Shams: Jrue for Simons

[Myth]

If Simons was worth a first on his contract, he'd have been traded before now. Once the Magic traded for Bane, it was difficult to identify a team that would trade for him without sending back bad money.

Then let him expire and walk. Don’t take a worse contract. Cronin is so afraid to let somebody walk for nothing that he’ll extend or trade for another bad/long contract to claim he got something.

I don’t like this move for POR because the contract is too long and they aren’t good enough for it to really make a difference… I do think you will appreciate the deal more though when the season starts. Reports of Jrue’s demise are greatly overstated. Everyone knew BOS needed to move him for money reasons and an over the top narrative turning it into an actual basketball decision spawned out of that. Im sure if you run tracking data and all that he’s lost some quickness and such, but overall he was really no different last year than before other than bad shooting in the corner compared to historically good the year before which just seems like shooting variance. His usage on Boston fell off because of their number of weapons, but anytime injuries called for him to scale up he was great.

In terms of on court impact, you will feel this is a steal for POR in short order. But yeah, the risk of decline is huge at his age and contract length.

My hope is that he does a brief mentorship and then Blazers move him along before a decline becomes more obvious. I don expect to enjoy him next season, but I still don’t like the risk of not being able to move him and getting stuck with another big contract for a declining player for the future years.

[djFan71]

Another thing here, what does this mean for similar players like Coby White, Colin Sexton or Austin Reaves?

I think Coby White is better than Simons, but he has some of the same strengths and weakness as him? Does this mean he's not going worth all that much in a trade? I have always viewed him as a late lottery pick and maybe this is still the case, but maybe not. I always believed that he should around 30 million dollars per year next off season. Perhaps this trade changes things , but maybe not.

Colin Sexton is basically the same player as Simons, are the Jazz simply stuck with Sexton now since nobody is going to assign meaningful to him?

Far as Austin Reaves, I wonder if this is going pressures him into to simply signing the 4/89 million extension this off season. Because if no teams views Simons at his salary as a 1st round pick,there no way a team view Austin Reaves as a 30+ million dollar per year. I don't view Austin as much better than Simons that Austin is worth 30 million per year, but Simons isn't even worth 27.6 million per year.

It could also just mean Jrue had more value than most thought.

I don't buy that Jrue Holiday has much value in a trade. He coming of a season where his offense has clearly regressed and while his defense is still quite impactful, it's not the same as it was in year's past.Lets not forget he's going between making 32-37 million over the next 3 years with a player option at the end of that deal. That's not a good contract considering his production at this point in his career.

People keep repeating this decline in defense, but it’s just not there, he still orchestrated the whole thing for a top defensive team and did all the help and switching things he always does.

But, I officially retire from defending his trade value at this point. Some smart, handsome devil of a Blazers fan can take the mantle.

[Mavrelous]

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[RiotPunch]

It would be hilarious if Portland trades Jrue back to Milwaukee for more assets

Now that would be downright poetic.

[cpower]

It would be hilarious if Portland trades Jrue back to Milwaukee for more assets

Now that would be downright poetic.

if you are the bucks, ask for 2 FRPs

[emajic11]

It could also just mean Jrue had more value than most thought.

I don't buy that Jrue Holiday has much value in a trade. He coming of a season where his offense has clearly regressed and while his defense is still quite impactful, it's not the same as it was in year's past.Lets not forget he's going between making 32-37 million over the next 3 years with a player option at the end of that deal. That's not a good contract considering his production at this point in his career.

People keep repeating this decline in defense, but it’s just not there, he still orchestrated the whole thing for a top teams and did all the team help and switching things he always does.

But, I officially retire from defending his trade value at this point. Some smart, handsome devil of a Blazers fan can take the mantle.

I, too, thought Jrue Holiday would return positive value, factoring in the mallet finger injury that he played through 2nd half of season.

[ReggiesKnicks]

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They will be expiring salary, which makes them salary ballast for a trade assuming their youth develops.

If their youth doesn't develop, then they are bad regardless and the salary of Jrue/Grant isn't all that relevant as this will be a failed rebuild and Portland will be rebuilding.

Essentially they are banking on continued improvement from their 21, 21 and 22 year olds while their maintain a lottery pick this year, a couple juicy 1sts in the future and Deni/Camara as longer-term wing pieces.

Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two. Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12. Their ceiling over the next 3 years (2026, 2027 and 2028) was already capped at whatever level Deni/Scoot/Sharpe can achieve while their floor was 8-12 in the draft.

Again, I absolutely love this for Portland. It's a clear direction. They have prospects with a high ceiling with complimentary, not overlapping, skill-sets.

[cpower]

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They will be expiring salary, which makes them salary ballast for a trade assuming their youth develops.

If their youth doesn't develop, then they are bad regardless and the salary of Jrue/Grant isn't all that relevant as this will be a failed rebuild and Portland will be rebuilding.

Essentially they are banking on continued improvement from their 21, 21 and 22 year olds while their maintain a lottery pick this year, a couple juicy 1sts in the future and Deni/Camara as longer-term wing pieces.

Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two. Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12. Their ceiling over the next 3 years (2026, 2027 and 2028) was already capped at whatever level Deni/Scoot/Sharpe can achieve while their floor was 8-12 in the draft.

Again, I absolutely love this for Portland. It's a clear direction. They have prospects with a high ceiling with complimentary, not overlapping, skill-sets.

Boston is the desperate team, ask for picks for god sake. Simmon is expiring you should get some value too. This is way lopsided.

[djFan71]

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They will be expiring salary, which makes them salary ballast for a trade assuming their youth develops.

If their youth doesn't develop, then they are bad regardless and the salary of Jrue/Grant isn't all that relevant as this will be a failed rebuild and Portland will be rebuilding.

Essentially they are banking on continued improvement from their 21, 21 and 22 year olds while their maintain a lottery pick this year, a couple juicy 1sts in the future and Deni/Camara as longer-term wing pieces.

Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two. Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12. Their ceiling over the next 3 years (2026, 2027 and 2028) was already capped at whatever level Deni/Scoot/Sharpe can achieve while their floor was 8-12 in the draft.

Again, I absolutely love this for Portland. It's a clear direction. They have prospects with a high ceiling with complimentary, not overlapping, skill-sets.

Exactly. It sounds dumb, but it’s actually kinda handy to have bad contracts, especially expiring ones. You get all the positives of his play/mentorship for the next couple seasons and then he a) might still be good, or b) you use his expiring salary in a deal. If it’s c) both, then the deal gets easier.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Boston is the desperate team, ask for picks for god sake. Simmon is expiring you should get some value too. This is way lopsided.

Y'all hilarious.

Simons is expiring you should get some value too

Why?

Maybe no team values undersized SG who can't defend and struggle to stay healthy.

Boston is the desperate team

Are they? They have good players who play winning basketball.

You know who wants to win? Owners. You know who wants to rebuild when their team is worse than the best team in the NBA? Fans of the other 29 teams.

At the end of the day Jrue Holiday is a much better player than Anfernee Simons.

Here are Simons career best rankings in composite scores.

LEBRON: 161 (2024)
RAPM: 213 / 336 (3-Year/4-Year)
MAMBA: 98 (2023), 166 (2024)
DARKO: 274 (2025)
BPM: 0.2 (96th in 2024 playing only 46/82 games)

Who exactly is going to give up meaningful value for this player, a player who has played 70 games just once in the past 5 seasons (Missed just 8 games in 2021, shortened season).

[LightTheBeam]

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Im so confused here. So boston didnt want simons but wanted the savings, Portland didnt want jrue but figured maybe they can rip the Kings off for a pick?

Im guessing derozan + spurs 1st for jrue is coming next

[Mavrelous]

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They will be expiring salary, which makes them salary ballast for a trade assuming their youth develops.

If their youth doesn't develop, then they are bad regardless and the salary of Jrue/Grant isn't all that relevant as this will be a failed rebuild and Portland will be rebuilding.

Essentially they are banking on continued improvement from their 21, 21 and 22 year olds while their maintain a lottery pick this year, a couple juicy 1sts in the future and Deni/Camara as longer-term wing pieces.

Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two. Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12. Their ceiling over the next 3 years (2026, 2027 and 2028) was already capped at whatever level Deni/Scoot/Sharpe can achieve while their floor was 8-12 in the draft.

Again, I absolutely love this for Portland. It's a clear direction. They have prospects with a high ceiling with complimentary, not overlapping, skill-sets.

Lots of odd assumptions here...

"Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two, Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12

That doesn't Justify trading for 35 y/o with 110M owed over 3 years.
Jrue Holiday was a 11/4/4 player this year, and he shined when he was 3rd/4th option offensively، he'll be 2nd option on the Blazers with very meh 1st option, they were 11th seed before, I'd be surprised if they make the play in.

[cpower]

Boston is the desperate team, ask for picks for god sake. Simmon is expiring you should get some value too. This is way lopsided.

Y'all hilarious.

Simons is expiring you should get some value too

Why?

Maybe no team values undersized SG who can't defend and struggle to stay healthy.

Boston is the desperate team

Are they? They have good players who play winning basketball.

You know who wants to win? Owners. You know who wants to rebuild when their team is worse than the best team in the NBA? Fans of the other 29 teams.

At the end of the day Jrue Holiday is a much better player than Anfernee Simons.

Here are Simons career best rankings in composite scores.

LEBRON: 161 (2024)
RAPM: 213 / 336 (3-Year/4-Year)
MAMBA: 98 (2023), 166 (2024)
DARKO: 274 (2025)
BPM: 0.2 (96th in 2024 playing only 46/82 games)

Who exactly is going to give up meaningful value for this player, a player who has played 70 games just once in the past 5 seasons (Missed just 8 games in 2021, shortened season).

Boston wants to get out of 2nd Apron why helping them? Lets just say Simmons is the worst player in the league sure just DNP him and let him walk then, there is no point giving up picks and lock yourself into another 100M.

[ReggiesKnicks]

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They will be expiring salary, which makes them salary ballast for a trade assuming their youth develops.

If their youth doesn't develop, then they are bad regardless and the salary of Jrue/Grant isn't all that relevant as this will be a failed rebuild and Portland will be rebuilding.

Essentially they are banking on continued improvement from their 21, 21 and 22 year olds while their maintain a lottery pick this year, a couple juicy 1sts in the future and Deni/Camara as longer-term wing pieces.

Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two. Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12. Their ceiling over the next 3 years (2026, 2027 and 2028) was already capped at whatever level Deni/Scoot/Sharpe can achieve while their floor was 8-12 in the draft.

Again, I absolutely love this for Portland. It's a clear direction. They have prospects with a high ceiling with complimentary, not overlapping, skill-sets.

Lots of odd assumptions here...

"Portland was in a spot where they were going to be picking 8-12 the next year or two, Adding a player as conductive to winning as Jrue Holiday is a step in a direction not ending up 8-12

That doesn't Justify trading for 35 y/o with 110M owed over 3 years.
Jrue Holiday was a 11/4/4 player this year, and he shined when he was 3rd/4th option offensively، he'll be 2nd option on the Blazers with very meh 1st option, they were 11th seed before, I'd be surprised if they make the play in.

Holiday was an 11/4/4 player this year.

Simons was an 19/5/3 player this year.

Is Simons better than Holiday in your mind?

As for Jrue Holiday being the 2nd option, he averages 9.2 FGA/G in 2025 and 10.0 in 2024.

Here are the players in Portland who averages more FGA/G than 9.2 in 2025.

Sharpe 15.3
Grant 12.2
Avdija 11.7
Ayton 11.7
Scoot 10.4
Camara 9.2

Maybe Jrue ups his volume and the young guys like Scoot and Deni take less shots, but is that the hill you want to die on? Seems like a viewpoint that is hard for you to back-up statistically.

[thamadkant]

Anyone have a solid idea on why Portland did this? Can’t be willing to pay this much just for a Scoot mentor right?

They were 9th out west for a long time last year and they weren't even properly playing, as in Billups was developing his wing players and sitting Ayton and Grant out a lot.

With Jrue, they get a proper veteran to lead them along Ayton and Grant. I expect Blazers to push for top 7 out west.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Boston wants to get out of 2nd Apron why helping them?

Portland wants to get better. Why is Boston helping Portland get better?

This is your logic.

[Mavrelous]

Holiday was an 11/4/4 player this year.

Simons was an 19/5/3 player this year.

Is Simons better than Holiday in your mind?

Next year he might be, but Simmons is an expiring and paid less, they weren't committed to him, they are committed to Jrue now.

As for Jrue Holiday being the 2nd option, he averages 9.2 FGA/G in 2025 and 10.0 in 2024.

Here are the players in Portland who averages more FGA/G than 9.2 in 2025.

Sharpe 15.3
Grant 12.2
Avdija 11.7
Ayton 11.7
Scoot 10.4
Camara 9.2

Maybe Jrue ups his volume and the young guys like Scoot and Deni take less shots, but is that the hill you want to die on? Seems like a viewpoint that is hard for you to back-up statistically.

Maybe, but I wouldn't walk into a situation where for a trade to be successful, I need a 35 y/o to perform in a manner he hasn't done in 2 years.

[ReggiesKnicks]

Holiday was an 11/4/4 player this year.

Simons was an 19/5/3 player this year.

Is Simons better than Holiday in your mind?

Next year he might be, but Simmons is an expiring and paid less, they weren't committed to him, they are committed to Jrue now.

Sure, but you are side-stepping my question.

You originally implied Jrue Holiday wasn't very good since he put up 11/4/4. If you think Simons is better because he put up 19/5/3, then you care about these numbers/stats.

If you don't think Simons is better even though his box-score was better than Jrue's, then what is the point of bringing up box-score to assess a player or make a factual point in a discussion?

If you are bringing up a stat-line only for it not to matter, then what was the point of bringing up the stat-line in the first place?

Maybe, but I wouldn't walk into a situation where for a trade to be successful, I need a 35 y/o to perform in a manner he hasn't done in 2 years.

Who is saying Jrue needs to be a 1st, 2nd or even 3rd option for Portland?

I expect Jrue to be 4th or 5th in FGA/G for Portland. You made a statement about how Jrue will be the 2nd option in Portland.

I disagree Jrue will be the 2nd option.

[SlimShady83]

Don't think any of us going to get any trades right this off season lols.

[Mavrelous]

Holiday was an 11/4/4 player this year.

Simons was an 19/5/3 player this year.

Is Simons better than Holiday in your mind?

Next year he might be, but Simmons is an expiring and paid less, they weren't committed to him, they are committed to Jrue now.

Sure, but you are side-stepping my question.

You originally implied Jrue Holiday wasn't very good since he put up 11/4/4. If you think Simons is better because he put up 19/5/3, then you care about these numbers/stats.

If you don't think Simons is better even though his box-score was better than Jrue's, then what is the point of bringing up box-score to assess a player or make a factual point in a discussion?

If you are bringing up a stat-line only for it not to matter, then what was the point of bringing up the stat-line in the first place?

Maybe, but I wouldn't walk into a situation where for a trade to be successful, I need a 35 y/o to perform in a manner he hasn't done in 2 years.

Who is saying Jrue needs to be a 1st, 2nd or even 3rd option for Portland?

I expect Jrue to be 4th or 5th in FGA/G for Portland. You made a statement about how Jrue will be the 2nd option in Portland.

I disagree Jrue will be the 2nd option.

I brought the stat line to demonstrate his impact, not to compare him with Simons.
Jrue will be 2nd option based in quality as offensive player and decision maker.
I see no reason for a team to trade for a 35 y/o on 110/3 contract when he's not productive enough and I don't have the system to hide his limitations, unlike the Celtics.