Giannis to Raptors

[Texas Chuck]

This deal looks solid for Bucks, you get a building block piece in Barnes, plus a bunch of picks. Get a top 10 pick too. That is probably better than Houston offers.

Ingram and IQ are much better players than Bucks were going to put around Giannis this year. If they hold onto Dick and Walter too they have a few young guys that could develop or have trade value to bring in some more playoff pieces.

You really think a guy like Barnes, #9 pick in a weak draft ( outside top 3) and so low end picks is good?

Barnes is basically Draymond Green

If Barnes turns into Draymond Green what an incredible stroke of luck for the Raptors(or the Bucks here). We have tons of data that shows us that Draymond was just as essential if not more than Steph to a dynasty. We have enough data that shows the Warriors were even better with Draymond on and STeph off than the reverse.

Draymond gets a lot of hate for acting like an ass and from casual fans who only box score watch and think he's not good. He was an absolutely elite player for a long time and maybe the highest impact player we've see in the data era.

Not the insult you were searching for I'm afraid.

[jbk1234]

I disagree. Oh not that other teams can't make better offers. They absolutely can. But I believe that if Giannis comes to the Bucks and says trade him he is going to have a specific team in mind(not saying its the Raptpors, but it will be a team) and I think as long as that team puts together a real serious offer(Barnes + picks/swaps is serious enough even if not ideal) then I think the Bucks help Giannis gets where he wants.

I could be wrong and I know people are going to point out Dame to the Bucks and not the Heat so I'm freely conceding I could be very very wrong. But that's my read on it. That the Bucks will really try and work with him rather than just coldly taking the best offer without concern for what he wants.

you're very wrong

first about giannis requesting a specific team

and also about the owners being willing to go along with that

doing giannis a favor would cost the owners at least a billion dollars

I could be wrong
How do you know with such certainty what Giannis might do in the future?
How do you know the Bucks governor wouldn't? I'm not saying you are wrong and I am right, but how do you know this with such certainty?
And finally I'm going to need to see your math. That's a bold statement. I'd love to see you back it up with some hard numbers.

I can only read it how I read it. But openly admit I could be way off. You have a lot of absolutes.

I don't have any way of knowing what's true, but I think single team trade requests are counterproductive in terms of how they're received by organizations. The last two guys to make that type of *request* ended up elsewhere. You at least provide a three-team list and then quietly tell two of the teams you're not committing to an extension at this time.

[mlloyd10]

This deal looks solid for Bucks, you get a building block piece in Barnes, plus a bunch of picks. Get a top 10 pick too. That is probably better than Houston offers.

Ingram and IQ are much better players than Bucks were going to put around Giannis this year. If they hold onto Dick and Walter too they have a few young guys that could develop or have trade value to bring in some more playoff pieces.

You really think a guy like Barnes, #9 pick in a weak draft ( outside top 3) and so low end picks is good?

Barnes is basically Draymond Green

If Barnes turns into Draymond Green what an incredible stroke of luck for the Raptors(or the Bucks here). We have tons of data that shows us that Draymond was just as essential if not more than Steph to a dynasty. We have enough data that shows the Warriors were even better with Draymond on and STeph off than the reverse.

Draymond gets a lot of hate for acting like an ass and from casual fans who only box score watch and think he's not good. He was an absolutely elite player for a long time and maybe the highest impact player we've see in the data era.

Not the insult you were searching for I'm afraid.

Draymond was a #2 / #3 guy. Plain and simple. When you had Steph/Thompson around you plsu KD for a bit, it makes him look better.

Draymond could never carry a team.

[Texas Chuck]

no he's not going to carry a team offensively. That's not who he is. Doesn't change how absurd his impact was. And Klay was a distant 3rd in importance to that team. I get the cute nickname and how offense is shiny, but make no mistake that dynasty was about Steph/Draymond, not Klay Thompson.

[Jojothewhale]

Draymond might be the single smartest on court/field/ice athlete of my lifetime. There’s no comp to be made to anyone let alone Scottie bleeping Barnes. I hate that it even gets brought up because it sounds like I’m trying to rip Barnes when I’m just trying to keep expectations in check.

I would argue he did carry that team. Because it was on the defensive end and he wasn’t a pure rim defender, it’s difficult to see in real time. But we can measure it. The sample size is huge. He’s an all time great. And also an ass. Neither negates the other.

[Slim Charless]

This deal looks solid for Bucks, you get a building block piece in Barnes, plus a bunch of picks. Get a top 10 pick too. That is probably better than Houston offers.

Ingram and IQ are much better players than Bucks were going to put around Giannis this year. If they hold onto Dick and Walter too they have a few young guys that could develop or have trade value to bring in some more playoff pieces.

You really think a guy like Barnes, #9 pick in a weak draft ( outside top 3) and so low end picks is good?

Barnes is basically Draymond Green

If Barnes turns into Draymond Green what an incredible stroke of luck for the Raptors(or the Bucks here). We have tons of data that shows us that Draymond was just as essential if not more than Steph to a dynasty. We have enough data that shows the Warriors were even better with Draymond on and STeph off than the reverse.

Draymond gets a lot of hate for acting like an ass and from casual fans who only box score watch and think he's not good. He was an absolutely elite player for a long time and maybe the highest impact player we've see in the data era.

Not the insult you were searching for I'm afraid.

Barnes is a great pickup for the Bucks and has to go in the trade.

I think that Barnes, IQ, #9 and filler is the move. Maybe toss a cpl picks and a young guy in there too.

[GiannisAnte34]

If he wants to stay East, which I think is wise, this is a good deal. He gets his own franchise and has a history with the front office.

The only downside I see with Toronto is that he has no co-star, and Toronto has no avenue of acquiring one after the trade. Clunky fit with Ingram + Poeltl, but workable. In other words, it's superior to what he has in Milwaukee.

Quickley/Shead
Agbajia/Walker
Ingram/Dick
Giannis/Mogbo
Poeltl/(MLE?)

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

[JMAC3]

If he wants to stay East, which I think is wise, this is a good deal. He gets his own franchise and has a history with the front office.

The only downside I see with Toronto is that he has no co-star, and Toronto has no avenue of acquiring one after the trade. Clunky fit with Ingram + Poeltl, but workable. In other words, it's superior to what he has in Milwaukee.

Quickley/Shead
Agbajia/Walker
Ingram/Dick
Giannis/Mogbo
Poeltl/(MLE?)

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

[redslastlaugh]

Bucks get Barnes, RJ, #9 (drafted), TOR26FRP, TOR28FRP, TOR30FRP, TOR32FRP

Raptors get Giannis

Bucks also get their pick of two of Dick, Walter, Agbaji, Shead and Mogbo...

[JMAC3]

Bucks get Barnes, RJ, #9 (drafted), TOR26FRP, TOR28FRP, TOR30FRP, TOR32FRP

Raptors get Giannis

Bucks also get their pick of two of Dick, Walter, Agbaji, Shead and Mogbo...

Toronto still has to have a team around Giannis post trade or it makes no sense to make this move...

[GiannisAnte34]

If he wants to stay East, which I think is wise, this is a good deal. He gets his own franchise and has a history with the front office.

The only downside I see with Toronto is that he has no co-star, and Toronto has no avenue of acquiring one after the trade. Clunky fit with Ingram + Poeltl, but workable. In other words, it's superior to what he has in Milwaukee.

Quickley/Shead
Agbajia/Walker
Ingram/Dick
Giannis/Mogbo
Poeltl/(MLE?)

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

1) not every player is concerned with arbitrary fan All-Time player ranking. I really doubt Giannis cares about that kind of thing especially to the degree KD did

2) it’s very obvious that there is only one player in the league you could say would be 1A over Giannis and that’s Jokic

Even in the hypothetical pairing of Giannis with SGA since OKC has the assets, it would be made very clear that Giannis is 1A. His stats would be ridiculous on a team that stacked

[Texas Chuck]

SGA is the reigning MVP leading one of the greatest teams of all-time. I think we can 1a him ahead of Giannis too.

[redslastlaugh]

Bucks get Barnes, RJ, #9 (drafted), TOR26FRP, TOR28FRP, TOR30FRP, TOR32FRP

Raptors get Giannis

Bucks also get their pick of two of Dick, Walter, Agbaji, Shead and Mogbo...

Toronto still has to have a team around Giannis post trade or it makes no sense to make this move...

the offer in the OP is too light to close the deal, imo
if Raps would rather keep all the younger guys, Milwaukee can get a better deal
it's too bad you guys didn't land in the top 4 of the draft, honestly

[zimpy27]

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

1) not every player is concerned with arbitrary fan All-Time player ranking. I really doubt Giannis cares about that kind of thing especially to the degree KD did

2) it’s very obvious that there is only one player in the league you could say would be 1A over Giannis and that’s Jokic

Even in the hypothetical pairing of Giannis with SGA since OKC has the assets, it would be made very clear that Giannis is 1A. His stats would be ridiculous on a team that stacked

He absolutely cares based on interviews he's most similar to LeBron. Fully expect him to choose a team with a plan to build around him and not to just add himself to a pre-done team as 2nd banana.

[zimpy27]

Bucks also get their pick of two of Dick, Walter, Agbaji, Shead and Mogbo...

Toronto still has to have a team around Giannis post trade or it makes no sense to make this move...

the offer in the OP is too light to close the deal, imo
if Raps would rather keep all the younger guys, Milwaukee can get a better deal
it's too bad you guys didn't land in the top 4 of the draft, honestly

Not many deals offer a 23 year old all star.
I think Bucks would want an all star talent back for him.

[GiannisAnte34]

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

1) not every player is concerned with arbitrary fan All-Time player ranking. I really doubt Giannis cares about that kind of thing especially to the degree KD did

2) it’s very obvious that there is only one player in the league you could say would be 1A over Giannis and that’s Jokic

Even in the hypothetical pairing of Giannis with SGA since OKC has the assets, it would be made very clear that Giannis is 1A. His stats would be ridiculous on a team that stacked

He absolutely cares based on interviews he's most similar to LeBron. Fully expect him to choose a team with a plan to build around him and not to just add himself to a pre-done team as 2nd banana.

Giannis is similar to the narcissist LeBron? Sure

[JMAC3]

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

1) not every player is concerned with arbitrary fan All-Time player ranking. I really doubt Giannis cares about that kind of thing especially to the degree KD did

2) it’s very obvious that there is only one player in the league you could say would be 1A over Giannis and that’s Jokic

Even in the hypothetical pairing of Giannis with SGA since OKC has the assets, it would be made very clear that Giannis is 1A. His stats would be ridiculous on a team that stacked

Whose team was it in Golden State? KD was considered a top 3 player in the world and it was Stephs team. It has nothing to do with Giannis not being good, but these teams have their guys already and push come to shove they are going to prioritize Wemby over Giannis or prioritize SGA over Giannis.

[Troubadour]

How does Giannis not already have his own franchise in Milwaukee? Stick only to the point outlined

He does, but vs getting traded somewhere like Spurs, Boston or OKC for instances where he would be the 2nd piece to fans ala KD was to Steph. If he goes to Houston, Toronto or Brooklyn he is the unquestioned #1 to the fans and front office.

1) not every player is concerned with arbitrary fan All-Time player ranking. I really doubt Giannis cares about that kind of thing especially to the degree KD did

2) it’s very obvious that there is only one player in the league you could say would be 1A over Giannis and that’s Jokic

Even in the hypothetical pairing of Giannis with SGA since OKC has the assets, it would be made very clear that Giannis is 1A. His stats would be ridiculous on a team that stacked

It's not about who's actually better, but who has top billing with the fans. SGA is both an MVP and has a history with the fanbase. Wembanyama has a significant headstart with the fans in San Antonio. Jalen Brunson is the face of that Knicks team. Brooklyn is a blank slate, so is Toronto if you're moving Barnes for him.

Not saying it's the be all and end all, but it's what I think the original comment is trying to say.

[GiannisAnte34]

SGA is the reigning MVP leading one of the greatest teams of all-time. I think we can 1a him ahead of Giannis too.

Giannis is a 2 time MVP on teams more shallow on talent than SGA, with a DPOY in there as well. There is no reason to think SGA would be statistically superior to Giannis if they were paired.

This years Thunder have an SRS of 12.7, were crediting that all to SGA? Guess he’s better than 1995-1997 Jordan and 1970-1972 Kareem and 2015-2017 Curry

[Texas Chuck]

I mean Giannis would be joining SGA's team. I think Giannis would understand that. Not that it matters.

The point is SGA is seen currently as the better player and that's okay. Its no knock on Giannis to acknowledge Joker and SGA lol.