BIG GAME JAMES WORTHY!

[Anklebreaker702]

There is a topic on the GB under player comparisons called can you beat my all time starting five. There were a few guys that picked Big Game as their power foward. I also wanted to but I needed a pure shooter so as much as it hurt me to do so I had to go with Larry the legend.

These young newby's began to ride everybody that picked James as their SF saying LeBron would eat him alive. Now to me LeBron is not on Worthy's level as of yet. I think James would use & abuse him on the low block. You name some of the greatest defenders (LeBron is not 1 of them) there was no one in the league that could stop him. The C's wouldn't even let Bird guard him they put McHale (1 of the best defensive PF's ever on him & he misused him like an old rag doll!!

I've posted a couple of highlights to refresh those that need to be refreshed & if you're too young to remember, this is just a sample of what he can do. Yes I admit he would have trouble guarding LeBron but LeBron has absolutely no chance with Big Game down on that low block at all!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TKCxO67aGw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHkE2frHbG4

Please give your thoughts on this!

[DEEP3CL]

Oh man that was just like yesterday! Big Game for a PF has exquisite foot work, speed, agility and power. The ability he had to finish in traffic and taking contact was amazing. This new generation of fans would be crazy to think LeBron would just totally out play Big Game, the one pure and undeniable advantage Big Game has over LBJ is his ability to post him up. LBJ doesn't post even though he has an excellent frame to do so.

LBJ is probably the better skilled player as far as the triple threat he is (pass,dribble,shooting), but Big Game offensively was a load to handle...........ask Kevin McHale how it worked for him ?

[Sedale Threatt]

I absolutely loved James -- one of the quickest and best finishers I've ever seen. Efficient, always rose to the occassion, great teammate...nothing but love for J-Dub. I miss those Statue of Liberty tomohawks.

But ankle, you simply can't put him in the same category as LeBron.

James, great as he was, wasn't a legit franchise player, not in the sense that LeBron and Magic and Bird and Jordan are/were. Totally different animals. Worthy was a complimentary star, James is a front-line franchise player.

Could James have been one under different categories? Perhaps, but I doubt it. Once he lost a step, and Magic retired, his game completely fell off the table. LeBron just does so many more things better -- more skill, better athlete, significantly better all-around player period.

[Anklebreaker702]

I absolutely loved James -- one of the quickest and best finishers I've ever seen. Efficient, always rose to the occassion, great teammate...nothing but love for J-Dub. I miss those Statue of Liberty tomohawks.

But ankle, you simply can't put him in the same category as LeBron.

James, great as he was, wasn't a legit franchise player, not in the sense that LeBron and Magic and Bird and Jordan are/were. Totally different animals. Worthy was a complimentary star, James is a front-line franchise player.

Could James have been one under different categories? Perhaps, but I doubt it. Once he lost a step, and Magic retired, his game completely fell off the table. LeBron just does so many more things better -- more skill, better athlete, significantly better all-around player period.

I totally disagree. He averaged 40 PPG against the bad boy defense that is considered by many as the best, WITHOUT Magic. He never truly lost a step. The year he retired he was having his best preseason he had in years he had been suffering from tendinitis in his knee & finally got it together. We aren't talking about franchise players here Sedale, we are talking about what they would do vs. each other. As far as franchise players, you would have seen how good he really was if the Clippers had won that coin toss. This guy would have lead the league in scoring several times, trust me.

Also after Magic left the only success we had was because of Worthy. Go back & look at the series the Suns came back from down 3-1 against us, it was Worthy who ate them alive. We'll have to agree to disagree on this 1 Sedale. I'll take Worthy any day, LeBron for having that big body of his can't even post up. Give me Worthy.

[butter17]

I absolutely loved James -- one of the quickest and best finishers I've ever seen. Efficient, always rose to the occassion, great teammate...nothing but love for J-Dub. I miss those Statue of Liberty tomohawks.

But ankle, you simply can't put him in the same category as LeBron.

James, great as he was, wasn't a legit franchise player, not in the sense that LeBron and Magic and Bird and Jordan are/were. Totally different animals. Worthy was a complimentary star, James is a front-line franchise player.

Could James have been one under different categories? Perhaps, but I doubt it. Once he lost a step, and Magic retired, his game completely fell off the table. LeBron just does so many more things better -- more skill, better athlete, significantly better all-around player period.

First of all if james worthy would have been drafted by the cavs, he would be putting up lebron like numbers. J.W. went to a team that was already stacked with good players so he didn't have to put up lebron numbers. And he still put up great numbers on a talented team. If jw went to another team with less talent, he would have put up LB like numbers i really believe that.

[Sedale Threatt]

I totally disagree. He averaged 40 PPG against the bad boy defense that is considered by many as the best, WITHOUT Magic. He never truly lost a step. The year he retired he was having his best preseason he had in years he had been suffering from tendinitis in his knee & finally got it together. We aren't talking about franchise players here Sedale, we are talking about what they would do vs. each other. As far as franchise players, you would have seen how good he really was if the Clippers had won that coin toss. This guy would have lead the league in scoring several times, trust me.

Also after Magic left the only success we had was because of Worthy. Go back & look at the series the Suns came back from down 3-1 against us, it was Worthy who ate them alive. We'll have to agree to disagree on this 1 Sedale. I'll take Worthy any day, LeBron for having that big body of his can't even post up. Give me Worthy.

"This guy would have led the league in scoring several times, trust me."

But the point is, he didn't. Anything else is conjecture and projection that can't be realistically compared to things that actually have happened. I.E., your allegation that James definitively would have won a scoring title or two doesn't carry nearly as much weight as the fact that LeBron actually has.

I also think your recollection of Worthy's last few years is pretty far off. Just look at his numbers, and in particular his shooting %. His efficiency was always his best quality, and it just dried up like a pond. And as far as him "eating the Suns alive," that never happened. He scored 9, 11, 13 and 12 over the first four games. He finally broke out for 24 points in the final game, but overall that's hardly what I'd consider eating anybody alive.

I also don't recall when he averaged 40 points against the Pistons; was this in the 89 Finals? I couldn't find any box scores, but I'm almost 100% certain that never happened.

Otherwise, your whole argument for James seems to rest in the fact that he can post up better. No question that was a great quality of J-Dub's game. But that isn't nearly enough to cancel out the fact that LeBron is better across the board, in just about every category you can name, be it athletically or skill-wise.

Put another way -- nobody but a died-in-the-wool Laker fan would pick James over LeBron. None.

[Mamba Venom]

I kind of see Odom like a Worthy more than all those silly Pippen comparisons

Worthy could pass and run the floor well

[MAMBAEMD]

Big Game James...I just loved his game.
He had great hands, fantastic footwork, and was awesome and unstopable with his back to the basket. He was perfect on the wings when Magic ran the break. Those tomahok dunks were simply electrifying. He would be on my all time starting 5 without hesitation.
I would not compare him to LeBron. They are totally different players. Lebron is much more comfortable on the perimeter and has not shown us a good post game so far in his career. He may develop it in the future but does not have it so far. He is definitely a better athlete than Big Game and has a stronger frame, but there were aspect of Worthy's game that are far more superior than LeBron's IMO.

[ShowtimeFan]

First off James was a SF not a PF, Rambis and AC were the Pf's during most of the glory years.

I saw nearly every (televised) game James ever played and he was a huge asset to the Lakers winning years, he used to score most of his points in the first quarter and was typically the reason the Lakers would be up by 10 at halftime, his second half points usually tapered off as that was when Magic and Kareem got theirs and there were a ton of games when the starters would be on the bench for much of the 4th quarter for what Chick called GARBAGE TIME...

I recall James KILLING Pippen early in Pippen's career, although that shifted to favor Pippen as James slowed down. To see his numbers, follow this link:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... hja01.html

FYI: Lakers could have taken Dominique Wilkens with their first pick, which might have also worked out "OK"...

[MAMBAEMD]

^^^agree with Showtimefan with your recollection of Big Game James
Although I have to say I always thanked God knowing we could have taken Dominique but chose Worthy instead. Worthy was a skilled basketball player whereas Nique was a flashy dunker. He really did not have much of a post game which was the hallmark of Worthy's career IMO.

[LAKESHOW]

at 6-9 lighting fast. folks talk about his finish, but his first step was freakin off the charts any era quickness. he was like a mini hakeem olajuwon. several several moves and would get you in the air with pump fakes and pump fakes. then when you think hes going for a pump fake, rises up and JAMS in your face. on the break? simply awesome

[MAMBAEMD]

at 6-9 lighting fast. folks talk about his finish, but his first step was freakin off the charts any era quickness. he was like a mini hakeem olajuwon. several several moves and would get you in the air with pump fakes and pump fakes. then when you think hes going for a pump fake, rises up and JAMS in your face. on the break? simply awesome

+1
Best hands and feet I've seen in 30 years watching the NBA.

[BULLZ1LLA]

I guess it would be like when Kobe was trying to guard 39-year-old Jordan in the post at Washington and Jordan just pivoted slightly and Kobe fell flat on his back while Jordan elevated and scored. FROM SHAQ.

[Anklebreaker702]

I totally disagree. He averaged 40 PPG against the bad boy defense that is considered by many as the best, WITHOUT Magic. He never truly lost a step. The year he retired he was having his best preseason he had in years he had been suffering from tendinitis in his knee & finally got it together. We aren't talking about franchise players here Sedale, we are talking about what they would do vs. each other. As far as franchise players, you would have seen how good he really was if the Clippers had won that coin toss. This guy would have lead the league in scoring several times, trust me.

Also after Magic left the only success we had was because of Worthy. Go back & look at the series the Suns came back from down 3-1 against us, it was Worthy who ate them alive. We'll have to agree to disagree on this 1 Sedale. I'll take Worthy any day, LeBron for having that big body of his can't even post up. Give me Worthy.

"This guy would have led the league in scoring several times, trust me."

But the point is, he didn't. Anything else is conjecture and projection that can't be realistically compared to things that actually have happened. I.E., your allegation that James definitively would have won a scoring title or two doesn't carry nearly as much weight as the fact that LeBron actually has.

I also think your recollection of Worthy's last few years is pretty far off. Just look at his numbers, and in particular his shooting %. His efficiency was always his best quality, and it just dried up like a pond. And as far as him "eating the Suns alive," that never happened. He scored 9, 11, 13 and 12 over the first four games. He finally broke out for 24 points in the final game, but overall that's hardly what I'd consider eating anybody alive.

I also don't recall when he averaged 40 points against the Pistons; was this in the 89 Finals? I couldn't find any box scores, but I'm almost 100% certain that never happened.

Otherwise, your whole argument for James seems to rest in the fact that he can post up better. No question that was a great quality of J-Dub's game. But that isn't nearly enough to cancel out the fact that LeBron is better across the board, in just about every category you can name, be it athletically or skill-wise.

Put another way -- nobody but a died-in-the-wool Laker fan would pick James over LeBron. None.

You picking LeBron is conjecture as well. That's where you got me all wrong. I dont pick Lakers because i'm a Laker fan. I saw what Worthy can do. As far as those 40 PPG against the Pistons in '89 i still have the last 2 games on tape & i believe he had 40 in both. I went to NBA.COM & I could only verify 1 of the 40 point games but I'll pull out my tape to be sure. If I was wrong about that Suns series that's fine. I was so distraught about losing Magic it was hard for me to watch basketball at that time so you could be right. I'm not trying 2 down LeBron but he can't even handle Kobe in the post & he's taller & heavier. Worthy is 10 times better than Kobe in the post. So what could LeBron do with him in the post. It seems that you want to bring up everything except answering that question. Answer that 1 & we can keep going about the rest. That's what the central theme is about here. Also it looks like i'm not the only one who remembers J-Dub in the same light.

[Anklebreaker702]

Big Game James...I just loved his game.
He had great hands, fantastic footwork, and was awesome and unstopable with his back to the basket. He was perfect on the wings when Magic ran the break. Those tomahok dunks were simply electrifying. He would be on my all time starting 5 without hesitation.
I would not compare him to LeBron. They are totally different players. Lebron is much more comfortable on the perimeter and has not shown us a good post game so far in his career. He may develop it in the future but does not have it so far. He is definitely a better athlete than Big Game and has a stronger frame, but there were aspect of Worthy's game that are far more superior than LeBron's IMO.

First off James was a SF not a PF, Rambis and AC were the Pf's during most of the glory years.

I saw nearly every (televised) game James ever played and he was a huge asset to the Lakers winning years, he used to score most of his points in the first quarter and was typically the reason the Lakers would be up by 10 at halftime, his second half points usually tapered off as that was when Magic and Kareem got theirs and there were a ton of games when the starters would be on the bench for much of the 4th quarter for what Chick called GARBAGE TIME...

I recall James KILLING Pippen early in Pippen's career, although that shifted to favor Pippen as James slowed down. To see his numbers, follow this link:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... hja01.html

FYI: Lakers could have taken Dominique Wilkens with their first pick, which might have also worked out "OK"...

^^^agree with Showtimefan with your recollection of Big Game James
Although I have to say I always thanked God knowing we could have taken Dominique but chose Worthy instead. Worthy was a skilled basketball player whereas Nique was a flashy dunker. He really did not have much of a post game which was the hallmark of Worthy's career IMO.

at 6-9 lighting fast. folks talk about his finish, but his first step was freakin off the charts any era quickness. he was like a mini hakeem olajuwon. several several moves and would get you in the air with pump fakes and pump fakes. then when you think hes going for a pump fake, rises up and JAMS in your face. on the break? simply awesome

You guys get it. but showtime fan, I don't believe I said he was a PF I know he was a SF.

[daddyfivestar]

James Worthy - Career
Lebron - handful of great seasons

I'll await anointing Lebron into the pantheon of greats until he gives me a decade of it.

[Sedale Threatt]

You picking LeBron is conjecture as well. That's where you got me all wrong. I dont pick Lakers because i'm a Laker fan. I saw what Worthy can do. As far as those 40 PPG against the Pistons in '89 i still have the last 2 games on tape & i believe he had 40 in both. I went to NBA.COM & I could only verify 1 of the 40 point games but I'll pull out my tape to be sure. If I was wrong about that Suns series that's fine. I was so distraught about losing Magic it was hard for me to watch basketball at that time so you could be right. I'm not trying 2 down LeBron but he can't even handle Kobe in the post & he's taller & heavier. Worthy is 10 times better than Kobe in the post. So what could LeBron do with him in the post. It seems that you want to bring up everything except answering that question. Answer that 1 & we can keep going about the rest. That's what the central theme is about here. Also it looks like i'm not the only one who remembers J-Dub in the same light.

I haven't been able to find any boxes of the '89 Finals. My dad was stationed overseas at the time, so I couldn't watch the games. I can't necessarily take your word for it considering your recollection of the Phoenix series was so far off.

Otherwise, trust me -- I have a great recollection of Worthy's game. He was one of my favorites, as much because of his attitude and style as his skills, which were vast. He was an absolutely ideal fit for that team -- not only a perfect fast-break player, but one who could score in the halfcourt without dominating the ball. And that's not even getting into his beard and goggles.

I guess I'm just scratching my head at how many people are picking him, a Top 50 player, over one who's going to end up in the Top 10 if he stays healthy and wins enough championships.

I'm also probably confused over what the argument is -- picking an all-time team, or a game of 1-on-1. Either way, it's an easy, easy choice for me.

Could LeBron stop Worthy in the post? Probably not. But when he's locked in on defense, he can be a very formidable obstacle with insane athleticism at 6-8, 270 (50 pounds more than JW). So personally I see LeBron giving James much more problems than the other way around.

And if we're looking at it from a team standpoint, that's an even easier decision. LeBron simply does too many things as a better scorer, a better rebounder and a better passer.

[dockingsched]

st on point as usual

[Anklebreaker702]

James Worthy - Career
Lebron - handful of great seasons

I'll await anointing Lebron into the pantheon of greats until he gives me a decade of it.

Thank You!

[Anklebreaker702]

You picking LeBron is conjecture as well. That's where you got me all wrong. I dont pick Lakers because i'm a Laker fan. I saw what Worthy can do. As far as those 40 PPG against the Pistons in '89 i still have the last 2 games on tape & i believe he had 40 in both. I went to NBA.COM & I could only verify 1 of the 40 point games but I'll pull out my tape to be sure. If I was wrong about that Suns series that's fine. I was so distraught about losing Magic it was hard for me to watch basketball at that time so you could be right. I'm not trying 2 down LeBron but he can't even handle Kobe in the post & he's taller & heavier. Worthy is 10 times better than Kobe in the post. So what could LeBron do with him in the post. It seems that you want to bring up everything except answering that question. Answer that 1 & we can keep going about the rest. That's what the central theme is about here. Also it looks like i'm not the only one who remembers J-Dub in the same light.

I haven't been able to find any boxes of the '89 Finals. My dad was stationed overseas at the time, so I couldn't watch the games. I can't necessarily take your word for it considering your recollection of the Phoenix series was so far off.

Otherwise, trust me -- I have a great recollection of Worthy's game. He was one of my favorites, as much because of his attitude and style as his skills, which were vast. He was an absolutely ideal fit for that team -- not only a perfect fast-break player, but one who could score in the halfcourt without dominating the ball. And that's not even getting into his beard and goggles.

I guess I'm just scratching my head at how many people are picking him, a Top 50 player, over one who's going to end up in the Top 10 if he stays healthy and wins enough championships.

I'm also probably confused over what the argument is -- picking an all-time team, or a game of 1-on-1. Either way, it's an easy, easy choice for me.

Could LeBron stop Worthy in the post? Probably not. But when he's locked in on defense, he can be a very formidable obstacle with insane athleticism at 6-8, 270 (50 pounds more than JW). So personally I see LeBron giving James much more problems than the other way around.

And if we're looking at it from a team standpoint, that's an even easier decision. LeBron simply does too many things as a better scorer, a better rebounder and a better passer.

ST this is totally fair. You know I like going back & forth with you because it brings out the best in both of us. Now I'm a man about mine & can admit when I wasn't factual or wrong. I was wrong about the 40 PPG
after Magic went down. It was 33 PPG. He has 26 in game 3 & 40 in Game 4. Close but still wasn't 40 like I initially said so I'm manning up & admitting that.

I have to give you your props on not truly understanding the topic. The topic was about these guys saying LeBron would just use Worthy in the ground. The rebuttal is that he would have just as many problems with Worthy if not more. I understand about LBJ's weight but that's not enough to stop James. His footwork was impeccable & no one & I mean no one could stop him! Not even the best defenders. McHale was an awesome defender & could guard Center's, PF's, & SF's & shut the best of scorers down. James used to misuse & abuse him PERIOD!