Ben Simmons trades go here (and here only): Expect warnings if not following forum rules

[jbk1234]

It’s been reported by our beat reporter, Jason Anderson, that the Sixers were only focused on a deal featuring Fox or Haliburton from the Kings. since then I’ve taken it as a yes to some degree (don’t know if that leaves open that they want one of them in some type of package)

The starting point was Fox +

Tbh, I have no idea why the Kings would be interested in Simmons when their first priority should be a new coach

They should just roll with the same roster this season and if they miss the playoffs again they’ll at get another decent pick for a competent coach to develop

Personally I have Fox/Simmons about equal. I'd entertain the notion because I, and perhaps the organization is high on Mitchell. I think Hali/Mitchell can be a good backcourt now. If the positional quagmire didn't exist, I wouldn't care for the trade. But maybe one of them will be able to guard SFs down the line

Simmons is 6"10'. He can guard SFs.

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[BoogieTime]

The starting point was Fox +

Tbh, I have no idea why the Kings would be interested in Simmons when their first priority should be a new coach

They should just roll with the same roster this season and if they miss the playoffs again they’ll at get another decent pick for a competent coach to develop

Personally I have Fox/Simmons about equal. I'd entertain the notion because I, and perhaps the organization is high on Mitchell. I think Hali/Mitchell can be a good backcourt now. If the positional quagmire didn't exist, I wouldn't care for the trade. But maybe one of them will be able to guard SFs down the line

Simmons is 6"10'. He can guard SFs.

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Yeah, I meant one of Fox/Hali/Mitchell. I don't mind that combo, but someone will have to guard up eventually

[Ballerhogger]

I think Brown for Simmons should be explored more. Celtics team looks nice for Simmons IMO ad they've loaded up on a number of players at SG/SF.

What would make up the difference between Brown and Simmons? Is it a straight swap?

I wouldn't want to break up the 2 Jays for a shot at Simmons. And we cant afford him without doing that, so I would pass personally

The two Jays are very good in their own right, respectively, but there are a number of measures that would suggest they don't necessarily have great synergy between them. If you could find someone to further empower one of the Jays in a trade while not dropping off in talent too much I would be tempted to go for it.

Your not going win with Ben as your 2nd option , plus they need stretch sf PF on court with him

[jbk1234]

You’re right on most of these beyond the last sentence. The basic obvious strategy isn’t to hope Simmons’ value increases but rather that the willingness/desire to trade for him increases. There will be teams that disappoint or aren’t coming out like they’re expecting to in a few months; maybe those teams need a talent upgrade then more than they think they do now, maybe someone sees that their plan isn’t working and they need playmaking and defense. Even if not and the Sixers don’t get any breaks, Simmons’ value couldn’t be lower than it is now, so nothing’s really lost. They can take whatever of these deals already exists that’s obviously selling low of BS.

For a number of reasons, I think Simmons value can get lower, and folks who say that it cannot suffer from a lack of imagination. That aside, the other teams get desperate gambit comes with some risk as well. If the goal is to get Fox from the Kings, or Dlo from the Wolves, it could work.

But a team like the Cavs could end up extending Sexton or trading him elsewhere which would essentially remove them as a potential trade partner. Teams can perform better than expected out of the gate and decide against breaking up their rosters. Also, there's the reality that a team like the Warriors could outbid the Sixers for a player like Beal.

This is all true and future's always unknown etc but I'm not sure I get your practical suggestion. The Sixers (understandably) don't like any of the offers on the table now and none of them is way better than the others, so I don't see how it's a better gamble to make a trade you don't like now instead of one in the future. The conclusion that the best offer now will likely be the best offer EVER doesn't make sense--at best it's a sort of panicked guess--and I doubt you would do the same thing with any of your personal valued possessions. If you're taking 50 cents on the dollar for your car, it's because you either a) have to sell it now or b) know you can't do any better. You're not going to take that offer the 3rd day on its ebay just to get it over with. And if many people are offering that 50 cents now and you know it's valuable, it's a good bet the offers will still be there in a month or two.

You can not like the offers on the table now but still have a couple you'd prefer over the others if you had to pull the trigger. Those offers may, or may not be there in the future.

The nightmare scenario is that Simmons reports, doesn't want to be there, plays uninspired ball, the fans get on him, team chemistry collapses, opposing teams routinely foul him in the fourth quarter, losses ensue, and Embiid ends up in Morey's office.

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[toooskies]

Yeah there is. He wants out. His agent says he's not reporting. Teams aren't offering much because they know the situation and how poorly he finished in the playoffs.

Philly can string this out as long as they like since Simmons is still under contract but it's silly to think the value gets any better.

You’re right on most of these beyond the last sentence. The basic obvious strategy isn’t to hope Simmons’ value increases but rather that the willingness/desire to trade for him increases. There will be teams that disappoint or aren’t coming out like they’re expecting to in a few months; maybe those teams need a talent upgrade then more than they think they do now, maybe someone sees that their plan isn’t working and they need playmaking and defense. Even if not and the Sixers don’t get any breaks, Simmons’ value couldn’t be lower than it is now, so nothing’s really lost. They can take whatever of these deals already exists that’s obviously selling low of BS.

For a number of reasons, I think Simmons value can get lower, and folks who say that it cannot suffer from a lack of imagination. That aside, the other teams get desperate gambit comes with some risk as well. If the goal is to get Fox from the Kings, or Dlo from the Wolves, it could work.

But a team like the Cavs could end up extending Sexton or trading him elsewhere which would essentially remove them as a potential trade partner. Teams can perform better than expected out of the gate and decide against breaking up their rosters.

Also, there's the reality that a team like the Warriors could outbid the Sixers for a player like Beal.

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Pretty much any Cavs deal involving Sexton could instead involve Garland and one less pick, or Okoro and one more pick.

[jbk1234]

You’re right on most of these beyond the last sentence. The basic obvious strategy isn’t to hope Simmons’ value increases but rather that the willingness/desire to trade for him increases. There will be teams that disappoint or aren’t coming out like they’re expecting to in a few months; maybe those teams need a talent upgrade then more than they think they do now, maybe someone sees that their plan isn’t working and they need playmaking and defense. Even if not and the Sixers don’t get any breaks, Simmons’ value couldn’t be lower than it is now, so nothing’s really lost. They can take whatever of these deals already exists that’s obviously selling low of BS.

For a number of reasons, I think Simmons value can get lower, and folks who say that it cannot suffer from a lack of imagination. That aside, the other teams get desperate gambit comes with some risk as well. If the goal is to get Fox from the Kings, or Dlo from the Wolves, it could work.

But a team like the Cavs could end up extending Sexton or trading him elsewhere which would essentially remove them as a potential trade partner. Teams can perform better than expected out of the gate and decide against breaking up their rosters.

Also, there's the reality that a team like the Warriors could outbid the Sixers for a player like Beal.

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Pretty much any Cavs deal involving Sexton could instead involve Garland and one less pick, or Okoro and one more pick.

The Cavs aren't going to trade Garland. They'll very much need his shooting if they trade for Simmons. The two year plan would be to move Mobley to starting center as he can play away from the basket and then deal Allen for a two guard who is more of a shooter. Okoro could be made available.

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[toooskies]

For a number of reasons, I think Simmons value can get lower, and folks who say that it cannot suffer from a lack of imagination. That aside, the other teams get desperate gambit comes with some risk as well. If the goal is to get Fox from the Kings, or Dlo from the Wolves, it could work.

But a team like the Cavs could end up extending Sexton or trading him elsewhere which would essentially remove them as a potential trade partner. Teams can perform better than expected out of the gate and decide against breaking up their rosters.

Also, there's the reality that a team like the Warriors could outbid the Sixers for a player like Beal.

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Pretty much any Cavs deal involving Sexton could instead involve Garland and one less pick, or Okoro and one more pick.

The Cavs aren't going to trade Garland. They'll very much need his shooting if they trade for Simmons. The two year plan would be to move Mobley to starting center as he can play away from the basket and then deal Allen for a two guard who is more of a shooter. Okoro could be made available.

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Your assumption is the Cavs won't do something dumb, but you also believe they've gone into the offseason with perhaps the worst SF play in the league last year, did nothing to make it better, and arguably made it worse with the Prince trade. I'm not taking anything that's somewhat reasonable off the table with the Cleveland front office. Garland's upside is potential all-star, Simmons is already there, it seems like the ballpark of a fair offer, discounting team fit. Maybe the Cavs also work a Curry-for-Okoro swap in the deal to resolve that.

[the_process]

Assuming the salary filler is Love… is Garland for Simmons a dumb trade for Cleveland though? I’d argue that’s pretty good for them.

[toooskies]

Assuming the salary filler is Love… is trading Garland for Simmons a dumb trade for Cleveland though? I’d argue that’s pretty good for them.

It's pretty much only dumb because it's a move to make Cleveland a win-now team but with very little outside shooting-- mostly just Markkanen and Sexton, and Sexton prefers to drive. So it probably doesn't actually help them win now. Thus the suggestion of the Okoro/Curry swap.

[DroseReturnChi]

Assuming the salary filler is Love… is trading Garland for Simmons a dumb trade for Cleveland though? I’d argue that’s pretty good for them.

It's pretty much only dumb because it's a move to make Cleveland a win-now team but with very little outside shooting-- mostly just Markkanen and Sexton, and Sexton prefers to drive. So it probably doesn't actually help them win now. Thus the suggestion of the Okoro/Curry swap.

why is it a win now team? sexton is the only win now guy trade him too.

[DroseReturnChi]

It’s been reported by our beat reporter, Jason Anderson, that the Sixers were only focused on a deal featuring Fox or Haliburton from the Kings. since then I’ve taken it as a yes to some degree (don’t know if that leaves open that they want one of them in some type of package)

The starting point was Fox +

Tbh, I have no idea why the Kings would be interested in Simmons when their first priority should be a new coach

They should just roll with the same roster this season and if they miss the playoffs again they’ll at get another decent pick for a competent coach to develop

Personally I have Fox/Simmons about equal. I'd entertain the notion because I, and perhaps the organization is high on Mitchell. I think Hali/Mitchell can be a good backcourt now. If the positional quagmire didn't exist, I wouldn't care for the trade. But maybe one of them will be able to guard SFs down the line

fox simmons is equal but when you factor in sixers and fox is treated like cornerstone kings are no longer destination.
same with brown who was equal a season ago but this season he smashed it tatum should be the one worried getting traded if he keeps up this pace.

which leaves cavs as the only plausible destination bc they can move all garland/sexton/love for simmons.

[toooskies]

Assuming the salary filler is Love… is trading Garland for Simmons a dumb trade for Cleveland though? I’d argue that’s pretty good for them.

It's pretty much only dumb because it's a move to make Cleveland a win-now team but with very little outside shooting-- mostly just Markkanen and Sexton, and Sexton prefers to drive. So it probably doesn't actually help them win now. Thus the suggestion of the Okoro/Curry swap.

why is it a win now team? sexton is the only win now guy trade him too.

Because the owner wants to win now? They traded a pick to get Markkanen (and didn't take the 1st from Portland directly for Nance). They traded a pick to get Allen. They haven't moved Sexton, which you'd be doing this offseason if you weren't ready to try to win now. If the Cavs are busy accumulating picks for a rebuild, they're doing a terrible job outside of Javale McGee trades.

That's beside the fact of whether they should or should not be a win now team, but a Simmons trade would definitely be them crossing the line into win-now territory.

[jbk1234]

Pretty much any Cavs deal involving Sexton could instead involve Garland and one less pick, or Okoro and one more pick.

The Cavs aren't going to trade Garland. They'll very much need his shooting if they trade for Simmons. The two year plan would be to move Mobley to starting center as he can play away from the basket and then deal Allen for a two guard who is more of a shooter. Okoro could be made available.

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Your assumption is the Cavs won't do something dumb, but you also believe they've gone into the offseason with perhaps the worst SF play in the league last year, did nothing to make it better, and arguably made it worse with the Prince trade. I'm not taking anything that's somewhat reasonable off the table with the Cleveland front office. Garland's upside is potential all-star, Simmons is already there, it seems like the ballpark of a fair offer, discounting team fit. Maybe the Cavs also work a Curry-for-Okoro swap in the deal to resolve that.

Simmons and Sexton wouldn't work together. I am assuming the Cavs won't do something dumb. I don't think that the Cavs failed to upgraded the backup SG and SF position because they're dumb. I think they tried and failed.

[zimpy27]

The Cavs aren't going to trade Garland. They'll very much need his shooting if they trade for Simmons. The two year plan would be to move Mobley to starting center as he can play away from the basket and then deal Allen for a two guard who is more of a shooter. Okoro could be made available.

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Your assumption is the Cavs won't do something dumb, but you also believe they've gone into the offseason with perhaps the worst SF play in the league last year, did nothing to make it better, and arguably made it worse with the Prince trade. I'm not taking anything that's somewhat reasonable off the table with the Cleveland front office. Garland's upside is potential all-star, Simmons is already there, it seems like the ballpark of a fair offer, discounting team fit. Maybe the Cavs also work a Curry-for-Okoro swap in the deal to resolve that.

Simmons and Sexton wouldn't work together. I am assuming the Cavs won't do something dumb. I don't think that the Cavs failed to upgraded the backup SG and SF position because they're dumb. I think they tried and failed.

Evan Dammerall reporting that Houston trying to get Simmons with Wall and picks.

He's a Cavs reporter. Any credibility?

[toooskies]

The Cavs aren't going to trade Garland. They'll very much need his shooting if they trade for Simmons. The two year plan would be to move Mobley to starting center as he can play away from the basket and then deal Allen for a two guard who is more of a shooter. Okoro could be made available.

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Your assumption is the Cavs won't do something dumb, but you also believe they've gone into the offseason with perhaps the worst SF play in the league last year, did nothing to make it better, and arguably made it worse with the Prince trade. I'm not taking anything that's somewhat reasonable off the table with the Cleveland front office. Garland's upside is potential all-star, Simmons is already there, it seems like the ballpark of a fair offer, discounting team fit. Maybe the Cavs also work a Curry-for-Okoro swap in the deal to resolve that.

Simmons and Sexton wouldn't work together. I am assuming the Cavs won't do something dumb. I don't think that the Cavs failed to upgraded the backup SG and SF position because they're dumb. I think they tried and failed.

Reasonable stance if the last big move they made wasn't to trade a PF with value for... another PF who shoots a bit better.

[Godaddycurse]

Anyone tried this variation before?

Wolves out: Prince, Bolmaro, Beasley, Layman, 3 1sts
Wolves in Simmons, Osman

Cavs out: Osman, Sexton
Cavs in: Beasley, Bolmaro

Philly out: Simmons
Philly in: Prince, Sexton, Layman, 3 Minny 1sts

Why for Philly: get a replacement scoring guard, 3 1sts and expiring for next star
Why for Cavs: avoid the tax and improve shooting
Why for Wolves: get simmons without dlo/edwards/towns

[JimmyPlopper]

I wouldn't want to break up the 2 Jays for a shot at Simmons. And we cant afford him without doing that, so I would pass personally

The two Jays are very good in their own right, respectively, but there are a number of measures that would suggest they don't necessarily have great synergy between them. If you could find someone to further empower one of the Jays in a trade while not dropping off in talent too much I would be tempted to go for it.

Brown is a much more dynamic player than Simmons and is on a better contract. I can't see the Celtics being remotely interested.

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I'm not sure how you are qualifying dynamic here - surely not regarding ability to be a multi-dimensional player. Also I can't imagine there are any teams out there that would value Brown as a player more than Simmons. Brown does have the added value of being a really popular person with teammates and within the community whereas Simmons personality is more aloof. I know that rubs fans the wrong way, in addition to his reluctance to shoot jumpers, but as I stated previously in this thread. The perception of Simmons value among fans (as represented by comments on this board) seem to be getting farther and farther away from how executives are likely to view him.

[zimpy27]

Anyone tried this variation before?

Wolves out: Prince, Bolmaro, Beasley, Layman, 3 1sts
Wolves in Simmons, Osman

Cavs out: Osman, Sexton
Cavs in: Beasley, Bolmaro

Philly out: Simmons
Philly in: Prince, Sexton, Layman, 3 Minny 1sts

Why for Philly: get a replacement scoring guard, 3 1sts and expiring for next star
Why for Cavs: avoid the tax and improve shooting
Why for Wolves: get simmons without dlo/edwards/towns

If Minny still had Rubio this would work but Philly already have a lack of playmaking with Simmons, to lose Simmons and not bring back equal playmaking is the wrong direction for them.

[crutonimo]

A 3 way trade with Phi/Sac/Houston:

Phi-Davion/Hield/Wood
Sac-Simmons
Hou-Bagley/Picks

gets Philly a whole ton of shooting to surround Embid and an on ball defender
allows Sac to go for it with a solid starting 5
gets Hou more picks and a test run of Bagley

[shrink]

Anyone tried this variation before?

Wolves out: Prince, Bolmaro, Beasley, Layman, 3 1sts
Wolves in Simmons, Osman

Cavs out: Osman, Sexton
Cavs in: Beasley, Bolmaro

Philly out: Simmons
Philly in: Prince, Sexton, Layman, 3 Minny 1sts

Why for Philly: get a replacement scoring guard, 3 1sts and expiring for next star
Why for Cavs: avoid the tax and improve shooting
Why for Wolves: get simmons without dlo/edwards/towns

If Minny still had Rubio this would work but Philly already have a lack of playmaking with Simmons, to lose Simmons and not bring back equal playmaking is the wrong direction for them.

I suspect that if Morey had ever expressed any interest in Rubio, Rosas wouldn’t have moved him in a lateral trade for Prince.