Offers for Gasol?

[LApwnd]

Lakers will either get expiring contracts that are not as good as Gasol, or thy will get guys like Boozer and Lee for Gasol.

What I want to know is who do they think is going to LAL next summer? I see them talking about next summer all the time, but who's available?

http://touch.latimes.com/#story/la-sp-l ... -20130529/

[magic wand time]

Cavs get Gasol, Blake
Lakers get Speights, CJ Miles, #31, #33, +-18M TPE (!!!)

Cavs get vets to help them grow into a legit playoffs team.

PG: Irving | Blake
SG: Waiters | Ellington (restricted FA)
SF: Gee | Karasev (19th pick)
PF: Thompson | Varejao | Noel
C: Gasol | Zeller | Noel

Lakers retool with younger and cheaper players. At 31/33 they could get nice role players like Bullock or Kabongo. They amnesty MWP.

If I were the Cavs, I'd then be poking around the Grizzlies to see how much they'd want added to do a Randolph-Gasol swap. Does Pau+#19 do it?

That's not such a bad deal for L.A. It gives them some capable role players and saves quite a bit of salary. I'd ask for 19 back instead of the 2nds but Kupchak may prefer the 2nds, as the talent differential isn't huge between 19-32 and the two selections increase your odds.

While I don't see CLE touching this, I agree LA would rather take on the two 2nds than 19, as you said because of the marginal talent gap and the non-guaranteed 2nds would not impact '14 cap space like a 1st rounder would.

[lelelazza8]

Lakers Trade Gasol & 48th pick... Get Der.Williams, 9th pick and 19th pick...
Cavaliers trade Varejao & 19th pick... get Gasol and 48th pick...
T'Wolves trade D.Williams & 9th pick... get A.Varejao...

Lakers use pick to add athleticism and 3 pts shooting...

[shrink]

Lakers Trade Gasol & 48th pick... Get Der.Williams, 9th pick and 19th pick...
Cavaliers trade Varejao & 19th pick... get Gasol and 48th pick...
T'Wolves trade D.Williams & 9th pick... get A.Varejao...

Lakers use pick to add athleticism and 3 pts shooting...

People here need to start realizing that players are paid for their expected production.

Is Gasol going to give any team he's traded to $19.7 mil worth of production? Not even close.

Is Varejao going to give any team he's traded to $9.0 mil worth of production? If the last three seasons show injury history (and he hasn't played 82 games in the last 3 seasons combined!), then the team that trades for Varejao is going to pay him $9 guaranteed million to watch games from the bench.

Of course, MIN is not going to do this trade. And even if they did, CLE would cut the Lakers out of this deal immediately -- even though LAL is including the #48 pick.

[Leto]

Lakers will either get expiring contracts that are not as good as Gasol, or thy will get guys like Boozer and Lee for Gasol.

What I want to know is who do they think is going to LAL next summer? I see them talking about next summer all the time, but who's available?

http://touch.latimes.com/#story/la-sp-l ... -20130529/

LBJ, Wade and Bosh are not going to LAL. Carmelo is not going to LAL. Iggy is opting out this season, so he will be signed to a long term deal= not going to LAL. ZBo has a player opt., so that's not exactly a prospect and Gay isn't opting out of a 19 mil PO. Basically, the first 7 players mentioned are not realistic possibilities which is why I asked : Who do the Lakers think they're going to get?

[nevetsov]

Suns offer Gortat ($7.75m expiring), Scola ($4.5m x2) and Beasley ($6m x2, 2nd year small buyout)

- Gortat can be flicked to a 3rd team for a draft pick
- Scola can be flicked to a 3rd team for a draft pick
- Beasley can play stretch PF in Pau's place for $13m less, and if he sucks then he can be bought out for $3m.

$19m expiring thus becomes $6m Beasley plus picks. Also, if Dwight does bolt, you can keep Gortat as a stopgap on the cheap.

PHX turns an expiring Gortat, and filler that shouldn't see the court this season (due to youth movement) into an expiring, slightly better Gasol. Sure he is way overpaid, but he's expiring and replaces equal salary that wouldn't produce positive long term value anyway.

[TheOUTLAW]

Lakers Trade Gasol & 48th pick... Get Der.Williams, 9th pick and 19th pick...
Cavaliers trade Varejao & 19th pick... get Gasol and 48th pick...
T'Wolves trade D.Williams & 9th pick... get A.Varejao...

Lakers use pick to add athleticism and 3 pts shooting...

What? the Cavs wouldn't dream of giving up Varejao and the 19 for Pau.

[rsavaj]

Suns offer Gortat ($7.75m expiring), Scola ($4.5m x2) and Beasley ($6m x2, 2nd year small buyout)

- Gortat can be flicked to a 3rd team for a draft pick
- Scola can be flicked to a 3rd team for a draft pick
- Beasley can play stretch PF in Pau's place for $13m less, and if he sucks then he can be bought out for $3m.

$19m expiring thus becomes $6m Beasley plus picks. Also, if Dwight does bolt, you can keep Gortat as a stopgap on the cheap.

PHX turns an expiring Gortat, and filler that shouldn't see the court this season (due to youth movement) into an expiring, slightly better Gasol. Sure he is way overpaid, but he's expiring and replaces equal salary that wouldn't produce positive long term value anyway.

But then what do we do with Gasol? We'd have to flip him or else we risk losing him for nothing. The whole point of trading Gortat is to gain an asset before he leaves in FA next summer.

[AustinCarr61]

Lakers Trade Gasol & 48th pick... Get Der.Williams, 9th pick and 19th pick...
Cavaliers trade Varejao & 19th pick... get Gasol and 48th pick...
T'Wolves trade D.Williams & 9th pick... get A.Varejao...

Lakers use pick to add athleticism and 3 pts shooting...

What? the Cavs wouldn't dream of giving up Varejao and the 19 for Pau.

Indeed. As the guy before said, if the Wolves are willing to do Derrick Williams & 9th pick for Andy, then we'll take that ourselves. You could then potentially move that to CHA for #4 (maybe add a little bit) and get one of Porter/Oladipo/McLemore to go with Noel.

But I can't see how that makes sense for MIN anyway so this is all moot.

[sportscrazy]

Let's say two of the following things happen...

1. MWP opts out of his contract so he can sign with NY or Brooklyn.

2. Dwight Howard signs with the Rockets.


Would the Lakers at that point be better off telling Kobe to pull a Derrick Rose and recover the whole season then amnesty Gasol followed by a season of tanking and then build a team in 2014 around a top 10 draft pick in a much better draft than this year?

[shrink]

Lakers paid Gasol $19 mil last year, and got 1655 minutes, 421 rebounds, and 671 points

Cavs paid Varejao $8.4 mil last year, and got 901 minutes, 363 rebounds, and 353 points

Wolves paid Williams $4.8 mil last year, and got 1916 minutes, 430 rebounds, and 933 points

Now I understand that trade value is based on future production, but when an owner spends a lot of money on a player, he needs him to turn that payroll into production. The Lakers don't have three Gasol's to maintain that level of play when the first one if on the bench, so it forces lesser players on the floor. It also uses up money that won't be spent on other payroll.

I'm sure at contract time, the agents for Gasol and Varejao will point to their per-game averages for their next deal, but don't be fooled. Until guaranteed contracts are gone, players that don't have good season production will be bad deals, taking money from the team when they are sitting on the bench.

[BossHoggin]

AV was hurt under Byron Scott, he was healthier under Brown, let's wait and see if he gets seriously injured this year.

[tviper]

Let's say two of the following things happen...

1. MWP opts out of his contract so he can sign with NY or Brooklyn.

2. Dwight Howard signs with the Rockets.


Would the Lakers at that point be better off telling Kobe to pull a Derrick Rose and recover the whole season then amnesty Gasol followed by a season of tanking and then build a team in 2014 around a top 10 draft pick in a much better draft than this year?

Re: 1, very unlikely that MWP opts out of 7.7M to sign at a much lower price for NY (who is in tax territory even if JR Smith leaves).

Re: Pau, there is no reason to use amnesty even if MWP opts out and signs elsewhere (highly unlikely) because either Pau is your starting 5 if D12 leaves (per your second assumption) or he can be traded for assets (contra the general consensus of this board, Pau still has considerable value).

The only scenario in which Pau is traded and D12 leaves is if Mitch makes a preemptive strike on or before draft night as an indication to D12 that LAL is his team for the taking and D12 nevertheless packs his bags. However, I can't see Laker organization making that play.

[tviper]

Lakers paid Gasol $19 mil last year, and got 1655 minutes, 421 rebounds, and 671 points

Cavs paid Varejao $8.4 mil last year, and got 901 minutes, 363 rebounds, and 353 points

Wolves paid Williams $4.8 mil last year, and got 1916 minutes, 430 rebounds, and 933 points

Now I understand that trade value is based on future production, but when an owner spends a lot of money on a player, he needs him to turn that payroll into production. The Lakers don't have three Gasol's to maintain that level of play when the first one if on the bench, so it forces lesser players on the floor. It also uses up money that won't be spent on other payroll.

I'm sure at contract time, the agents for Gasol and Varejao will point to their per-game averages for their next deal, but don't be fooled. Until guaranteed contracts are gone, players that don't have good season production will be bad deals, taking money from the team when they are sitting on the bench.

shrink, I get your premise, but past performance matters too, as well as context. The fact is that Pau won two championships and dominated the Olympics. I am pretty sure most GMs can see past MDA misusing Pau and a bad run of nagging injuries due to constant play through the Olympics and believe that a rested healthy Pau in the right role is well worth his contract given that: 1) low post play is likely seen as vital to success (per these playoffs), and 2) there is no long term commitment.

[shrink]

I guess I disagree.

If a team is taking on Gasol to try to get themselves ring, why would they put more weight into two rings that would then be three and four years old, than the plantar fasciitis from three months ago?

And while the $19.7 mil isn't a longterm commitment, it's a pretty large amount of money up front, and is certainly a big chunk of a team's payroll. In any regard, in today's NBA economics, $19.7 mil is overpaying for whatever his 2013-14 expected production is.

[parson]

Every time I see this thread, I think "Offers for Gasol? Please? Please?"

[loserX]

The only scenario in which Pau is traded and D12 leaves is if Mitch makes a preemptive strike on or before draft night as an indication to D12 that LAL is his team for the taking and D12 nevertheless packs his bags. However, I can't see Laker organization making that play.

Totally agree with this (I even and-1ed your post ).

Any talk of moving Pau really can't happen until the Lakers know what's going to happen with Dwight.

If Dwight leaves, are they going to tank? Or are they going to need to keep Pau to have any chance of winning games?

If Dwight stays, can they make it work with Pau? Or should they trade Pau for complementary pieces? (Trading him for capspace isn't likely to make Dwight want to stick around and waste a year of his career.)

Until Dwight decides, the Lakers aren't even going to know what they're looking for in return for Pau. So any talk of trading Gasol early (say, at the draft) is unlikely to say the least.

[LApwnd]

Lakers will either get expiring contracts that are not as good as Gasol, or thy will get guys like Boozer and Lee for Gasol.

What I want to know is who do they think is going to LAL next summer? I see them talking about next summer all the time, but who's available?

http://touch.latimes.com/#story/la-sp-l ... -20130529/

LBJ, Wade and Bosh are not going to LAL. Carmelo is not going to LAL. Iggy is opting out this season, so he will be signed to a long term deal= not going to LAL. ZBo has a player opt., so that's not exactly a prospect and Gay isn't opting out of a 19 mil PO. Basically, the first 7 players mentioned are not realistic possibilities which is why I asked : Who do the Lakers think they're going to get?

assumptions, there's no gurantee but would you rather have that ability to offer a contract to players like a James, Wade, etc. or tie it up with players like Boozer?

[Leto]

^ Lets just say my assumption is far more likely to happen than yours.

It depends on what I was trying to do. If I'm trying to win next season or, Im trying to convince Howard to stay, Im probably going to make some trades because Howard is likely not going to sign long-term if you don't show some kind of insurance of getting better. Trying to convince Howard to stay by saying, "hey, were taking a long shot huge gamble that if it fails we'll be F-ed for the next several years which are also the prime f your career. How about signing a long term contract with us?" is probably not going to work.

On the other hand, Cuban is doubling down on that same strategy. So far, its landed him in the lottery and Dirk hasn't demanded a trade. Of course, Dirk has a different kind of loyalty to the Mavs than Howard has with the Lakers.

I think Kupchak has put himself into a corner with no good options. If you want to play the FA market, you risk losing Howard. If Howard leaves, you have even less chance of getting any FA's in 2014. Catch-22.

[LApwnd]

I think Kupchak has put himself into a corner with no good options. If you want to play the FA market, you risk losing Howard. If Howard leaves, you have even less chance of getting any FA's in 2014. Catch-22.

why? if he leaves now we have 2 MAX slots and another 10mill type slot guy. As a big name FA wouldn't you want to sign on a team with that type of flexibility?