Offers for Kyrie Irving

MNRunLeft · Post #101 » by **MNRunLeft** » Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:47 pm

KGboss wrote:Maybe Kyrie isnt worth a 3 time all star champion, 2 time assist leader, 2nd team all defensive player. You guys are really minimizing who he is. I understand the injury and he is an expiring - but saying one isnt worth the other is complete BS. If anything Ainge should be the one asking for extras in that trade considering. When Rondo is healthy he is a top 15 player in the league and top 5 playoff performer. Saying he isnt worth Irving is pretty laughable.

So saying a 21 year old all star with a year left on his rookie contract has more trade value than a 27 year old all star coming off a torn ACL and a year away from UFA is laughable? Certainly think it depends on the direction of the team, consider may prefer Rondo (if healthy) but teams in the rebuilding proccess would certainly value Irving higher imo.

MNRunLeft · Post #102 » by **MNRunLeft** » Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:53 pm

jbk1234 wrote:
rugbyrugger23 wrote:To Cavs: Rubio, Barea (or choose filler), and Jones (plus 1-2 first rounders from OKC)
-Cavs get Rubio to pair with scoring Waiters, and Rubio has proven to play very well in 2 guard set. Plus dump Jack contract (which I am assuming is considered negative for team like Cavs).

To Wolves: Westbrook, Jack and Perkins
-Wolves get scoring PG in Westbrook and Love's best bud to keep him in MN plus add Jack to upgrade worst bench in NBA.

To OKC: Kyrie, Pek, Bud or Brewer
-Thunder get a scoring PG in Kyrie that absorbs Westbrook loss but on rookie deal. Kyrie fits great with Lamb for a interesting-young backcourt. Pek is the HUGE upgrade over Perkins and Brewer/Bud is nice upgrade to bench.

Unless Love is coming back the Wolves have nothing that would make Cleveland trade Irving.

Agree the Wolves don't have the assest that would fit Clevelands need in a Irving deal while keeping Love. But in the proprosed deal above I can't imagine why the Wolves simply wouldn't cut OKC out and replace Jones and the picks with Shabazz and Deng. Again not saying Cleveland would accept but from Wolves prespective Irving + Pek >> Westbrook + Perkins.

Lateral Quicks · Post #103 » by **Lateral Quicks** » Fri Jan 31, 2014 11:11 pm

If Kyrie was as good as people think he is, Cleveland wouldn't by so bad. There are a lot of better point guards in the league right now.

CB-Blazer · Post #104 » by **CB-Blazer** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 2:27 am

Some of these deals are crazy. Kylie isn't going to bring in substantially more than Paul, Howard, Melo, Deron, etc did, which some of these deals offer way more.

I like Kyrie, but he is being pretty overrated in this thread.

DowJones · Post #105 » by **DowJones** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 6:40 am

CB-Blazer wrote:Some of these deals are crazy. Kylie isn't going to bring in substantially more than Paul, Howard, Melo, Deron, etc did, which some of these deals offer way more.

I like Kyrie, but he is being pretty overrated in this thread.

Yes, he would get more than those guys. Kyrie is still on his rookie deal. That means any team he gets traded to would have a GREAT chance at signing him to an extension as nobody has ever turned down the max to sign a qualifying offer. Kyrie is also very young. He is as young today as D-Williams was as a rookie.

Kyrie would fetch something real good. The deal would be similar to what Utah got for Williams which was 1 elite young prospect (Favors), 2 future 1st round draft picks, and a decent player in Devin Harris. Cleveland would be looking for a Top-5 pick in the 2014 draft as a starting point. If the pick is in the Top-3 then that alone may be enough. I don't see anyone trading Embiid for Kyrie, but I could see a few teams trading pick #2 or pick #3 for him.

Players like Kyrie typically are NEVER available. You are talking about a 2x All-Star at age 21 that is still on his rookie contract. You are talking about a guy that all of Team-USA was raving about during the past 2 summers. You are talking about a guy that outperformed guys like Paul George and Anthony Davis this past summer at the Team USA workouts.

ballislife · Post #106 » by **ballislife** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 8:12 am

"Uncle Drew" is worth more than Kyrie Irving.

With that said.. I'd give up a few picks + TRoss for Irving.

LApwnd · Post #107 » by **LApwnd** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 8:22 am

Lateral Quicks wrote:If Kyrie was as good as people think he is, Cleveland wouldn't by so bad. There are a lot of better point guards in the league right now.

thats not cause of Irving...its because of this guy....I find it quite comical now in regards to last season when some cavs fans were defending this lump of potato and saying he was good coach and LA did him wrong :lol:

CB-Blazer · Post #108 » by **CB-Blazer** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 8:26 am

DowJones wrote:
CB-Blazer wrote:Some of these deals are crazy. Kylie isn't going to bring in substantially more than Paul, Howard, Melo, Deron, etc did, which some of these deals offer way more.

I like Kyrie, but he is being pretty overrated in this thread.

Yes, he would get more than those guys. Kyrie is still on his rookie deal. That means any team he gets traded to would have a GREAT chance at signing him to an extension as nobody has ever turned down the max to sign a qualifying offer. Kyrie is also very young. He is as young today as D-Williams was as a rookie.

Kyrie would fetch something real good. The deal would be similar to what Utah got for Williams which was 1 elite young prospect (Favors), 2 future 1st round draft picks, and a decent player in Devin Harris. Cleveland would be looking for a Top-5 pick in the 2014 draft as a starting point. If the pick is in the Top-3 then that alone may be enough. I don't see anyone trading Embiid for Kyrie, but I could see a few teams trading pick #2 or pick #3 for him.

Players like Kyrie typically are NEVER available. You are talking about a 2x All-Star at age 21 that is still on his rookie contract. You are talking about a guy that all of Team-USA was raving about during the past 2 summers. You are talking about a guy that outperformed guys like Paul George and Anthony Davis this past summer at the Team USA workouts.

2x all star in the east......JJ just made the east all star team.
16-30 in the east
Seemingly always injured.
Disgruntled
End of rookie contract
And when you have to talk bout out performing someone on work outs, well your reaching.

I'm not saying he won't fetch a decent package.

But Derozan, Ross, Amir, multiple firsts and multiple 2 nds? You really think he is worth that :lol:

He will likely get a good prospect or a early lotto pick, 2 mid/late 1sts and a tad bit of salary relief.

Your not going to get multiple top picks, your not going to get several good prospects in addition to a few first rounders, your not going to get Westbrook, your not going to get Rondo.

DowJones · Post #109 » by **DowJones** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 4:32 pm

CB-Blazer wrote:
DowJones wrote:
CB-Blazer wrote:Some of these deals are crazy. Kylie isn't going to bring in substantially more than Paul, Howard, Melo, Deron, etc did, which some of these deals offer way more.

I like Kyrie, but he is being pretty overrated in this thread.

Yes, he would get more than those guys. Kyrie is still on his rookie deal. That means any team he gets traded to would have a GREAT chance at signing him to an extension as nobody has ever turned down the max to sign a qualifying offer. Kyrie is also very young. He is as young today as D-Williams was as a rookie.

Kyrie would fetch something real good. The deal would be similar to what Utah got for Williams which was 1 elite young prospect (Favors), 2 future 1st round draft picks, and a decent player in Devin Harris. Cleveland would be looking for a Top-5 pick in the 2014 draft as a starting point. If the pick is in the Top-3 then that alone may be enough. I don't see anyone trading Embiid for Kyrie, but I could see a few teams trading pick #2 or pick #3 for him.

Players like Kyrie typically are NEVER available. You are talking about a 2x All-Star at age 21 that is still on his rookie contract. You are talking about a guy that all of Team-USA was raving about during the past 2 summers. You are talking about a guy that outperformed guys like Paul George and Anthony Davis this past summer at the Team USA workouts.

2x all star in the east......JJ just made the east all star team.
16-30 in the east
Seemingly always injured.
Disgruntled
End of rookie contract
And when you have to talk bout out performing someone on work outs, well your reaching.

I'm not saying he won't fetch a decent package.

But Derozan, Ross, Amir, multiple firsts and multiple 2 nds? You really think he is worth that

He will likely get a good prospect or a early lotto pick, 2 mid/late 1sts and a tad bit of salary relief.

Your not going to get multiple top picks, your not going to get several good prospects in addition to a few first rounders, your not going to get Westbrook, your not going to get Rondo.

Again, what did Utah get for Deron Williams? They got an A prospect (Favors), 2 1st round picks, and a decent player in Devin Harris. Kyrie has more value now than DWill had that year. Do I think Cleveland could get more than that package? Maybe not, but something involving a Top-3 2014 pick sounds about right. I guess it depends on the teams that get the pick. The Lakers would probably do it. A team like Milwaukee, Sacramento, Detroit, or Orlando may do it.

Cleveland won't be looking for Rondo or Westbrook. They will be looking for a re-building package.

doctor him · Post #110 » by **doctor him** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 5:25 pm

LApwnd wrote:
thats not cause of Irving...its because of this guy....I find it quite comical now in regards to last season when some cavs fans were defending this lump of potato and saying he was good coach and LA did him wrong

Coaches and the systems they run absolutely do affect what we see on the court.

I find it comical that Evan Turner is a "bust" yet we know that Doug Collins did an awful lot that made Turner look bad on the court.

This isn't to say that Turner would be in Springfield if not for Collins, but the coach didn't do him any favors.

hege53190 · Post #111 » by **hege53190** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 6:15 pm

Henson, Knight, 2015 unprotected #1, 2017 unprotected #1, cap space

for

Irving, Jack

Does that get it done for Cavs fans

It would have to happen after the season sometime.

Irving
Giannis
Wiggins
Middleton
Sanders

Ersan
Mayo
Jack
Zaza

Could be a solid core. I don't know if I do it as a Bucks fan but I think that package at least has to get the Cavs attention

Mac1958 · Post #112 » by **Mac1958** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 6:29 pm

.

Ty Lawson
Kenneth Faried

for

Kyrie Irving
Anthony Bennett

.

Niko23 · Post #113 » by **Niko23** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 6:55 pm

hege53190 wrote:Henson, Knight, 2015 unprotected #1, 2017 unprotected #1, cap space

for

Irving, Jack

Does that get it done for Cavs fans

It would have to happen after the season sometime.

Irving
Giannis
Wiggins
Middleton
Sanders

Ersan
Mayo
Jack
Zaza

Could be a solid core. I don't know if I do it as a Bucks fan but I think that package at least has to get the Cavs attention

As a Cavs fan this does not get my attention.

Niko23 · Post #114 » by **Niko23** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 6:57 pm

Mac1958 wrote:.

Ty Lawson
Kenneth Faried

for

Kyrie Irving
Anthony Bennett

.

Not terrible - but I might prefer Gallo instead and would think about adding value

Ruckusmh · Post #115 » by **Ruckusmh** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 10:05 pm

What about from Utah:

Burke
14 1st unprotected
14 Golden State 1st

and either another first in the future or we can take one of your contracts for RJ, Biedrins, or Marv.

Boarder Patrol · Post #116 » by **Boarder Patrol** » Sat Feb 1, 2014 10:58 pm

Kyrie is young, he's athletic, and has a ton of upside. But currently, he's an average starting point guard. Teams don't trade multiple unprotected 1st round picks and/or A+ level young talent for average starting point guards no matter their age. He's got a good marketing team, can dribble between his legs a lot, and make long two point shots every now and then. But his defense is terrible, he is one of the worst passing point guards in the league, and scores for volume but on terrible efficiency. He plays Kyrie ball, not team ball and his play doesn't translate into wins. For his upside/athleticism/age/status (note: maybe a small market would trade more for him to boost ticket sales)

Burke
Kanter
2015 Utah 1st (top 6 protected)
2 x GSW 2nd
Expiring

for

Kyrie
Jack (or bad contract of Cleveland's choice)

-------------

Vucevic
Denver 2014 1st
Withey
2 x Orlando 2nd

for

Kyrie

-------------

Michael Kidd-Gilchrist
Zeller
Detroit #1, Portland #1, Charlotte 2014 #1 (if not conveyed to Chicago)
Other prospect(s) not too familiar with what Charlotte has

for

Kyrie
+?

DowJones · Post #117 » by **DowJones** » Sun Feb 2, 2014 12:02 am

hege53190 wrote:Henson, Knight, 2015 unprotected #1, 2017 unprotected #1, cap space

for

Irving, Jack

Does that get it done for Cavs fans

It would have to happen after the season sometime.

Irving
Giannis
Wiggins
Middleton
Sanders

Ersan
Mayo
Jack
Zaza

Could be a solid core. I don't know if I do it as a Bucks fan but I think that package at least has to get the Cavs attention

An absolute no. You aren't offering 1 of your team's 2 best trade chips for Kyrie. Any deal with Milwaukee needs to start with the 2014 1st (no protection) or maybe both Giannis and Henson (plus additional pieces).

DowJones · Post #118 » by **DowJones** » Sun Feb 2, 2014 12:04 am

Niko23 wrote:
Mac1958 wrote:.

Ty Lawson
Kenneth Faried

for

Kyrie Irving
Anthony Bennett

.

Not terrible - but I might prefer Gallo instead and would think about adding value

Ewww...this is the WORST move Cleveland could make. This isn't a re-building package and it isn't a package that would make Cleveland competitive for anyhting other than the 7th or 6th seed in future years.

bullsnewdynasty · Post #119 » by **bullsnewdynasty** » Sun Feb 2, 2014 12:05 am

hege53190 wrote:Henson, Knight, 2015 unprotected #1, 2017 unprotected #1, cap space

for

Irving, Jack

Does that get it done for Cavs fans

It would have to happen after the season sometime.

Irving
Giannis
Wiggins
Middleton
Sanders

Ersan
Mayo
Jack
Zaza

Could be a solid core. I don't know if I do it as a Bucks fan but I think that package at least has to get the Cavs attention

Those 2015 and 2017 first round picks from the Bucks wouldn't be very valuable given that they would be a sure fire playoff team in the East.

DowJones · Post #120 » by **DowJones** » Sun Feb 2, 2014 12:09 am

Ruckusmh wrote:What about from Utah:

Burke
14 1st unprotected
14 Golden State 1st

and either another first in the future or we can take one of your contracts for RJ, Biedrins, or Marv.

Yes, and this is the type of deal that I think would get Cleveland's attention. Now I am assuming that this would be done AFTER the season but BEFORE the draft and Utah's pick would be in the 2-7 range. I think Burke plus a pick in the Top-7 plus maybe a future 1st would be what Cleveland is looking for.

Anything that gives Cleveland a pick in the Top-7 or so in the draft is a good starting point. If Cleveland is looking to re-build and start over, they would want 2 picks in the Top-7 of this loaded draft.