Domas to the Spurs

[SNPA]

You described him the same way but with a fluffy connotation. People can read.



No, for a person who's chastizing folks for not reading, you didn't seem to read this. I described your justification for why Sabonis fits with Wemby as a 2000s mentality. Sabonis is a center, just like Wemby is. Wemby could play spot minutes at PF, sure. If the Spurs have a low-investment option to experiment that's fine. That's why drafting Queen would be different, because if he's just the backup center, that's fine for the 14th pick. They didn't trade other rotation players to add him. They didn't commit a big salary to him. If Sabonis was a 20 mpg player, in contrast, it would be a disaster.



So it should be clear now that you didn't read my post correctly. I specifically didn't say I wanted Queen to play PF next to Wemby. That's basically the opposite of the point I was making. The Spurs need a backup center -- that's arguably their biggest need going into the draft barring any trades. So using their second pick on such a player is fine, whether that player ends up being able to play with Wemby or not. The Spurs are not taking up salary that should be going to the rest of the team, including their future PF. It gives them flexibility and talent. If they're going to do more, it needs to be with a person who fits, and Sabonis is not, for all the reasons both of us have said.

lol. No. I described Sabonis based on reality and you described some fictional player and argued against that make believe player.

As for the deep analysis of they are both centers therefore it must fail blah blah…yeah. Not impressive. They’d be the best frontline in basketball and it wouldn’t be close. People are massively underselling the versatility and skill of these two guys. Anyhow…good luck with Queen.

If Sabonis could play the 4 he would. He has already proven he can't. Similarly, the Spurs already tried Wemby at the 4 and realised it neutered everything that made him special. Both are 5s. Period. So leaving aside how good Sabonis actually is, the trade doesn't work for the Spurs either. They're not throwing away valuable assets to get a back-up to Wemby.

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

[One_and_Done]

lol. No. I described Sabonis based on reality and you described some fictional player and argued against that make believe player.

As for the deep analysis of they are both centers therefore it must fail blah blah…yeah. Not impressive. They’d be the best frontline in basketball and it wouldn’t be close. People are massively underselling the versatility and skill of these two guys. Anyhow…good luck with Queen.

If Sabonis could play the 4 he would. He has already proven he can't. Similarly, the Spurs already tried Wemby at the 4 and realised it neutered everything that made him special. Both are 5s. Period. So leaving aside how good Sabonis actually is, the trade doesn't work for the Spurs either. They're not throwing away valuable assets to get a back-up to Wemby.

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

[SNPA]

If Sabonis could play the 4 he would. He has already proven he can't. Similarly, the Spurs already tried Wemby at the 4 and realised it neutered everything that made him special. Both are 5s. Period. So leaving aside how good Sabonis actually is, the trade doesn't work for the Spurs either. They're not throwing away valuable assets to get a back-up to Wemby.

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

If the Spurs can get perfect players they should do that, Sabonis does have flaws. That’s just not normally how it works.

The argument I’m putting forward is they compliment each other. It’s not a one way street. You have a bruiser, monster rebounder who is a great passer and can operate on the perimeter, combined with an athletic freak who is going to play more like a wing than a traditional big.

Kings fans have long agreed the players to pair with Sabonis are JJJ, Chet types. Well..VW is just the ultimate version.

Sabonis makes VWs life easier, not harder.

[One_and_Done]

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

If the Spurs can get perfect players they should do that, Sabonis does have flaws. That’s just not normally how it works.

The argument I’m putting forward is they compliment each other. It’s not a one way street. You have a bruiser, monster rebounder who is a great passer and can operate on the perimeter, combined with an athletic freak who is going to play more like a wing than a traditional big.

Kings fans have long agreed the players to pair with Sabonis are JJJ, Chet types. Well..VW is just the ultimate version.

Sabonis makes VWs life easier, not harder.

You could as easily say Westbrook or Simmons 'complement' Wemby, because each brings something he doesn't have like passing or perimeter D. It wouldn't make the decision to acquire them any less irrational.

Sabonis makes Wemby's life harder compared to a more optimal fit. Heck, Harrison Barnes might be a more optimal fit. Certainly Harrison Barnes age 25 would be. It's not like they need to find unicorn here, just someone who enhances Wemby more than he kills him. Sabonis is not that player.

[SNPA]

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

If the Spurs can get perfect players they should do that, Sabonis does have flaws. That’s just not normally how it works.

The argument I’m putting forward is they compliment each other. It’s not a one way street. You have a bruiser, monster rebounder who is a great passer and can operate on the perimeter, combined with an athletic freak who is going to play more like a wing than a traditional big.

Kings fans have long agreed the players to pair with Sabonis are JJJ, Chet types. Well..VW is just the ultimate version.

Sabonis makes VWs life easier, not harder.

You could as easily say Westbrook or Simmons 'complement' Wemby, because each brings something he doesn't have like passing or perimeter D. It wouldn't make the decision to acquire them any less irrational.

Sabonis makes Wemby's life harder compared to a more optimal fit. Heck, Harrison Barnes might be a more optimal fit. Certainly Harrison Barnes age 25 would be. It's not like they need to find unicorn here, just someone who enhances Wemby more than he kills him. Sabonis is not that player.

Disagree on all of it. Westbrook and Simmons are negative players. Sabonis is an all nba type.

The Barnes part I don’t get either. Sabonis and VW won’t play 48 together every night. There’s plenty of room for a couple complimentary archetypes. It’s not an either or situation.

[One_and_Done]

If the Spurs can get perfect players they should do that, Sabonis does have flaws. That’s just not normally how it works.

The argument I’m putting forward is they compliment each other. It’s not a one way street. You have a bruiser, monster rebounder who is a great passer and can operate on the perimeter, combined with an athletic freak who is going to play more like a wing than a traditional big.

Kings fans have long agreed the players to pair with Sabonis are JJJ, Chet types. Well..VW is just the ultimate version.

Sabonis makes VWs life easier, not harder.

You could as easily say Westbrook or Simmons 'complement' Wemby, because each brings something he doesn't have like passing or perimeter D. It wouldn't make the decision to acquire them any less irrational.

Sabonis makes Wemby's life harder compared to a more optimal fit. Heck, Harrison Barnes might be a more optimal fit. Certainly Harrison Barnes age 25 would be. It's not like they need to find unicorn here, just someone who enhances Wemby more than he kills him. Sabonis is not that player.

Disagree on all of it. Westbrook and Simmons are negative players. Sabonis is an all nba type.

The Barnes part I don’t get either. Sabonis and VW won’t play 48 together every night. There’s plenty of room for a couple complimentary archetypes. It’s not an either or situation.

They won't play a minute together because this trade will never happen.

[SNPA]

You could as easily say Westbrook or Simmons 'complement' Wemby, because each brings something he doesn't have like passing or perimeter D. It wouldn't make the decision to acquire them any less irrational.

Sabonis makes Wemby's life harder compared to a more optimal fit. Heck, Harrison Barnes might be a more optimal fit. Certainly Harrison Barnes age 25 would be. It's not like they need to find unicorn here, just someone who enhances Wemby more than he kills him. Sabonis is not that player.

Disagree on all of it. Westbrook and Simmons are negative players. Sabonis is an all nba type.

The Barnes part I don’t get either. Sabonis and VW won’t play 48 together every night. There’s plenty of room for a couple complimentary archetypes. It’s not an either or situation.

They won't play a minute together because this trade will never happen.

Agreed. But likely more because Sabonis isn’t available than Pop wouldn’t want him.

FYI- I called Barnes as a Pop guy almost two years before the Spurs got him. Pop guys are actually easy to spot. Sabonis is a Pop guy. I.e. he is over himself (no big ego), is highly coach able and flexible in his role, and he processes the game quickly. Pop wants guys willing to be stars in their roles…Sabonis screams that type, it’s who he is.

[Chinook]

Pop's not the GM of the Spurs. He's been the head exec for the team for decades. Him retiring as coach doesn't mean he's now gonna pull a Pat Riley. It's just another thing that's easy to miss if you don't follow the Spurs, just like thinking Wemby and Sabonis fit together. It comes from only knowing the team superficially. That's completely understandable, but it becomes obvious pretty quickly

[sackings916]

If Sabonis could play the 4 he would. He has already proven he can't. Similarly, the Spurs already tried Wemby at the 4 and realised it neutered everything that made him special. Both are 5s. Period. So leaving aside how good Sabonis actually is, the trade doesn't work for the Spurs either. They're not throwing away valuable assets to get a back-up to Wemby.

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

[One_and_Done]

With VW weak-side it’s all about matchups. Sabonis can run guys off the line if he has the greatest shot blocker ever behind him. It won’t be an issue. It’s actually an advantage because Sabonis can take and dish out the physicality by matchup keeping VW from being banged up.

Why am I having to explain this on this board?

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

[SNPA]

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

That’s a desperate response. Totally devoid of any attempt at an argument.

Two seasons ago Sabonis led the best offense in NBA history to that point. I’ll write it again for those in the back, Sabonis was the main hub for the best offense in history two seasons ago.

[One_and_Done]

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

That’s a desperate response. Totally devoid of any attempt at an argument.

Two seasons ago Sabonis led the best offense in NBA history to that point. I’ll write it again for those in the back, Sabonis was the main hub for the best offense in history two seasons ago.

These days the best and worst offense is set every new year. Sabonis is a good hub for a RS offense as the 5, but he goes to die in the playoffs. He's also not going to be leading good RS offenses at the 4.

[SNPA]

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

That’s a desperate response. Totally devoid of any attempt at an argument.

Two seasons ago Sabonis led the best offense in NBA history to that point. I’ll write it again for those in the back, Sabonis was the main hub for the best offense in history two seasons ago.

These days the best and worst offense is set every new year. Sabonis is a good hub for a RS offense as the 5, but he goes to die in the playoffs. He's also not going to be leading good RS offenses at the 4.

There’s meat here. I respect it. Sabonis has left questions around his post season performances. That’s a legit criticism.

How that’s play out next to VW we could debate.

[sackings916]

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

I don’t buy it. We hear this narrative all the time, but what facts back this up? The fact is the Kings best player is Sabonis, and until they get a legit number one guy their ceiling will always be limited. This is a talent issue, not skillset. Sabonis ideal fit is behind a number one scoring option surrounded by plus defenders, and that ceiling is a championship contender.

[Sactowndog]

It's not your fault. Alot of people make this mistake.

When you have a special player, the goal is to put guys around him to accentuate their strengths. People will often make this mistake; they take a flawed player, say Ben Simmons, and ask 'who would make him playable?' And a guy like Wemby would indeed make Simmons much more playable... but it neuters the very advantages that make Wemby so special. What you want to do is surround Wemby with guys who make him even better, not use his specialness to allow flawed players to exist around him.

Sabonis is a flawed player. The Spurs should have little interest in him generally, but certainly not when he plays the same position as their franchise player.

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

Curious what you think his strengths and weakness are?

I would say his best strength are dribble hand-off screens to get team mates open. He is 10th in the league in assists. Last two seasons he shot .379 and .417 from 3. He also among the league leaders in rebounding with almost twice as many as Wemby because he can’t be moved.

If you don’t want him fine but your comments about not a fit with Wemby to me are nonsensical.

[sackings916]

You’re right in that Sabonis has flaws, and outside of maybe 10 guys in the league every player is flawed. The fact is that Sabonis strengths HEAVILY outweigh his flaws, as evidenced by about every advanced metric and the fact that Sabonis finished in the top 10 in VORP, W/S, BPM and PER. There were only FOUR guys in the entire league that finished in the top 10 of each category. The other 3 besides Sabonis? Jokic, SGA, and Giannis.

His strengths won't outweigh his weaknesses next to Wemby. His ideal fit is as the starting 5 for a 40 win team with a limited ceiling and no playoff aspirations.

Curious what you think his strengths and weakness are?

I would say his best strength are dribble hand-off screens to get team mates open. He is 10th in the league in assists. Last two seasons he shot .379 and .417 from 3. He also among the league leaders in rebounding with almost twice as many as Wemby because he can’t be moved.

If you don’t want him fine but your comments about not a fit with Wemby to me are nonsensical.

I would say his biggest strength is his physicality and strength combined with elite basketball IQ, his speed as a center is vastly underrated, and that plus his unlimited motor make him a beast. But all we hear about is he doesn’t block shots lol. And according to one and done, these traits will somehow disappear if he’s next to Wemby.