bulls-lakers

[dflaschberger]

As a bulls fan I know that our future is probably not now, but in the future. I honestly think we are the 3rd best team in the East right now, but in with a group of clubs like Orlando and Cleveland. Detroit and Boston will rule the conference for 2 years before their vets start to decline. I want us to be competitive for this and next year, then ready for a five year run (at least) as top dog.

I also know the lakers future is now, while kobe is in his prime. They are close out West, but need a little more. Therefore:

Noc and JSmith for Kwame, Critterton and their #1 this year (top 8 protection?)

Why?
The lakers get a nice starting 3 in Noc-Ariza is a bench player. Noc would fit perfect in the triangle and is tough (Kobe and Phil would like him). Smith is a VERY good backup big, another nice fit in LA.

They give up a nice prospect in Critterton but don't have time to develop him with fisher and Farmer. their #1 will be around 20-not likely to be an impact player for them right away. They have a short window to get to the top, but it's possible. Plus, smith's deal expires right when Bynum is ready for his (max?) extension.


For the bulls, it does many things;
1. a possible 3rd guard for kirk and ben-critteton has size
2. frees up $ for deng and gordon
3. frees up minutes to develop thomas, noah, thabo and gray

I love Noc and Smith, but I feel we are a second round exit at best this year. We would still make the playoffs this year, possibly advance, but have a brighter future with this deal. the pick plus our pick help us land 1 more future big and a backup 2/3 who can shoot

[Cliff Levingston]

We really only need to get rid of one guy from the front court. Cliff Levingston's order of preference would be:

1. Wallace (even though he's made a nice resurgence under Boylan)
2. Nocioni (solid player but not a good fit for us)

Joe Smith is on a short, MLE deal and had been playing very well for us. Furthermore, his reliable 18 foot and in jump shot really helps us space the floor and run the pick and roll.

In other words, there's not nearly enough value coming back in this trade for Cliff Levingston.

[warren weel im]

I have to say its a tempting offer. The Lakers could use Joe Smith being a bruiser at the 4 spot and Nocioni being a very sound defensive shooter.

However, there are several things that need to be ironed out.

1. the trade doesn't work because of Noc's BYC status.
2. Lakers cannot accept MORE salary for non-impact big names because of the tax. Meaning, the Lakers will have to send more salary back.
3. Lakers would have loaded contracts that span out to 2010 where a projected investment is said to be in the works.

Counter-offer:

Joe Smith + Joakim Noah + Adrian Griffin
-- for --
Kwame Brown + JCritt + 08 1st [top 10 protected]

[dflaschberger]

i think it would work. Kwame and JC are about $11 million, Smith and Noc would be $13.5 or so. So the lakers fit, the bulls can only take back 1/2 of noc's deal, so I think it works there also

Cliff-I see your point, but do you see mine about the near future? I am an optimist, but I don't see us in the Finals this year or maybe even next year. However, I do see us in the playoffs, even after this deal

kirk/duhon/Critterton
duhon/Ben/thabo
Deng/TThomas/Thabo (Noah has been guarding 3's also)
Noah/TThomas
Wallace/Gray/Kwame

We free up $ and give our guys minutes. Noah proved last nite he is ready to play 20 minutes a game, probably more. Gray is ready for 15 a nite-wallace needs his.

This deal is a small step back for a possible big step up, allowing our young bigs to develop and get our future 3rd guard

[Cliff Levingston]

i think it would work. Kwame and JC are about $11 million, Smith and Noc would be $13.5 or so. So the lakers fit, the bulls can only take back 1/2 of noc's deal, so I think it works there also

Cliff-I see your point, but do you see mine about the near future? I am an optimist, but I don't see us in the Finals this year or maybe even next year. However, I do see us in the playoffs, even after this deal

kirk/duhon/Critterton
duhon/Ben/thabo
Deng/TThomas/Thabo (Noah has been guarding 3's also)
Noah/TThomas
Wallace/Gray/Kwame

We free up $ and give our guys minutes. Noah proved last nite he is ready to play 20 minutes a game, probably more. Gray is ready for 15 a nite-wallace needs his.

This deal is a small step back for a possible big step up, allowing our young bigs to develop and get our future 3rd guard

Cliff Levingston can see the logic but still wouldn't do it. It's not like Smith and Noc are complete chumps that you're looking to completely dump their salary, which is what you're doing here. Crittenton wouldn't see the court this year but he's a decent fit, but you're getting him to play behind Hinrich and Gordon and to compete with Sefolosha for minutes. The first rounder we get from the Lakers would be in the 20's which will net us another bench player that we won't need.

As said, Cliff Levingston could handle dumping Nocioni cause he's a very incomplete player without a true effective position. Joe Smith however is a legit PF with range to 18 feet and can be a nice vet to have for the next 4 years.

If you're looking to package Nocioni and Smith, then get a useful big man back and/or another useful 2. We only need to trade one of Smith, Nocioni or Wallace to create sufficient playing time for Gray, Noah and Thomas.

Joe Smith + Joakim Noah + Adrian Griffin
-- for --
Kwame Brown + JCritt + 08 1st [top 10 protected]

The Bulls aren't going to use a recent lottery pick to dump a guy they don't want to dump. This deal is downright dreadful for the Bulls.

[dflaschberger]

i like smith too cliff, but I heard Critterton is VERY highly thought of-if he's not a top prospect for 2 years down the road, then losing smith and noc is too much.

I also think LA is one kobe ankle turn away from a late lottery spot, with Portland, NO and Houston also wanting one of the final 2 spots in the west

[Cliff Levingston]

I also think LA is one kobe ankle turn away from a late lottery spot

You could apply that logic to any team with a star player on it.

[dflaschberger]

yes cliff, but why not? It is a risk, but with NO and Port looking like playoff teams, and Hou certainly having enough talent to get in-I could see LA slipping to a #12 or 13 pick-couldn't you.

Not likely, but not impossible

[Cliff Levingston]

yes cliff, but why not? It is a risk, but with NO and Port looking like playoff teams, and Hou certainly having enough talent to get in-I could see LA slipping to a #12 or 13 pick-couldn't you.

No.

- Kobe is one of the best conditioned athletes in sport and rarely gets seriously hurt.
- Andrew Bynum is the real deal and will only continue to get better.
- Phil Jackson is one of the best coaches in NBA history.

[dflaschberger]

I see Dallas, Suns, Spurs still above them by season's end. I see Utah and Denver also finishing higher. That leaves the lakers, rockets, NO, portland and GS fighting for 3 spots-maybe utah added to a group fighting for 4 spots.

I know the lakers should finish b/w 5-7-which would mean the pick comes in around 22 or so. However, my point is, a slip and we move up to the late lottery. W/out Kobe for 2 weeks and the lakers might slip down a bunch, plus they have a tougher 2nd half schedule-
Of course, my deal lessens the chance of them slipping, but it is still possible (and not 1% possible-it could happen)

[chefy]

lal

nocioni,thomas

brown,radmanovic,1st,

chi

brown,radmanovic,lal's1st, sea's2nd

nocioni,smith,thabo

sea

smith,thabo

thomas,2nd