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Gasol: Big men should get ball more

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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#21 » by KObe Bryant » Wed May 27, 2009 2:53 am

Pau's right. Now, I hope they'll do it every night and let's see how effectively it is.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#22 » by supaflash » Wed May 27, 2009 3:46 am

I blame Phil and Fisher and I'm sick of it.

Pau is right. We have huge mismatches, they simply can't guard Bynum and Pau, especially when they are both out there. I love Lamar, but his matchup is not good this series. Keyon and Anderson are both quick enough to guard him and athletic enough to block his shot, and smart enough to force him right. And its not like Lamar hasn't made his share of poor rotations. Phil will yank Bynum for one, while Lamar will commit 2 or 3 in a row and nothing. And Bynum is the only one challenging shots and putting guys on the floor. I hope he puts Donte and JR on their backs.

And seriously, has anyone ever seen Fisher pass the ball into the post? I don't know what his problem is, he just won't do it. I'm so sick of it.

And ONCE AGAIN Phil fails to call a good timeout. First half, Kobe goes out, Denver hits a couple shots and makes a huge energy block. What does he do? Waits till it was 9 or 10 down instead of 5.
I'm sick of it. I get it, you want to make these guys mentally strong, learn to play through it. Thats great, its a good thing during the season. BUT ITS THE CONFERENCE FINALS. Call your timeouts like you give a damn about your team and maybe they will give a damn about the game. One prideful move and we could never recover. Phil damnit, you never know when the officials are going to go into a touch foul frenzy and the team won't be able to get a run going. Why take the risk. Call a damn timeout and tell your stupid team to throw the damn ball into the post.

The officials ruined the flow of that last game and I'm pissed about it, but we didn't deserve to win that game because Phil and Fish are old prideful fools.

Pound this punk ass team. I want 50 FTs for US, they cannot guard us.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#23 » by LAKESHOW » Wed May 27, 2009 4:17 am

its true, but not that easy. its a readable situation. with shaq, it was just force feed and the offense was motioned from that point. now however, kobe has to read the situation. why? because much of the offense is run through him. instead of shaq, KOBE crushes the pocket. when he drives, teams double or triple and clog the lane, and he dishes it out to the shooter.

however, this is kobes offense. kobes team. IT IS HE(KOBE) who must run the offense smoothly to where pau gets the touches. KOBE MUST DEMAND IT AND TELL HIS TEAMMATES to get it down low to pau, or to set up this play or set up that play. NOW WITH THAT SAID, not all situations are kick it down low situations. many situations are play the perimeter and jump shoot teams to death. but whether to go down low or run the perimeter, it is on KOBE to be the court general and run the ship the right way. own it, its his team. and right now, ive actually seen glimpses of where he goes down low and motions to the other side and lets pau go 1 on 1.

thats why jax didnt really say much. he knows he cant really order it up. thats not his style. his style is to let them figure it out.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#24 » by The Skyhook » Wed May 27, 2009 4:38 am

I hope we pound the god damn ball inside. Instead of having Kobe go off for a bunch of points, he needs to play the fasilitator role. Get the ball inside. Drew and Pau need to establish good post position. They need to send a message to Nene, Anderson, and Martin that they will no longer let those 3 out work them in the paint. Lamar I know your flying somewhere in the sky and we desperetly need you to come back down to earth and play ball. Lamar's one of those guys that can get this team going with high energy. We need that from him. Orlando plays by shooting up a million 3s well its time the Lakers playing by using their strength. Its their lenght and size. Use it and the Nuggets will not be able to match up with us causing them to have a mental collapse. Their thugs won't know how to handle being played physically against. Remember we came back against Boston after they whooped our ass in the FInals. Those bastards didn't know what hit em. Only thing is we don't have until this upcoming Christmas to deliever that message to the Nuggets. It must be done now!
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#25 » by microfib4thewin » Wed May 27, 2009 4:56 am

Usually I feel that the offense shifted away from post ups too much, but not for this playoff. The reason why Gasol isn't shooting more is due to him getting shut down by Nene and Kmart. Yes, he looks like he's very efficient with his shots, but that is only because Kobe was able to bail him out when he struggles to get an open look, which is happening very often. He's becoming our Jose Calderon, a guy who has good percentages and puts up decent stats but does not help the team out as much as the numbers indicate. He shouldn't be complaining about lack of shots when he's getting out-muscled by smaller defenders and has no recognition on getting back to the screener to prevent easy layups. Same goes for Bynum.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#26 » by hermes » Wed May 27, 2009 5:09 am

SS_MagicMark wrote:My barber thinks I need more haircuts.

he doesn't want you to get mistaken for a hippie
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#27 » by Dr Aki » Wed May 27, 2009 5:18 am

i agree with pau

playing inside-out is a staple tactic for a reason

it isnt just a case of if pau's doing his job on the offensive end, kobe's being asked to shoulder too much of the scoring load

ariza's played absolutely great, but when i want someone to make an entry pass i want luke walton in the game

partially, its how denver is playing gasol/bynum but its also a mentality and the only one always looking to do that is luke walton.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#28 » by lakersfanatic » Wed May 27, 2009 5:34 am

well if the guy can man up and take it to the hoop without fumbling or losing the ball he would probably get a whole ton of touches. It's true that techincally we should be dominanting the glass with our big three... but we're not.

But for the sake of higher percentage shots in the paint, im always up for more baskets for our centers. I prefer that then just trying to shoot our way out. It's even safer than attacking the basketball and praying that the officials would give u a shooting foul.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#29 » by crazyeights » Wed May 27, 2009 5:59 am

milesfides wrote:Complete garbage about talking to the media. Honesty has nothing to do with it. Did Kobe complain to the media of not getting the ball in crunch time after Derek Fisher airballed that 3 in game 2?

It's about keeping together as a team, fighting together in the trenches. Dwight Howard should shut up and play. He called out his coach in the last series, and he's frequently yapping so much pretty much everybody is telling him to shut up - including his own teammates. Shaq also was immature for always speaking out in the media.

You're using bad examples to justify what Gasol did, because those guys were immature, unprofessional, and self-defeating.

Again, Gasol just needs to shut his face.

About getting the ball more - the entire team needs better ball movement, and the onus is on everybody, including the big men, to make that happen. If Gasol and Bynum were killing the nuggets down low, it would be a no-brainer. But they've been inconsistent down low - can anybody dispute that?

Moreover, our bigs are not playing crappy defense (including Fisher), so yapping about offense just makes them look like petty, single-minded tools.

There's a reason why Phil is pulling Bynum. And there's a reason why Denver took a page out of Boston's defense, because they knew we were soft inside. And we still are. George Karl spoke openly about it.

Sportswriters all across the country are pointing out the obvious, how Bynum has disappeared and Gasol is soft.

And please, let's not talk about free throws. Pau's bricked a ton, especially when it counts a lot, i.e., fourth quarter. He's under 70% in the playoffs, after hitting almost 80% in the reg season. Way to step up and punish teams in the post.

Lamar's shooting under 60%. Shaq would be proud.

Speaking of Shaq, Bynum is shooting 57% this series from the line. Didn't he boast he was like Shaq but could hit free throws?

Kobe's shooting 92%. Somebody is focused, and it ain't our big men.

By the way, Kobe shot 13 free throws last night. Bynum? 3. Gasol? 7. Odom? 4.

Let's not talk about who's being aggressive and attacking the Nuggets.

Basketball is a game that quickly figures out who's effective. Be aggressive and effective, and the ball will find you.

Otherwise, shut your face and play better.


Sportswriters? You're citing sportswriters? :lol: Miles did someone jack your password?

Dwight Howard should shut his mouth? Pretty sure his team is kicking ass after taking his advice. How does 3-1 sound to you?

Pau bricked a ton? He only missed 2 last game....Does each FT weigh 1,000 pounds?

Even Phil said that to ask Pau what he thought about getting more touches. Phil isn't a pussy. He'll tell the team what he thinks. Instead, Phil wanted Pau to tell the team himself. If Phil thought they did a good job at feeding our 77.8%, most consistent, match-up then he'd simply say "no." But he didn't say that, he let Pau speak for himself. He led the media to him. There's a reason for that.

Why are you bringing in Lamar into this? When did I post about Lamar? I'm talking Pau/Bynum. Lamar, as I've stated elsewhere, is one of the reasons why we lost last game. When Phil took Bynum out we went from being down 4 to well into double digits. This was the only line-up change for either team....uh a correlation?

They've been inconsistent down low? 77.8% last game....I don't know what you're watching.

And as for Kobe's shooting 92% ... great. I think the team missed a huge opportunity giving him the ball in the 3rd quarter after the cheap shot from Jones. Kobe was pissed and ready to take over. Instead we started the Luke Walton show.

We need to go inside-out: starting with Pau/Bynum kicking it out to Kobe. We have such advantages with these 3, no way can we continue to go away from them and win this series.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#30 » by MAMBAEMD » Wed May 27, 2009 5:59 am

I kind of like the fact that Gasol is showing some fire in him and is demanding the ball more.
I just wish he didn't do it in the papers. Just keep it in house and don't show signs of divisiveness.

That said, the Laker's problems in Game 4 were not on offense: the loss was due to poor boxing out and getting crushed on the boards, and poor perimeter defense, and just overall being otplayed and outhustled by the Nuggs.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#31 » by Sofa King » Wed May 27, 2009 6:07 am

They would get him the ball more if Nene, K-mart, and Birdman would stop punking him in the post. Grow a pair and you'll get it more.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#32 » by Anklebreaker702 » Wed May 27, 2009 7:05 am

supaflash wrote:I blame Phil and Fisher and I'm sick of it.

Pau is right. We have huge mismatches, they simply can't guard Bynum and Pau, especially when they are both out there. I love Lamar, but his matchup is not good this series. Keyon and Anderson are both quick enough to guard him and athletic enough to block his shot, and smart enough to force him right. And its not like Lamar hasn't made his share of poor rotations. Phil will yank Bynum for one, while Lamar will commit 2 or 3 in a row and nothing. And Bynum is the only one challenging shots and putting guys on the floor. I hope he puts Donte and JR on their backs.

And seriously, has anyone ever seen Fisher pass the ball into the post? I don't know what his problem is, he just won't do it. I'm so sick of it.

And ONCE AGAIN Phil fails to call a good timeout. First half, Kobe goes out, Denver hits a couple shots and makes a huge energy block. What does he do? Waits till it was 9 or 10 down instead of 5.
I'm sick of it. I get it, you want to make these guys mentally strong, learn to play through it. Thats great, its a good thing during the season. BUT ITS THE CONFERENCE FINALS. Call your timeouts like you give a damn about your team and maybe they will give a damn about the game. One prideful move and we could never recover. Phil damnit, you never know when the officials are going to go into a touch foul frenzy and the team won't be able to get a run going. Why take the risk. Call a damn timeout and tell your stupid team to throw the damn ball into the post.

The officials ruined the flow of that last game and I'm pissed about it, but we didn't deserve to win that game because Phil and Fish are old prideful fools.

Pound this punk ass team. I want 50 FTs for US, they cannot guard us.

One of the most accurate posts I've seen on this subject! Good post.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#33 » by Anklebreaker702 » Wed May 27, 2009 7:09 am

tlifeset wrote:We don't need stats ... even though they do a pretty good job making the case for us ...

Gasol and Bynum dominated the Nuggets offensively. Both got into grooves and were undermined by either Phil substituting them and/or guard du jour (Fisher, Sasha, etc.) deciding to shoot more.

Not to mention, in the first half when both were on the floor ... the Nuggets go into significant foul trouble. And when both weren't on the floor in the 4th, the Nuggets attacked the rim with reckless abandon.

To amend Shaq ... Feed the big dogs.

Denver has no answer for them.

But part of me thinks that Phil is playing one of his zen psychological tricks here to get Gasol to ask for the ball more and get Bynum to ask for more minutes. His thinking probably is ... if they want it, they'll ask for it. They'll want to prove their coach wrong.

Honestly, the game 4 loss was the best loss we could have had: coming home ... borderline blowout (even though we had our chances) that Phil can use as leverage to get under their skin ... and give JR Smith tons of confidence so he goes 2 for 20 next game ending with Billups punching him in the face ... plus, phil's got a nice beef with the refs who will respond with more home town cooking ... oh, and the Nuggets got 3 technical fouls in a win ... in their thug minds that means "Technical = Win".
Good post but it's time to for phil to trade the Zen's for wins. That crap is old
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#34 » by Anklebreaker702 » Wed May 27, 2009 7:11 am

Sofa King wrote:They would get him the ball more if Nene, K-mart, and Birdman would stop punking him in the post. Grow a pair and you'll get it more.

You're right about Pau growing nads sofa king but this may be him lobbying for Bynum as well. Unless you were a blind man it was easy to see he was having his way & would have had a monster game had he gotten more minutes.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#35 » by Sofa King » Wed May 27, 2009 10:55 am

anklebreaker702 wrote:
Sofa King wrote:They would get him the ball more if Nene, K-mart, and Birdman would stop punking him in the post. Grow a pair and you'll get it more.

You're right about Pau growing nads sofa king but this may be him lobbying for Bynum as well. Unless you were a blind man it was easy to see he was having his way & would have had a monster game had he gotten more minutes.


I want to see Pau from the Spurs series of last year. He took it to Duncan. Not the Pau from the Celtics series where he spread them to KG.

Pau needs to do more than just GET THE BALL MORE. He needs to show his defense in the post and stop those dunks. He needs to block those lay ins. He needs to get the frikken rebound.

This team, not just Pau, is so laid back except for Kobe and maybe an aging Fisher.

Bynum, can't rely on him. He's injured. If you ask me, Phil is being nice and he's actually scared to play Bynum heavy minutes because he's not 100%. Phil doesn't want Bynum to get his knees hurt again and be out another year. That's why I don't think Bynum is ready. Bynum looks like he is in PRESEASON form. He's playing soft out there while you got some thugs taking it to him and punking him down low. All you need to do is tap that knee cap and Bynum's done. So I don't blame Phil for not putting him in longer and neither should you.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#36 » by BallAboveAll » Wed May 27, 2009 2:21 pm

Gasol needs to stop getting pushed off the block. And he needs to stop passing up shots. Sometimes he touches the ball and doesn't even look at the basket.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#37 » by hermes » Wed May 27, 2009 3:39 pm

BallAboveAll wrote:Gasol needs to stop getting pushed off the block. And he needs to stop passing up shots. Sometimes he touches the ball and doesn't even look at the basket.

good point there are times when he catches the ball two feet from the 3 point line, what kind of posting up is that?
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#38 » by geevesjr » Wed May 27, 2009 4:02 pm

nastneemz81 wrote:Their thugs won't know how to handle being played physically against.


I don't think our "thugs" plan on taking a page out of your team's book :crazy:
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#39 » by KOBE_PAUER » Wed May 27, 2009 4:19 pm

Sofa King wrote:They would get him the ball more if Nene, K-mart, and Birdman would stop punking him in the post. Grow a pair and you'll get it more.

I cant understand stupids answers like this. The guy is playing amazing all the series when they pass him the ball. Averaging 62% on shooting, and 14 rebounds per game. You cant blame Gasol. The last year against the same frontcourt, Gasol destroyed them, he is dominating the game inside when the idiot guards from our team can pass the ball to the big man. The problem are players like Fisher, Farmar, Vujacic, Ariza or Odom. Absolutely useless guys passing the ball, and thats why we are playing garbage this post season. Passing the ball to Gasol more, the Lakers play better basketball.
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Re: Gasol: Big men should get ball more 

Post#40 » by semi-sentient » Wed May 27, 2009 4:34 pm

Why is it that our bigs do nothing but complain about touches?

Why isn't Gasol calling out himself and the rest of our big men out for giving up 20 offensive rebounds, which absolutely killed us whenever we went on a run? Pau got just as many touches this game as he did in the last game, yet somehow we won that game? Our bigs are simply not giving the same effort from game to game, and that includes Pau as much as anyone else.

I would agree that Pau's defense has been mostly adequate, but there is no excuse for us to get outrebounded the way we did. None whatsoever. That's all effort and focus right there. You have to show up on every possession and be ready to get that loose ball.

This team still doesn't get it. We need to give consistent effort and play defense on every possession not just focus on scoring. We flat out have the wrong mentality on this team. It's a real damn shame that Kobe is going out there giving it his all while everyone else is bitching about getting touches.

Are those touches going to prevent Denver from dropping 120 points on us or something? Cut the crap and focus on the defensive end and everything will work itself out.

BTW, I find it ironic that the only big which has had a significant drop off in rebounds from home to away games is Pau, despite him getting more touches than he has at Staples. At home he has averaged 15.5 rebounds while averaging 10.5 on the road. Odom and Bynum have had just about the same amount so there is no drop off from them. Practically everyone else on the team has seen their rebounds increase or stay about the same. Someone's just not trying as hard.
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