Ben Simmons Containment Thread Take 3

[BoogieTime]

It's quite likely Portland has a standing offer of CJ + either Roco or Picks to Philly for Simmons and
has been waiting all summer for Philly to pull the trigger. Let's see if something gets done when they
get closer to the opening of training camps.

One of the issues with a CJ trade is, after Embiid and Harris, Maxey will in short order become one of the Sixers better players

With him and Curry SG really isnt a position of need

[jpatrick]

It's quite likely Portland has a standing offer of CJ + either Roco or Picks to Philly for Simmons and
has been waiting all summer for Philly to pull the trigger. Let's see if something gets done when they
get closer to the opening of training camps.

One of the issues with a CJ trade is, after Embiid and Harris, Maxey will in short order become one of the Sixers better players

With him and Curry SG really isnt a position of need

I think CJ could play point. But a CJ, Maxey, Curry guard rotation is small and would be horrific on the defensive end.

[Crives]

Suns trade:
Ayton + Dario + Jae

Suns receive:
Ben Simmons + PJ Washington

Sixers trade:
Ben

Sixers receive:
Gordon Hayward

Hornets trade:
PJ + Gordon

Hornets receive:
Ayton + Dario + Jae


Why?

First, as a suns fans, I don’t think I could really trade Ayton, especially after what he just did in the playoffs. But maybe Monty Williams is the one guy who can revive Bens career. If Ben can buy into being a full time center surrounded by shooting, maybe this is worth discussing.

Philly-
Get a really good win now piece who can initiate the offense in Gordon Hayward. If you are willing to trade Simmons for CJ, you should be excited to trade for Gordon.

Hornets-
Get their veteran leader in crowder for the young guys, while getting their 2nd young star to pair with Lamelo in Ayton.

The Sixers are not trading Ben and taking Gordon Heyward....You were serious......Ben will sit and we will find out if he and klutch are willing to lose almost 40 million. Morey is no fool, we will make a deal later when teams realize they aren't winning with what they have and we can get a fair offer. You guys think because Morey asked too high that he is going to take Pennies on the dollar because you somehow want to punish us....Yeah right

I really do hope Morey doesn’t bend over to Klutch

[OGSactownballer]

Suns trade:
Ayton + Dario + Jae

Suns receive:
Ben Simmons + PJ Washington

Sixers trade:
Ben

Sixers receive:
Gordon Hayward

Hornets trade:
PJ + Gordon

Hornets receive:
Ayton + Dario + Jae


Why?

First, as a suns fans, I don’t think I could really trade Ayton, especially after what he just did in the playoffs. But maybe Monty Williams is the one guy who can revive Bens career. If Ben can buy into being a full time center surrounded by shooting, maybe this is worth discussing.

Philly-
Get a really good win now piece who can initiate the offense in Gordon Hayward. If you are willing to trade Simmons for CJ, you should be excited to trade for Gordon.

Hornets-
Get their veteran leader in crowder for the young guys, while getting their 2nd young star to pair with Lamelo in Ayton.

The Sixers are not trading Ben and taking Gordon Heyward....You were serious......Ben will sit and we will find out if he and klutch are willing to lose almost 40 million. Morey is no fool, we will make a deal later when teams realize they aren't winning with what they have and we can get a fair offer. You guys think because Morey asked too high that he is going to take Pennies on the dollar because you somehow want to punish us....Yeah right

I really do hope Morey doesn’t bend over to Klutch

He will or this will be his last GM job.

He cannot win this battle now. He should have put the clamps on Doc and Embiid after the series. That was a class 1A F up as a GM to ever allow them to run mouth like that.

It completely set off one of the most volatile media centers in the country and gave them a pariah to blame.

I don’t blame the kid for a single second. I would have told them all to piss up a rope and tanked my own value to screw them too.

They made their own bed and they are going to get hammered on this deal for it.

[Sportfan73]

The Sixers are not trading Ben and taking Gordon Heyward....You were serious......Ben will sit and we will find out if he and klutch are willing to lose almost 40 million. Morey is no fool, we will make a deal later when teams realize they aren't winning with what they have and we can get a fair offer. You guys think because Morey asked too high that he is going to take Pennies on the dollar because you somehow want to punish us....Yeah right

I really do hope Morey doesn’t bend over to Klutch

He will or this will be his last GM job.

He cannot win this battle now. He should have put the clamps on Doc and Embiid after the series. That was a class 1A F up as a GM to ever allow them to run mouth like that.

It completely set off one of the most volatile media centers in the country and gave them a pariah to blame.

I don’t blame the kid for a single second. I would have told them all to piss up a rope and tanked my own value to screw them too.

They made their own bed and they are going to get hammered on this deal for it.

4 years at max money left..

[Devilanche]

Okay my attempt at a Simmons deal. I have the Kings as the best team for him.

Thunder trade: Kenrich Williams
Thunder get: Bagley, 22 SAC 2nd(55-60 protected)

Cavs trade: Sexton
Cavs get: Shake Milton, 22 Kings 1st(top 8, top 6, top 4, 2 2nds)

Kings trade: Barnes/Haliburton/Bagley/22 1st/22 2nd
Kings get: Ben Simmons/Kenrich Williams

Sixers trade: Ben Simmons/Shake Milton
Sixers get: Haliburton/Sexton/Barnes

Thunder get a 2nd and take a flier on Bagley
Cavs get a good pick for Sexton and Milton provides them a bench scoring threat to pair with Rubio
Kings go get a 2nd star to pair with Fox and Williams provides some important forward depth
Sixers get two talented young guards for Simmons and a good solid combo forward

Flame away

No from Sacramento. Haliburton is not on the table.

The thing is, I don't think the Kings want Simmons that badly - he'd be an odd fit on the Kings and the GM's crushes are guys who can shoot.

Would the Kings be happy to have Simmons for pennies on the dollar? Sure. But they're not going all out on a mission of Simmons-or-bust. Which is a long winded way of saying I highly doubt he will end up in Sacramento.

.

I think that is really a discounted price already but sure understandable if Sacremento doesn’t want pay that much

[Killboard]

Wonder who is the best guard/wing close to his prime that 2 unprotected first and 2 swaps could get from a rebuilding team.

Wolves send those picks there and Prince+Reid (Okogie or Layman can also be included if needed to match salaries).
Philly gets that guy + Beasley or Beverley.
Wolves get Simmons.

[MKWB]

Wonder who is the best guard/wing close to his prime that 2 unprotected first and 2 swaps could get from a rebuilding team.

Wolves send those picks there and Prince+Reid (Okogie or Layman can also be included if needed to match salaries).
Philly gets that guy + Beasley or Beverley.
Wolves get Simmons.

What team and player could that be? Jerami Grant fits that bill, but not worth that many picks probably. Maybe split the picks where Philly gets some and a win-now player, and the other team (DET?) gets some picks.

[gambitx777]

I would keep Simmons over either of those and just deal with it. But in answering the question which players help me most just for one season? I'd take the Kings package. Barnes offers a bit more than Beasley and Hield a bit more than Prince/PatBev.

Now assuming those are just the matching contracts and multiple 1sts would be included by each team to reach the value of Simmons I would take the Wolves offer, keep Beasley and look to flip the expirings of Bev and Prince along with assets for a point guard. Hield would be much more difficult to flip.

So for winning now if I had to keep the players, the Kings. For value, I'd rather have the matching from Minny.

Solid explanation, TC…thanks!


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If only Minnesota didn't flip Rubio for Prince, they'd have a PG to trade. Shrewd move by Cleveland to sabotage Minnesota!

Would Rubio, Beasley and picks get that done even at this point.

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[babyjax13]

I wonder if Washington could jump into all of this.

Washington trades: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Daniel Gafford, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Kyle Kuzma, picks
Washington receives: Ben Simmons
Get a true star player who matches well with Beal.

Philadelphia trades: Ben Simmons
Philadelphia receives: Derrick White, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Lonnie Walker, Daniel Gafford, picks
Get a bunch of depth + a really underrated player in White and picks (don't know what these need to be to fill the gap).

San Antonio trades: Derrick White, Lonnie Walker
San Antonio receives: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Kyle Kuzma
Move White to clear a bit of the backcourt logjam and get some young frontcourt players.

[zimpy27]

It's quite likely Portland has a standing offer of CJ + either Roco or Picks to Philly for Simmons and
has been waiting all summer for Philly to pull the trigger. Let's see if something gets done when they
get closer to the opening of training camps.

One of the issues with a CJ trade is, after Embiid and Harris, Maxey will in short order become one of the Sixers better players

With him and Curry SG really isnt a position of need

I think CJ could play point. But a CJ, Maxey, Curry guard rotation is small and would be horrific on the defensive end.

Yeah I think Curry+Simmons would be moved if they bring in CJ+Covington..

CJ, Green, Covington, Harris, Embiid -- Maxey, Thybulle, Korkmaz, Reed, Drummond

I don't think Curry would fit with Lillard/Simons either and I think the Simmons/Nurkic for would be awful. So Curry/Nurkic to a third team for a stretch 5. And then pick assets to Philly.

[gambitx777]

I wonder if Washington could jump into all of this.

Washington trades: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Daniel Gafford, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Kyle Kuzma, picks
Washington receives: Ben Simmons
Get a true star player who matches well with Beal.

Philadelphia trades: Ben Simmons
Philadelphia receives: Derrick White, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Lonnie Walker, Daniel Gafford, picks
Get a bunch of depth + a really underrated player in White and picks (don't know what these need to be to fill the gap).

San Antonio trades: Derrick White, Lonnie Walker
San Antonio receives: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Kyle Kuzma
Move White to clear a bit of the backcourt logjam and get some young frontcourt players.

I as a wizards fan would hate this because imo Simmons is not a true star, he's more fool's gold than anything and I think these premadana antics actually forcing his way out, are only going to make his immaturity and work ethic issues worse. I would much rather keep going starting caliber players in Kuz and Rui and the 19 year old deni and the depth than trade it for Simmons.

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[Devilanche]

Wonder who is the best guard/wing close to his prime that 2 unprotected first and 2 swaps could get from a rebuilding team.

Wolves send those picks there and Prince+Reid (Okogie or Layman can also be included if needed to match salaries).
Philly gets that guy + Beasley or Beverley.
Wolves get Simmons.

That team have to prefer picks over paying the same price and more to get Simmons for themselves instead.

[Norm2953]

One of the issues with a CJ trade is, after Embiid and Harris, Maxey will in short order become one of the Sixers better players

With him and Curry SG really isnt a position of need

I think CJ could play point. But a CJ, Maxey, Curry guard rotation is small and would be horrific on the defensive end.

Yeah I think Curry+Simmons would be moved if they bring in CJ+Covington..

CJ, Green, Covington, Harris, Embiid -- Maxey, Thybulle, Korkmaz, Reed, Drummond

I don't think Curry would fit with Lillard/Simons either and I think the Simmons/Nurkic for would be awful. So Curry/Nurkic to a third team for a stretch 5. And then pick assets to Philly.

Curry played for Portland when Portland reached the WCF. He would do fine as the third guard behind Dame/Powell.

[DroseReturnChi]

Wonder who is the best guard/wing close to his prime that 2 unprotected first and 2 swaps could get from a rebuilding team.

Wolves send those picks there and Prince+Reid (Okogie or Layman can also be included if needed to match salaries).
Philly gets that guy + Beasley or Beverley.
Wolves get Simmons.

dude literally every single team has 2 unprotected picks. if you think morey is going to be ecstatic to think wolves post simmons is going to be a bottom 5 team, your just wrong. any team with simmons is a top 20 pick potentially which is why he needs multiple unprotected in the distant future to look like they are gold like boston/gs foolishly believed.

[DroseReturnChi]

No from Sacramento. Haliburton is not on the table.

The thing is, I don't think the Kings want Simmons that badly - he'd be an odd fit on the Kings and the GM's crushes are guys who can shoot.

Would the Kings be happy to have Simmons for pennies on the dollar? Sure. But they're not going all out on a mission of Simmons-or-bust. Which is a long winded way of saying I highly doubt he will end up in Sacramento.

.

simmons is a better fit than either hali/fox because he fixes kings biggest weakness which is defense. thats why im saying they should not be cheap and trade dollar for a dollar. the chances of hali/fox/mitchell working out in 5 yrs is close to 0 a good gm would be prepared for the inevitable because otherwise they might be the ones similar to simmons/embiid issue.

i said yrs ago sixers have to trade embiid for simmons to be a all nba player and this is what happens if they dont listen and only care abt talent. fit does matter in the end especially if you want to win a title. nba is all about usage i knew simmons would be marginalized to death after joel was going for that mvp. simmons fit only with a few team with winners like golden state because steph/klay are the few stars that likes to play better off ball.

[patman66]

No from Sacramento. Haliburton is not on the table.

The thing is, I don't think the Kings want Simmons that badly - he'd be an odd fit on the Kings and the GM's crushes are guys who can shoot.

Would the Kings be happy to have Simmons for pennies on the dollar? Sure. But they're not going all out on a mission of Simmons-or-bust. Which is a long winded way of saying I highly doubt he will end up in Sacramento.

.

simmons is a better fit than either hali/fox because he fixes kings biggest weakness which is defense. thats why im saying they should not be cheap and trade dollar for a dollar. the chances of hali/fox/mitchell working out in 5 yrs is close to 0 a good gm would be prepared for the inevitable because otherwise they might be the ones similar to simmons/embiid issue.

i said yrs ago sixers have to trade embiid for simmons to be a all nba player and this is what happens if they dont listen and only care abt talent. fit does matter in the end especially if you want to win a title. nba is all about usage i knew simmons would be marginalized to death after joel was going for that mvp. simmons fit only with a few team with winners like golden state because steph/klay are the few stars that likes to play better off ball.

Why don't you think hali-fox-Mitchell have zero percent chance of working out? I would not trade Fox for Simmons as I see no other team offering up a comparable talent, so why should they? All they have to do is beat the next best offer as they are an out of conference team.

Hield, haliburton and Bagley to Philly

[Devilanche]

No from Sacramento. Haliburton is not on the table.

The thing is, I don't think the Kings want Simmons that badly - he'd be an odd fit on the Kings and the GM's crushes are guys who can shoot.

Would the Kings be happy to have Simmons for pennies on the dollar? Sure. But they're not going all out on a mission of Simmons-or-bust. Which is a long winded way of saying I highly doubt he will end up in Sacramento.

.

simmons is a better fit than either hali/fox because he fixes kings biggest weakness which is defense. thats why im saying they should not be cheap and trade dollar for a dollar. the chances of hali/fox/mitchell working out in 5 yrs is close to 0 a good gm would be prepared for the inevitable because otherwise they might be the ones similar to simmons/embiid issue.

i said yrs ago sixers have to trade embiid for simmons to be a all nba player and this is what happens if they dont listen and only care abt talent. fit does matter in the end especially if you want to win a title. nba is all about usage i knew simmons would be marginalized to death after joel was going for that mvp. simmons fit only with a few team with winners like golden state because steph/klay are the few stars that likes to play better off ball.

Why don't you think hali-fox-Mitchell have zero percent chance of working out? I would not trade Fox for Simmons as I see no other team offering up a comparable talent, so why should they? All they have to do is beat the next best offer as they are an out of conference team.

Hield, haliburton and Bagley to Philly

I think right now kings aren’t even offering haliburton.

[beb0p]

No from Sacramento. Haliburton is not on the table.

The thing is, I don't think the Kings want Simmons that badly - he'd be an odd fit on the Kings and the GM's crushes are guys who can shoot.

Would the Kings be happy to have Simmons for pennies on the dollar? Sure. But they're not going all out on a mission of Simmons-or-bust. Which is a long winded way of saying I highly doubt he will end up in Sacramento.

.

simmons is a better fit than either hali/fox because he fixes kings biggest weakness which is defense. thats why im saying they should not be cheap and trade dollar for a dollar. the chances of hali/fox/mitchell working out in 5 yrs is close to 0 a good gm would be prepared for the inevitable because otherwise they might be the ones similar to simmons/embiid issue.

i said yrs ago sixers have to trade embiid for simmons to be a all nba player and this is what happens if they dont listen and only care abt talent. fit does matter in the end especially if you want to win a title. nba is all about usage i knew simmons would be marginalized to death after joel was going for that mvp. simmons fit only with a few team with winners like golden state because steph/klay are the few stars that likes to play better off ball.

Moving Hield and Bagley will automatically fix the Kings' defense. If you want to improve their defense even more, there are more economical ways to go about it than to pay a premium for Simmons. Defensive players traditionally do not commands the price that Morey is asking for. It's offense that cost a premium, and Morey is pricing Simmons on the level of an offensive jaggernaut. If the Kings (or any team) pay Morey's price for Simmons based on defense, then right away they've already lost the trade.

Unless the player is a C, he needs to be able to shoot in order to play for the Kings. They already have two ball handlers (potentially three with Davion playing alongside Fox and Haliburton), so a ballhandler is the last thing they need more of. Simmons is not a good fit on the Kings. You can argue he's so talented that it doesn't matter, but I'd argue that he's so unique that the fit matters for him more than many star level players. The Kings need a wing who can shoot. Simmons is not that guy. There is no reason to force a round peg into a square hole.

I don't know what you mean by Hali/Fox/Mitchell working out in 5 years. No one on the Kings is expecting Hali/Fox/Mitchell to be the big three. Haliburton should at best be the #3 guy and preferably the #4. Mitchell is clue guy. They are hunting for one or two players who can carry the offensive load for Fox and also defend at a high level. Maybe they find that guy, maybe the don't. The last they should do is to settle for someone who only somewhat fill that role and paying a premium for it.

.

[kuclas]

I wonder if Washington could jump into all of this.

Washington trades: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Daniel Gafford, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Kyle Kuzma, picks
Washington receives: Ben Simmons
Get a true star player who matches well with Beal.

Philadelphia trades: Ben Simmons
Philadelphia receives: Derrick White, Kentavious Caldwell Pope, Lonnie Walker, Daniel Gafford, picks
Get a bunch of depth + a really underrated player in White and picks (don't know what these need to be to fill the gap).

San Antonio trades: Derrick White, Lonnie Walker
San Antonio receives: Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura, Kyle Kuzma
Move White to clear a bit of the backcourt logjam and get some young frontcourt players.

Good grief. Sixers need a secondary iso scorer ball handler at end of the game.

Not a bunch of role players. White can’t shoot either. Embiid is a better mid range and 3 point shooter than white. If that tells you something.

Maxey and or Milton can step up and play bigger role and not even have to trade for white.