Ben Simmons trades go here (and here only): Expect warnings if not following forum rules

[Roy The Natural]

If minny is prepared to give 4 FRP for Simmons then I think Philly could give 6 FRP for Lillard or 5 FRP for Beal.. don't think those teams say no. I could also see 7 FRP for Steph Curry if GSW go all in on youth.

I think all those teams say no. Pupu platters of picks isn't going to entice a team unless it's star vehemently wants out. Give me Ingram, NAW, and a pick over that all day long. I think most teams properly value a piece coming back to sell to the fan base. Trading Lillard for a bunch of future 1st and salary matching garbage is a sure way to get fired .. same as Curry and Beal.

I don't think most front offices are as obsessed with picks of unknown value as RealGM is.

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player.

I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

Until Beal, Lillard, or Curry start causing a full blown ruckus in and off the court we should assume that they won't be leveraging their way to a specific destination that doesn't have pieces that a rebuilding team would value.

Recent lottery picks who've shown upside and/or guaranteed lotto picks is the default return. A pupu platters of unknown value isn't the answer, and is irrelevant until next off-season if Simmons is still on the 76ers.

[jbk1234]

I think all those teams say no. Pupu platters of picks isn't going to entice a team unless it's star vehemently wants out. Give me Ingram, NAW, and a pick over that all day long. I think most teams properly value a piece coming back to sell to the fan base. Trading Lillard for a bunch of future 1st and salary matching garbage is a sure way to get fired .. same as Curry and Beal.

I don't think most front offices are as obsessed with picks of unknown value as RealGM is.

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player.

I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

The PG trade was for Leonard and PG though. Zero chance that the Clippers trade all that without Leonard making the acquisition of PG a condition of signing.

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[Roy The Natural]

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player.

I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

The PG trade was for Leonard and PG though. Zero chance that the Clippers all that without Leonard making the acquisition of PG a condition of signing.

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Maybe... I don't think it was unfair value. I just don't think the Clippers give up all that without getting Kawhi because there would be no point as PG wasn't good enough on his own to turn them into a contender. Depends on how you read the context of the signing of Kawhi. PG was a win now piece and the Clippers cashes in their prospects and picks when they had the ability to put together multiple win now pieces.

It still doesn't change the reality of optics here. Neither Portland nor Golden State are going to trade the most beloved players in their franchises history for a bunch of unknown value. It just doesn't happen that way outside of 1 occasion where the player basically forced it to happen due to a high level of leverage he had, and a willingness to act like a complete fool.

[DroseReturnChi]

I think Morey would rather overpay for a better player than Simmons instead of getting very good value with less talent for Simmons

this is obvious why i have been saying no to cj bc even in simmons worst moment he will be better than cj's best yr.
philly is going to add every asset to simmons for a superstar not receive role players. morey is the type to rather rot.
cj is not even good fit in philly who needs more of a primary ball handler 30 ppg guy in curry, dame. he fits in a potential kyrie irving trade with nets.

[NYG]

I think Morey would rather overpay for a better player than Simmons instead of getting very good value with less talent for Simmons

I agree... the only Simmons trade that Morey makes is Simmons and picks/youth for a clearly better player

[NYG]

There were rumors that the Pelicans would move Brandon Ingram for Lillard. I can't see a scenario in which the 76ers can provide a better retool package then the Pelicans or the myriad of other teams that will inevitably throw their hat in the ring.

I think the idea of the 76ers cashing in Simmons+ for a certifiable star above him is pretty much out the window at this point. There's absolutely nothing to suggest that it is a plausibility outside wishful thinking on posters who are perhaps irrationally high on Simmons.

Simmons is a hard player to build around, and at this point he's proven to be extremely fickle as an asset. He's on unnecessary risk for any team hoping to retool. There will be more stable and versatile assets available to a team like Portland in the event that Lillard is moved

My point wasn't that the 76ers will get Beal or Lillard, just they won't trade him if they don't.

Anything is possible, but I just don't see how bringing Simmons back, or having him sit out the entire season, are outcomes that are in the Sixers interests at this point.

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I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

[jbk1234]

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

The PG trade was for Leonard and PG though. Zero chance that the Clippers all that without Leonard making the acquisition of PG a condition of signing.

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Maybe... I don't think it was unfair value. I just don't think the Clippers give up all that without getting Kawhi because there would be no point as PG wasn't good enough on his own to turn them into a contender. Depends on how you read the context of the signing of Kawhi. PG was a win now piece and the Clippers cashes in their prospects and picks when they had the ability to put together multiple win now pieces.

It still doesn't change the reality of optics here. Neither Portland nor Golden State are going to trade the most beloved players in their franchises history for a bunch of unknown value. It just doesn't happen that way outside of 1 occasion where the player basically forced it to happen due to a high level of leverage he had, and a willingness to act like a complete fool.

PG was traded to OKC for Sabonis and Dipo, pre break out, before that. There's no maybe about it. If Leonard isn't involved in the decision, the Clippers aren't offering all that.

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[Roy The Natural]

The PG trade was for Leonard and PG though. Zero chance that the Clippers all that without Leonard making the acquisition of PG a condition of signing.

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Maybe... I don't think it was unfair value. I just don't think the Clippers give up all that without getting Kawhi because there would be no point as PG wasn't good enough on his own to turn them into a contender. Depends on how you read the context of the signing of Kawhi. PG was a win now piece and the Clippers cashes in their prospects and picks when they had the ability to put together multiple win now pieces.

It still doesn't change the reality of optics here. Neither Portland nor Golden State are going to trade the most beloved players in their franchises history for a bunch of unknown value. It just doesn't happen that way outside of 1 occasion where the player basically forced it to happen due to a high level of leverage he had, and a willingness to act like a complete fool.

PG was traded to OKC for Sabonis and Dipo, pre break out, before that. There's no maybe about it. If Leonard isn't involved in the decision, the Clippers aren't offering all that.

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There's plenty of if.... You're missing the context entirely. PG was traded for Dipo and Sabonis as an expiring who had leveraged his way to poor value by only including "certain teams" on his list of resign destinations.

The context is simple. Teams going into a win now mode pay premium for impactful talent. Just like the Lakers gave up everything for AD. The vast majority of trades for a star going to a win now situation are built around giving up whatever is promising on your team and loading picks on too of that. The context of PG13 is directly relatable to AD, Holiday, and plenty of other impact players. The teams are paying all that capital to appease the high level win now pieces on their team. The situation with PG13 is only unique in it's semantics. If Kawhi was already on the team and indicated that he wanted another star player or PG13 specifically or else he'd be out, the Clippers would do the exact same thing.

Meanwhile, Hardens situation is fairly unique in that the distraction that he created was so severe that it necessitated moving him. And I'm fairly certain he avoided any sort of bidding war by proving and relaying how he would act and what he would do if he ended up somewhere he didn't want. Applying that context to any current star is unfounded speculation at best, and wilfully ignorant of context at worst.

[Roy The Natural]

My point wasn't that the 76ers will get Beal or Lillard, just they won't trade him if they don't.

Anything is possible, but I just don't see how bringing Simmons back, or having him sit out the entire season, are outcomes that are in the Sixers interests at this point.

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I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

Naahh that's unlikely.

[zimpy27]

Anything is possible, but I just don't see how bringing Simmons back, or having him sit out the entire season, are outcomes that are in the Sixers interests at this point.

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I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

Naahh that's unlikely.

I think you have to consider Morey. His past shows he will overpay for better or even equal talent if he has to. He's an aggressive GM that offers for players, he doesn't sit back and receive offers.

I initially thought like you but the more I thought about it, the more I considered Morey's past behaviour, the more I realised that this will more likely be an overpay situation.

If Portland took 6 FRP for Lillard then they could probably get 4-5 FRPs for CJ, Nurkic, Covington as well. That's kicking off a big rebuild. Are you sure they wouldn't consider it?

[Sportfan73]

I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

Naahh that's unlikely.

I think you have to consider Morey. His past shows he will overpay for better or even equal talent if he has to. He's an aggressive GM that offers for players, he doesn't sit back and receive offers.

I initially thought like you but the more I thought about it, the more I considered Morey's past behaviour, the more I realised that this will more likely be an overpay situation.

Only if he can get that done in the next month

[Roy The Natural]

I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

Naahh that's unlikely.

I think you have to consider Morey. His past shows he will overpay for better or even equal talent if he has to. He's an aggressive GM that offers for players, he doesn't sit back and receive offers.

I initially thought like you but the more I thought about it, the more I considered Morey's past behaviour, the more I realised that this will more likely be an overpay situation.

Have to have a willing partner. I don't think they have one for a better player. Lost in all this is the fact that other teams most likely don't want a player like Ben Simmons as a rebuilding piece, and Malik Beasley and 1sts isn't that enticing either for guys like Beal. I don't think anyone's coming available until next off-season. There may be rumblings, but I don't think Beal or Lillard are leaving unless they have disastrous seasons and I don't think they will.

[Roy The Natural]

I don't think downgrading talent is either. Simmons plus picks for a clearly better player will likely be the Simmons trade.

Naahh that's unlikely.

I think you have to consider Morey. His past shows he will overpay for better or even equal talent if he has to. He's an aggressive GM that offers for players, he doesn't sit back and receive offers.

I initially thought like you but the more I thought about it, the more I considered Morey's past behaviour, the more I realised that this will more likely be an overpay situation.

If Portland took 6 FRP for Lillard then they could probably get 4-5 FRPs for CJ, Nurkic, Covington as well. That's kicking off a big rebuild. Are you sure they wouldn't consider it?

No... They don't have to consider it and they shouldn't. A bunch of picks without any clue on slotting, but mostly leaning towards the end of the first is not enticing.

If Lillard is going to get moved it will be in the offseason. And when/if that happens then Philly can offer all those picks to get lottery talent and picks and get that to Portland if it's worth as much as you think. This platter of volatility is a disastrous outcome for Portland. Recent lottery talent, or current lottery picks, that's the core of any Lillard trade, substituting it with future picks from good teams will definitely be a no go. I'd put money on Portland getting back at least one guaranteed valuable asset in a deal. They're not breaking up Lillard into 7 dimes.

[Sportfan73]

Naahh that's unlikely.

I think you have to consider Morey. His past shows he will overpay for better or even equal talent if he has to. He's an aggressive GM that offers for players, he doesn't sit back and receive offers.

I initially thought like you but the more I thought about it, the more I considered Morey's past behaviour, the more I realised that this will more likely be an overpay situation.

Have to have a willing partner. I don't think they have one for a better player. Lost in all this is the fact that other teams most likely don't want a player like Ben Simmons as a rebuilding piece, and Malik Beasley and 1sts isn't that enticing either for guys like Beal. I don't think anyone's coming available until next off-season. There may be rumblings, but I don't think Beal or Lillard are leaving unless they have disastrous seasons and I don't think they will.

Yeah this is just what it is. I don’t think Morey played his hand wrong as I believe he probably tried that approach all summer. He waited it out as long as possible and now I think he goes best player available plus an asset or two. If he got 2 more picks then when someone comes available he can still go like Maxey, Thybulle, green(expiring), and 5 firsts and 3 swaps or whatever.

[Sportfan73]

Truth be told I think it comes down to Portland, Indiana, and San Antonio

[MoneyTalks41890]

So I still like the SAC concept.

Something like Simmons for Hali, Barnes.

Then do something like Holmes, Bagley for Zinger.

[kuclas]

I think all those teams say no. Pupu platters of picks isn't going to entice a team unless it's star vehemently wants out. Give me Ingram, NAW, and a pick over that all day long. I think most teams properly value a piece coming back to sell to the fan base. Trading Lillard for a bunch of future 1st and salary matching garbage is a sure way to get fired .. same as Curry and Beal.

I don't think most front offices are as obsessed with picks of unknown value as RealGM is.

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player.

I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

Until Beal, Lillard, or Curry start causing a full blown ruckus in and off the court we should assume that they won't be leveraging their way to a specific destination that doesn't have pieces that a rebuilding team would value.

Recent lottery picks who've shown upside and/or guaranteed lotto picks is the default return. A pupu platters of unknown value isn't the answer, and is irrelevant until next off-season if Simmons is still on the 76ers.

Which pg13 trade. The one to Indiana to okc for essentially for oladipo who failed in Orlando/future pick (Sabonis). Pg13 was expiring and already said he would not resign with Indiana

Or pg13 to clippers trade which netted SGa plus a bunch of picks. Pg13 resigned for multiple years

If people want the pg13 to clippers trade. That is also an outlier because it was really a two step process 1. Make the pg13 trade
2. Get top player in k Leonard to sign as free
Agent

What which pg13 trade are you talking about.

Because ain’t no one giving u the pg13 to clippers trade unless it involves another top 5 player coming along.

[zimpy27]

What's the Detroit package?

Grant and Hayes?

[HotelVitale]

I think all those teams say no. Pupu platters of picks isn't going to entice a team unless it's star vehemently wants out. Give me Ingram, NAW, and a pick over that all day long. I think most teams properly value a piece coming back to sell to the fan base. Trading Lillard for a bunch of future 1st and salary matching garbage is a sure way to get fired .. same as Curry and Beal. I don't think most front offices are as obsessed with picks of unknown value as RealGM is.

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player. I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return. Until Beal, Lillard, or Curry start causing a full blown ruckus in and off the court we should assume that they won't be leveraging their way to a specific destination that doesn't have pieces that a rebuilding team would value. Recent lottery picks who've shown upside and/or guaranteed lotto picks is the default return. A pupu platters of unknown value isn't the answer, and is irrelevant until next off-season if Simmons is still on the 76ers.

Fully agree, and it seems clear that there's no standard or 'gauge' for NBA stuff in general. Each situation and negotiation is different, with many variables and factors in play. It's maybe a boring cliche to say that as though it tells you anything, but it's just a better and more real perspective than 'this trade happened before therefore GMs will follow its example.'

The Harden trade was also quite different in that the team was very very motivated to receive nothing of current on-court value (so they could tank and keep their pick this year), and in that Harden was already 31 and only really interested in and open to a handful of teams. I'd also add that we've had the AD trade more recently than either PG trade, not sure why that hasn't come up. That was a #4 pick right away, three young prospects including one soon-to-be AS, and two futures 1sts. That's a big-time haul and contrasts strongly with that Harden junk--but again neither is all that relevant because this is a totally different situation in every way.

[Roy The Natural]

It does happen, Harden just got 4 FRPs for Houston which sets the market. 5 FRPs is an overpay for Beal that the Wizards have to consider as an opportunity to get better value than they ever would again for this player.

I wouldn't sell home but if someone offered me a very high number I'd take it for the opportunity I'd never get again.

The Harden trade is and has been an outlier. Using it to gauge EVERYTHING is a fool's errand. The PG13 trade is what teams want. And we've seen that type of return far more often than a Harden type composition for a return.

Until Beal, Lillard, or Curry start causing a full blown ruckus in and off the court we should assume that they won't be leveraging their way to a specific destination that doesn't have pieces that a rebuilding team would value.

Recent lottery picks who've shown upside and/or guaranteed lotto picks is the default return. A pupu platters of unknown value isn't the answer, and is irrelevant until next off-season if Simmons is still on the 76ers.

Which pg13 trade. The one to Indiana to okc for essentially for oladipo who failed in Orlando/future pick (Sabonis). Pg13 was expiring and already said he would not resign with Indiana

Or pg13 to clippers trade which netted SGa plus a bunch of picks. Pg13 resigned for multiple years

If people want the pg13 to clippers trade. That is also an outlier because it was really a two step process 1. Make the pg13 trade
2. Get top player in k Leonard to sign as free
Agent

What which pg13 trade are you talking about.

Because ain’t no one giving u the pg13 to clippers trade unless it involves another top 5 player coming along.

I disagree with step 2 if your assessment. Contextually free agency is a semantics based argument. It's more about if you have current win now pieces, and win now players, you must appease them by paying a fortune. Which for most teams trying to acquire a superstar is the case.