Ben Simmons Containment Thread Take 3

[Bentley1225]

Ill offer this idea for:'
-Washington to get combination of tangible assets to help them compete and picks in dealing Beal
-Philly adds an all-star in Beal
-Minnesota adds Simmons
-Pistons move on from Grant and focus on complete rebuild

To Washington (Trade Beal)
-Jerami Grant (2 years, $40.9 million)
-Malik Beasley (2 years, $29.8 million)
-2022 Philadelphia 1st round pick
-2023 Minnesota 1st round pick
-2023 Atlanta, Charlotte or Brooklyn 2nd round pick (most favourable) via Philadelphia
-2024 Philadelphia 2nd round pick
-2025 Minnesota 2nd round pick
-2027 Minnesota 1st round pick

To Philadelphia (Trade Simmons, 2 1sts, 2 2nds)
-Bradley Beal (1 year, $34.5 million plus P.O.) - agrees to extension with Philly.

To Minnesota (Trade Prince, Beasley, Layman, 3 1sts, 2nd)
-Ben Simmons (4 years, $145 million)

To Detroit (Trade Grant)
-Tauren Prince (1 year, $13 million)
-Jake Layman (1 year, $3.9 million)
-2024 Philadelphia 1st round pick
-2025 Minnesota 1st round pick

Why?
-Washington gets 2 starters on reasonable contracts, 3 1sts and 3 2nds for Beal in final year of his deal. Grant and/or Beasley could be flipped again in 12 months for more picks.

Dinwiddie/Holiday/Neto
Beasley/Pope
Grant/Avdija/Kispert
Hachimura/Kuzma/Bertrans/Gill
Bryant/Harrell/Todd

-Philadelphia gets their ideal 'win now' piece

Beal/Maxey/Springer
Thybulle/Curry/Milton/Joe
Green/Niang/Korkmaz
Harris/Perry?/Tolliver?
Embiid/Drummond

-Minnesota gets Simmons

Russell/Beverley/McLaughlin
Okogie/Nowell/Bolmaro
Edwards/Turner?/FA?
Simmons/McDaniels/Vanderbilt
Towns/Reid/Davis?

-Pistons gets 2 1sts and expiring for Grant to complete rebuild. They subsequently waive McGruder.

Cunningham/Joseph/F. Jackson/Lee
Bey/Hayes/
J.Jackson/Doumbouya/Layman
Olynyk/Prince/Livers
Stewart/Lyles/Okafor

[tbhawksfan1]

How about this... OKC was reported ready to trade SGA and their first for #1

SGA to Philly
BS to Minny
Beasley, McDaniels, P Bev and some FRP to OKC

Philly get perfect compliment to Biid
Minny gets BS
OKC gets more FRP

Everybody happy

[Scoot McGroot]

Yes, if they are keeping Lillard they are trying to win now. They are not winning anything with 20 year old guys. The Blazers need win now talent, better than CJ.

Yeah, I think they do that with Edwards and Turner. I think Dame would be pretty stoked if the team made this trade. Better now, and in the future? Sounds like a great step for Portland...

Lillard is 31, a 20 year old is not going to help him now and he doesnt have the time to see if Edwards can become something in this league in 5 years. If such a trade were to materialize he would probably demand a trade. The only reasonable paths for the Blazers are either to trade Lillard and rebuild or trade CJ + whatever picks they can give for a better player and hope it will be enough. Trading for Edwards would make sense only if they are taking path 1, i.e trade Lillard and rebuild.

I see it the other way. I see Portland turning CJ into better players, with longer windows, being the type of thing that revitalizes Dame and allows him to say "Ah, now we have good players, or trade packages to get other players better than CJ would've gotten".

[DangerZone13]

Let us not forget Simmons has a 15% trade kicker, so you're looking at about 38M for him. I think Philly will have to sit on it and hope a team collapses at the beginning of the year. Ben is a good player, but at that money, I think it's valid to question if he has the desire to get better - especially if he goes to a team that isn't winning.

[Drwho17]

CJ would have been traded years ago if his trade value was 25% of what you trying to get here. Portland is cut out.

Edwards or a pick package is what Minny would offer, not both. Minny is not paying this price.

Pacers easily say no.

Edwards isn’t being offered at all

Yup. Lock it up.. lol.

Edwards will be a piece of any Ben Simmons package that Minnesota is involved in, unless they are going to move Towns instead, which is unlikely.

[Mr Loggins]

.Beverly/Beasley/McDaniels/picks is like four nickels for a quarter.

blasphemy!

[mg]

Honestly I see no realistic path for the Wolves to acquire Simmons without giving up one of their 'star' players. Morey supposedly wants Dame. There's no way he's settling for roleplayers or draft picks that don't move the needle next season with Embiid's prime ticking away.

[MoneyTalks41890]

How about this... OKC was reported ready to trade SGA and their first for #1

SGA to Philly
BS to Minny
Beasley, McDaniels, P Bev and some FRP to OKC

Philly get perfect compliment to Biid
Minny gets BS
OKC gets more FRP

Everybody happy

No, everybody is not happy. That's beyond horrible for OKC.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Honestly I see no realistic path for the Wolves to acquire Simmons without giving up one of their 'star' players. Morey supposedly wants Dame. There's no way he's settling for roleplayers or draft picks that don't move the needle next season with Embiid's prime ticking away.

To me, Wolves send Edwards+filler to POR, Dame to PHI, Simmons to Minny, Picks/young players from Philly to POR. Maybe Maxey or someone to the Wolves if the Wolves insist Edwards > Simmons on value.

[GutUNC]

There is no trade between Phl and Min that doesn't include Edwards. I don't even know why I keep seeing stuff like that.

If you keep seeing stuff like that, you must also "keep seeing" how a deal will involve a third team.

The problem is the nebulous "third team" will want something of substantial value from Minnesota, too. Russell, Beasley isn't going to cut it for them either.

NOTE: Which is not to say I think MIN should cough up Edwards. I get why they wouldn't. I just don't think the answer to the question of how MIN gets Simmons without giving up anything that hurts them is to shout "THIRD TEAM".

[Topofthekey]

Yes, if they are keeping Lillard they are trying to win now. They are not winning anything with 20 year old guys. The Blazers need win now talent, better than CJ.

Yeah, I think they do that with Edwards and Turner. I think Dame would be pretty stoked if the team made this trade. Better now, and in the future? Sounds like a great step for Portland...

Lillard is 31, a 20 year old is not going to help him now and he doesnt have the time to see if Edwards can become something in this league in 5 years. If such a trade were to materialize he would probably demand a trade. The only reasonable paths for the Blazers are either to trade Lillard and rebuild or trade CJ + whatever picks they can give for a better player and hope it will be enough. Trading for Edwards would make sense only if they are taking path 1, i.e trade Lillard and rebuild.

None of this matter

Edwards and Turner have way more trade value than CJ

If it's about building a win now team, Blazers still take the trade and then flip Edwards and Turner for other win now pieces

[Northern hoops]

Let us not forget Simmons has a 15% trade kicker, so you're looking at about 38M for him. I think Philly will have to sit on it and hope a team collapses at the beginning of the year. Ben is a good player, but at that money, I think it's valid to question if he has the desire to get better - especially if he goes to a team that isn't winning.

I don't think this is an issue for the Wolves. They're going to operate as a team over the cap for the forseeable future and I think if they're bringing in a player like Simmons they'd be willing to pay the tax.

I'm higher than most Wolves fans on here in regards to Simmons, for all the reasons others have mentioned (fit, raising floor, defense, etc.), would be willing to combine some combination of DLo, Beasley, salary filler and all of our picks (protections go up if DLo is included). Would like to keep McDaniels and would value him more than any of the picks we'd include, but would guess he'd likely be involved.

[VDT]

Yeah, I think they do that with Edwards and Turner. I think Dame would be pretty stoked if the team made this trade. Better now, and in the future? Sounds like a great step for Portland...

Lillard is 31, a 20 year old is not going to help him now and he doesnt have the time to see if Edwards can become something in this league in 5 years. If such a trade were to materialize he would probably demand a trade. The only reasonable paths for the Blazers are either to trade Lillard and rebuild or trade CJ + whatever picks they can give for a better player and hope it will be enough. Trading for Edwards would make sense only if they are taking path 1, i.e trade Lillard and rebuild.

I see it the other way. I see Portland turning CJ into better players, with longer windows, being the type of thing that revitalizes Dame and allows him to say "Ah, now we have good players, or trade packages to get other players better than CJ would've gotten".

Edwards is basically an unknown at this point. No one knows when and to what degree he will become a major contributor in this league. And Lillard, a 31 year old 6 ft guard, is the guy they try to appease. His window (if he even has one) is rapidly closing. I doubt he will see a 20 year old guy being his main help as positive at this point in his career. Similarly, i doubt he would be excited that they will waste a year hoping to get a better trade in the future, although this might be a valid strategy in a vacuum.

As i said, the Blazers need a win now piece better than CJ, whether that is feasible is another story. I just dont see Lillard being content with the team trading veterans for 20 year old guys.

[TGW]

The Wizards pass. None of those assets are enticing enough for Beal.

[Chinook]

If Edwards and picks get Lillard, why wouldn't Minny just go for that? It's like the Spurs trade with Murray being suggested. If the team offering the main piece is gunning for the same guy, it's going to be hard to rope them in as a third team unless the other team also has a core piece. Like if the Blazers want Simmons and Edwards for Lillard. Then only one of those team could possibly make it work, and they can't just cut the other one out since both are necessary. Obviously, even then, someone has to be amenable to selling, and you likely need a forth team.

In rough strokes:

Portland gets Edwards and Simmons
Philly gets Beasley, Murray and assets
Minny gets Lillard
SA gets Prince and assets

No, I'm not saying I'd do this as a Spurs fan or that the FO would. It's just an example to demonstrate what roping in a competitor would look like.

[VDT]

Yeah, I think they do that with Edwards and Turner. I think Dame would be pretty stoked if the team made this trade. Better now, and in the future? Sounds like a great step for Portland...

Lillard is 31, a 20 year old is not going to help him now and he doesnt have the time to see if Edwards can become something in this league in 5 years. If such a trade were to materialize he would probably demand a trade. The only reasonable paths for the Blazers are either to trade Lillard and rebuild or trade CJ + whatever picks they can give for a better player and hope it will be enough. Trading for Edwards would make sense only if they are taking path 1, i.e trade Lillard and rebuild.

None of this matter

Edwards and Turner have way more trade value than CJ

If it's about building a win now team, Blazers still take the trade and then flip Edwards and Turner for other win now pieces

That's a fair view but unless the Blazers have an immediate follow up trade to get a star with that package i still dont see it as likely. Might make sense for the FO to get more value but i doubt Lillard will be content with such a move and if the team is forced to trade Lillard they might actually lose value-wise from these trades.

[psman2]

Why would Washington care about Grant if they are trading Beal? They would take the picks over Grant easily and do a proper tank.

I don't think Beal as an expiring is going to pull quite this good of a package.

[Myth]

I know DLo is buddies with KAT, but Minny should absolutely be willing to include him in a deal.

[MoneyTalks41890]

I know DLo is buddies with KAT, but Minny should absolutely be willing to include him in a deal.

I just don't think it makes sense to do so if you get Simmons, because you need as much shooting as possible and DLo provides that.

[Scoot McGroot]

Lillard is 31, a 20 year old is not going to help him now and he doesnt have the time to see if Edwards can become something in this league in 5 years. If such a trade were to materialize he would probably demand a trade. The only reasonable paths for the Blazers are either to trade Lillard and rebuild or trade CJ + whatever picks they can give for a better player and hope it will be enough. Trading for Edwards would make sense only if they are taking path 1, i.e trade Lillard and rebuild.

I see it the other way. I see Portland turning CJ into better players, with longer windows, being the type of thing that revitalizes Dame and allows him to say "Ah, now we have good players, or trade packages to get other players better than CJ would've gotten".

Edwards is basically an unknown at this point. No one knows when and to what degree he will become a major contributor in this league. And Lillard, a 31 year old 6 ft guard, is the guy they try to appease. His window (if he even has one) is rapidly closing. I doubt he will see a 20 year old guy being his main help as positive at this point in his career. Similarly, i doubt he would be excited that they will waste a year hoping to get a better trade in the future, although this might be a valid strategy in a vacuum.

As i said, the Blazers need a win now piece better than CJ, whether that is feasible is another story. I just dont see Lillard being content with the team trading veterans for 20 year old guys.

If the consideration is “Either we keep 30 year old guys because they’re in their 30’s, or we trade them for guys in their 20’s who make us better” I’d really hope that Portland would trade for the guys in their 20’s who make them better. I think Dame would rather stay on a team that is getting better. I think that appeases him more than holding onto his teammate just because he’s older. Like, the thing that would push Dame to demand out is that they have topped out, and have no means to get better. Here, they would do so. Obviously, though Portland wouldn’t get this offer. It’s laughably bad for multiple other teams.