Wade To Portland..?

[zong]

Wade would hate to play in the west, too much hard-nosed defence will kill the kid in half a dozen years

[Spykes]

The most important question imo is... Why has this thread made it to 7 pages?!

Miami isn't trading Wade and Portland isn't going to trade what it will take to get him. End of story. I don't know how something that simple creates 7 pages of dialog.

[kookie_819]

I hate both your teams so maybe I can be a bit objective? And I grew up hating the Huskies.


Wade is most definitely in the top ten discussions, and he's an amazing player when healthy and 100%, but can someone tell me the last time Wade was 100%?



Roy isn't exactly chump change, he is going to be a very big star in his own right and Oden will have a lot to do with that. Much like Shaq had to do with Wade.


Wade didn't make his star all by himself he had the diesel's coat tails to help get him there.


I don't think Miami fan is giving Roy near the credit he deserves because if I'm Portland I wouldn't do a Roy for Wade trade straight across. Mostly because the guy is starting to look like he's Tmacs lost twin when it comes to injuries.

Look at their numbers.

Roy
PPG 19.3
RPG 4.5
APG 5.7
SPG 0.9
BPG 0.2
TO 1.85
FG% 0.456
FT% 0.791
3P% 0.339
MPG 37.0

Wade
PPG 25.0
RPG 4.2
APG 6.8
SPG 1.9
BPG 0.8
TO 4.41
FG% 0.469
FT% 0.748
3P% 0.259
MPG 38.2

Wade has three more buckets, one more dime, one more theft, but close to three more fumbles. Wade has the edge but it is a small edge.

Wade doesn't have much help so he has to shoot a lot he also turns it over a lot. But if I'm looking to the future even if this is a Wade for Roy straight across I'd just hang on to Roy. Why rock the boat when things are rolling?

Wade has his ring and he was amazing in the playoffs but you know the expression.

What have you done for me lately?

Fair argument, but I must point out that the whole injury thing also implies to Roy as well. Remember, he only played 57 games last season, and has rumors of injuries from his college days.

You explained well about Wade's turnovers. He has absolutely zero help, so he has to do things by himself. It's like Dwight last season. None of his teammates were stepping up, so he tried to force through double teams, which led to so many turnovers.

And about Oden, only time will tell. He might be a David Robinson, or a Sam Bowie. He's already had a broken hand and a microfracture surgery before he turned 20 years old. That's pretty bad. Amare, after he came back from his injuries, looked slower and less explosive. This is what we might see with Oden.

You're right, it's a "What have you done for me lately" league, but Roy hasn't done much, really, at least until he makes the playoffs (very likely this season) or he has a ring. And it's not like Wade is doing nothing right now; even with injuries, he's trying to do everything he can to get his team a win, but his teammates fail to help him. Also, if I recall correctly, Oden has done nothing at all to consider him a future great player or having #3 trade value in the entire NBA , so it applies to him too I guess.

[DeezXXnutZ]

^^What did Oden do in his freshmen year at Ohio St...Only take them too the Final Four..Not to mention dominate Noah and Hortford (The #3 and #9 picks in the draft)

[kookie_819]

^^What did Oden do in his freshmen year at Ohio St...Only take them too the Final Four..Not to mention dominate Noah and Hortford (The #3 and #9 picks in the draft)

That's before his microfracture, and college success does not necessarily translate to success in the NBA, so whatever he did in Ohio State is not of concern to me now.

[BBallFreak]

^^What did Oden do in his freshmen year at Ohio St...Only take them too the Final Four..Not to mention dominate Noah and Hortford (The #3 and #9 picks in the draft)

What did Wade do two years ago?

[Flash is the Future]

Wade would hate to play in the west, too much hard-nosed defence will kill the kid in half a dozen years

That's always been a poor argument to me. The East has the slow it down, grind it out defensive teams. The West has the fastbreaking offensive teams. Because of that, Wade, Kobe, and Lebron have consistently played their best ball against the West.

[RoxFan08]

-= original quote snipped =-


That's always been a poor argument to me. The East has the slow it down, grind it out defensive teams. The West has the fastbreaking offensive teams. Because of that, Wade, Kobe, and Lebron have consistently played their best ball against the West.

Eh, the Jazz and Warriors play hack a Yao pretty fiercely when we play them. New Orleans too. At least the East teams play some semblance of clean. Sloan tells his players to play dirty. Can you tell I hate the Jazz? (wth, they shoulda changed their name after moving from New Orleans. At least Houston Rockets makes sense. Utah Jazz???)

[Tiggo Bitties]

Just for the record...

Deez does not speak for all Blazers fans so please dont lump us all together like someone did earlier in this thread.

He's on his own here.

Miami isnt trading Wade and Portland isnt trading what it would take to get him so this entire thread is some weak sauce.

[miller31time]

The original offer is absurd.

The 2nd offer I saw in this thread (Wade for Roy and LMA) is overpaying on Portland's part. Miami would have to think about it, like any team would think about any proposed trade, but they would then accept it.

[zong]

-= original quote snipped =-


That's always been a poor argument to me. The East has the slow it down, grind it out defensive teams. The West has the fastbreaking offensive teams. Because of that, Wade, Kobe, and Lebron have consistently played their best ball against the West.

right, i forgot the refs carry whistles, and there's more than 1 ref

whistles + wade = good outcomes in the west

but seriously, miami shouldnt trade Wade when they already know what he can get them: the ultimate prize!

[Village Idiot]

What a bizzare thread.

The original proposal is clearly a bad one for both teams. Miami needs a go to guy not two complimentary players. Portland has a go-to-guy who is arguably just as good as Wade in Roy and doesn't need another. Portland needs Aldridge at the high-post to run the pick and roll. Outlaw is a very useful piece as well. Next to Wade those to guys could push Miami back to the top. Without him they'd only be good players without a leader.

What are we to surmise from the Heat fans arguments defending their poor record this year? I have a hard time believing Wade is playing injured. To allow a player to get on the court prematurely leaves them open to all sorts of liability issues. Surely he is closer to 90% than 70-75%. His statistics this year are only slightly down from last year. Same goes Shaq. What's left? Kapono, Walker and Posey? 8-32?

[wiff]

Sweet I was hoping this thread wasn't locked yet.

-= original quote snipped =-

Fair argument, but I must point out that the whole injury thing also implies to Roy as well. Remember, he only played 57 games last season, and has rumors of injuries from his college days.

You explained well about Wade's turnovers. He has absolutely zero help, so he has to do things by himself. It's like Dwight last season. None of his teammates were stepping up, so he tried to force through double teams, which led to so many turnovers.

Sure I can see your point with Roy being injury proned too.

And I can see your point when you say Wade doesn't have any help so he is pressing.

But look at the Blazers! Take a good look at the team. The youngest team in the league. I don't really see a ton of help for Roy either. I don't see a single All-Star on that team. Other than Roy this year.

I already broke down the stats Wade vs Roy now let's look at the other starting 4 players and 6th man.

C Shaq 14.2pts and 7.8rebs
C Przybilla 4.8pts and 7.2rebs
Advantage Heat

PF Haslem 12.5pts and 9.4rebs
PF LMA 17.3pts and 7.4rebs
Small advantage Blazers

SF Dorell Wright 6.6pts and 4.6rebs
SF Martell Webster 10.9pts and 4.1
Small advantage Blazers

PG J Will 8.9pts and 5asts
PG Jack 9.7pts and 3.7asts
Push

6th Ricky Davis 14.2pts and 4.3rebs
6th Travis Outlaw 12.9pts and 5.2rebs
Push

Grand Total
Heat 56.4pts, 26.1rebs and 5asts
Blazers 55.6pts, 23.9pts and 3.7asts

So where is all this help that Roy is getting that Wade isn't? Plus Roy is doing it in the West.

Is it the coaching? Is Nate a better coach than Riley? Doubt it.

So if Wade is such a superior player to Roy that the Blazers would need to throw in their second best player LMA before the Heat even come to the table, why is it that Roy's team has a much better record and in the West?

Could it be that Roy and Wade are actually on the same playing field when it comes to talent? After looking at the numbers I'd say Roy does more for his team than Wade is doing for the Heat.

Plus we West Coast guys know you East coasters don't stay up late enough to watch the games out here.

[Spykes]

Jarrett Jack isn't starting for the Blazers wiff, Steve Blake is.

Also, I'm not a 100% on this, but I don't think Wright is starting for the Heat.

I don't think that'll change the outcome of the point you're trying to make at all, but it would probably help to make sure you have all the players right.

[VintaGe36]

Stats are fine, but you can't expect a team, that was already old and not EXTREMELY deep to begin with to continue to play well when you use arguably your best perimeter defender(Posey) Your best 3pt Shooter(Kapano) and a solid Vet who can do both things above (Eddie Jones)

Jwill is a year older, and injured this year.

Him and Jack in terms of Stats are a push, but in terms of on court effect, I can't imagine how they are a push.

Wade can only do so much.

IMO the Heat are a GREAT team on paper, but lack chemistry,

Shaq has a history of coming into camp overweight and taking a while to get into a groove, PLUS he has his divorce this year.

MIA traded for Ricky Davis and Mark Blount, two new players(even if one doesn't get PT) who need to gel.

Wade was out for a while and is back.

Cook is a rookie trying to learn his role in the NBA.

That team is FAR From stable, whereas POR has had addition by subtraction ditching Randolph.

Blake was a Blazer once before, I can't see the transition being THAT hard.

Roy has been great and Travis Outlaw has made GARGANCION strides this year.

Webster has improved as well.

REALLY IMO, two different teams to compare.

One is on the rise, with young players meshing, and the other is the opposite.

hope that made some sense.

[BBallFreak]

C Shaq 14.2pts and 7.8rebs
C Przybilla 4.8pts and 7.2rebs
Advantage Heat

Forgot another stat, didn't you? Ya know, games played. Shaq has been in and out of the lineup all season long. He's now out another two weeks.

SF Dorell Wright 6.6pts and 4.6rebs
SF Martell Webster 10.9pts and 4.1
Small advantage Blazers

Games played? 3 point percentage? On a team with Shaq and Wade, that's can't be overstated. But hey, if the advantage is so small, we'll trade you Wright and a second rounder for Webster.

PG J Will 8.9pts and 5asts
PG Jack 9.7pts and 3.7asts
Push

Again, field goal percentage and games played have to be taken into account.

6th Ricky Davis 14.2pts and 4.3rebs
6th Travis Outlaw 12.9pts and 5.2rebs
Push

It's been well established that Ricky Davis is a moron. I'm willing to bet Portland fans wouldn't say the same of Outlaw. And that doesn't take into account the fact that Channing Frye is playing whereas Zo is done, and that James Jones is doing a wonderful job of stretching a defense.

Seriously, comparing teams by their stats and not considering all the stats is exceedingly disingenuous. It's hard to call what Wade has help when they're missing games left and right, don't compliment his game, and shoot horrible percentages from the field...

[Teddy KGB]

If this is all that it takes to get D-Wade, Dallas offers either:

Nowitzki + Terry for Wade + Haslem

or

Howard + Harris + 2 1sts [08, '10, unprotected] for Wade and Blount

[wiff]

Wade can only do so much.

[b]IMO the Heat are a GREAT team on paper, but lack chemistry,]/b]

Shaq has a history of coming into camp overweight and taking a while to get into a groove, PLUS he has his divorce this year.

Not trying to poke holes or anything but didn't Shaq actaully come into camp this season in relatively decent shape for the guy?

And if it's just chemisty with the bench players a couple of small trades should right the ship.

I know the stats don't tell the whole story, but I think most of you could see where I was going with my point.

Portland even though they are young and are any better stas wise with those basics stats of "starting players" and 6th man have some how put together a successful team where Miami hasn't

Sure Shaq has been hurt but he has played in a bunch of games too and how is their record when he has been playing?

And if it simply comes down to chemistry it shouldn't be that hard to fix.