Ben Simmons Containment Thread Take 3

[BoogieTime]

Still surprised Rivers hasn't been reprimanded or at least forced to apologize, so that the possibility of running it back is at least most open if they don't get the deal they are looking for

The not so secret, secret here is that the Sixers want to go in another direction. I think they regret the situation having gotten to this point, and they certainly regret where his trade value is, but that's not the same as wanting him back.

Bringing him back in an attempt to run it back won't necessarily result in improving his trade value.

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Maybe so

[zimpy27]

Still surprised Rivers hasn't been reprimanded or at least forced to apologize, so that the possibility of running it back is at least most open if they don't get the deal they are looking for

The not so secret, secret here is that the Sixers want to go in another direction. I think they regret the situation having gotten to this point, and they certainly regret where his trade value is, but that's not the same as wanting him back.

Bringing him back in an attempt to run it back won't necessarily result in improving his trade value.

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I disagree. Morey figured out a great team to make Embiid and Simmons a strong duo and it worked in the RS but the Hawks identified a strategy to run momentum plays against them. Philly would likely have identified the flaw and filled it.
IMO they needed:
- a second playmaker to Simmons that could lead the bench and sub in to change up offense. (have yet to do this. probs because of Simmons situation. I really believe that Philly is looking for one elite playmaker or two playmakers in exchange for Simmons to fix this flaw)
- get rid of Hill. (did it)
- bring in another experienced SF/PF. (did it, got Niang)
- I would have canned DOc for his Simmons comments but also, he was terrible down the stretch by not adjusting. (won't do this)

[zimpy27]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

[BoogieTime]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I think your overvaluing Simmons again

Id have Cleveland struggling to give Garland in a package

Sexton/Okoro/ filler and maybe a first round pick seems fine IMO

[Darthlukey]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I think your overvaluing Simmons again

Id have Cleveland struggling to give Garland in a package

Sexton/Okoro/ filler and maybe a first round pick seems fine IMO

Also a pretty cheap price for Cavs to Dump the Love contract. Thats 60m for a 1st

[zimpy27]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I think your overvaluing Simmons again

Id have Cleveland struggling to give Garland in a package

Sexton/Okoro/ filler and maybe a first round pick seems fine IMO

Well, I have Curry and Sexton at a similar value that Sexton edges and I have Simmons as slightly more valuable than Garland. Playmaking is what Sixers need.

What about Love+Garland+FRP for Simmons?

[zimpy27]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I think your overvaluing Simmons again

Id have Cleveland struggling to give Garland in a package

Sexton/Okoro/ filler and maybe a first round pick seems fine IMO

Also a pretty cheap price for Cavs to Dump the Love contract. Thats 60m for a 1st

That Cavs 22 FRP is pretty valuable, it'd need to be unprotected. I think that's worth the 60m. Especially because Love is a player that could rehab some value. Boston got off a bigger contract for #16 and got Horford+Brown

[DroseReturnChi]

Still surprised Rivers hasn't been reprimanded or at least forced to apologize, so that the possibility of running it back is at least most open if they don't get the deal they are looking for

not surprising since rivers is in the drivers seat he can get away with it. i bet rivers keeps harassing the to the point ben takes legal action or confront him personally bc it look liked doc likes to shift his share of blame to others to relieve his stress. this ben simmons situation would have been resolved only if rivers didnt pull the trigger it was fixable worst case when no one wants ben.

and doc is what 4 yrs left on deal philly will lose a lot of money and take reputation hit.

[kuclas]

Still surprised Rivers hasn't been reprimanded or at least forced to apologize, so that the possibility of running it back is at least most open if they don't get the deal they are looking for

The not so secret, secret here is that the Sixers want to go in another direction. I think they regret the situation having gotten to this point, and they certainly regret where his trade value is, but that's not the same as wanting him back.

Bringing him back in an attempt to run it back won't necessarily result in improving his trade value.

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I disagree. Morey figured out a great team to make Embiid and Simmons a strong duo and it worked in the RS but the Hawks identified a strategy to run momentum plays against them. Philly would likely have identified the flaw and filled it.
IMO they needed:
- a second playmaker to Simmons that could lead the bench and sub in to change up offense. (have yet to do this. probs because of Simmons situation. I really believe that Philly is looking for one elite playmaker or two playmakers in exchange for Simmons to fix this flaw)
- get rid of Hill. (did it)
- bring in another experienced SF/PF. (did it, got Niang)
- I would have canned DOc for his Simmons comments but also, he was terrible down the stretch by not adjusting. (won't do this)

It’s also on doc rivers. Momentum killing hack and Ben in game 5 (with Sixers up 10 ans 3.5 min left) trying to save 26 point lead.

If doc rivers had recognized what I did. Hack a capela who was shooting 33% and looked just as rattled as Simmons. It would have impacted the outcome. Cause either hawks let capela shoot and miss free throws wasting possession. Or sub out capela which means Embiid goes to work and gets fouled more often than not.

It was horrendous blunder on doc rivers.

The hawks hacked a simmmons in game 1 even when up. So a leading team should be hacking a capela. Cause it degrades the amount of Posssesions.

[jbk1234]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I'd gladly let Simmons play elsewhere if the Sixers insist on Garland. I'm only Lukewarm on the idea of trading for Simmons at all.

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[jbk1234]

CLE give Sexton+Garland+Love+CLE22FRP
CLE get Simmons+Curry+Favors
Curry, Okoro, Simmons, Mobley, Allen -- Rubio, Windler, Cedi, Markannen, Favors

PHI give Simmons+Curry
PHI get Sexton+Garland+TPE(33m- to use on a player like Wiggins by deadline)
Garland, Green, Wiggins, Harris, Embiid -- Sexton, Maxey, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond

OKC give Favors
OKC get Love+CLE22FRP

I think your overvaluing Simmons again

Id have Cleveland struggling to give Garland in a package

Sexton/Okoro/ filler and maybe a first round pick seems fine IMO

Also a pretty cheap price for Cavs to Dump the Love contract. Thats 60m for a 1st

The only team that could really get us *off* Love's money is OKC at this point and given the fact that free agency is over for this season already, it would be stupid to surrender value to get off of the entire $60M. You're paying extra for value you're not going to realize. If you're going to take another shot at trading Love, much better to do it at the deadline or next summer.

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[EvanZ]

Here I solved it.

Read on Twitter

?s=20

I'd be fine sending Duarte to GS too.

[Van_Trump]

I disagree. Morey figured out a great team to make Embiid and Simmons a strong duo and it worked in the RS but the Hawks identified a strategy to run momentum plays against them. Philly would likely have identified the flaw and filled it.
IMO they needed:
- a second playmaker to Simmons that could lead the bench and sub in to change up offense. (have yet to do this. probs because of Simmons situation. I really believe that Philly is looking for one elite playmaker or two playmakers in exchange for Simmons to fix this flaw)

Van Vleet + Dragic + 2022 FRP

Latest low ball offer from the Raptors. (this is assuming Simmons still retains enough trade value for this to be a low ball offer)

Question: Is Simmons trade value dropping over time?

[Texas Chuck]

Here I solved it.

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Sure that looks like amazing value for Philly because both Indy and GSW get badly ripped off here.

Can't see how the Pacers would increase their offer by a factor of Myles Turner.

[EvanZ]

The Pacers are the ones that really want Simmons. And the Warriors are winners in this trade too. It's a huge upgrade from Wiseman to Turner.

[Texas Chuck]

The Pacers are the ones that really want Simmons. And the Warriors are winners in this trade too. It's a huge upgrade from Wiseman to Turner.

Sure its a massive upgrade right now. But I don't believe the difference in value is Kuminga. And Indy did make an offer. Brogdon and a first. Turner is a lot of added value to their offer and I don't believe Warren's injury makes them desperate to suddenly add a bunch more value. Probably makes them less likely to if I'm honest.

[EvanZ]

The Pacers are the ones that really want Simmons. And the Warriors are winners in this trade too. It's a huge upgrade from Wiseman to Turner.

Sure its a massive upgrade right now. But I don't believe the difference in value is Kuminga. And Indy did make an offer. Brogdon and a first. Turner is a lot of added value to their offer and I don't believe Warren's injury makes them desperate to suddenly add a bunch more value. Probably makes them less likely to if I'm honest.

I think the basics of the trade are solid but sure there could be a few tweaks. Maybe Duarte stays in Indy or goes to GS instead. Maybe Philly sends back Maxey or Springer or even Paul Reed to Indy.

But the basic components are there for a 3-team trade where each team gets what they really need or want. Indy clearly wants Simmons. The Warriors get their upgrade at center to truly contend now while keeping Wiggins. And Philly gets a win now piece and blue chip assets more or less. The framework seems solid to me. No deal is perfect obviously.

[jbk1234]

The Pacers are the ones that really want Simmons. And the Warriors are winners in this trade too. It's a huge upgrade from Wiseman to Turner.

Sure its a massive upgrade right now. But I don't believe the difference in value is Kuminga. And Indy did make an offer. Brogdon and a first. Turner is a lot of added value to their offer and I don't believe Warren's injury makes them desperate to suddenly add a bunch more value. Probably makes them less likely to if I'm honest.

I think the basics of the trade are solid but sure there could be a few tweaks. Maybe Duarte stays in Indy or goes to GS instead. Maybe Philly sends back Maxey or Springer or even Paul Reed to Indy.

But the basic components are there for a 3-team trade where each team gets what they really need or want. Indy clearly wants Simmons. The Warriors get their upgrade at center to truly contend now while keeping Wiggins. And Philly gets a win now piece and blue chip assets more or less. The framework seems solid to me. No deal is perfect obviously.

The basics are not good. If the Pacers are trading for Simmons, then they need to retain Turner because the added value comes from Simmons being able to play in more space. Sabonis needs to be the player going out here, and then you can start tinkering around the edges.

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[EvanZ]

The basics are not good. If the Pacers are trading for Simmons, then they need to retain Turner because the added value comes from Simmons being able to play in more space. Sabonis needs to be the player going out here, and then you can start tinkering around the edges.

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I think Sabonis works with Simmons about as well as he'd work with Draymond. Could probably make the argument that GS should do that deal for Sabonis.

[jbk1234]

The basics are not good. If the Pacers are trading for Simmons, then they need to retain Turner because the added value comes from Simmons being able to play in more space. Sabonis needs to be the player going out here, and then you can start tinkering around the edges.

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I think Sabonis works with Simmons about as well as he'd work with Draymond. Could probably make the argument that GS should do that deal for Sabonis.

The Warriors don't need to be in the trade at all. The Hornets and Raptors could really use Sabonis as well.