Kuminga to SAC, is there a middle ground?

[gswhoops]

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Smitty with some truth. Monk is a good player!

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

[DB23]

It's funny how the ones most predicting/hoping for Kuminga to take the QO are Kings fans. None of the analysts in the league - from Lowe to Windhorst/Bontemps, to Fischer/Stein to Siegel expect that to be the outcome.

Crazy that for some Kings fans the closest thing they get to a win is the hope GS loses a player for nothing or gets fleeced in a deal by the Kings

I have seen many people predict he takes the qualifying offer. I get you think he will not so we shall see.

For your sake, I hope he does. He’s not worth the headache. We would still get a year out of him on a two year window but unless he dramatically improves his shooting then I hate just fit with us too.

Hopefully there is a three team deal out there.

I do like monk, just not for us with our current roster construction and needs.

[ChuckDurn]

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Smitty with some truth. Monk is a good player!

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

From the Warriors’ perspective, I like it talent-wise….. and with Gafford’s salary, I’d think they could make something work without having to send out Hield or Moody. (Though the Warriors seem really averse to having anybody with a contract beyond summer 2027, and Gafford’s goes 2 years beyond that.)

But on-the-court, I’m not sure how it would work from a spacing perspective, given that he has no range. Plus, it it doesn’t really address the “big wing / combo forward” issue, and just gives us more depth at the 5. Sure, it likely allows Horford to slide down and play some 4 rather than being pretty strictly a 5, but the problem is more in dealing with the agile 3’s and 4’s in the league, and that deal wouldn’t do anything to fix that roster issue.

[NW]

Scoot Henderson out 8 weeks with a hamstring tear. Possible Monk destination in a JK 3-way deal? Not sure how pressed the Blazers are to win this year or what the return would be though

[OGSactownballer]

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Smitty with some truth. Monk is a good player!

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

Honestly given our current situation if Dallas is that high on Monk, I’d just cut GSW out and look to trade directly Monk for PJ and whatever minor stuff is needed to make that go.

[Godaddycurse]

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Smitty with some truth. Monk is a good player!

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

Honestly given our current situation if Dallas is that high on Monk, I’d just cut GSW out and look to trade directly Monk for PJ and whatever minor stuff is needed to make that go.

PJ cant be traded

[gswhoops]

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

Honestly given our current situation if Dallas is that high on Monk, I’d just cut GSW out and look to trade directly Monk for PJ and whatever minor stuff is needed to make that go.

PJ cant be traded

Yeah and I think there’s a pretty big value gap between Gafford and PJ

[Texas Chuck]

Honestly given our current situation if Dallas is that high on Monk, I’d just cut GSW out and look to trade directly Monk for PJ and whatever minor stuff is needed to make that go.

PJ cant be traded

Yeah and I think there’s a pretty big value gap between Gafford and PJ

And even if not, PJ's ability to play with any of Dallas' best players makes him a guy Dallas should prefer to hold onto over Gafford considering neither of them hold significant trade value.

And while I think Monk is better than any of Dallas' current guard options pre-Kyrie, I don't think he moves the needle enough to punt on PJ after getting him extended.

[sackings916]

PJ cant be traded

Yeah and I think there’s a pretty big value gap between Gafford and PJ

And even if not, PJ's ability to play with any of Dallas' best players makes him a guy Dallas should prefer to hold onto over Gafford considering neither of them hold significant trade value.

And while I think Monk is better than any of Dallas' current guard options pre-Kyrie, I don't think he moves the needle enough to punt on PJ after getting him extended.

Do you see the Mavs look to move one of their frontcourt pieces for a guard? Or is the plan likely to wait for Kyrie and see what they have?

[Nate the Great]

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Smitty with some truth. Monk is a good player!

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

From the Warriors’ perspective, I like it talent-wise….. and with Gafford’s salary, I’d think they could make something work without having to send out Hield or Moody. (Though the Warriors seem really averse to having anybody with a contract beyond summer 2027, and Gafford’s goes 2 years beyond that.)

But on-the-court, I’m not sure how it would work from a spacing perspective, given that he has no range. Plus, it it doesn’t really address the “big wing / combo forward” issue, and just gives us more depth at the 5. Sure, it likely allows Horford to slide down and play some 4 rather than being pretty strictly a 5, but the problem is more in dealing with the agile 3’s and 4’s in the league, and that deal wouldn’t do anything to fix that roster issue.

They would still have to send out Hield or Moody, I think. The current rules make it difficult to impossible to trade Kuminga without sending out another significant contract.

If they did it, they’d still sign Horford, who would start. If Horford wasn’t playing, they’d start Post. Gafford would have some value as a center against certain opponents, but I think he’d primarily be a backup power forward.

[ChuckDurn]

I still think there's a potential Monk to Dallas, Gafford to GSW, Kuminga to Sacto deal in there somewhere.

From the Warriors’ perspective, I like it talent-wise….. and with Gafford’s salary, I’d think they could make something work without having to send out Hield or Moody. (Though the Warriors seem really averse to having anybody with a contract beyond summer 2027, and Gafford’s goes 2 years beyond that.)

But on-the-court, I’m not sure how it would work from a spacing perspective, given that he has no range. Plus, it it doesn’t really address the “big wing / combo forward” issue, and just gives us more depth at the 5. Sure, it likely allows Horford to slide down and play some 4 rather than being pretty strictly a 5, but the problem is more in dealing with the agile 3’s and 4’s in the league, and that deal wouldn’t do anything to fix that roster issue.

They would still have to send out Hield or Moody, I think. The current rules make it difficult to impossible to trade Kuminga without sending out another significant contract.

If they did it, they’d still sign Horford, who would start. If Horford wasn’t playing, they’d start Post. Gafford would have some value as a center against certain opponents, but I think he’d primarily be a backup power forward.

It would probably depend on exactly what Kuminga’s deal with the Kings would be with the base-year compensation rules, but the Warriors can potentially add Santos and / or Jackson Davis as salary ballast to make it work financially without needing to send out Hield or Moody. I’m operating based on that assumption.

And Gafford has no shooting range or ball skills on offense, and defends the hoop on defense rather than playing with much perimeter mobility…… so I don’t see him as a power forward in this day and age. Gary Payton II is more likely to see back-up power forward minutes on the Warriors than Gafford would.

[jredsaz]

If Kuminga signs the QO does his bird rights remain intact for the Warriors or to a team like the Kings who trade for him?

[giberish]

If Kuminga signs the QO does his bird rights remain intact for the Warriors or to a team like the Kings who trade for him?

The Warriors would retain his Bird rights (having been with the team for 3+ seasons), but if traded his new team wouldn't have Bird rights (only 1 year contract and 1 season with new team).

Due to this he would have the ability to reject any midseason trades.

[gswhoops]

From the Warriors’ perspective, I like it talent-wise….. and with Gafford’s salary, I’d think they could make something work without having to send out Hield or Moody. (Though the Warriors seem really averse to having anybody with a contract beyond summer 2027, and Gafford’s goes 2 years beyond that.)

But on-the-court, I’m not sure how it would work from a spacing perspective, given that he has no range. Plus, it it doesn’t really address the “big wing / combo forward” issue, and just gives us more depth at the 5. Sure, it likely allows Horford to slide down and play some 4 rather than being pretty strictly a 5, but the problem is more in dealing with the agile 3’s and 4’s in the league, and that deal wouldn’t do anything to fix that roster issue.

They would still have to send out Hield or Moody, I think. The current rules make it difficult to impossible to trade Kuminga without sending out another significant contract.

If they did it, they’d still sign Horford, who would start. If Horford wasn’t playing, they’d start Post. Gafford would have some value as a center against certain opponents, but I think he’d primarily be a backup power forward.

It would probably depend on exactly what Kuminga’s deal with the Kings would be with the base-year compensation rules, but the Warriors can potentially add Santos and / or Jackson Davis as salary ballast to make it work financially without needing to send out Hield or Moody. I’m operating based on that assumption.

And Gafford has no shooting range or ball skills on offense, and defends the hoop on defense rather than playing with much perimeter mobility…… so I don’t see him as a power forward in this day and age. Gary Payton II is more likely to see back-up power forward minutes on the Warriors than Gafford would.

Gafford makes $14.3M, so if we include TJD or Santos (my preference would be TJD here since we'd have Horford, Gafford, Post, and Draymond in smallball lineups to cover the 5 spot) Kuminga's new deal would have to start at around $24.3M to avoid the first apron -- which seems doable, especially if he's on a flat/descending deal.

[OGSactownballer]

So my bad forgetting that PJ reupped and isn’t trade eligible. And agree that Dallas is unlikely to want to move him because he is absolutely a Swiss Army knife for lineups.

That aside…

I’d have to say that the Horford signing announcement pretty much says that something is going to happen here in the next day or two (or is already settled) with Kuminga.
No question that the sign and trade will happen and that the parameters of the needs and a third team have been satisfied or nearly so.

[ChuckDurn]

So my bad forgetting that PJ reupped and isn’t trade eligible. And agree that Dallas is unlikely to want to move him because he is absolutely a Swiss Army knife for lineups.

That aside…

I’d have to say that the Horford signing announcement pretty much says that something is going to happen here in the next day or two (or is already settled) with Kuminga.
No maintain that the sign and trade will happen and that the parameters of the needs and a third team have been satisfied or nearly so.

The announcement with Horford was very carefully worded - he hasn’t signed a deal, he’s committed to a deal, but notice that there isn’t mention of what that deal is (aside from being multi-year). So the details are clearly “still waiting”. It’s inevitable that something was going to be finalized with Kuminga within the next couple of days, given that his QO expires on Wednesday, so I think Horford’s team (and the Warriors) felt comfortable enough to make what is still a very vague announcement, knowing that it isn’t finalized but that I’m sure they have “high and low” bounds agreed with the Warriors at this point.

I doubt it’s going to be a sign-and-trade, but I could be wrong. I think Kuminga ends up starting the season with the Warriors, either on the 2+1 (team option) deal for $75M, or a 2+1 (player option) for less money, such as $66M. We’ll see.

[DonaldSanders]

I’d have to say that the Horford signing announcement pretty much says that something is going to happen here in the next day or two (or is already settled) with Kuminga.
No question that the sign and trade will happen and that the parameters of the needs and a third team have been satisfied or nearly so.

Sign and trade is still certainly possible (and I'd welcome a 3rd team figuring out the right deal), but I don't understand why you're saying no question? The vagueness of all the announced intents -- Horford, GPII, Melton is intentional because the JK deal isn't done, but it doesn't hint what will happen yet with Kuminga. The announcements do hurt JK's negotiating position slightly, as say a month or two ago there was perhaps some anxiety these players could sign elsewhere, and now it's pretty much guaranteed they are going to GSW.

My guess is still that the Warriors sign him and trade him mid-season.

[schaffy]

I’d have to say that the Horford signing announcement pretty much says that something is going to happen here in the next day or two (or is already settled) with Kuminga.
No question that the sign and trade will happen and that the parameters of the needs and a third team have been satisfied or nearly so.

Sign and trade is still certainly possible (and I'd welcome a 3rd team figuring out the right deal), but I don't understand why you're saying no question? The vagueness of all the announced intents -- Horford, GPII, Melton is intentional because the JK deal isn't done, but it doesn't hint what will happen yet with Kuminga. The announcements do hurt JK's negotiating position slightly, as say a month or two ago there was perhaps some anxiety these players could sign elsewhere, and now it's pretty much guaranteed they are going to GSW.

My guess is still that the Warriors sign him and trade him mid-season.

I dont think those guys agreeing to sign some contract for some yet-to-be announced amount of money has any impact at all on the negotiating position of either side. Its not like GSW was going to agree to pay him more earlier to wrap this up so they didn't lose the other guys. We've seen its been the exact opposite -- he waited and got better offers. Do you think now after these announcements they'll call him up and be like "well actually we are going to reduce those previous offers by 10%"?

Both sides have pretty clear tradeoffs they have to determine and doing things early was never going to give either side more leverage. The deadline puts pressure on both sides [Andrew Brandts whole twitter shtick of "deadlines spur action"].

GSW -- they kinda need the large salary slot to be able to move later for pieces they think can help them while also being aware of the apron restrictions they could face. But what is the amount of money/length/options where its still a tradable deal that gives them options but doesn't require attaching surplus value?
JK -- whats the balance of money vs control he'll accept? Will he give up a lot of money to get more control (QO)? Or will he ultimately take as much money as he can get and give up control? Or somewhere in between.

[gswhoops]

I’d have to say that the Horford signing announcement pretty much says that something is going to happen here in the next day or two (or is already settled) with Kuminga.
No question that the sign and trade will happen and that the parameters of the needs and a third team have been satisfied or nearly so.

Sign and trade is still certainly possible (and I'd welcome a 3rd team figuring out the right deal), but I don't understand why you're saying no question? The vagueness of all the announced intents -- Horford, GPII, Melton is intentional because the JK deal isn't done, but it doesn't hint what will happen yet with Kuminga. The announcements do hurt JK's negotiating position slightly, as say a month or two ago there was perhaps some anxiety these players could sign elsewhere, and now it's pretty much guaranteed they are going to GSW.

My guess is still that the Warriors sign him and trade him mid-season.

I tend to agree that I don't think they would announce these deals unless they were close to a resolution with JK one way or another. Now, that could be that they're close on a contract, or a S&T, or it could be that MDJ just got fed up and said "here's our best and final offer, sign it or sign the QO and we'll see you at training camp." Neither I nor anyone else here knows which one is true.

[theBigLip]

The deadline is coming to sign the QO, right? Isn’t that Oct 1? So something is going to have to happen soon.

As for the “commitment announcements”, I think that’s just GSW and those free agents letting everyone know their deals are essentially done. Just waiting on Kuminga situation to resolve in a few days.