that Vogel was getting fired.

I remember Jeannie a Woj report, then a couple of days later Woj wrote a scathing article of how bad the Lakers have been Post Kobe, citing their bad losses etc. Then there was silence from both camps, then boom Woj now have exclusive scoops about the Lakers, which players and coaches they sign waay ahead of any reporters.

From the 2013-2015 season thru the 2015-2016 season, Kobe's final years with the Lakers, the team failed to win 30 games in any of those seasons and post Kobe Bryant, the Lakers only had winning records in 2019-2020 and 2020-2021.

In the recent LA Times article, it sure sounded like Jeanie wants to keep the core of Westbrook, LeBron and AD, regardless of what Phil is advocating.

Is Pelinka even empowered to construct the roster and hire a head coach?

Similar to the Knicks (big market team relying on the pull and luster of the big city where the franchise is located), the Lakers are no longer only stuck in mediocrity, but have now become inept at acquiring big name free agents (and Jeanie is whining about the luxury tax). LaMarcus Aldridge (very disturbing article: https://fadeawayworld.net/nba-media/the-reason-why-lamarcus-aldridge-rejected-the-lakers-6-years-ago-they-didnt-talk-enough-about-basketball) and Kawaii Leonard, both rejected signing with the Lakers.

More objective criticism of the Laker organization:

Watch on YouTube

You know things are bad when even members of the media have started criticizing Jeanie and the management team. Those guys usually would jump in front of a bus to defend Jeanie. I have heard many "Lakers are a sh*t show, but Jeanie is magnificent" comments from them, which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. How is the CEO of a terribly run company magnificent lol?

[myersia]

I remember Jeannie a Woj report, then a couple of days later Woj wrote a scathing article of how bad the Lakers have been Post Kobe, citing their bad losses etc. Then there was silence from both camps, then boom Woj now have exclusive scoops about the Lakers, which players and coaches they sign waay ahead of any reporters.

From the 2013-2015 season thru the 2015-2016 season, Kobe's final years with the Lakers, the team failed to win 30 games in any of those seasons and post Kobe Bryant, the Lakers only had winning records in 2019-2020 and 2020-2021.

In the recent LA Times article, it sure sounded like Jeanie wants to keep the core of Westbrook, LeBron and AD, regardless of what Phil is advocating.

Is Pelinka even empowered to construct the roster and hire a head coach?

Similar to the Knicks (big market team relying on the pull and luster of the big city where the franchise is located), the Lakers are no longer only stuck in mediocrity, but have now become inept at acquiring big name free agents (and Jeanie is whining about the luxury tax). LaMarcus Aldridge (very disturbing article: https://fadeawayworld.net/nba-media/the-reason-why-lamarcus-aldridge-rejected-the-lakers-6-years-ago-they-didnt-talk-enough-about-basketball) and Kawaii Leonard, both rejected signing with the Lakers.

More objective criticism of the Laker organization:

Watch on YouTube

You know things are bad when even members of the media have started criticizing Jeanie and the management team. Those guys usually would jump in front of a bus to defend Jeanie. I have heard many "Lakers are a sh*t show, but Jeanie is magnificent" comments from them, which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. How is the CEO of a terribly run company magnificent lol?

I’d rather celebrate not having to hire Doc Rivers now!!!

[SK21209]

Looks like Darvin Ham and Terry Stotts are the front runners. I hope it’s Ham.

[Slava]

All you need from a coach is good defensive schemes and a buy in from Lebron. I’d be happy with either Ham or Snyder. Even Doc Rivers won’t be the worst hire owing to his stature as a coach respected by players and depending on who joins his staff. If you can get someone like Atkinson as an assistant, that would be solid.

[sonnyhill]

All you need from a coach is good defensive schemes and a buy in from Lebron. I’d be happy with either Ham or Snyder. Even Doc Rivers won’t be the worst hire owing to his stature as a coach respected by players and depending on who joins his staff. If you can get someone like Atkinson as an assistant, that would be solid.

Didn't the Lakers have good defensive schemes and buy in from LeBron with Vogel's system?

Also, why would Atkinson make a lateral-downward move from being a lead assistant in Golden State with its stable ownership, front office, coaching staff and mix of stars and youth on its roster to work for a highly dysfunctional Laker Organizaiton?

With both Snyder and Rivers still employed by Utah and Philadelphia, would it be considered tampering by the league for the Lakers to interview either/both?

Ham makes sense as a potential hire; however, LeBron may prefer a coach with pervious head coaching experience.

[myersia]

I don’t get the hate on Stotts. He’s not a bad coach at all and he got the most out of all the blazers teams. Maybe I’m putting too much stock in Stotts but I always thought he was decent. If we got Stotts with a defensive minded assistant….

[Slava]

All you need from a coach is good defensive schemes and a buy in from Lebron. I’d be happy with either Ham or Snyder. Even Doc Rivers won’t be the worst hire owing to his stature as a coach respected by players and depending on who joins his staff. If you can get someone like Atkinson as an assistant, that would be solid.

Didn't the Lakers have good defensive schemes and buy in from LeBron with Vogel's system?

Also, why would Atkinson make a lateral-downward move from being a lead assistant in Golden State with its stable ownership, front office, coaching staff and mix of stars and youth on its roster to work for a highly dysfunctional Laker Organizaiton?

With both Snyder and Rivers still employed by Utah and Philadelphia, would it be considered tampering by the league for the Lakers to interview either/both?

Ham makes sense as a potential hire; however, LeBron may prefer a coach with pervious head coaching experience.

1. I wouldn’t have fired Vogel.
2. Atkinson is an assistant in golden state. No more no less. Mike Brown was the second in line and they might replace him with someone else again.
3. Lakers are obviously not going to interview anyone without the teams permission and it might save the other team money by not firing the coach if they can workout a way to deal with the lakers.
4. Ham would theoretically be fine but Lebron James in his final years isn’t a great place for a rookie coach.

[tamaraw08]

I don’t get the hate on Stotts. He’s not a bad coach at all and he got the most out of all the blazers teams. Maybe I’m putting too much stock in Stotts but I always thought he was decent. If we got Stotts with a defensive minded assistant….

I don’t get it either. Maybe they think he’s another white re-thread who rode on the greatness of Dame and Lillard? But it’s not like he dumped the ball to his great players to work their magic and asked the rest to get out of the way. I loved they Horns Formation where they required specific movement to get high % Shots. Not sure though if Lebron will buy his schemes, I doubt too if it’ll work with Russ. He’s not a good with defense so they’ll need a guy like Steve Clifford to assist him

[LAKESHOW]

Cmon, we all know someone's head had to roll. Vogel was in line. Higher ups? We all know the higher ups ain't gonna fire themselves. Even though I woulda dropped pelinka. But since pelinka wasn't goin, Vogel was the natural choice as payment for this debacle. It had to be done

[sonnyhill]

Cmon, we all know someone's head had to roll. Vogel was in line. Higher ups? We all know the higher ups ain't gonna fire themselves. Even though I woulda dropped pelinka. But since pelinka wasn't goin, Vogel was the natural choice as payment for this debacle. It had to be done

I understand your analysis about "heads had to roll;" yet, it was LeBron and Klutch which lobbied for and pressured the Laker front office to construct this past season's roster debacle. Why wouldn't LeBron's head be the one which "...had to roll?"

Do Laker fans really care if LeBron breaks the scoring record in a Laker uniform or another team's uniform?

Why not empower Phil to help construct both next year's roster (building around Westbrook) and set the team up with draft picks which would come from both a LeBron trade and an AD trade? Also, Westbrook's contract comes off the books after next season; so, instead of trading him away along with a future Laker draft pick, shouldn't the Lakers leverage the value of Russell's contract coming off the books and spend that money in two seasons on future available free agents?

Does Pelinka have the smarts to pull of smart trades of aging assets for future draft picks and possibly expiring contracts or is the Laker franchise doomed to keep the same core of aging players and hope for a different result next season? Hope sure seems like a bad strategy.

[TylersLakers]

What's everyone's hope for the coach at this point? Snyder unlikely, Nurse almost impossible, etc.

I'm hoping for Darvin Ham and Stotts as an assistant coach and offensive co-ordinator.

Terrible market for coaches however. Should've stuck with Vogel, hired someone like Stotts as an assistant, and had him take over early in the season if things go haywire on an interim basis. Then you put yourself in the market next off-season when there's more clarity around LeBron's status.

[LAL1947]

Jason Kidd, when asked what's been the difference for him in his journey as a coach that has helped take this Mavs team to the Conference finals. (6:20 into the video)

"Easy answer, Frank Vogel prepared me for this."

It's a gracious thing for Jason Kidd to say and I don't think he would've said it if it wasn't true.

Watch on YouTube

[sonnyhill]

Jason Kidd, when asked what's been the difference for him in his journey as a coach that has helped take this Mavs team to the Conference finals. (6:20 into the video)

"Easy answer, Frank Vogel prepared me for this."

It's a gracious thing for Jason Kidd to have said and I don't think he would've said it if it wasn't true.

Watch on YouTube

Good for Kidd to publicly acknowledge Vogel's value!

It was only two season's ago that Vogel had coached the Lakers to a championship; and yet, he suddenly dropped off in value as a coach? It would be curious to know how much input Frank Vogel had in construction of this past season's roster (or was it really a LeBron-Klutch created roster?).

Will the public ever know who made the decision to fire Vogel? Was it a front office decision or was it driven by the players (similar to Magic pushing Westhead out)?

Because of the influence that LeBron has in the league combined with his leverage to influence what the Lakers do in its hiring-and-firing of its coaches, the league might just allow for LeBron to become the Lakers' player-coach and upon retirement give LeBron, Klutch and its Keiretsu the opportunity to purchase the Lakers and fulfill the league's dual goal of more minority ownership representation and planting its flag in Las Vegas.

Would LeBron be good player-coach for the Lakers? Hard to say; however, it may be inevitable as we see how Jeanie and her sewing group find it more important to "entertain" the fanbase with more "side-show" milestones (similar to LeBron breaking the NBA scoring record while wearing a Laker uniform) than building a winning product on the court and a stable and enduring organizational structure.

[LAL1947]

Because of the influence that LeBron has in the league combined with his leverage to influence what the Lakers do in its hiring-and-firing of its coaches, the league might just allow for LeBron to become the Lakers' player-coach and upon retirement give LeBron, Klutch and its Keiretsu the opportunity to purchase the Lakers and fulfill the league's dual goal of more minority ownership representation and planting its flag in Las Vegas.

Are you a Clippers fan in disguise?

If not, I think you need to stop pushing this narrative, the Lakers aren't moving to Las Vegas.

Also Lebron as a player-coach is illegal, and Klutch being part of the ownership group will make me vomit.

[Ball so hard]

Jason Kidd, when asked what's been the difference for him in his journey as a coach that has helped take this Mavs team to the Conference finals. (6:20 into the video)

"Easy answer, Frank Vogel prepared me for this."

It's a gracious thing for Jason Kidd to have said and I don't think he would've said it if it wasn't true.

Watch on YouTube

Good for Kidd to publicly acknowledge Vogel's value!

It was only two season's ago that Vogel had coached the Lakers to a championship; and yet, he suddenly dropped off in value as a coach? It would be curious to know how much input Frank Vogel had in construction of this past season's roster (or was it really a LeBron-Klutch created roster?).

Will the public ever know who made the decision to fire Vogel? Was it a front office decision or was it driven by the players (similar to Magic pushing Westhead out)?

Because of the influence that LeBron has in the league combined with his leverage to influence what the Lakers do in its hiring-and-firing of its coaches, the league might just allow for LeBron to become the Lakers' player-coach and upon retirement give LeBron, Klutch and its Keiretsu the opportunity to purchase the Lakers and fulfill the league's dual goal of more minority ownership representation and planting its flag in Las Vegas.

Would LeBron be good player-coach for the Lakers? Hard to say; however, it may be inevitable as we see how Jeanie and her sewing group find it more important to "entertain" the fanbase with more "side-show" milestones (similar to LeBron breaking the NBA scoring record while wearing a Laker uniform) than building a winning product on the court and a stable and enduring organizational structure.

The firing of Vogel was misguided at best. I've said many times and I maintain this was a mistake. There aren't any better options available; just about everyone knows this. Is Stotts really an upgrade? I've yet to hear a convincing argument in favor of Stotts as an upgrade. Sure he probably has a better mind on offense...but so what? The same people pushing for Stotts will be complaining about the lack of defense in no time. I've also heard we should hire Stotts and hire a defensive minded coach. Would it not have been better to keep Vogel and hire an offensive minded coach. After all, Vogel has proven he's capable of coaching a championship caliber team. It pains me to admit i've lost so much interest in this franchise. We have a bunch of buffoons running our team.

[sonnyhill]

Because of the influence that LeBron has in the league combined with his leverage to influence what the Lakers do in its hiring-and-firing of its coaches, the league might just allow for LeBron to become the Lakers' player-coach and upon retirement give LeBron, Klutch and its Keiretsu the opportunity to purchase the Lakers and fulfill the league's dual goal of more minority ownership representation and planting its flag in Las Vegas.

Are you a Clippers fan in disguise?

If not, I think you need to stop pushing this narrative, the Lakers aren't moving to Las Vegas.

Also Lebron as a player-coach is illegal, and Klutch being part of the ownership group will make me vomit.

The Clippers should have never been given the green light by the league to move into Los Angeles. They should have either had stayed in Buffalo (the Braves) or had properly developed the brand in the San Diego market. However, now that they are in Los Angeles with an owner who thinks differently, has deep pockets, and are changing the calculus of the professional Los Angeles basketball landscape, Laker fans need to take a hard look at the Clippers as a real threat to "Laker Nation residing in Los Angeles supremacy." In the early 1970s, it was interesting to watch the Braves-Clippers coached by Dr. Jack and with Bob McAdoo, Ernie D., and Randy Smith, but have never found the Clippers to be nothing more than a joke until Balmer gained ownership of their franchise. Now, the Clippers are a real threat to both the Lakers and the rest of the league. Look at what Lacob and Guber have done with their ownership group and the once "more pathetic than the Clippers" Warrior team. Not good for Laker Nation.

Jeanie would buy-off on LeBron as player-coach and the league might allow for it, due, in large part, because of his iconic status and because he is chasing after the all time scoring record. Jeanie would also get the "boost" from the novelty of her player-coach wearing a Laker uniform while chasing the all time scoring record, and this would keep Laker fans focused on the Laker brand while simultaneously distracting Laker fans away from its abysmal won-loss record.

Why are you so vehemently opposed to "Klutch being part of the ownership group?" The Buss family had its run; it might be time for the Lakers to re-invent itself and LeBron-Klutch represent a new way to do things. What is it about a Laker team with a LeBron-Klutch ownership which scares you?

Also, while you may be vehemently opposed to the Lakers possibly moving into a state with no state income tax, a city where entertainment is ensconced into both its economy and its social fabric, and the a new arena in Las Vegas, the majority of Southern California fans really do not care where the Lakers call their home city. Similar to when the Rams had first moved to Anaheim and then to St. Louis and Similar to the Raiders moving back to Oakland and then to Las Vegas, the Southern California fanbase felt more apathy than antipathy.

[Kilroy]

Jason Kidd, when asked what's been the difference for him in his journey as a coach that has helped take this Mavs team to the Conference finals. (6:20 into the video)

"Easy answer, Frank Vogel prepared me for this."

It's a gracious thing for Jason Kidd to have said and I don't think he would've said it if it wasn't true.

Watch on YouTube

Good for Kidd to publicly acknowledge Vogel's value!

It was only two season's ago that Vogel had coached the Lakers to a championship; and yet, he suddenly dropped off in value as a coach? It would be curious to know how much input Frank Vogel had in construction of this past season's roster (or was it really a LeBron-Klutch created roster?).

Will the public ever know who made the decision to fire Vogel? Was it a front office decision or was it driven by the players (similar to Magic pushing Westhead out)?

Because of the influence that LeBron has in the league combined with his leverage to influence what the Lakers do in its hiring-and-firing of its coaches, the league might just allow for LeBron to become the Lakers' player-coach and upon retirement give LeBron, Klutch and its Keiretsu the opportunity to purchase the Lakers and fulfill the league's dual goal of more minority ownership representation and planting its flag in Las Vegas.

Would LeBron be good player-coach for the Lakers? Hard to say; however, it may be inevitable as we see how Jeanie and her sewing group find it more important to "entertain" the fanbase with more "side-show" milestones (similar to LeBron breaking the NBA scoring record while wearing a Laker uniform) than building a winning product on the court and a stable and enduring organizational structure.

The firing of Vogel was misguided at best. I've said many times and I maintain this was a mistake. There aren't any better options available; just about everyone knows this. Is Stotts really an upgrade? I've yet to hear a convincing argument in favor of Stotts as an upgrade. Sure he probably has a better mind on offense...but so what? The same people pushing for Stotts will be complaining about the lack of defense in no time. I've also heard we should hire Stotts and hire a defensive minded coach. Would it not have been better to keep Vogel and hire an offensive minded coach. After all, Vogel has proven he's capable of coaching a championship caliber team. It pains me to admit i've lost so much interest in this franchise. We have a bunch of buffoons running our team.

Firing Vogel in a vacuum, isn't necessarily the problem, or the symptom of a bigger problem... The issue is that he was apparently fired because he couldn't figure out how to maximize Westbrook... That's a huge red-flag regarding the organization...
I mean, I get it... Someone had to take the fall, and Vogel wasn't perfect, but the fact that the FO thinks Lakers fans are going to accept that particular excuse, is a big example of how out of touch they are...

If you're choosing between Westbrook and Vogel, the healthy org chooses Vogel every single time...

[LAKESHOW]

I've said it before. The mistakes in personnel is on Pelinka. Vogel did not like his choices. And being on the bottom of the totem, Vogel was scapegoated. And someone needed to be sacrificed. And Pelinka was not going to fire himself