Hou - Mia - LAL (Houston cashes in its vets)

[LarsV8]

To Miami
Christain Wood

To LA
Duncan Robinson
Eric Gordon
DJ Augustin

To Houston
Russel Westbrook
1st Available #1 pick from LAL - Unprotected
2024 + 2026 Miami #1 (top 8 protected)

Miami adds an impact player and dumps an expensive and regressing player in Robinson, whose playing time is being cut.

LAL turns the page on Russ and gets some actual shooters around Lebron / AD.

Houston can park Russ next to Wall on the bench and add to their asset pile to help build the team.

[Texas Chuck]

Wood is definitely not worth Robinson and 2 firsts with minimal protections. And certainly isn't worth it to a team that employs Bam.

Part of the issue here too is Miami is being asked to overpay because the Lakers don't have enough to pay for their part of this.

[K_chile22]

Lakers take this and run away laughing, way too good for them at the cost of the heat
Think a more reasonable deal would be trying to see what LAL would add to turn THT into Duncan Robinson. Unfortunately I think they're a bit too tapped out on assets to make that happen

[Godaddycurse]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

[LarsV8]

Wood is definitely not worth Robinson and 2 firsts with minimal protections. And certainly isn't worth it to a team that employs Bam.

Part of the issue here too is Miami is being asked to overpay because the Lakers don't have enough to pay for their part of this.

I took that part directly from Miami's team trade thread, with slight changes.

Happy to see a consensus building within the group for going after Christian Wood. We might have to overpay but it is what it is

Heat trade

C Omer Yurtseven
SF Duncan Robinson
PF Markieff Morris
SF KZ Okpala
2024 and 2026 top 15 protected picks

21.5 million outgoing gets us to 1.2 million under cap

for

C/PF Christian Wood
PG DJ Augustin
2nd round pick
1.7 million exception

20.6 million incoming

Wood gives us an impact big next to Bam that can score and shoot 3’s. DJ Augustin gives us a reliable vet PG behind Lowry and Vincent. We have all seen how much pressure this team is under without Lowry so it will be nice to have that insurance going into the playoffs. We will have money to sign Martin and roster spots to sign buyout depth. Can really round this team out for the stretch run.

[K_chile22]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

I don't think LAL would do this but I generally don't really value pure shooters like Robinson as much as most. My general philosophy is you want to find the shooters not pay them, they're pretty replaceable, if Lakers disagree I'd take this as Houston

[Texas Chuck]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

I don't think LAL would do this but I generally don't really value pure shooters like Robinson as much as most. My general philosophy is you want to find the shooters not pay them, they're pretty replaceable, if Lakers disagree I'd take this as Houston

Interesting on shooters. And mostly you appear to be right. The guys who are specialists who have gotten paid quickly became pretty unattractive--Bertans, Buddy. The ones kept at MLE or less remain pretty valuable.

The question is what is Robinson? Because 2 seasons ago, he had arguably one of the 5 best shooting seasons of all-time taking everything into consideration. He wasn't just a good shooter, he had an absurd season.

I have his release and off-ball movement making him more valuable than just straight catch and shoot guys and him playing off Lebron and AD feels lethal, just absolutely lethal. I'd do this so fast as the Lakers.

[ZombieKilla]

Stone would be fired before he hung up the phone if he accepted this deal.

[R-DAWG]

I like this kind of concept for Houston - because I'm a believer that in order to get a first for Eric Gordon you are going to need to take back a contract with at least 1 year left on it. My assumption is, however, that they would like to move off Teiss and Nwaba if they take on Westbrook, with LA throwing the Rockets cash for a Westbrook buyout. Getting off the last year of Nwaba and 2 years of Theiss saves HOU $22.8MM, add in the last year of Gordon and Houston sends out $42.4MM in future salary taking back an additional $4.67MM total with the Westbrook deal.

So basically for Houston, they turn Gordon and $4.67MM into a 1st rd pick, plus get Theiss money off the books a year earlier. They lose $13.7MM in cap space in 2022, but pick up $9.1MM in 2023.

It's really not a terrible return for Houston.

[LarsV8]

Stone would be fired before he hung up the phone if he accepted this deal.

How so?

[loveandbeer]

Robinson is gonna be paid $20m at the end of that deal. He averages 11ppg on very average efficiency which has been declining every season.

That's an awful contract...

No thanks from LAL.

[K_chile22]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

I don't think LAL would do this but I generally don't really value pure shooters like Robinson as much as most. My general philosophy is you want to find the shooters not pay them, they're pretty replaceable, if Lakers disagree I'd take this as Houston

Interesting on shooters. And mostly you appear to be right. The guys who are specialists who have gotten paid quickly became pretty unattractive--Bertans, Buddy. The ones kept at MLE or less remain pretty valuable.

The question is what is Robinson? Because 2 seasons ago, he had arguably one of the 5 best shooting seasons of all-time taking everything into consideration. He wasn't just a good shooter, he had an absurd season.

I have his release and off-ball movement making him more valuable than just straight catch and shoot guys and him playing off Lebron and AD feels lethal, just absolutely lethal. I'd do this so fast as the Lakers.

Right, he's the best at it but you can still get like 70% of that off the scrap heap with a bit of luck (Garrison Matthews, Max Strus are the first two that come to mind) or for MLE or less money like Shamet or Monk. I think he has some value by being elite at it but it's diluted by the high replacement level for that type of player, similar to run and dunk centers

[Texas Chuck]

I don't think LAL would do this but I generally don't really value pure shooters like Robinson as much as most. My general philosophy is you want to find the shooters not pay them, they're pretty replaceable, if Lakers disagree I'd take this as Houston

Interesting on shooters. And mostly you appear to be right. The guys who are specialists who have gotten paid quickly became pretty unattractive--Bertans, Buddy. The ones kept at MLE or less remain pretty valuable.

The question is what is Robinson? Because 2 seasons ago, he had arguably one of the 5 best shooting seasons of all-time taking everything into consideration. He wasn't just a good shooter, he had an absurd season.

I have his release and off-ball movement making him more valuable than just straight catch and shoot guys and him playing off Lebron and AD feels lethal, just absolutely lethal. I'd do this so fast as the Lakers.

Right, he's the best at it but you can still get like 70% of that off the scrap heap with a bit of luck (Garrison Matthews, Max Strus are the first two that come to mind) or for MLE or less money like Shamet or Monk. I think he has some value by being elite at it but it's diluted by the high replacement level for that type of player, similar to run and dunk centers

I won't stand here and take this Dwight Powell slander.

But yeah I just feel differently. I would pay up for the best of the best shooters. I don't know that I agree with your 70% figure, but I'd also pay for that 30% in the right situation. And Lebron James is always the right situation.

[ZombieKilla]

Stone would be fired before he hung up the phone if he accepted this deal.

How so?

There’s no way the Rockets take back Westbrook without sending out Wall.
And they certainly wouldn’t send out players that have actual positive value only to get WB back with a couple picks.
A few Rockets fans might want to totally destroy the team for future picks, but I seriously doubt the front office is that incompetent.

[Texas Chuck]

Stone would be fired before he hung up the phone if he accepted this deal.

How so?

There’s no way the Rockets take back Westbrook without sending out Wall.
And they certainly wouldn’t send out players that have actual positive value only to get WB back with a couple picks.
A few Rockets fans might want to totally destroy the team for future picks, but I seriously doubt the front office is that incompetent.

pretty sure the Rockets front office is competent enough to realize this trade isn't remotely destroying anything worth keeping. The future is clearly a couple years away at least. So getting assets for shifting some money around is certainly a reasonable approach even if you prefer to do something different.

[K_chile22]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

This actually made me question something: can protected swap options roll over? So if Miami's pick is top 4 can the swap roll to the next draft? I know it can become a 2nd (Miami's swap option with Houston is lotto protected and would become a second if Miami fell into the lotto)

[Godaddycurse]

LAL out: THT, Nunn, 2027 1st
LAL in: Robinson

Miami out: Robinson, 2024 swap top 4 protected
Miami in: Wood

Houston out: Wood
Houston in: THT, Nunn, LAL 2027 1st, MIA 2024 swap top 4 protected

This actually made me question something: can protected swap options roll over? So if Miami's pick is top 4 can the swap roll to the next draft? I know it can become a 2nd (Miami's swap option with Houston is lotto protected and would become a second if Miami fell into the lotto)

Maybe phrase it choice of 2024 or 2025 swap?

[supertruck97]

How so?

There’s no way the Rockets take back Westbrook without sending out Wall.
And they certainly wouldn’t send out players that have actual positive value only to get WB back with a couple picks.
A few Rockets fans might want to totally destroy the team for future picks, but I seriously doubt the front office is that incompetent.

pretty sure the Rockets front office is competent enough to realize this trade isn't remotely destroying anything worth keeping. The future is clearly a couple years away at least. So getting assets for shifting some money around is certainly a reasonable approach even if you prefer to do something different.

This is more than shifting money around. This is pissing value down the drain for the benefit of the Lakers.

Gordon by himself is worth an expiring and either a late 1st or a high 2nd.
Wood by himself is worth an expiring and mid-1st.

This deal has those 2 1sts coming in 2027 (Lakers) and 2026 (Miami). 4+ years away.

The remaining is taking on Westbrooks Supermax for the grand total benefit of Miami's 1st, 2 years from now. $45M in dead weight next year for likely a late 1st in 2024. That's not shifting assets. That's career suicide for a GM.

[Karmaloop]

Interesting on shooters. And mostly you appear to be right. The guys who are specialists who have gotten paid quickly became pretty unattractive--Bertans, Buddy. The ones kept at MLE or less remain pretty valuable.

The question is what is Robinson? Because 2 seasons ago, he had arguably one of the 5 best shooting seasons of all-time taking everything into consideration. He wasn't just a good shooter, he had an absurd season.

I have his release and off-ball movement making him more valuable than just straight catch and shoot guys and him playing off Lebron and AD feels lethal, just absolutely lethal. I'd do this so fast as the Lakers.

I'm with chile on this one. I just can't fathom spending that kind of coin on a shooter no matter how badly the Lakers need/want more shooters on the court with LeBron and AD. But I think the bigger problem is there isn't even a ball handler coming back the Lakers way unless you plan on having Augustin or Gordon running point.

[BBallFreak]

Miami isn't trading two first round picks for Wood, no matter what one poster on our board says. That's far too high an asking price. It's clearly the Lakers that needs to pay, here.