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Shoot the J....SHOOT IT!!!

RJ would be wonderful here, but not at his contract rate.

Game... blouses.

Tayshaun Prince
Gerald Wallace
Ron Artest
Shane Battier
Josh Howard
Richard Jefferson

In that order.

I'm going to say..
Prince
Artest
Battier
Wallace
Howard
Jefferson

But again, that all depends on what we'd have to give up to get them..

Andrei Kirilenko should be an option, because that's who I'd pick.

I think Prince and Jefferson are the only realistic options. I don't see the others getting traded. Probably Odom and Farmar for Prince or Jefferson.

is lamar the do nothing option, i'm ok with that

If the last two years is any indication, AK is not great at playing SF in a half court offense. He shouldn't be considered a trade target unless you want him inserted on the second unit, good luck making him agree to that.

Ron Artest (MLE)
Tayshaun Prince
Gerald Wallace
Mike Miller
Richard Jefferson
Shane Battier
Ron Artest (Trade)
Josh Howard

I don't think AK-47 should be given consideration. You've said it yourself, Miles, a large reason he doesn't do well with the Jazz is because he should be playing PF, not SF. If so, he is not a good option when taking into account his contract and the possible team chemistry issues he'd bring.

ETA Miller

i'd take mike miller.

artest
wallace
prince

everyone else

in that order

or i wouldnt mind keeping odom

1) Prince
2) Battier
3) Artest
4) Odom
5) Wallace
6) Jefferson

Gerald3Wallace wrote:artest
wallace
prince

This is my list, in this order, as well. I don't see any point in trading Odom unless we get one of these three.

incontrol__ wrote:
I don't think AK-47 should be given consideration. You've said it yourself, Miles, a large reason he doesn't do well with the Jazz is because he should be playing PF, not SF. If so, he is not a good option when taking into account his contract and the possible team chemistry issues he'd bring.

Did I say that? I don't think I did...because I've always considered him a flex forward. I think I was addressing other people's questions about his ability to play PF, since I've advocated trading Odom for AK before we got Gasol. Many people saw AK as primarily a SF, not a PF, but I've argued that he had success playing PF after Malone left, that his rebounds went up as he played more in the frontcourt.

And IIRC, I believe I've argued AK wasn't as productive due to the offense moving away from him and centering more around the 2-man game between Deron and Boozer. Most of the other touches went to Okur, and spot up shooters such as Harpring, Fish, and later, Korver. And that's what Kirilenko was reduced to, a kick-out spot up shooter. Give him credit, though, after crying about it he worked on his three-point shooting and he's capable.

But intrinsically, he would flourish in the open-opportunity triangle offense, with the ball movement and unselfishness we've come to love. Kirilenko would be at home to nest in this offense. Artest simply doesn't move off the ball as well as Kirilenko does, and Prince isn't close to as good of a passer. Kirilenko can handle, pass, shoot, cut, finish, read the defense - everything Phil Jackson and the Lakers hoped Odom could be in the triangle.

I think I've said on numerous occasions how AK would be a great halfcourt facilitator for the opposite reasons why Odom had struggled. AK is a very good passer in the halfcourt - there was a time a year ago in the playoffs when Deron Williams was in foul trouble - Sloan had Kirilenko play point guard - and he was great at it. Derek Fisher remained alongside as the shooting guard.

To sum up, Kirilenko would be perfect for the offense because:

1. he can hit that open three - 38% for the season
2. unselfish, excellent passer - best among all small forward in assist ratio (including Lebron James)*
3. terrific off-the-ball player, scores around the basket without plays getting called for him
4. he is the best individual and team defender at his position in the NBA, capable of shutting down 4 positions.

*"Assist Ratio is the percentage of a player’s possessions that ends in an assist. Assist Ratio = (Assists x 100) divided by [(FGA + (FTA x 0.44) + Assists + Turnovers]" -espn.com

If we want to win championships, and Buss is willing to pay, he can do NO BETTER than Kirilenko. As great as Artest and Prince are defensively, Kirilenko is in another league with his ability to seamlessly switch from lock down defender to basket protector, whatever the team needs. He's going to add intelligence to our frequently befuddled and confused defense. He's a game changer, one of the few players who can dominate the game defensively - from the perimeter or around the basket.

He is also the greatest shotblocking small forward OF ALL TIME and currently sits behind Tim Duncan and Shaq in career shotblocking averages. That's insane. What's even more insane is that Kirilenko's numbers are brought down by his relatively low minutes (held back early in his career and the last 2 years). His shotblocking rate lands him in top-10 - all time.

If AK were combined with another first-team All-Defender Kobe Bryant, both anchored by Bynum in the middle, the Lakers would be in good position to become one of the greatest defensive teams in the history of the game.

Get Kirilenko, and the Lakers will give Boston a heavy dose of their own medicine. There's going to be a fence on the perimeter and a lid on the basket.

dcash4 wrote:i'd take mike miller.

Ugh, i can't believe Miller slipped my mind.

I'll go with the excuse that i was sorta tired and i'm pretty much resigned to the belief that we can't get him (due to fairly obvious reasons).. lol

milesfides wrote:Did I say that? I don't think I did...because I've always considered him a flex forward. I think I was addressing other people's questions about his ability to play PF, since I've advocated trading Odom for AK before we got Gasol.

I could've sworn you had said so last season. Guess i was wrong.. I don't have a great memory. So, sorry about that, then.

milesfides wrote:1. he can hit that open three - 38% for the season

His percentage for the season was good, but that doesn't mean he has a 3 point shot that defenders would respect (and not dare him to shoot) and which he would make consistently enough to punish them for that, IMO. In the series against the Jazz i thought we dared him to shoot a lot at times, and minus the last game, he seemed to either brick it (jumper or 3), or pass it off (which would hurt the Jazz).

I don't think he'd be much better than Lamar here.

milesfides wrote:4. he is the best individual and team defender at his position in the NBA, capable of shutting down 4 positions.

He's obviously, as you said, a great/amazing help defender, but he doesn't appear to be such a great man-to-man defender.. He and the Jazz seem to get torched a lot by good SG's/SF's. Not to say that's the end all be all, but based on things like that, what i think i see, and some stats -which are obviously fairly questionable as to their reliability- i'm not sure i'd call him a great individual defender. Obviously, still, a good upgrade over Lamar (who's no slouch himself) defensively.

milesfides wrote:If we want to win championships, and Buss is willing to pay, he can do NO BETTER than Kirilenko.

It's unreasonable to think Buss should be willing to pay his 4th best player more than 16 million a year (15.1, 16.4, 17.8) for the next three years, particularly when there are similarly good (better, IMO) options out there (i.e. Prince, Battier, Wallace, Jefferson) which are due a ton less.

So, you think he'd be fine being the 4th best player on this team?

Ultimately, i stand by what i said -- taking his contract, and the possible chemistry problems he could cause, i just don't think he should be an option that the FO should be thinking about..

ron looks like he wants to eat your child ala iron mike tyson

I like any of these guys, no doubt. But Artest always does have some risk of meltdown (a risk worth taking, but still, it's there), he may at times break from the offense, and his defense is mostly individual.

Miller is by far the best shooter among them all, but defensively, I find him average, which is a serious compromise. As long as we're prioritizing defense, I'm not sure that makes him the best candidate.

incontrol, you have a point about Kirilenko's 3-point shooting. I think he's a capable shooter, but he's not an elite shooter by any means. But then again, neither is Prince or Artest. What I meant is that Kirilenko isn't an offensive liability. There will be time he misses, of course, as any shooter does. I think it would remiss to single out a couple games where he shot poorly. Vujacic was among the league leaders in 3-point percentage, but he shot 1-9, 2-10 in the critical game 4 and 5. Posey had games in the playoffs where he shoots 1-5, 1-6.

That's why I think defense should have the highest priority. Shooting can come and go in any game. But defense, especially elite defense, is what gives a player and a team a consistent chance to win a game.

I've already talked about Artest, but Prince is obviously no slouch either. He'd be a great addition. But I see him as a poor man's Kirilenko.

As far as Kirilenko's role, IIRC, he was upset about his role not so much because of fewer shot attempts, but because of his lack of involvement in the offense. He never got to touch the ball, and was reduced to being a jump-shooter. But that won't be the case in Los Angeles. Like I said before, he is a great halfcourt passer, a very unselfish player. His unselfishness isn't like Odom's unselfishness, which might better be described as ineptitude. Kirilenko actually is a terrific assist man, he leads the league's small forwards in assists per possession. It accounts for turnovers as well, so for a guy who has a limited role in the offense, he has absolutely maximized his value to the team.

In fact, that's why I think Kirilenko would be the most seamless fit on our team. How will Artest and Prince really adjust to a reduced role? But Kirilenko has walked the walk. We know he'll be a terrific passer, he'll shoot high percentages, and he'll play elite defense - even if he get to shoot only 6, 7 times a game. That's something that Artest and Prince can't boast.