Official: Shams/Woj/Shelbourne: It's Brooklyn for the Beard

[gom]

I think Cleveland was a big winner. I also feel Indiana made a great move, getting a good player in exchange for an expiring deal and avoiding a heaping plate of drama. My hope is that it works out for all clubs, that the Brooklyn superteam raises the bar in the East and that Houston does not fall too far. My fear is that Brooklyn gave up too much, that they may suffer the same way they did in the Boston megadeal, and it sucks, because I'm a fan of the Nets too. On the other hand, the deal can flip the other way if Brooklyn is too successful. In that case, the pick swaps will be null & void and the picks the Rockets get will not compensate much either.

I chose Cleveland & Indiana as winners in the poll.

Meanwhile where is Kyrie...

I understand it's not a popular position here, but I support Kyrie's position after the domestic terrorists stormed the Capitol last week. So do the Nets and his teammates:

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/kevin_durant_nets_support_kyrie_irving_100_percent_amid_continued_absence/s1_8061_33786677

I have faith Irving will eventually rejoin the team, and the Nets are going to do some serious crushing in the East, assuming of course they can dodge the virus and other injuries. I wish Kyrie and the Nets well.

[Prospect Dong]

My two cents:

Houston made out the best in this deal - four picks and four swaps.... I’ll get to the swaps later
Indiana did well - LeVert better than Oladipo right now
Cleveland - okay, but they took Prince’s contract AND gave up a first rounder?

Brooklyn - who’s going to play center? Jordan is washed. Word is Green is going to be small ball center? And Harden and Kyrie on same team? Kylie’s a nut job. Brooklyn has a better chance of winning if they trade Kyrie. So those Houston swaps should be great for the Rockets in about two years.

I don't think "who's going to play center" is a very important question for contending teams in this day and age. Maybe they need one more ring-chaser to eat minutes in the regular season - but it's pretty easy to fill out your center rotation with guys who would have been starters five years ago. When it comes to crunch time in the playoffs, you slide Durant up and have maybe the best two way center in the league. The other half of key games, you live with Jordan or some rando wing who doesn't mind getting elbowed in the throat by Aaron Baynes and Tristan Thompson. Those guys aren't knocking you out of the playoffs, no matter who you put on them...

Great post - I hear you. I just wonder about everything Nets - trading the wrong center, adding Harden to Kyrie, less depth now. A lot can go wrong. We’ll see.

The other thought - in the East, as we saw last playoffs, is about matchups. Embiid gobbles up the Nets right now, as is. Other teams, not so much. Nets-Bucks is an awesome series.

And another..... Dewayne Dedmon is sitting around, enjoying the fact that the Pistons are paying him not to play for them. I smell a Dedmon signing shortly.....

Oh yeah, there's definitely a lot that can still go wrong. You build a team around three superstars you were able to acquire because they are somewhere between flighty and mercenary and you can't expect them to give you much of a leash if anything - anything at all - goes sideways. Kyrie, in particular, terrifies me.

But you probably have to take this shot if you're the nets. Windows don't stay open long when you're building around guys in their 30s, and this raises their ceiling by several notches. If they end up fielding two top ten players and another top 20 guy the rest should take care of itself in the playoffs.

[Stillwater]

KI is getting traded now right? I mean hes not even there and its not like he wants to share the ball with another high usage player on top of KD. Maybe he has changed but I think he gets disgruntled if he isnt already

[patman66]

Ughhh...

Well, I threatened to turn in my fan card if this happened, and while I want to stick to my word, I just can't ditch my team. This team has 2 of my least favorite players in the league and other than Harris, I don't really feel attachment to anyone on this team. But, I think the deal was more than fair and increases the Nets title chances for the foreseeable future. Value-wise, this was pretty much spot on to previous iteration, other than Dinwiddie absent from the deal, so I'm wondering if he's back next year. It will be interesting to see how the Nets fill the roster spots going forward. They have 3 roster spots, the Disabled PE for Dinwiddie and the tax MLE, both about $5.7m each. From the trade, Kurucs wasn't playing, Prince played the SF/PF (poorly) and Caris was having an up and down start as PG/SF/6th man. The biggest loss by far is Allen, so they need to fill that hole. I've seen Dedmon mentioned, and I'm not sure who else is out there. I've heard Isaiah Thomas mentioned, and KD and Kyrie did play with him over the summer saying how good he looked, but even with DIniwwide injured, LeVert gone and Kyrie gone nuts, I don't think a diminutive, defense-less SG in a less than PG's body is needed. I wouldn't be surprised if Jamal Crawford is signed, just because they seem attached to him for some reason. I really want bigs and wings that defend. I wonder if the Nets even wait for the buyout market and see what players become available then.

Current depth:
Irving / T.Johnson / C.Chiozza* / (Dinwiddie)
Harden / B.Brown / Shamet
J.Harris / TLC
Durant / Green
Jordan / R.Perry* / Claxton
*2-ways

I can't see why Dinwiddie would want to share time with those 2 unless he has a setback in his rehab.

To win a title and be part of something that he helped create.
Plus, it's not like Kyrie would be blocking his playing time right now. He'd have plenty of chances to play PG-SF.

I like dinwiddie, but what the hell did he have to do with bringing Kyrie, Durant and Harden to BKN.

[Trader_Joe]

I can't see why Dinwiddie would want to share time with those 2 unless he has a setback in his rehab.

To win a title and be part of something that he helped create.
Plus, it's not like Kyrie would be blocking his playing time right now. He'd have plenty of chances to play PG-SF.

I like dinwiddie, but what the hell did he have to do with bringing Kyrie, Durant and Harden to BKN.

Thought it was well known

Dinwiddie helped make BK be a PO team and appealing to FAs. He was taking a Harvaed class with Kyrie and sold him on the Nets when he was still in Boston.

https://www.netsdaily.com/2019/7/17/20698423/spencer-dinwiddie-kyrie-irving-told-me-in-december-new-york-might-be-fun-next-year

[Prokorov]

KI is getting traded now right? I mean hes not even there and its not like he wants to share the ball with another high usage player on top of KD. Maybe he has changed but I think he gets disgruntled if he isnt already

Kyrie ALREADY shared the ball with 2 high usage players...

Durant and Levert both 30%+ usage

[Prokorov]

I'm really suprised the Nets were able to retain Joe Harris in this deal. They didnt give up 1 single valuable player when you consider health/term.

-Allen is young and healthy. but he is a pending free agent who turned down a big extension and looking to break the bank
-Levert has some term but cant stay healthy and is horribly inefficient and has yet to show he can play off the ball or put 50 games of solid play together

The picks are high in number.... 7 outgoing for the nets. but 2021 is a swap that is a lock not to convey. making it 3 picks and 3 swaps from there. The rocks Owe i Believe 4 firsts to OKC (2 swaps, 2 picks) with 2021 being a swap a lock to convey.

I'd expect KD/Harden/Kyrie to tail off or split after 2 years, but rockets are not in the best rebuild spot with their own picks owed. I can see 2 or 3 of those 4 swaps from Brooklyn to the rockets not conveying

[Prokorov]

No idea why people dislike this for the Rockets

They got a motherlode of picks

The unprotected picks in '24 and '26 could turn out to be gold, and can the pick swaps in '23, '25, and '27

I mean, do people seriously still expect the big 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie to contend in 2026 or 2027, when they are all in their late 30s?

But Cavs is the big winner of this trade, they absolutely sniped Allen for almost nothing

I think its because this could end up as a big nothingburger for them. Those picks have potential, but its all kinda random-ish at this point. And the assets they could have used, LeVert and Allen, were shipped away for underwhelming returns (based on how these votes are going on both boards).

I dont think its necessarily bad, but there's very little finite, concrete, definite value they got back. My guess anyways

Yea, exactly, they are holding a ton of scratch tickets. will they get 2 picks in the 20s, 4 in the teens, and 2 lotto picks? or just end up with 4 picks all outside the lotto?

When you trade someone of Harden's calibur you need at least 1 excellent player 25 and under or a pick guranteed top 3-5 in the upcoming draft. they got neither of those. They should have walked away with ben simmons. instead they got oladipo and 8 scratch tickets.

[Prokorov]

Harden and Durant can both leave after next season. KD and Kyrie have question marks around their health. Those picks and swaps in the out years could be very good.

BRK has a run in them for the next couple of seasons, at which point age becomes a factor with both KD and Harden, as well as Deandre Jordan. It's now or never for them.

The Nets have a path to retool though.

-they will have their 2021 pick, which wont convey to the rockets
-they will at worst have houstons 2023 pick
-Harris should still be in his prime 2024 and later.
-Nets should still be a free agent destination as KD/Kyrie/Durant age or walk
-Marks has done a great job turning D-league talent into rotation players

The nets dont need 3 all-nba players to be an east 8 seed.

[Prospect Dong]

I think Cleveland was a big winner. I also feel Indiana made a great move, getting a good player in exchange for an expiring deal and avoiding a heaping plate of drama. My hope is that it works out for all clubs, that the Brooklyn superteam raises the bar in the East and that Houston does not fall too far. My fear is that Brooklyn gave up too much, that they may suffer the same way they did in the Boston megadeal, and it sucks, because I'm a fan of the Nets too. On the other hand, the deal can flip the other way if Brooklyn is too successful. In that case, the pick swaps will be null & void and the picks the Rockets get will not compensate much either.

I chose Cleveland & Indiana as winners in the poll.

Meanwhile where is Kyrie...

I understand it's not a popular position here, but I support Kyrie's position after the domestic terrorists stormed the Capitol last week. So do the Nets and his teammates:

https://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/kevin_durant_nets_support_kyrie_irving_100_percent_amid_continued_absence/s1_8061_33786677

I have faith Irving will eventually rejoin the team, and the Nets are going to do some serious crushing in the East, assuming of course they can dodge the virus and other injuries. I wish Kyrie and the Nets well.

And I don't know that I buy "I'm taking time off work because of the coup", especially not from Kyrie, who has a lot more history saying crazy stuff than he does with genuine activism. It sounds like you have to work pretty hard even to get that reasoning from his absence, though.

[Prokorov]

No idea why people dislike this for the Rockets

They got a motherlode of picks

The unprotected picks in '24 and '26 could turn out to be gold, as can the pick swaps in '23, '25, and '27

I mean, do people seriously still expect the big 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie to contend in 2026 or 2027, when they are all in their late 30s?

But Cavs is the big winner of this trade, they absolutely sniped Allen for almost nothing

I agree. I also think that Houston wants to bottom out. This is a strong draft. With Covid protocols eliminating fans, now is a good time to tank it. Getting a top-5 pick with their own draft pick this year is also a win.

doesn OKC get their pick this year via swap?

[Prokorov]

Read on Twitter

says the guy who covers the knicks and bashed KD left and right

[patman66]

To win a title and be part of something that he helped create.
Plus, it's not like Kyrie would be blocking his playing time right now. He'd have plenty of chances to play PG-SF.

I like dinwiddie, but what the hell did he have to do with bringing Kyrie, Durant and Harden to BKN.

Thought it was well known

Dinwiddie helped make BK be a PO team and appealing to FAs. He was taking a Harvaed class with Kyrie and sold him on the Nets when he was still in Boston.

https://www.netsdaily.com/2019/7/17/20698423/spencer-dinwiddie-kyrie-irving-told-me-in-december-new-york-might-be-fun-next-year

Gee, I thought Kyrie grew up a nets fan and he wanted to go play in NY. Kyrie went to the nets becasue he and Durant were coming and they got to bring thier buddies with them. Or is it your take that Kyrie would have gone to the nets without durant and his buddies because dinwiddie told him it was a nice place? There are only 300 vets in the NBA and 30 teams, every player that has been in the league 5 years knows everything about a place. These guys socialize with each other. Kyrie went home because Durant and his buddies went too.

What made BKN be an attractive place was in NY and an owner that was going to spend money and let basketball people spend it. Not that they were a 500 team and lost in the first rd.

[Dadouv47]

No idea why people dislike this for the Rockets

They got a motherlode of picks

The unprotected picks in '24 and '26 could turn out to be gold, as can the pick swaps in '23, '25, and '27

I mean, do people seriously still expect the big 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie to contend in 2026 or 2027, when they are all in their late 30s?

But Cavs is the big winner of this trade, they absolutely sniped Allen for almost nothing

I agree. I also think that Houston wants to bottom out. This is a strong draft. With Covid protocols eliminating fans, now is a good time to tank it. Getting a top-5 pick with their own draft pick this year is also a win.

doesn OKC get their pick this year via swap?

top 4 protected. Houston will get the worst of OKC/Houston/Miami pick if not in top 4

Disagree with your post above saying Houston is in a tough spot to rebuild. 2 picks owed but only one protected swap this year and they have their own picks until 2024. So they could easily go full rebuild during 2 years. They got 2 FRPs for Covigton, one for Westbrook, 4 FRPs now for Harden and IF they want to rebuild they could get a great package for Wood (and some asset for Tucker).

I just don't think they want to rebuild (otherwise they wouldn't have traded Levert for Oladipo) but if they have to that's not a problem at all.

[Mr B]

I hate it for both teams, but what about KP/Kyrie swap?

Dallas has some depth pieces to mix in..

Hell no. I would not want Kyrie on the Mavs at all. He would come to Dallas actually believing that he’s the alpha. Besides Cuban isn’t trading KP.


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[Stillwater]

KI is getting traded now right? I mean hes not even there and its not like he wants to share the ball with another high usage player on top of KD. Maybe he has changed but I think he gets disgruntled if he isnt already

Kyrie ALREADY shared the ball with 2 high usage players...

Durant and Levert both 30%+ usage

thats fair but CL is not the same kind of ball hog as Kyrie and Harden

[Stillwater]

Im surprised more people are not seeing a Simmons Kyrie swap as reasonable for both rosters
https://basketball.realgm.com/tradechecker/saved_trade/7381392

[Trader_Joe]

I like dinwiddie, but what the hell did he have to do with bringing Kyrie, Durant and Harden to BKN.

Thought it was well known

Dinwiddie helped make BK be a PO team and appealing to FAs. He was taking a Harvaed class with Kyrie and sold him on the Nets when he was still in Boston.

https://www.netsdaily.com/2019/7/17/20698423/spencer-dinwiddie-kyrie-irving-told-me-in-december-new-york-might-be-fun-next-year

Gee, I thought Kyrie grew up a nets fan and he wanted to go play in NY. Kyrie went to the nets becasue he and Durant were coming and they got to bring thier buddies with them. Or is it your take that Kyrie would have gone to the nets without durant and his buddies because dinwiddie told him it was a nice place? There are only 300 vets in the NBA and 30 teams, every player that has been in the league 5 years knows everything about a place. These guys socialize with each other. Kyrie went home because Durant and his buddies went too.

What made BKN be an attractive place was in NY and an owner that was going to spend money and let basketball people spend it. Not that they were a 500 team and lost in the first rd.

Yes he did. But would he have considered the Nets had they not turned the franchise around?
Would he have known all he did about the culture and appeal if not for Dinwiddie? Otherwise, I haven't heard of any major FAs from NY/NJ or anywhere that have ever clamored to play for the Nets in all my years a Nets fan. Then you had Durant and now Harden wanting to play for the Nets (not the Knicks who will spend), and they didn't grow up Nets fans or in NY/NJ, nor have you ever heard of their interest prior.
Diwniddie has been part of the what Marks' built since days 1. He was found in the G.League, signed to a cheap 2 year and been through the trenches. I think he might want to finish what he helped start. Just my take .

[patman66]

Thought it was well known

Dinwiddie helped make BK be a PO team and appealing to FAs. He was taking a Harvaed class with Kyrie and sold him on the Nets when he was still in Boston.

https://www.netsdaily.com/2019/7/17/20698423/spencer-dinwiddie-kyrie-irving-told-me-in-december-new-york-might-be-fun-next-year

Gee, I thought Kyrie grew up a nets fan and he wanted to go play in NY. Kyrie went to the nets becasue he and Durant were coming and they got to bring thier buddies with them. Or is it your take that Kyrie would have gone to the nets without durant and his buddies because dinwiddie told him it was a nice place? There are only 300 vets in the NBA and 30 teams, every player that has been in the league 5 years knows everything about a place. These guys socialize with each other. Kyrie went home because Durant and his buddies went too.

What made BKN be an attractive place was in NY and an owner that was going to spend money and let basketball people spend it. Not that they were a 500 team and lost in the first rd.

Yes he did. But would he have considered the Nets had they not turned the franchise around?
Would he have known all he did about the culture and appeal if not for Dinwiddie? Otherwise, I haven't heard of any major FAs from NY/NJ or anywhere that have ever clamored to play for the Nets in all my years a Nets fan. Then you had Durant and now Harden wanting to play for the Nets (not the Knicks who will spend), and they didn't grow up Nets fans or in NY/NJ, nor have you ever heard of their interest prior.
Diwniddie has been part of the what Marks' built since days 1. He was found in the G.League, signed to a cheap 2 year and been through the trenches. I think he might want to finish what he helped start. Just my take .

I don't know what you mean by turned it around. They were a 500 team and yes he was part of doing that. All I am saying is that a recruitment pitch had zero effect on Kyrie coming there. I don't think durnat wanted to play for the nets as much as he wanted something new to build on. He knew his legacy took a hit by joining a super team the year after he lost to them. the Nets offered the opportunity to team with a bunch of his friends to rebuild his legacy. It was a package deal, The nets had the money to do so, that is why they choose the nets. not because they finished 500 the year before.

Harden wants top play with durant again. Durant plays in Bkn. Like I said, big market, owner willing to spend, and basketball people running the team. That is why all three of them are there, not becasue of Levert, Harris, Dinwiddie and Allen. But because those basketball people put together that team they were confident the basketball people would be able to surround themselves with more talent as the years went on.

Now dinwiddie is 28 in july, he is not going to want to opt in a be a FA again the following year when he is 29, If he is lucky he can get another deal when he is 32 if he opts out. Now I think he would gladly play for the nets if they match whatever offer he gets. But he is going to want to be paid as a starter and not a back up.

[basketballwacko2]

I'm really suprised the Nets were able to retain Joe Harris in this deal. They didnt give up 1 single valuable player when you consider health/term.

-Allen is young and healthy. but he is a pending free agent who turned down a big extension and looking to break the bank
-Levert has some term but cant stay healthy and is horribly inefficient and has yet to show he can play off the ball or put 50 games of solid play together

The picks are high in number.... 7 outgoing for the nets. but 2021 is a swap that is a lock not to convey. making it 3 picks and 3 swaps from there. The rocks Owe i Believe 4 firsts to OKC (2 swaps, 2 picks) with 2021 being a swap a lock to convey.

I'd expect KD/Harden/Kyrie to tail off or split after 2 years, but rockets are not in the best rebuild spot with their own picks owed. I can see 2 or 3 of those 4 swaps from Brooklyn to the rockets not conveying

Somehow this story seems all too familiar! Trio of big named stars comes to Nets, projections of multiple NBA championships, one star is 32 the other is 31 and the 3rd doesn't know if he still wants to play basketball.

The Nets may get an NBA title this year or next. But 2024-25-26-27 is a long time from now and those picks and swaps might end up being as bad as that other deal. Oh sure everyone says the Nets are in Brooklyn now and they'll be a perennial contender so even if star A or star B goes down or retires who cares we'll just get a new one. We'll see.