Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc 3.0

[K_chile22]

I had some pretty big misses this year, but feeling good about how much I loved that Tucker deal for the Bucks when the consensus in that thread was that he was washed.

People pointing to a decline in ppg for a guy who has so little offensive value to begin with, who was suddenly on a team with like one + passer and no spacing was always silly. He's taken off a little offensively, which is why his usage is ridiculously low even for him as a buck, but that's not what he was ever valuable for

[K_chile22]

Uhhh. SOUND ALL OF THE ALARMS IN DALLAS

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[Texas Chuck]

Uhhh. SOUND ALL OF THE ALARMS IN DALLAS

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I had heard this and talked about it on the GB last week. His influence has been growing in Dallas and people aren't happy. Cato late on this story but maybe has new stuff? Harlabob very much a Cuban guy.

[K_chile22]

Uhhh. SOUND ALL OF THE ALARMS IN DALLAS

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I had heard this and talked about it on the GB last week. His influence has been growing in Dallas and people aren't happy. Cato late on this story but maybe has new stuff? Harlabob very much a Cuban guy.

He made both of their picks in the 2020 draft without asking any scouts anything about the guys he picked and many of them didn't like one of the two, which really rubbed people the wrong way. Obviously doesn't say which one. Luka hates him. He at least approves all transactions and was the force behind the Curry-Richardson trade (tbf I liked it at the time for them)
Edit: sorry, he led the acquisition of Seth, which was actually good

[K_chile22]

Oh yeah and he would script out rotations and starting lineups for Carlisle to use. Unclear if Carlisle actually listened. He also pushed them to sign Wright, insisting he would be the starter next to Luka but no one else thought so, but that's why they started him in the first game of his first season there

[Texas Chuck]

]He made both of their picks in the 2020 draft without asking any scouts anything about the guys he picked and many of them didn't like one of the two, which really rubbed people the wrong way. Obviously doesn't say which one. Luka hates him. He at least approves all transactions and was the force behind the Curry-Richardson trade (tbf I liked it at the time for them)

They made 3 picks so are they talking about the 2 2nd rounders or Green and Terry and lumping Bey in the Curry trade?

And I was pushing for that trade all year so I can't blame anyone but obviously a pretty big misfire by Dallas and me.


What I had heard last week was about him traveling with the team for the first time this year and getting into rotations and lineups for the first time. Which I can't imagine went over well with Rick or Luka. He arrived between drafting Luka and trading for KP and word has it he was a major part of that move as well.

I know he was maybe the GOAT NBA bettor wagering 7 figures a day with something like a 70% winning clip. But almost all of that was on him wagering the over in 2nd halfs because the books would take their finely calculated over/under number for the game and just divide it equally per half and he made a killing until they fixed it.

I also know he's a big Sloan guy so a connection to Cuban.

I like having smart creative minds in the room, but not sure his skills translate to team-building and I knew quite a few guys from the poker community ten years ago saying the guy was absolutely insufferable. Very smart, but quick to let you know he was the smartest guy in the room and not one for working collectively.

[K_chile22]

]He made both of their picks in the 2020 draft without asking any scouts anything about the guys he picked and many of them didn't like one of the two, which really rubbed people the wrong way. Obviously doesn't say which one. Luka hates him. He at least approves all transactions and was the force behind the Curry-Richardson trade (tbf I liked it at the time for them)

They made 3 picks so are they talking about the 2 2nd rounders or Green and Terry and lumping Bey in the Curry trade?

And I was pushing for that trade all year so I can't blame anyone but obviously a pretty big misfire by Dallas and me.


What I had heard last week was about him traveling with the team for the first time this year and getting into rotations and lineups for the first time. Which I can't imagine went over well with Rick or Luka. He arrived between drafting Luka and trading for KP and word has it he was a major part of that move as well.

I know he was maybe the GOAT NBA bettor wagering 7 figures a day with something like a 70% winning clip. But almost all of that was on him wagering the over in 2nd halfs because the books would take their finely calculated over/under number for the game and just divide it equally per half and he made a killing until they fixed it.

I also know he's a big Sloan guy so a connection to Cuban.

I like having smart creative minds in the room, but not sure his skills translate to team-building and I knew quite a few guys from the poker community ten years ago saying the guy was absolutely insufferable. Very smart, but quick to let you know he was the smartest guy in the room and not one for working collectively.

Green and Terry were the picks he made.

People on the team said they have two GMs and he is, in fact, insufferable. Cuban loves him tho and no one seems to know why

“What did (he) sell to Mark to make him believe (he) can do this?” asks one source with an intimate knowledge of the situation. “Nobody knows.”

They said about the draft pick thing.

On the Luka front there's this

Voulgaris, sitting with an open laptop in his typical courtside seat across from the Mavericks’ bench, motioned downward with his hands, which Doncic specifically interpreted as Voulgaris telling him to calm down, multiple team and league sources tell The Athletic. Doncic snapped back, telling Voulgaris, according to one source’s recollection, “Don’t **** tell me to calm down.” The same sources say Voulgaris later professed that his motion wasn’t solely directed at Doncic, but regardless of intent, it only worsened an already inflamed relationship between the two.

And another incident where Bobs left a game in the fourth when the mavs were down 10 and Luka noticed and started telling everyone in the locker room Bob quit on them

[Texas Chuck]

Wonder what all this means for Finley's future in Dallas. There had been rumblings that Donnie would move over to the business side in a few years and Finley would take over his role as the GM(maybe with a different title). Not sure what this means for him but certainly none of this is very encouraging. Dallas had been so stable for so long and when Rosas came in and tried to usurp power Cuban quickly just shipped him back out.

I could see Carlisle walking away if he's expected to take orders from a sports gambler of all people. You are right about alarms.

[K_chile22]

Wonder what all this means for Finley's future in Dallas. There had been rumblings that Donnie would move over to the business side in a few years and Finley would take over his role as the GM(maybe with a different title). Not sure what this means for him but certainly none of this is very encouraging. Dallas had been so stable for so long and when Rosas came in and tried to usurp power Cuban quickly just shipped him back out.

I could see Carlisle walking away if he's expected to take orders from a sports gambler of all people. You are right about alarms.

If Luka likes Carlisle, Bob will be gone. No way he has Cuban so tightly wound around his finger that he'd side with him if Luka put his foot down. I think ultimately Luka will get him fired eventually. Apparently his contract just expired but seems like Cuban still really likes him so we will see what happens.

This is probably all coming out so that people in the org can convince Cuban to just let him walk

[HornetJail]

Mavs fans would know better, but Mark Cuban would fire his entire FO if Luka told him to and threatened to request a trade if he didn't, right? Bob's gone imo

[Texas Chuck]

Mavs fans would know better, but Mark Cuban would fire his entire FO if Luka told him to and threatened to request a trade if he didn't, right? Bob's gone imo

When in doubt, side with the superstar right? We never faced this with Dirk who never would have wielded his power in that fashion. Cuban is clearly loyal as they have lots of guys still in important positions for a long time. But choosing Harlabob over Luka would be incredibly stupid. Or Donnie for that matter.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Yeah that's easy if Luka doesn't like what a front office guy has been doing, you fire the front office guy. Obviously you need to be somewhat careful with the impression you provide Luka, but not really. It also lets you "start fresh" assuming Bob is a big enough trophy here that you can just attribute most of the roster issues to him as a fall guy, and then try really hard to do stuff better going forward. Better than firing Carlisle, who has been pretty good.

[shrink]

Mavs fans would know better, but Mark Cuban would fire his entire FO if Luka told him to and threatened to request a trade if he didn't, right? Bob's gone imo

When in doubt, side with the superstar right? We never faced this with Dirk who never would have wielded his power in that fashion. Cuban is clearly loyal as they have lots of guys still in important positions for a long time. But choosing Harlabob over Luka would be incredibly stupid. Or Donnie for that matter.

The more I learn about the GM side, the more respect I have for the relationship between Dirk and the Mavs.

So Luka’s #1 on Cuban’s loyalty list, right? Luka, Carlisle, Donnie?

I have so much respect for Rick Carlisle, and I think he has been one of the best coaches in the NBA every damn season. But Luka is so special ..

[Texas Chuck]

So Luka’s #1 on Cuban’s loyalty list, right? Luka, Carlisle, Donnie?

I would say no. I'd probably go Donnie, Rick, Luka. But Luka is the guy impossible to replace so he wins any power struggle. But I don't believe Cuban's relationship with Luka is anything like his relationship with Dirk. Part of that is Cuban and Dirk are 20 years closer in age, but mostly they essentially started together. Dirk was in Dallas a year and a half before Mark, but Dallas' winning started basically the second Cuban got here. I think that bond is unique.

[MoneyTalks41890]

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[JD45]

Analytics guys are a lot easier to replace than SuperStars.

This article reads like a planted hit piece. Maybe just paving the way out for Voulgaris.

I am a big fan of analytics and how it can give insight into sports. But ultimately I think it has to be used as an assistant to the coach and not a replacement for his decision making. The article isn't clear, but it would be perfectly reasonable for analytics to help develop lineups and rotation ideas to discuss with the coach, who can then decide what might actually work. Its totally different for analytics to actually make those decisions.

This might also explain Carlisle's rant last year about post-ups being inefficient offensively compared to 3 point shots. Which while true in aggregate, does not always hold for mis-matches. Carlisle could have been just parroting the politically expedient view. Then we see Luka in game instructing KP to get in the post for a mis-match and Carlisle admits it was Luka's initiative. Luka could probably benefit from analytics review, but he also has a high enough basketball IQ to intuitively grasp when some of it is BS.

If what is in the article is true, the Mavs should fire Voulgaris immediately. Then maybe hire a mid-20s Slovenian math PhD basketball fan to replace him.

[tiderulz]

Mavs fans would know better, but Mark Cuban would fire his entire FO if Luka told him to and threatened to request a trade if he didn't, right? Bob's gone imo

When in doubt, side with the superstar right? We never faced this with Dirk who never would have wielded his power in that fashion. Cuban is clearly loyal as they have lots of guys still in important positions for a long time. But choosing Harlabob over Luka would be incredibly stupid. Or Donnie for that matter.

Orlando did that with Dwight Howard. didnt turn out well

[daoneandonly]

]He made both of their picks in the 2020 draft without asking any scouts anything about the guys he picked and many of them didn't like one of the two, which really rubbed people the wrong way. Obviously doesn't say which one. Luka hates him. He at least approves all transactions and was the force behind the Curry-Richardson trade (tbf I liked it at the time for them)

They made 3 picks so are they talking about the 2 2nd rounders or Green and Terry and lumping Bey in the Curry trade?

And I was pushing for that trade all year so I can't blame anyone but obviously a pretty big misfire by Dallas and me.


What I had heard last week was about him traveling with the team for the first time this year and getting into rotations and lineups for the first time. Which I can't imagine went over well with Rick or Luka. He arrived between drafting Luka and trading for KP and word has it he was a major part of that move as well.

I know he was maybe the GOAT NBA bettor wagering 7 figures a day with something like a 70% winning clip. But almost all of that was on him wagering the over in 2nd halfs because the books would take their finely calculated over/under number for the game and just divide it equally per half and he made a killing until they fixed it.

I also know he's a big Sloan guy so a connection to Cuban.

I like having smart creative minds in the room, but not sure his skills translate to team-building and I knew quite a few guys from the poker community ten years ago saying the guy was absolutely insufferable. Very smart, but quick to let you know he was the smartest guy in the room and not one for working collectively.

Green and Terry were the picks he made.

People on the team said they have two GMs and he is, in fact, insufferable. Cuban loves him tho and no one seems to know why

“What did (he) sell to Mark to make him believe (he) can do this?” asks one source with an intimate knowledge of the situation. “Nobody knows.”

They said about the draft pick thing.

On the Luka front there's this

Voulgaris, sitting with an open laptop in his typical courtside seat across from the Mavericks’ bench, motioned downward with his hands, which Doncic specifically interpreted as Voulgaris telling him to calm down, multiple team and league sources tell The Athletic. Doncic snapped back, telling Voulgaris, according to one source’s recollection, “Don’t **** tell me to calm down.” The same sources say Voulgaris later professed that his motion wasn’t solely directed at Doncic, but regardless of intent, it only worsened an already inflamed relationship between the two.

And another incident where Bobs left a game in the fourth when the mavs were down 10 and Luka noticed and started telling everyone in the locker room Bob quit on them

So the "analytics" guy is why Dallas was the only team in the league that had Josh Green rated higher than Saddique bey? The J Rich trade most thought was the right call, myself included, but picking Green over Bey (and in hindsight over Bane) was just idiotic. Cuban also has this smartest guy int he room tendency, and its rather annoying. I've always thought Dirk would have multiple rings if not for Cuban.

[Resistance]

Analytics guys are a lot easier to replace than SuperStars.

This article reads like a planted hit piece. Maybe just paving the way out for Voulgaris.

I am a big fan of analytics and how it can give insight into sports. But ultimately I think it has to be used as an assistant to the coach and not a replacement for his decision making. The article isn't clear, but it would be perfectly reasonable for analytics to help develop lineups and rotation ideas to discuss with the coach, who can then decide what might actually work. Its totally different for analytics to actually make those decisions.

This might also explain Carlisle's rant last year about post-ups being inefficient offensively compared to 3 point shots. Which while true in aggregate, does not always hold for mis-matches. Carlisle could have been just parroting the politically expedient view. Then we see Luka in game instructing KP to get in the post for a mis-match and Carlisle admits it was Luka's initiative. Luka could probably benefit from analytics review, but he also has a high enough basketball IQ to intuitively grasp when some of it is BS.

If what is in the article is true, the Mavs should fire Voulgaris immediately. Then maybe hire a mid-20s Slovenian math PhD basketball fan to replace him.

Ivana Seric is the closest person that I can think to fit that description. She isn't in her mid 20's and isn't Slovenian, but is a really smart Coatian that worked for Philadelphia.

[Texas Chuck]

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I don't know Rohlin, but Chris Haynes retweeted so I'm assuming its legit.